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Sourdough (rec.food.sourdough) Discussing the hobby or craft of baking with sourdough. We are not just a recipe group, Our charter is to discuss the care, feeding, and breeding of yeasts and lactobacilli that make up sourdough cultures. |
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Crust is too hard
My sourdough bread rises fine and bakes nice, but the crust
is too hard. I don't use any spray or water in a pan. Is there something I can do to make a more tender crust? Ernie |
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Crust is too hard
Multiple spraying of water onto loafs during baking makes disgustingly
thin crust. Falling asleep while baking can make amazingly thick, dark and smelly crust. S. Ernie wrote: > > My sourdough bread rises fine and bakes nice, but the crust > is too hard. I don't use any spray or water in a pan. Is > there something I can do to make a more tender crust? > Ernie -- remove -nospam from my email address, if there is one SD page is the http://samartha.net/SD/ |
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Crust is too hard
Samantha,
When I first started baking San Francisco Sourdough bread I put a pan of water in the oven like the directions said and sprayed it for a nice crispy crust. It was so hard that I quit using any water altogether. It is still so hard and thick that I can hardly cut it. I bake it for 65 minutes at 400 deg. I looks great and tastes fine although it isn't quite as sour as I like, but it has a crust like a coconut. Does the kneading time have any effect on crust hardness and thickness? Ernie "Samartha Deva" > wrote in message ... > Multiple spraying of water onto loafs during baking makes disgustingly > thin crust. > > Falling asleep while baking can make amazingly thick, dark and smelly > crust. > > S. > > Ernie wrote: > > > > My sourdough bread rises fine and bakes nice, but the crust > > is too hard. I don't use any spray or water in a pan. Is > > there something I can do to make a more tender crust? > > Ernie > > -- > remove -nospam from my email address, if there is one > SD page is the http://samartha.net/SD/ |
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Crust is too hard
On Thu, 18 Dec 2003 00:42:29 GMT, "Ernie"
> wrote: >I bake it for 65 minutes at >400 deg. Howdy, That is the sort of time and temperature that would be appropriate for a huge (3-4 Kilo) loaf. If yours are smaller than that you might want to try a temperature of about 450F for 35 minutes or so. That is likely to make for a thinner crust. Also, if you prefer a tender crust, you can paint the loaf with milk or butter just before baking... HTH, -- Kenneth If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS." |
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Crust is too hard
Well Ernie,
I thought that spraying water _onto_ the loafs during baking would make good crust and the result was a paper thin hull giving in with a light finger's touch, which I did not like. Then I started thinking that spraying the water was the cause for the thin crust, stopped doing it and the thin crusts disappeared. I don't know how big your loafs are - size is definitely an issue, smaller loaf = thicker crust, all else the same. Baking time definitely has an influence, longer = thicker crust. Your 65 minutes sound long. My loafs usually bake within 35/40 minutes, that's the 1500 g rye/wheat mix. When I have white breads, they go usually faster, depending on size. If I bake longer, the bread gets thicker and darker crust. I have not experimented with lower temperature and longer baking times. Some bakeries claim 2+ hour baking times. I have a $ 6.- meat thermometer and when the middle of the loaf has 180 F, it's done. That happens usually at the times given above. Kneading time, dough development sure has influence on crust but I think it's mainly baking time and temperature, maybe steam. Why do you need to bake 65 minutes and what is your loaf size? It would be interesting to see when you reach the 180 F (some say 190 F) in the middle of the loaf so you know when you are done and don't need to accumulate more crust. Samartha Ernie wrote: > > Samantha, > When I first started baking San Francisco Sourdough bread I > put a pan of water in the oven like the directions said and > sprayed it for a nice crispy crust. It was so hard that I > quit using any water altogether. It is still so hard and > thick that I can hardly cut it. I bake it for 65 minutes at > 400 deg. I looks great and tastes fine although it isn't > quite as sour as I like, but it has a crust like a coconut. > Does the kneading time have any effect on crust hardness and > thickness? > Ernie -- remove -nospam from my email address, if there is one SD page is the http://samartha.net/SD/ |
