Sourdough (rec.food.sourdough) Discussing the hobby or craft of baking with sourdough. We are not just a recipe group, Our charter is to discuss the care, feeding, and breeding of yeasts and lactobacilli that make up sourdough cultures.

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  #41 (permalink)   Report Post  
Charles Perry
 
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Dick Adams wrote:
>
> Do you think this bread looks like cornbread?
>


Well, maybe not cornbread as in bread made from corn. But, it
probably looks like korn bread as in bread made with whole or
almost whole grains.

Those old Germanic bakers were always telling the cookbook
authors that rrrreal Pumpernickle had korn (whole grain)in it and
the cookbook authors went along and added corn(maize)meal to the
recipes that they (cookbook authora)invented. There is no
putting the genie back in the bottle despite the best efforts of
the Pumpernickle Police.

Regards,

Charles
--
Charles Perry
Reply to:

** A balanced diet is a cookie in each hand **
  #42 (permalink)   Report Post  
Dick Adams
 
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"Charles Perry" > wrote in message =
...

> Those old Germanic bakers were always telling the cookbook
> authors that rrrreal Pumpernickle had korn (whole grain)in it and
> the cookbook authors went along and added corn(maize)meal to the
> recipes that they (cookbook authora)invented. =20


They were, for the most part, dead before the present glut of bake
book writers, except if you include old Samartha, who actually has not
written a book yet, so far as I know, but maybe we can count his web
site and posts.

Anyway, I wish to make it clear that I am not confused about corn
and korn. It is just that I could not get any korn so I used corn =
instead.
Well, I could get chopped korn (as rye chops), but only in 50-pound=20
sacks, but I am not ready to commit at that scale.

Surprisingly, the chopped corn softened up in my two-day process
without any extreme measures, like "soakers". Mrs. Adams, who has
tender teeth, is eating the present loaf without misgiving, thinking =
that
it is actual pumpernickel. But, as I have mentioned, she is Swedish,
which is not so good as German when it comes to being finicky
about pumpernickel.

--
DickA



  #43 (permalink)   Report Post  
Dick Adams
 
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"Charles Perry" > wrote in message =
...

> Those old Germanic bakers were always telling the cookbook
> authors that rrrreal Pumpernickle had korn (whole grain)in it and
> the cookbook authors went along and added corn(maize)meal to the
> recipes that they (cookbook authora)invented. =20


They were, for the most part, dead before the present glut of bake
book writers, except if you include old Samartha, who actually has not
written a book yet, so far as I know, but maybe we can count his web
site and posts.

Anyway, I wish to make it clear that I am not confused about corn
and korn. It is just that I could not get any korn so I used corn =
instead.
Well, I could get chopped korn (as rye chops), but only in 50-pound=20
sacks, but I am not ready to commit at that scale.

Surprisingly, the chopped corn softened up in my two-day process
without any extreme measures, like "soakers". Mrs. Adams, who has
tender teeth, is eating the present loaf without misgiving, thinking =
that
it is actual pumpernickel. But, as I have mentioned, she is Swedish,
which is not so good as German when it comes to being finicky
about pumpernickel.

--
DickA



  #44 (permalink)   Report Post  
Ulrike Westphal
 
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"Charles Perry" > schrieb im Newsbeitrag
...
>
>
> Dick Adams wrote:
> >
> > Do you think this bread looks like cornbread?
> >

>
> Well, maybe not cornbread as in bread made from corn. But, it
> probably looks like korn bread as in bread made with whole or
> almost whole grains.
>
> Those old Germanic bakers were always telling the cookbook
> authors that rrrreal Pumpernickle had korn (whole grain)in it and
> the cookbook authors went along and added corn(maize)meal to the
> recipes that they (cookbook authora)invented. There is no
> putting the genie back in the bottle despite the best efforts of
> the Pumpernickle Police.
>
> Regards,
>
> Charles
> --
> Charles Perry
> Reply to:
>
> ** A balanced diet is a cookie in each hand **


I apologize: I should have said "Dreikornbrot", perhaps to translate with
"Three-grain-bread"??

To be correct: The German "Korn" is not grain in PUPO's sense. A
"Five-grain- bread " may contain (Oil)seeds like sunflower, flax or sesame.
A "Fuenfkornbrot" has five types of grain from the following bread- grains
which belongs to the graminaceous: corn (maize, indian corn), rye, wheat,
oat, spelt, rice, barley, millet and buckwheat. So the real German
pumpernickel has only rye, wheat and old bread and seeds from rye and/or
wheat.

