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I tried two steeps of each of four fully-withered second flush darjeelings.
None of these have the strong grassy odor that has become typical of modern first flush darjeeling teas, they were all selected for being dark and mellow. I took 30g of each with 250mL of boiling water, steeped for 2.5 minutes. I then followed the same procedure again for a second steep. Almost certainly the second steep should have been for at least a minute longer. This was performed single-blind. TEA ONE ------- Namring Estate Darjeeling FTGFOP1 (ordered from Upton's, TD35) The odor of the cup was flat and woody. The overall flavour was rounded, malty, and a little tannic but without anything distinctive. The second steep was even less distinguished. TEA TWO ------- Puttabong Estate Darjeeling SFTGFOP1 MUSC (ordered from Upton's, TD45) The odor in the cup, rather than being fruity as you might expect from something that says "muscatel" on the package, was very strong of bamboo. It was as close to a grassy odor as any of these teas got. It was a somewhat flat flavour, but much more rounded than the others. The second steep retained that odor, but retained none of the flavour of the first steep. This tea was distinctly different than any of the others. TEA THREE --------- Margaret's Hope Muscatel (from Harrod's, item 955639) The odor was slightly fruity, holding up the muscatel banner properly, although that fruitiness was not retained in the cup. Very clean and deep. TEA FOUR -------- Chamong Tea Estate Darjeeling (Fabindia Organics) The odor was flat but slightly strawlike. The second steep kept the odor and flavour well, definitely holding up better on a second steep than any of the others. Malty, less tannic than the others but not so fruity. Interestingly enough this was my everyday tea for quite a while and I was unable to identify it in the blind comparison CONCLUSION ---------- I would drink any of these teas at any time and they are all of the same basic style. However, the Puttabong definitely stood out as being different in basic flavour profile, and the Chamong stood up better in the second steep. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
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Lewis Perin > wrote:
(Scott Dorsey) writes: > >>I took 30g of each with 250mL of boiling water, steeped for 2.5 minutes. >>I then followed the same procedure again for a second steep. Almost >>certainly the second steep should have been for at least a minute longer. >>This was performed single-blind. > >Thanks for posting this. But *30g*?! Thats a lot of leaf. Are you >sure thats how much you used? That was a typo! It should have been 3.0g. Experimentally, I found 1tsp of the Puttabong measured 1.8g and that when I took a pinch the size that I normally use for an 8oz mug, it weighed 3.2g, so I settled on 3.0 as a reasonable reference. Others may choose to use less or more but for God's sake don't use 30. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
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On 2014-09-12 17:09:12 +0000, Scott Dorsey said:
> I tried two steeps of each of four fully-withered second flush darjeelings. > None of these have the strong grassy odor that has become typical of modern > first flush darjeeling teas, they were all selected for being dark and mellow. > > I took 30g of each with 250mL of boiling water, steeped for 2.5 minutes. > I then followed the same procedure again for a second steep. Almost > certainly the second steep should have been for at least a minute longer. > This was performed single-blind. > > > TEA ONE > ------- > Namring Estate Darjeeling FTGFOP1 (ordered from Upton's, TD35) > > The odor of the cup was flat and woody. The overall flavour was rounded, > malty, and a little tannic but without anything distinctive. The second > steep was even less distinguished. > > TEA TWO > ------- > Puttabong Estate Darjeeling SFTGFOP1 MUSC (ordered from Upton's, TD45) > > The odor in the cup, rather than being fruity as you might expect from > something that says "muscatel" on the package, was very strong of bamboo. > It was as close to a grassy odor as any of these teas got. It was a > somewhat flat flavour, but much more rounded than the others. The second > steep retained that odor, but retained none of the flavour of the first > steep. This tea was distinctly different than any of the others. > > TEA THREE > --------- > Margaret's Hope Muscatel (from Harrod's, item 955639) > > The odor was slightly fruity, holding up the muscatel banner properly, > although that fruitiness was not retained in the cup. Very clean and deep. > > TEA FOUR > -------- > Chamong Tea Estate Darjeeling (Fabindia Organics) > > The odor was flat but slightly strawlike. The second steep kept the odor > and flavour well, definitely holding up better on a second steep than any > of the others. Malty, less tannic than the others but not so fruity. > > Interestingly enough this was my everyday tea for quite a while and I was > unable to identify it in the blind comparison > > > CONCLUSION > ---------- > > I would drink any of these teas at any time and they are all of the same > basic style. However, the Puttabong definitely stood out as being different > in basic flavour profile, and the Chamong stood up better in the second > steep. > --scott I think you'd have much better luck if your water was around 190F or so instead of boiling. |
