Tea (rec.drink.tea) Discussion relating to tea, the world's second most consumed beverage (after water), made by infusing or boiling the leaves of the tea plant (C. sinensis or close relatives) in water.

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Old 16-09-2007, 08:32 AM posted to rec.food.drink.tea
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Default worried about pesticides in tea?

Since a lot of the tea we drink comes from China and Indonesia, are
you ever worried that the tea leaves were sprayed with pesticides such
as DDT or other harmful chemicals? I'd hate to think that I could
be drinking a cup full of toxins or pesticides along with my EGCG.

Is the correct move to switch to organic teas? Does anyone really
know if tea bushes are completely safe for consumption?

Any input is highly appreciated. thanks.


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Old 16-09-2007, 08:54 AM posted to rec.food.drink.tea
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On Sep 16, 2:32 am, Tea Sunrise wrote:
Since a lot of the tea we drink comes from China and Indonesia, are
you ever worried that the tea leaves were sprayed with pesticides such
as DDT or other harmful chemicals? I'd hate to think that I could
be drinking a cup full of toxins or pesticides along with my EGCG.

Is the correct move to switch to organic teas? Does anyone really
know if tea bushes are completely safe for consumption?

Any input is highly appreciated. thanks.


Since there're a lot of organic teas to try, I'm switching to organic
tea for the time being for a lot of my teas. You can get organic
Assams, Nilgiris, Ceylons, and whites. Oolongs are more difficult.
Toci

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Old 16-09-2007, 12:21 PM posted to rec.food.drink.tea
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Default worried about pesticides in tea?

Is the correct move to switch to organic teas? Does anyone really
know if tea bushes are completely safe for consumption?

Any input is highly appreciated. thanks.



Drink at your own risk. Organic tea from China does not exist.

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Old 16-09-2007, 01:50 PM posted to rec.food.drink.tea
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Default worried about pesticides in tea?

i try to drink organic tea but i think even non organic teas are
generally quite safe

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Old 16-09-2007, 02:28 PM posted to rec.food.drink.tea
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Default worried about pesticides in tea?

On Sep 16, 3:32 am, Tea Sunrise wrote:
Since a lot of the tea we drink comes from China and Indonesia, are
you ever worried that the tea leaves were sprayed with pesticides such
as DDT or other harmful chemicals? I'd hate to think that I could
be drinking a cup full of toxins or pesticides along with my EGCG.

Is the correct move to switch to organic teas? Does anyone really
know if tea bushes are completely safe for consumption?

Any input is highly appreciated. thanks.


There is no such thing really as organic tea (my belief in any so-
called organic food is minimal at best anyhow though) Mainly for the
fact that no one can control the ground/soil contents or the rain,
atmosphere, runoff, etc. regardless of what they do. It is a fact of
life today. This whole "organic" business is just that, a business.

I have always said from day 1 that I fully believe any perceived
health benefits in tea are nullified by environmental/handling/
processing issues. I just hope the balance is in favor of the health
side and less on the dark side. But it is always just that, a hope.

I have seen "organic" okra test so high for uranium it was off the
charts. I've seen artesian wells test high for lead, cyanide, and a
host of other nasty things... the bottom line is that with tea it is a
sponge. It soaks up and concentrates, especially into new growth which
are the prized buds and leaves, and that is just how it is. EGCG and
all the rest of the health benefit B.S. is nothing but marketing and
hype. Drink tea because you want to, and you enjoy it, and also
remember to take a break from the stuff every now and then for some
water or other drink to keep things in some sort of balance. I know I
can put away 10-14 cups a day easily, I also know I don't do 10-14
cups of anything else, even water... so I know I'm way out of any sort
of balance there and if there happens to be toxins/chemicals in some
of the tea I'm drinking I'm getting nice steady, prolonged doses which
is just about the worst possible way to do it. I understand it, I
accept it, and I move on with life.

Spending extra for some silly stamp of approval is just that, silly.
If you want "organic" then patronize your local small farms and
growers for as much as possible, it probably won't help one bit in the
end but at least you kept a hard-working family alive instead of some
corporate mill. Speaking of which, my tea bush is growing like crazy
now that it is a bit older... at this rate I'll have to charge about
$10,000/oz. but it is the most "organic" tea ever grown and has never
been subject to anything since it has been in my greenhouse from birth
and hand cared for with no contact with the environment except the
sunlight that comes in and the air that circulates through. I'll be
taking orders for about year 2010, so get them in early... *crickets
chirping*

- Dominic
http://teasphere.wordpress.com



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Old 16-09-2007, 06:54 PM posted to rec.food.drink.tea
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On Sep 16, 6:21 am, Mydnight wrote:
Is the correct move to switch to organic teas? Does anyone really
know if tea bushes are completely safe for consumption?