So it's all a kind of definition what you'll understand....

Who cares for definitions, if it is the taste that counts???

Ulrike


  #45 (permalink)   Report Post  
Ulrike Westphal
 
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Default


"Charles Perry" > schrieb im Newsbeitrag
...
>
>
> Dick Adams wrote:
> >
> > Do you think this bread looks like cornbread?
> >

>
> Well, maybe not cornbread as in bread made from corn. But, it
> probably looks like korn bread as in bread made with whole or
> almost whole grains.
>
> Those old Germanic bakers were always telling the cookbook
> authors that rrrreal Pumpernickle had korn (whole grain)in it and
> the cookbook authors went along and added corn(maize)meal to the
> recipes that they (cookbook authora)invented. There is no
> putting the genie back in the bottle despite the best efforts of
> the Pumpernickle Police.
>
> Regards,
>
> Charles
> --
> Charles Perry
> Reply to:
>
> ** A balanced diet is a cookie in each hand **


I apologize: I should have said "Dreikornbrot", perhaps to translate with
"Three-grain-bread"??

To be correct: The German "Korn" is not grain in PUPO's sense. A
"Five-grain- bread " may contain (Oil)seeds like sunflower, flax or sesame.
A "Fuenfkornbrot" has five types of grain from the following bread- grains
which belongs to the graminaceous: corn (maize, indian corn), rye, wheat,
oat, spelt, rice, barley, millet and buckwheat. So the real German
pumpernickel has only rye, wheat and old bread and seeds from rye and/or
wheat.

So it's all a kind of definition what you'll understand....

Who cares for definitions, if it is the taste that counts???

Ulrike




  #46 (permalink)   Report Post  
Ulrike Westphal
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Ulrike Westphal" > schrieb im Newsbeitrag
...
>
> "Charles Perry" > schrieb im Newsbeitrag
> ...
> >
> >
> > Dick Adams wrote:
> > >
> > > Do you think this bread looks like cornbread?
> > >

> >
> > Well, maybe not cornbread as in bread made from corn. But, it
> > probably looks like korn bread as in bread made with whole or
> > almost whole grains.
> >
> > Those old Germanic bakers were always telling the cookbook
> > authors that rrrreal Pumpernickle had korn (whole grain)in it and
> > the cookbook authors went along and added corn(maize)meal to the
> > recipes that they (cookbook authora)invented. There is no
> > putting the genie back in the bottle despite the best efforts of
> > the Pumpernickle Police.
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Charles
> > --
> > Charles Perry
> > Reply to:
> >
> > ** A balanced diet is a cookie in each hand **

>
> I apologize: I should have said "Dreikornbrot", perhaps to translate with
> "Three-grain-bread"??
>
> To be correct: The German "Korn" is not grain in PUPO's sense. A
> "Five-grain- bread " may contain (Oil)seeds like sunflower, flax or

sesame.
> A "Fuenfkornbrot" has five types of grain from the following bread- grains
> which belongs to the graminaceous: corn (maize, indian corn), rye, wheat,
> oat, spelt, rice, barley, millet and buckwheat. So the real German
> pumpernickel has only rye, wheat and old bread and seeds from rye and/or
> wheat.
>
> So it's all a kind of definition what you'll understand....
>
> Who cares for definitions, if it is the taste that counts???
>
> Ulrike

I forgot to add:
As long as I have not to take Dick's bread - whatever it is - as a
pumpernickel ....

Ulrike


  #47 (permalink)   Report Post  
Ulrike Westphal
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Ulrike Westphal" > schrieb im Newsbeitrag
...
>
> "Charles Perry" > schrieb im Newsbeitrag
> ...
> >
> >
> > Dick Adams wrote:
> > >
> > > Do you think this bread looks like cornbread?
> > >

> >
> > Well, maybe not cornbread as in bread made from corn. But, it
> > probably looks like korn bread as in bread made with whole or
> > almost whole grains.
> >
> > Those old Germanic bakers were always telling the cookbook
> > authors that rrrreal Pumpernickle had korn (whole grain)in it and
> > the cookbook authors went along and added corn(maize)meal to the
> > recipes that they (cookbook authora)invented. There is no
> > putting the genie back in the bottle despite the best efforts of
> > the Pumpernickle Police.
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > Charles
> > --
> > Charles Perry
> > Reply to:
> >
> > ** A balanced diet is a cookie in each hand **