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Oregonian Haruspex > wrote:
>On 2014-09-12 17:09:12 +0000, Scott Dorsey said: > >> I tried two steeps of each of four fully-withered second flush darjeelings. >> None of these have the strong grassy odor that has become typical of modern >> first flush darjeeling teas, they were all selected for being dark and mellow. >> >> I took 30g of each with 250mL of boiling water, steeped for 2.5 minutes. >> I then followed the same procedure again for a second steep. Almost >> certainly the second steep should have been for at least a minute longer. >> This was performed single-blind. > >I think you'd have much better luck if your water was around 190F or >so instead of boiling. The thing is, these are all fully-withered teas, very dark and much more like an assam in processing than the modern almost-green darjeelings, so traditionally they are done with boiling water. I suppose I could try them with a slightly cooler water just to see, though. But they're not oolongs like most modern darjeeling is. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
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(Scott Dorsey) writes:
>Oregonian Haruspex > wrote: >>On 2014-09-12 17:09:12 +0000, Scott Dorsey said: >> >>> I tried two steeps of each of four fully-withered second flush darjeelings. >>> None of these have the strong grassy odor that has become typical of modern >>> first flush darjeeling teas, they were all selected for being dark >>> and mellow. >>> >>> I took 30g of each with 250mL of boiling water, steeped for 2.5 minutes. >>> I then followed the same procedure again for a second steep. Almost >>> certainly the second steep should have been for at least a minute longer. >>> This was performed single-blind. >> >>I think you'd have much better luck if your water was around 190ºF or >>so instead of boiling. > >The thing is, these are all fully-withered teas, very dark and much more >like an assam in processing than the modern almost-green darjeelings, so >traditionally they are done with boiling water. I suppose I could try >them with a slightly cooler water just to see, though. But they're not >oolongs like most modern darjeeling is. >--scott Sorry, I have to disagree with your last sentence. Oolongs arent fully oxidized/fermented, but not everything thats partially oxidized is an oolong. Theres a lot of craft in making an oolong that isnt required to make a black tea (even a black tea that isnt fully oxidized - I know, my head hurts, too.) Maybe thats why, when Darjeeling gardens set out to make an oolong, the results tend to fall short. /Lew --- Lew Perin / http://babelcarp.org |
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Lewis Perin > wrote:
(Scott Dorsey) writes: > >>Oregonian Haruspex > wrote: >>>On 2014-09-12 17:09:12 +0000, Scott Dorsey said: >>> >>>> I tried two steeps of each of four fully-withered second flush darjeelings. >>>> None of these have the strong grassy odor that has become typical of modern >>>> first flush darjeeling teas, they were all selected for being dark >>>> and mellow. >>>> >>>> I took 30g of each with 250mL of boiling water, steeped for 2.5 minutes. >>>> I then followed the same procedure again for a second steep. Almost >>>> certainly the second steep should have been for at least a minute longer. >>>> This was performed single-blind. >>> >>>I think you'd have much better luck if your water was around 190ºF or >>>so instead of boiling. >> >>The thing is, these are all fully-withered teas, very dark and much more >>like an assam in processing than the modern almost-green darjeelings, so >>traditionally they are done with boiling water. I suppose I could try >>them with a slightly cooler water just to see, though. But they're not >>oolongs like most modern darjeeling is. >>--scott > >Sorry, I have to disagree with your last sentence. Oolongs arent fully >oxidized/fermented, but not everything thats partially oxidized is an >oolong. Theres a lot of craft in making an oolong that isnt required >to make a black tea (even a black tea that isnt fully oxidized - I >know, my head hurts, too.) Maybe thats why, when Darjeeling gardens >set out to make an oolong, the results tend to fall short. Okay, it's not really an oolong.... but it's not really a black tea. What it is, is a darjeeling. But it's different than the fully withered darjeelings which really are orthodox process black teas. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
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On 2014-10-21 14:51:11 +0000, Scott Dorsey said:
> Oregonian Haruspex > wrote: >> On 2014-09-12 17:09:12 +0000, Scott Dorsey said: >> >>> I tried two steeps of each of four fully-withered second flush darjeelings. >>> None of these have the strong grassy odor that has become typical of modern >>> first flush darjeeling teas, they were all selected for being dark and mellow. >>> >>> I took 30g of each with 250mL of boiling water, steeped for 2.5 minutes. >>> I then followed the same procedure again for a second steep. Almost >>> certainly the second steep should have been for at least a minute longer. >>> This was performed single-blind. >> >> I think you'd have much better luck if your water was around 190F or >> so instead of boiling. > > The thing is, these are all fully-withered teas, very dark and much more > like an assam in processing than the modern almost-green darjeelings, so > traditionally they are done with boiling water. I suppose I could try > them with a slightly cooler water just to see, though. But they're not > oolongs like most modern darjeeling is. > --scott I don't know of any tea that is traditionally done with boiling water. Things may be different in the UK and associated nations, though. |
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Oregonian Haruspex > writes:
>On 2014-10-21 14:51:11 +0000, Scott Dorsey said: > >> Oregonian Haruspex > wrote: >>> On 2014-09-12 17:09:12 +0000, Scott Dorsey said: >>> >>>> I tried two steeps of each of four fully-withered second flush darjeelings. >>>> None of these have the strong grassy odor that has become typical of modern >>>> first flush darjeeling teas, they were all selected for being dark and mellow. >>>> >>>> I took 30g of each with 250mL of boiling water, steeped for 2.5 minutes. >>>> I then followed the same procedure again for a second steep. Almost >>>> certainly the second steep should have been for at least a minute longer. >>>> This was performed single-blind. >>> >>> I think you'd have much better luck if your water was around 190ºF or >>> so instead of boiling. >> >> The thing is, these are all fully-withered teas, very dark and much more >> like an assam in processing than the modern almost-green darjeelings, so >> traditionally they are done with boiling water. I suppose I could try >> them with a slightly cooler water just to see, though. But they're not >> oolongs like most modern darjeeling is. >> --scott > >I don't know of any tea that is traditionally done with boiling water. >Things may be different in the UK and associated nations, though. There isnt necessarily One True Tradition for a given tea. Plenty of people in China use boiling water for any number of oolongs. Short steeps, of course. /Lew --- Lew Perin / http://babelcarp.org |
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On 2014-10-23 15:36:30 +0000, Lewis Perin said:
> Oregonian Haruspex > writes: > >> On 2014-10-21 14:51:11 +0000, Scott Dorsey said: >> >>> Oregonian Haruspex > wrote: >>>> On 2014-09-12 17:09:12 +0000, Scott Dorsey said: >>>> >>>>> I tried two steeps of each of four fully-withered second flush darjeelings. >>>>> None of these have the strong grassy odor that has become typical of modern >>>>> first flush darjeeling teas, they were all selected for being dark and mellow. >>>>> >>>>> I took 30g of each with 250mL of boiling water, steeped for 2.5 minutes. >>>>> I then followed the same procedure again for a second steep. Almost >>>>> certainly the second steep should have been for at least a minute longer. >>>>> This was performed single-blind. >>>> >>>> I think you'd have much better luck if your water was around 190ºF or >>>> so instead of boiling. >>> >>> The thing is, these are all fully-withered teas, very dark and much more >>> like an assam in processing than the modern almost-green darjeelings, so >>> traditionally they are done with boiling water. I suppose I could try >>> them with a slightly cooler water just to see, though. But they're not >>> oolongs like most modern darjeeling is. >>> --scott >> >> I don't know of any tea that is traditionally done with boiling water. >> Things may be different in the UK and associated nations, though. > > There isnt necessarily One True Tradition for a given tea. Plenty of > people in China use boiling water for any number of oolongs. Short > steeps, of course. I won't argue the point with you but the very idea of pouring boiling water onto tea leaves makes me shudder with horror. |
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Oregonian Haruspex > wrote:
> >I won't argue the point with you but the very idea of pouring boiling >water onto tea leaves makes me shudder with horror. I find most blacks become kind of insipid if you drop the water temperature much. It's not like drinking a green tea. To add on the thread, this week I received the "Namring Second Flush Darjeeling" from Harney and Sons, and I am sorry to report that it has less overall flavour than any of the others in the trial mentioned before. The first steep is okay but uneventful, and it is down hill from there. I'd hate to try this one with cooler water, it would have even less happening. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