Any input is highly appreciated. thanks.


Drink at your own risk. Organic tea from China does not exist.


Upton has a bunch of Chineses organic teas. What is the
"miscommunication?" Toci

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Old 16-09-2007, 11:28 PM posted to rec.food.drink.tea
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Default worried about pesticides in tea?

On Sep 16, 10:54 am, toci wrote:
On Sep 16, 6:21 am, Mydnight wrote:

Is the correct move to switch to organic teas? Does anyone really
know if tea bushes are completely safe for consumption?


Any input is highly appreciated. thanks.


Drink at your own risk. Organic tea from China does not exist.


Upton has a bunch of Chineses organic teas. What is the
"miscommunication?" Toci


I think the "miscommunication" can be the standards by which "organic"
is determined. There is a "world" standard, a US standard" and here in
California, very rigid standards.
The criteria have to do with how long the soil has been untainted, the
seeds or actual growing product untainted, the packaging untainted
etc.
And then, there is the inevitable question of actually adhering to
those criteria. Here in California, we have inspections.
Who knows what truly goes on in Chinese "inspections".
Mydnight, do you know exactly what are the criteria for organic
growing in China and if there are qualified inspectors who actually
inspect?
In my mind, you're probably bound to get a hellofalot more poisons in
an FDA inspected American hot dog than you would in a cup of Chinese
tea.
I guess it's all relative, eh?
Shen


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Old 17-09-2007, 01:12 AM posted to rec.food.drink.tea
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On Sep 16, 6:32 pm, Refolo wrote:

Not, if you grow something organic, you do not put more pesticides in
the environment.

So, the more organic the best for all.



pesticides are organic and biodegradable


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Old 17-09-2007, 01:40 AM posted to rec.food.drink.tea
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On Sep 16, 6:32 pm, Refolo wrote:
On Sun, 16 Sep 2007 13:28:04 -0000, "Dominic T."

wrote:
atmosphere, runoff, etc. regardless of what they do. It is a fact of
life today. This whole "organic" business is just that, a business.


Not, if you grow something organic, you do not put more pesticides in
the environment.

So, the more organic the best for all.


I understand this, and I'm also not going to come down on anyone who
want to eat only "organic" products... fine by me. But I will say that
it matters not one bit whether *you* use pesticides, if the crop is
planted in the ground, in the open it will be almost indistinguishable
from a "non" organic product when analyzed. No one can control
groundwater, rain, runoff, air quality, etc. as if they were in a
bubble... unless they are in a bubble. I have a lot of family and
friends in the agriculture business and even the ones who grow organic
produce will not try to sugar-coat the reality of the situation. It is
what it is, and as they will even gladly admit, the "organic" labeled
produce sells and sells for a large markup and in many cases it is
absolutely no different than how they have been growing those same
tomatoes, corn, cucumbers in years past. They love this new marketing
and hype, they don't pay a cent to advertise it and they reap all of
the benefits.

To think anything is going to grow in China and not be tainted in some
way or another though is fooling themselves, same goes for right here
in the good ole US of A, no difference. If you have a local family
farm or co-op, like I said, go for it. It's better than a Whole Foods
market or Wal-Mart and you are directly helping local people in your
community, if that "green" product had to take a half way around the
world journey to get to you, you've already offset any carbon/CO2/etc.
that was saved in the production... but you saved there being double
the amount... so I guess that's a plus. Again, just my views, but
having some familiarity with it all, I can safely say that it is a
business and it is a fad and there will always be folks willing to
fill a niche.

- Dominic

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Old 17-09-2007, 02:34 AM posted to rec.food.drink.tea
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Default worried about pesticides in tea?

On Sep 16, 3:32 am, Tea Sunrise wrote:
Since a lot of the tea we drink comes from China and Indonesia, are
you ever worried that the tea leaves were sprayed with pesticides such
as DDT or other harmful chemicals? I'd hate to think that I could
be drinking a cup full of toxins or pesticides along with my EGCG.

Is the correct move to switch to organic teas? Does anyone really
know if tea bushes are completely safe for consumption?

Any input is highly appreciated. thanks.