>
> I apologize: I should have said "Dreikornbrot", perhaps to translate with
> "Three-grain-bread"??
>
> To be correct: The German "Korn" is not grain in PUPO's sense. A
> "Five-grain- bread " may contain (Oil)seeds like sunflower, flax or

sesame.
> A "Fuenfkornbrot" has five types of grain from the following bread- grains
> which belongs to the graminaceous: corn (maize, indian corn), rye, wheat,
> oat, spelt, rice, barley, millet and buckwheat. So the real German
> pumpernickel has only rye, wheat and old bread and seeds from rye and/or
> wheat.
>
> So it's all a kind of definition what you'll understand....
>
> Who cares for definitions, if it is the taste that counts???
>
> Ulrike

I forgot to add:
As long as I have not to take Dick's bread - whatever it is - as a
pumpernickel ....

Ulrike


  #48 (permalink)   Report Post  
Dick Adams
 
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"Ulrike Westphal" > wrote in message =
...

> > Who cares for definitions, if it is the taste that counts???

> I forgot to add:
> As long as I have not to take Dick's bread - whatever it is - as a
> pumpernickel ....


What ever it is? It's yummy, that's what.

Wife and kids can't get enough of it.

None left for the birds.

Too soggy to hurt dogs.

Etc.=20

The point is that conditions for slow cook of breads like pumpernickel
can probably be gotten with a crock pot.

Still a theory, at this writing.

---
DickA

  #49 (permalink)   Report Post  
Dick Adams
 
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Default


"Ulrike Westphal" > wrote in message =
...

> > Who cares for definitions, if it is the taste that counts???

> I forgot to add:
> As long as I have not to take Dick's bread - whatever it is - as a
> pumpernickel ....


What ever it is? It's yummy, that's what.

Wife and kids can't get enough of it.

None left for the birds.

Too soggy to hurt dogs.

Etc.=20

The point is that conditions for slow cook of breads like pumpernickel
can probably be gotten with a crock pot.

Still a theory, at this writing.

---
DickA

  #50 (permalink)   Report Post  
J Boehm
 
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t very bad.
>
> I find your recipe very interesting - do you know any more about the
> background of the timings or is there a source where you got it?


No complications with this simple recipe. I punch the dough down twice,
sometimes three times. Bake it from cold at 200-220C for about 40 minutes.
Someone said he gets a rise of 100% in the oven. Here I don't get that,
the volume is increased before I put it into the oven.
JB


  #51 (permalink)   Report Post  
J Boehm
 
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t very bad.
>
> I find your recipe very interesting - do you know any more about the
> background of the timings or is there a source where you got it?


No complications with this simple recipe. I punch the dough down twice,
sometimes three times. Bake it from cold at 200-220C for about 40 minutes.
Someone said he gets a rise of 100% in the oven. Here I don't get that,
the volume is increased before I put it into the oven.
JB
  #52 (permalink)   Report Post  
Art Sackett
 
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Wooly > wrote:
> Where I'm from cornbread is made from a combination of wheat and corn
> flour.


:-) In my house, there's no wheat at all in cornbread. :-)

--
Art Sackett,
Patron Saint of Drunken Fornication
  #53 (permalink)   Report Post  
Art Sackett
 
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Wooly > wrote:
> Where I'm from cornbread is made from a combination of wheat and corn
> flour.


:-) In my house, there's no wheat at all in cornbread. :-)

--
Art Sackett,
Patron Saint of Drunken Fornication
  #54 (permalink)   Report Post  
Ulrike Westphal
 
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"Art Sackett" > schrieb im Newsbeitrag
...
> Wooly > wrote:
> > Where I'm from cornbread is made from a combination of wheat and corn
> > flour.

>
> :-) In my house, there's no wheat at all in cornbread. :-)
>
> --
> Art Sackett,
> Patron Saint of Drunken Fornication


When in Rome do as the Romans do


  #55 (permalink)   Report Post  
Ulrike Westphal
 
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"Art Sackett" > schrieb im Newsbeitrag
...
> Wooly > wrote:
> > Where I'm from cornbread is made from a combination of wheat and corn
> > flour.