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On Friday, September 12, 2014 at 10:39:12 PM UTC+5:30, Scott Dorsey wrote: > I tried two steeps of each of four fully-withered second flush darjeelings. > None of these have the strong grassy odor that has become typical of modern > first flush darjeeling teas, they were all selected for being dark and mellow. > > I took 30g of each with 250mL of boiling water, steeped for 2.5 minutes. > I then followed the same procedure again for a second steep. Almost > certainly the second steep should have been for at least a minute longer. > This was performed single-blind. > > > TEA ONE > ------- > Namring Estate Darjeeling FTGFOP1 (ordered from Upton's, TD35) > > The odor of the cup was flat and woody. The overall flavour was rounded, > malty, and a little tannic but without anything distinctive. The second > steep was even less distinguished. > > TEA TWO > ------- > Puttabong Estate Darjeeling SFTGFOP1 MUSC (ordered from Upton's, TD45) > > The odor in the cup, rather than being fruity as you might expect from > something that says "muscatel" on the package, was very strong of bamboo. > It was as close to a grassy odor as any of these teas got. It was a > somewhat flat flavour, but much more rounded than the others. The second > steep retained that odor, but retained none of the flavour of the first > steep. This tea was distinctly different than any of the others. > > TEA THREE > --------- > Margaret's Hope Muscatel (from Harrod's, item 955639) > > The odor was slightly fruity, holding up the muscatel banner properly, > although that fruitiness was not retained in the cup. Very clean and deep. > > TEA FOUR > -------- > Chamong Tea Estate Darjeeling (Fabindia Organics) > > The odor was flat but slightly strawlike. The second steep kept the odor > and flavour well, definitely holding up better on a second steep than any > of the others. Malty, less tannic than the others but not so fruity. > > Interestingly enough this was my everyday tea for quite a while and I was > unable to identify it in the blind comparison > > > CONCLUSION > ---------- > > I would drink any of these teas at any time and they are all of the same > basic style. However, the Puttabong definitely stood out as being different > in basic flavour profile, and the Chamong stood up better in the second > steep. > --scott > > -- > "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
We Cup Darjeeling
So, talking about the whole fully withered darjeeling thing on the ##tea channel on freenode (which appears to consist of refugees from reddit), someone suggested I try the "First Flush Jungpana 'Clonal Spring Delight'" tea from What-Cha, saying it was pretty dark. And.... this is GREEN. This is so green. Not only that, it has the sort of fishy, seaweedy taste that some Japanese greens have, which I have never experienced in any other teas. So I'd count it as interesting but diametrically opposed to the style I am looking for. However.... in order to make up the order, I also ordered a mystery tea kit from What-Cha, and they sent two teas that were themselves much more interesting than the darjeeling. They had something marked "Azores Orange Pekoe Black Tea." I had no idea they grew tea in the Azores at all. Very smooth and rounded with no real tannic bite to it at all. It's not something I'd pick as a daily drinking tea but it could sure be nice for blending to smooth out a harsher tea. They also included some of the "Wild Boar" black tea from Vietnam which was again very smooth and rounded but with a much thicker mouthfeel and a deeper taste. Anyway.... just wanted folks to know about some of this stuff. None of it was really to my taste but all of it was interesting and might be to yours. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
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(Scott Dorsey) writes:
>So, talking about the whole fully withered darjeeling thing on the >##tea channel on freenode (which appears to consist of refugees from reddit), >someone suggested I try the "First Flush Jungpana 'Clonal Spring Delight'" >tea from What-Cha, saying it was pretty dark. > >And.... this is GREEN. This is so green. Not only that, it has the sort >of fishy, seaweedy taste that some Japanese greens have, which I have never >experienced in any other teas. > >So I'd count it as interesting but diametrically opposed to the style I am >looking for. Im afraid you arent going to find a first flush Darjeeling that isnt green these days. /Lew --- Lew Perin / http://babelcarp.org |
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Lewis Perin > wrote:
(Scott Dorsey) writes: > >>So, talking about the whole fully withered darjeeling thing on the >>##tea channel on freenode (which appears to consist of refugees from reddit), >>someone suggested I try the "First Flush Jungpana 'Clonal Spring Delight'" >>tea from What-Cha, saying it was pretty dark. >> >>And.... this is GREEN. This is so green. Not only that, it has the sort >>of fishy, seaweedy taste that some Japanese greens have, which I have never >>experienced in any other teas. >> >>So I'd count it as interesting but diametrically opposed to the style I am >>looking for. > >Im afraid you arent going to find a first flush Darjeeling that isnt >green these days. Sadly true. Even so, this was green even by THOSE standards. --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
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