I completely agree with you. I recently read a newspaper article
about a woman who became ill due to drinking green tea which was
contaminated with DDT (she drink the same tea for a couple of years -
a cheap Chinese green tea). While I agree that "going organic" is no
guarantee of avoiding toxins, I do think that going organic can help
to reduce the chance of your tea being contaminated. I recently asked
Upton Tea about how they ensure that their teas are organic - they
told me that they do test most of the organic teas from time to time
to make sure everything is ok. I also read that in 2000 the EU
introduced new standards for tea. The number of restricted chemicals
jumped from 7 to 134. From what I understand, these standards actually
require testing of the end product as opposed to merely making sure no
pesticides are used, etc. According to this China Daily article the
result of the new EU regulations was that in 2001 tea exports from
China to the EU dropped by 37%. (http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/english/
doc/2004-04/13/content_322923.htm) (Sorry, not trying to pick on
Chinese teas.) As a result I have tried ordering some teas from the
EU. Specifically I ordered some teas from Jing Tea in the UK. (http://
jingtea.com/). The only problem is expense.

Another tea shop that actually tests every tea they sell is a German
tea company (Tea Gschwender) which has a shop in Chicago that you can
order from. I just tried something from there as well. They seem to
be slow in stocking new Chinese greens and oolongs. (http://
www.teagschwendner.com/)

I have to admit I'm still trying to figure out exactly what the US and
other organic certifications really mean. I do find the concept of
actually testing the tea easier to understand!

Good luck in you search for toxin-free tea. I'm doing the same.



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Old 17-09-2007, 02:51 AM posted to rec.food.drink.tea
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Default worried about pesticides in tea?

On Sep 16, 3:32 am, Tea Sunrise wrote:
Since a lot of the tea we drink comes from China and Indonesia, are
you ever worried that the tea leaves were sprayed with pesticides such
as DDT or other harmful chemicals? I'd hate to think that I could
be drinking a cup full of toxins or pesticides along with my EGCG.

Is the correct move to switch to organic teas? Does anyone really
know if tea bushes are completely safe for consumption?

Any input is highly apprec


I don't think there's a need to switch from non-organic to organic tea
(Camellia Sinensis). Pollution in some of the Tea producing countries
has become rampant due to recent economic booms while enviromental
laws,unfortunately, have literally become un-enforceable. Organic teas
are sold at a premium price but do not offer the "purity" you
seek,unless you grow it yourself. Dominics response I believe covers
this subject very clearly .Good Luck

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Old 17-09-2007, 03:34 AM posted to rec.food.drink.tea
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Default worried about pesticides in tea?

Organic teas are sold at a premium price but do not offer the "purity" you
seek,unless you grow it yourself.


That's quite correct. There are organic teas grown and produced in
China. But don't fool yourself. Many places in China are heavily
polluted. And pollution knows no borders. So, say your farm is
organic, there is nothing you can do to prevent chemicals from rain
leaching and accumulating in the soil; or chemicals in dust and
residues blown in by the wind. Even if you grew tea yourself in China,
there is nothing you can do to ensure it's 100% pure. There's only so
much a person can do. In China, "clean and pure" just means,
relatively speaking, as clean and pure as can be, giving the
environmental circumstances of the country. So, farmers try to grow
good tea as far as possible away from human settlement - up in some
tea mountains somewhere. Then, the cheap tea they grow in gardens
around their houses - and that stuff is polluted and contaminated like
heck.



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Old 17-09-2007, 03:51 AM posted to rec.food.drink.tea
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Who knows what truly goes on in Chinese "inspections".
Mydnight, do you know exactly what are the criteria for organic
growing in China and if there are qualified inspectors who actually
inspect?
In my mind, you're probably bound to get a hellofalot more poisons in
an FDA inspected American hot dog than you would in a cup of Chinese


In China, there are no serious inspections to see such a thing done
and any certification can be bought with the right amount of money or
copied and printed. I had lunch with someone from the 'something
something something something department of agriculture something
something position in Guangdong' (the Chinese love their titles more
than Westerners), and he avoided all conversation on this topic.

The closest thing to organic I've seen so far has been my good
friend's relatives farm where they hand pick any insects out of their
crops and use aphids. They have some excellently fresh veggies.

Tea. Drink at your own risk.

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Old 17-09-2007, 10:11 AM posted to rec.food.drink.tea
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Default worried about pesticides in tea?


wrote in message
oups.com...
On Sep 16, 3:32 am, Tea Sunrise wrote:
Since a lot of the tea we drink comes from China and Indonesia, are
you ever worried that the tea leaves were sprayed with pesticides such
as DDT or other harmful chemicals? I'd hate to think that I could
be drinking a cup full of toxins or pesticides along with my EGCG.