>
> :-) In my house, there's no wheat at all in cornbread. :-)
>
> --
> Art Sackett,
> Patron Saint of Drunken Fornication


When in Rome do as the Romans do




  #56 (permalink)   Report Post  
Dick Adams
 
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"Art Sackett" > wrote in message =
...
=20
> :-) In my house, there's no wheat at all in cornbread. :-)


Probably no bread in "corn", either.

> Art Sackett, Patron Saint of Drunken Fornication


Sainthood is not a big thing at r.f.s. Try another tag line.
  #57 (permalink)   Report Post  
Dick Adams
 
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"Art Sackett" > wrote in message =
...
=20
> :-) In my house, there's no wheat at all in cornbread. :-)


Probably no bread in "corn", either.

> Art Sackett, Patron Saint of Drunken Fornication


Sainthood is not a big thing at r.f.s. Try another tag line.
  #58 (permalink)   Report Post  
Art Sackett
 
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Dick Adams > wrote:

> Sainthood is not a big thing at r.f.s. Try another tag line.


Good naturedly and smiling:

Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time, and it annoys
the pig.

Personally, when I find someone in Usenet offensive in some way, I just
edit my killfile and get on with my life. It preserves bandwidth and
storage, avoids pointless conflict, and maybe even allows me to look a
little bit more gentlemanly than I truly am (which ain't much).

That all said, I've learned a lot from your generous postings here in
r.f.s and I genuinely appreciate your knowledge and the fact that you
share it freely. Thank you.

--
Art Sackett,
Patron Saint of Drunken Fornication
  #59 (permalink)   Report Post  
Dick Adams
 
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"Art Sackett" > wrote in message =
...

> That all said, I've learned a lot from your generous postings here in=20
> r.f.s ...


Well, I guess you are not all bad.

So go ahead with your inspirations of drunken fornication if that's
what you want to do.

-d.a.
  #60 (permalink)   Report Post  
Art Sackett
 
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Dick Adams > wrote:

> Well, I guess you are not all bad.


:-) Thanks. I try not to be *all* bad. Heck, the little yeasties in the
crock in the fridge and the worms in the garden, we get along just
fine. I feed them, they feed me, it works out.

> So go ahead with your inspirations of drunken fornication if that's
> what you want to do.


I shall, thanks. Along with baking up a couple of loaves of bread each
week, making wines and soft drinks, and all that other stuff that keeps
me occupied when I'm not caught up in that highly overrated pastime,
working for a living.

--
Art Sackett,
Patron Saint of Drunken Fornication
  #61 (permalink)   Report Post  
Art Sackett
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Dick Adams > wrote:

> Well, I guess you are not all bad.


:-) Thanks. I try not to be *all* bad. Heck, the little yeasties in the
crock in the fridge and the worms in the garden, we get along just
fine. I feed them, they feed me, it works out.

> So go ahead with your inspirations of drunken fornication if that's
> what you want to do.


I shall, thanks. Along with baking up a couple of loaves of bread each
week, making wines and soft drinks, and all that other stuff that keeps
me occupied when I'm not caught up in that highly overrated pastime,
working for a living.

--
Art Sackett,
Patron Saint of Drunken Fornication
  #62 (permalink)   Report Post  
Art Sackett
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Dick Adams > wrote:

> Well, I guess you are not all bad.


:-) Thanks. I try not to be *all* bad. Heck, the little yeasties in the
crock in the fridge and the worms in the garden, we get along just
fine. I feed them, they feed me, it works out.

> So go ahead with your inspirations of drunken fornication if that's
> what you want to do.


I shall, thanks. Along with baking up a couple of loaves of bread each
week, making wines and soft drinks, and all that other stuff that keeps
me occupied when I'm not caught up in that highly overrated pastime,
working for a living.

--
Art Sackett,
Patron Saint of Drunken Fornication
  #63 (permalink)   Report Post  
Art Sackett
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Dick Adams > wrote:

> Well, I guess you are not all bad.


:-) Thanks. I try not to be *all* bad. Heck, the little yeasties in the
crock in the fridge and the worms in the garden, we get along just
fine. I feed them, they feed me, it works out.

> So go ahead with your inspirations of drunken fornication if that's
> what you want to do.


I shall, thanks. Along with baking up a couple of loaves of bread each
week, making wines and soft drinks, and all that other stuff that keeps
me occupied when I'm not caught up in that highly overrated pastime,
working for a living.

--
Art Sackett,
Patron Saint of Drunken Fornication
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