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Crust is too hard
Ernie wrote:
> > My sourdough bread rises fine and bakes nice, but the crust > is too hard. I don't use any spray or water in a pan. Is > there something I can do to make a more tender crust? > Ernie If you want to get soft crust then after you pull it from the oven and while it is still hot rub it with some butter or margarine. The crust will be like the crust in commercial white bread. Personally I like a good firm crust that crunches when I bite into it. Bert |
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Crust is too hard
"Ernie" >wrote in message=20 . .. > Is there something I can do to make a more tender crust? Assuming the bread is made and baked properly, you can bag it in plastic after a short interval of cooling. Keep it in the bag for a few hours, and the crust will soften. That is much too easy, and you may prefer to do it in a more intricate and hopeless way, particularly as there is a minute=20 hazard of mold growth for a loaf stored too moist (or any amount of moist). |
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Crust is too hard
Dick Adams wrote:
> That is much too easy, and you may prefer to do it in a more > intricate and hopeless way, particularly as there is a minute > hazard of mold growth for a loaf stored too moist (or any > amount of moist). Minute? Not minute. David |
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Crust is too hard
I might suggest that you bake it at about 400=B0 for not more than 35-40 =
minutes. At 65 minutes, you should need a hack saw to cut it! :>) "Ernie" > wrote in message = ... > quit using any water altogether. It is still so hard and > thick that I can hardly cut it. I bake it for 65 minutes at > 400 deg. I looks great and tastes fine although it isn't |
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Crust is too hard
On Thu, 18 Dec 2003 09:49:00 GMT, "Pawnee" >
wrote: >I might suggest that you bake it at about 400° for not more than 35-40 minutes. At 65 minutes, you should need a hack saw to cut it! :>) > > >"Ernie" > wrote in message ... > >> quit using any water altogether. It is still so hard and >> thick that I can hardly cut it. I bake it for 65 minutes at >> 400 deg. I looks great and tastes fine although it isn't Hi Ernie, You might want to change your posting settings. Right now, your lines are so long that we have to scroll way out across the very wide page as you see above... HTH, -- Kenneth If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS." |
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Crust is too hard
Thanks for the good information.
The consensus seems to be that I am baking it too long. I was using Jan Jaworski's Internet Directions for Authentic Sourdough Bread. I tried cooking it for less time once and wound up with a crust that didn't get dark on top and was raw in the middle. I will try Samantha's suggestion for using a meat thermometer. If that doesn't work I will try Kenneth's suggestion of painting the crust with milk. Pawnee is correct about needing a hack saw to cut it. I changed my post settings from 60 characterd per line to 50, I hope that is better Kenneth. Bert if you tried my coconut crust you might change your mind about liking a good hard crust. It actually cracks and pops when I take it out of the oven. Dick, I think it would take a week in a plastic bag before this crust got soft. David, Other than the caps I don't see any difference between Minute and minute? Thanks again everyone. Ernie |
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Crust is too hard
Ernie wrote:
> I changed my post settings > from 60 characterd per line to 50, 70 is about right, but newsreaders should be able to wrap long lines anyway. I never saw that wide-line-screen business until it was copied out that way. > David, Other than the caps I don't see any > difference between Minute and minute? A very small difference. B/ |
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Crust is too hard
Ernie wrote:
> My sourdough bread rises fine and bakes nice, but the crust > is too hard. I don't use any spray or water in a pan. Is > there something I can do to make a more tender crust? > Ernie Have you check the tempture of your oven. Joe (:-) |
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Crust is too hard