Is the correct move to switch to organic teas? Does anyone really
know if tea bushes are completely safe for consumption?

Any input is highly appreciated. thanks.


I completely agree with you. I recently read a newspaper article
about a woman who became ill due to drinking green tea which was
contaminated with DDT (she drink the same tea for a couple of years -
a cheap Chinese green tea). While I agree that "going organic" is no
guarantee of avoiding toxins, I do think that going organic can help
to reduce the chance of your tea being contaminated. I recently asked
Upton Tea about how they ensure that their teas are organic - they
told me that they do test most of the organic teas from time to time
to make sure everything is ok. I also read that in 2000 the EU
introduced new standards for tea. The number of restricted chemicals
jumped from 7 to 134. From what I understand, these standards actually
require testing of the end product as opposed to merely making sure no
pesticides are used, etc. According to this China Daily article the
result of the new EU regulations was that in 2001 tea exports from
China to the EU dropped by 37%. (http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/english/
doc/2004-04/13/content_322923.htm) (Sorry, not trying to pick on
Chinese teas.) As a result I have tried ordering some teas from the
EU. Specifically I ordered some teas from Jing Tea in the UK. (http://
jingtea.com/). The only problem is expense.

Another tea shop that actually tests every tea they sell is a German
tea company (Tea Gschwender) which has a shop in Chicago that you can
order from. I just tried something from there as well. They seem to
be slow in stocking new Chinese greens and oolongs. (http://
www.teagschwendner.com/)

I have to admit I'm still trying to figure out exactly what the US and
other organic certifications really mean. I do find the concept of
actually testing the tea easier to understand!

Good luck in you search for toxin-free tea. I'm doing the same.



This brings up something I've been meaning to ask the group...if I wanted to
take a sample of tea from my cupboard and get it analyzed for pesticides
etc., how would I go aobut doing that? I imagine a lab, but what kind, how
would I find one, and would they do such a thing for a member of the general
public?

Melinda


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Old 17-09-2007, 03:05 PM posted to rec.food.drink.tea
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Default worried about pesticides in tea?

On Sep 16, 12:32 pm, Tea Sunrise wrote:
Since a lot of the tea we drink comes from China and Indonesia, are
you ever worried that the tea leaves were sprayed with pesticides such
as DDT or other harmful chemicals? I'd hate to think that I could
be drinking a cup full of toxins or pesticides along with my EGCG.

Is the correct move to switch to organic teas? Does anyone really
know if tea bushes are completely safe for consumption?

Any input is highly appreciated. thanks.


Organic Certificates are being sold by these certifying agencies at
diffrent price tags like - if you pay a very high fees - you are
organic within 6 months, if the amount paid is lower - 15 months, if
still lower than 24 months..... the story goes on.. bottomline is if
you have cash you can become organic real quick otherwise dont even
think or imagine getting a certificate... it just wont happen - no
matter how good you are...

Organic Organic and Organic has just turned out to be a marketing
gimmick. a small example - a big group in india buys several gardens
as they switch from one trade to another and in a small time span all
their gardens are certified organic ..... hey a land and a bush that
were on chemicals for over 100 years suddenly becomes organic - 100%
in 6 months or a year - is that possible? the answer friends lies with
us.

I think that we should study the source that we buy from - by that i
mean the manufacturing source and whenever we buy teas from our US
wholeseller or retailer we should ask him to provide us with a
pysiochemical certificate for the teas he is carrying. this
certificate is provided by the lab, they provide details like the
moisture content, the ash content, blah blah and the main part is that
they provide the pesticide analysis (dicofol, ethion, quinolphos,
fenzaquin, glyphospate, melathion, diazinon, fenamiphos, propargite)
these are the common chemicals that the lab tests.. this certificate
only costs 150 USD to 200 USD per tea. this will help the person
market his teas better and he will also be able to make a loyal
clientale for himself...

if the american tea association or any body can make a law that any
person selling tea to US wholesellers, retailers or consumers has to
provide this certificate for the tea he sells - i think our job in
deciding which tea to drink will be easier, it will also make the
manufacturers more conscious.

we have to make things more realistic and stop companies from taking
advantage of this word organic, they are fooling consumers and
charging a very high price for something that is actually not worth
it.

if anyne wants to see a copy of the physiochemical certificate -
please feel free to e-mail me and ask for one.







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