"Joe Umstead" > wrote in message ... > Ernie wrote: > > > My sourdough bread rises fine and bakes nice, but the crust > > is too hard. I don't use any spray or water in a pan. Is > > there something I can do to make a more tender crust? > > Ernie > > Have you check the tempture of your oven. > > Joe (:-) Thanks for the idea Joe, but it is correct. Ernie |
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Crust is too hard
"Ernie" > wrote in message=20 . com... > [ ... ] > Dick, I think it would take a week in a plastic bag before=20 > this crust got soft. Not much would happen in a week that would not happen in a couple of hours. But if you have baked the smithereens out of your loaf, nothing will happen at all because there is too little moisture left. Another possibility is to cover the loaves with something that keeps the moisture from escaping, while they are cooling. Also, loaves can be rehydrated to an extent by placing them under a cover with something damp, like wetted sponges or dishtowels (beside, not on). Several hours of that will make=20 a difference. Ernie, you do not want to know this, because it is simple- minded. It is just that there may be someone simpleminded out there who may follow this thread. --- DickA |
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Crust is too hard
Darva Conger wrote:
> oddly, his post wraps just fine for me.... Your email client is wrapping it. Unfortunately, certain clients may not wrap the lines in outgoing messages, so readers that don't compensate for that have trouble. In Netscrape (what I'm using now) you can tell it to auto-wrap, but it is designed poorly so I end up formatting manually. Pine is much better with that. David |
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Crust is too hard
And me . . . .
"Darva Conger" > wrote in message = nk.net... > >You might want to change your posting settings. Right now, your lines > >are so long that we have to scroll way out across the very wide page > >as you see above... > > > >HTH, >=20 > oddly, his post wraps just fine for me.... |
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Crust is too hard (Thanks Everyone)
Well today I baked a great loaf of San Francisco
Sourdough bread thanks to everyone's help. I used a meat thermometer and set the oven to 450 degrees like Samantha suggested. I set the timer for 35 minutes and the bread was actually 185 degrees in 35 minutes. The crust is a beautiful dark brown, and crispy, but not too hard. It still isn't quite as good as my favorite San Francisco commercial bakery, but now I can do a lot of experimenting. Ernie |
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Crust is too hard (Thanks Everyone)
Ernie,
good, there is some progress in your direction. What I suggest is that you get a spray bottle with water and maybe every 10 minutes during baking, maybe two times, mist the loaf so it's wet on the upper surface and you may get a very thin crust. You probably need to turn it 180 degrees with some tool (I use something similar to this: http://store6.yimg.com/I/thelefthand_1763_37401 - works fine with loafs to 1500 g - 3+ lb.) This is what I did with the result described - of cause, that's not what I wanted, but that's how things work - trying, failing, avoiding the potholes next time, of cause there are new one's coming up right away, makes life interesting... :-) Good luck, Samartha Ernie wrote: > > Well today I baked a great loaf of San Francisco > Sourdough bread thanks to everyone's help. I used > a meat thermometer and set the oven to 450 degrees > like Samantha suggested. I set the timer for 35 > minutes and the bread was actually 185 degrees in > 35 minutes. The crust is a beautiful dark brown, > and crispy, but not too hard. It still isn't > quite as good as my favorite San Francisco > commercial bakery, but now I can do a lot of > experimenting. > Ernie -- remove -nospam from my email address, if there is one SD page is the http://samartha.net/SD/ |
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Crust is too hard (Thanks Everyone)
Thank you Samantha,
I liked the crust I got on the last loaf I baked, it was thick, crunchy and chewy. I was afraid to use water because I thought it would make another coconut crust. Glad you told me that it makes a thinner crust, I will try it. I also have to work on larger holes and a more sour flavor. I think I will try some rye flour in the next loaf to see if that will give me a more sour flavor and make the mixture a little wetter for larger holes. Now that I am close there are lots of things I can experiment with. The only thing I need now is someone to help eat it. Thanks Ernie "Samartha Deva" > wrote in message ... > Ernie, > > good, there is some progress in your direction. What I suggest is that > you get a spray bottle with water and maybe every 10 minutes during > baking, maybe two times, mist the loaf so it's wet on the upper surface > and you may get a very thin crust. You probably need to turn it 180 > degrees with some tool (I use something similar to this: > http://store6.yimg.com/I/thelefthand_1763_37401 - works fine with loafs > to 1500 g - 3+ lb.) This is what I did with the result described - of > cause, that's not what I wanted, but that's how things work - trying, > failing, avoiding the potholes next time, of cause there are new one's > coming up right away, makes life interesting... :-) > > > Good luck, > > Samartha > > > > Ernie wrote: > > > > Well today I baked a great loaf of San Francisco > > Sourdough bread thanks to everyone's help. I used > > a meat thermometer and set the oven to 450 degrees > > like Samantha suggested. I set the timer for 35 > > minutes and the bread was actually 185 degrees in > > 35 minutes. The crust is a beautiful dark brown, > > and crispy, but not too hard. It still isn't > > quite as good as my favorite San Francisco > > commercial bakery, but now I can do a lot of > > experimenting. > > Ernie > > -- > remove -nospam from my email address, if there is one > SD page is the http://samartha.net/SD/ |
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Crust is too hard (Thanks Everyone)
On Sat, 20 Dec 2003 04:12:00 GMT, "Ernie"
> wrote: >like Samantha suggested. LOL! He/She/It is the wicked witch of sourdough. -- Map Of The Vast Right Wing Conspiracy: http://www.freewebs.com/vrwc/ |
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Crust is too hard (Thanks Everyone)
On Fri, 19 Dec 2003 21:46:40 -0700, Samartha Deva
> wrote: >Ernie, >good, there is some progress in your direction. And "Samantha" didn't even spot the reference. -- Map Of The Vast Right Wing Conspiracy: http://www.freewebs.com/vrwc/ |
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Crust is too hard (Thanks Everyone)
On Sat, 20 Dec 2003 14:56:23 GMT, "Ernie"
> wrote: >Thank you Samantha, This is too much. If you keep this up I am going to break a rib laughing so hard. -- Map Of The Vast Right Wing Conspiracy: http://www.freewebs.com/vrwc/ |
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Crust is too hard (Thanks Everyone)
And if you keep this up you are going in my kill file!
Ernie "Bob" > wrote in message ... > On Sat, 20 Dec 2003 14:56:23 GMT, "Ernie" > > wrote: > > >Thank you Samantha, > > This is too much. If you keep this up I am going to break a rib > laughing so hard. |
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My apology Samartha
I am sorry I Got your name wrong Samartha. I am 73 years old and
don't see very good. Thanks again for the help. Ernie |
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Crust is too hard (Thanks Everyone)
On Sat, 20 Dec 2003 15:58:08 GMT, "Ernie"
> wrote: >> >Thank you Samantha, >> This is too much. If you keep this up I am going to break a rib >> laughing so hard. >And if you keep this up you are going in my kill file! Go ahead, I don't care one bit. Be an asshole if you want - you are in good company on this forum. People around here have no sense of humor, except CrockPot Adams - and that's only because he's stoned when he posts. -- Map Of The Vast Right Wing Conspiracy: http://www.freewebs.com/vrwc/ Complete, fully thought through, professional, well-executed violence never leads to more violence because, you see, afterwards, the other guys are all dead. That's right, dead. Not 'on trial,' not 'reeducated,' not 'nurtured back into the bosom of love.' Dead. D-E-A-D. Well, you get the idea. -- USMC General Hawley |
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My apology Samartha
On Sat, 20 Dec 2003 19:01:32 GMT, "Ernie"
> wrote: >I am sorry I Got your name wrong Samartha. I am 73 years old and >don't see very good. Thanks again for the help. >Ernie Don't worry, dude. Everyone makes the same mistake. -- Map Of The Vast Right Wing Conspiracy: http://www.freewebs.com/vrwc/ Complete, fully thought through, professional, well-executed violence never leads to more violence because, you see, afterwards, the other guys are all dead. That's right, dead. Not 'on trial,' not 'reeducated,' not 'nurtured back into the bosom of love.' Dead. D-E-A-D. Well, you get the idea. -- USMC General Hawley |
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Crust is too hard (Thanks Everyone)
Good bye Bob Plunk!
Ernie "Bob" > wrote in message ... > On Sat, 20 Dec 2003 15:58:08 GMT, "Ernie" > > wrote: > > >> >Thank you Samantha, > > >> This is too much. If you keep this up I am going to break a rib > >> laughing so hard. > > >And if you keep this up you are going in my kill file! > > Go ahead, I don't care one bit. Be an asshole if you want - you are in > good company on this forum. > > People around here have no sense of humor, except CrockPot Adams - and > that's only because he's stoned when he posts. > > > -- > > Map Of The Vast Right Wing Conspiracy: > http://www.freewebs.com/vrwc/ > > Complete, fully thought through, professional, well-executed > violence never leads to more violence because, you see, > afterwards, the other guys are all dead. That's right, dead. > Not 'on trial,' not 'reeducated,' not 'nurtured back into the > bosom of love.' Dead. D-E-A-D. Well, you get the idea. > -- USMC General Hawley |
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My apology Samartha
"Bob" > wrote in message ... > On Sat, 20 Dec 2003 19:01:32 GMT, "Ernie" > > wrote: > > >I am sorry I Got your name wrong Samartha. I am 73 years old and > >don't see very good. Thanks again for the help. > >Ernie > > Don't worry, dude. Everyone makes the same mistake. LOL even my spell checker wants to call you Samantha. Ernie |
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Crust is too hard (Thanks Everyone)
"Ernie" >=20 wrote in message ... > Good bye Bob Plunk! That's plonk. Can't you get anything right? Anyway, I hope it works for you. "Bob" is revived, even for the plonkers (and plunkers), every time some one=20 replies to one of his abundant posts. --- DickA |
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Crust is too hard (Thanks Everyone)
I'll use Plonk! for you.
Ernie "Dick Adams" > wrote in message ... "Ernie" > wrote in message ... > Good bye Bob Plunk! That's plonk. Can't you get anything right? Anyway, I hope it works for you. "Bob" is revived, even for the plonkers (and plunkers), every time some one replies to one of his abundant posts. --- DickA |
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Crust is too hard (Thanks Everyone)
On Sat, 20 Dec 2003 21:42:57 GMT, "Ernie"
> wrote: >I'll use Plonk! for you. You keep this up and you just as well not be on the forum. -- Map Of The Vast Right Wing Conspiracy: http://www.freewebs.com/vrwc/ Complete, fully thought through, professional, well-executed violence never leads to more violence because, you see, afterwards, the other guys are all dead. That's right, dead. Not 'on trial,' not 'reeducated,' not 'nurtured back into the bosom of love.' Dead. D-E-A-D. Well, you get the idea. -- USMC General Hawley |
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My apology Samartha
On Sat, 20 Dec 2003 20:32:20 GMT, "Ernie"
> wrote: >"Bob" > wrote in message ... >> >I am sorry I Got your name wrong Samartha. I am 73 years old >> >and don't see very good. Thanks again for the help. >> Don't worry, dude. Everyone makes the same mistake. >LOL even my spell checker wants to call you Samantha. Your spell checker needs better glasses too - I am not Samartha. <jeez> -- Map Of The Vast Right Wing Conspiracy: http://www.freewebs.com/vrwc/ Complete, fully thought through, professional, well-executed violence never leads to more violence because, you see, afterwards, the other guys are all dead. That's right, dead. Not 'on trial,' not 'reeducated,' not 'nurtured back into the bosom of love.' Dead. D-E-A-D. Well, you get the idea. -- USMC General Hawley |
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