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Tips in Restaurant Not Going to Waitstaff
Hi, All: What's the law -- specifically, NYC ordinances/regulations/whatever -- on tips for waitstaff actually getting to them? I've confirmation now that my favorite Indian restaurant is pocketing tips customers leave for the waitstaff! The rationale is that these waitstaff get a "salary" (~$300/wk. for 6-day wks. @ 9-10 hrs./day), but I as the customer leaving a tip certainly don't know! Who do I go to about this? Better Business Bureau? Labor Dep't.? What's the law in a situation like this?? I'm rather upset that my generosity has been wasted, seeing how it wasn't management I was tipping |
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On 17 Jan 2005 15:13:22 -0800, "NYC XYZ" >
wrote: >Who do I go to about this? Better Business Bureau? Labor Dep't.? >What's the law in a situation like this?? YOU buy the restaurant and then you can make up the rules. All waitpeople must abide by the rules that were set up when they were hired. Maybe they KNOW the tip money goes to the management. What difference does it make to you? Personally, I don't care for the "tip pot" where all tips are deposited and then equally divided at the end of the shift. I bust my butt and the lazy waitperson gets the same amount as I did. |
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On 17 Jan 2005 15:13:22 -0800, "NYC XYZ" >
wrote: >Who do I go to about this? Better Business Bureau? Labor Dep't.? >What's the law in a situation like this?? YOU buy the restaurant and then you can make up the rules. All waitpeople must abide by the rules that were set up when they were hired. Maybe they KNOW the tip money goes to the management. What difference does it make to you? Personally, I don't care for the "tip pot" where all tips are deposited and then equally divided at the end of the shift. I bust my butt and the lazy waitperson gets the same amount as I did. |
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Ida Slapter wrote: > > > YOU buy the restaurant and then you can make up the rules. All > waitpeople must abide by the rules that were set up when they were > hired. Maybe they KNOW the tip money goes to the management. What > difference does it make to you? ?! Um, why do people leave tips? They leave tips to express appreciation for the service by waitstaff! (Good cooking helps put them in a charitable mood, to be sure.) If I knew my money was just going to the manangement, then I wouldn't bother leaving a tip -- I'd already paid for the meal! Frankly, I think tipping is silly to begin with -- but if it's done, it's done on account of the waitstaff, not the management! There must be something illegal about this. > Personally, I don't care for the "tip pot" where all tips are > deposited and then equally divided at the end of the shift. I bust my > butt and the lazy waitperson gets the same amount as I did. WTF are you talking about?! I'm not talking about whether the tip is shared among all waitstaff, I'm talking about leaving a tip for the waitperson only to have that tip go to management! I hope you take better orders than you read...maybe you deserve to wait on tables all your life. |
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Ida Slapter wrote: > > > YOU buy the restaurant and then you can make up the rules. All > waitpeople must abide by the rules that were set up when they were > hired. Maybe they KNOW the tip money goes to the management. What > difference does it make to you? ?! Um, why do people leave tips? They leave tips to express appreciation for the service by waitstaff! (Good cooking helps put them in a charitable mood, to be sure.) If I knew my money was just going to the manangement, then I wouldn't bother leaving a tip -- I'd already paid for the meal! Frankly, I think tipping is silly to begin with -- but if it's done, it's done on account of the waitstaff, not the management! There must be something illegal about this. > Personally, I don't care for the "tip pot" where all tips are > deposited and then equally divided at the end of the shift. I bust my > butt and the lazy waitperson gets the same amount as I did. WTF are you talking about?! I'm not talking about whether the tip is shared among all waitstaff, I'm talking about leaving a tip for the waitperson only to have that tip go to management! I hope you take better orders than you read...maybe you deserve to wait on tables all your life. |
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The actual story is this. Tips on CC's are being used to pay the % that the
restaurant owes the CC company for the use of their cards. (Sounds F'd up . the % is taken. out of the tip illegally... this is against the law but the companies are getting away with it. so just do what I do. pay the bill with the CC and leave the tip in cash.... then the % needed to pay the CC company comes from the bill alone leaving the tip to the workers, as for anyone saying the Restaurant has the right to take the tips. NO. totally wrong. they may have to share tips with the rest of the staff but no. the owner is breaking the law if they pocket the tips. "NYC XYZ" > wrote in message ups.com... > > Hi, All: > > What's the law -- specifically, NYC ordinances/regulations/whatever -- > on tips for waitstaff actually getting to them? I've confirmation now > that my favorite Indian restaurant is pocketing tips customers leave > for the waitstaff! The rationale is that these waitstaff get a > "salary" (~$300/wk. for 6-day wks. @ 9-10 hrs./day), but I as the > customer leaving a tip certainly don't know! > > Who do I go to about this? Better Business Bureau? Labor Dep't.? > What's the law in a situation like this?? I'm rather upset that my > generosity has been wasted, seeing how it wasn't management I was > tipping > |
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Sorry totally illegal......
no ifs ands or buts... "Ida Slapter" > wrote in message news  > On 17 Jan 2005 15:13:22 -0800, "NYC XYZ" > > wrote: > > >Who do I go to about this? Better Business Bureau? Labor Dep't.? > >What's the law in a situation like this?? > > YOU buy the restaurant and then you can make up the rules. All > waitpeople must abide by the rules that were set up when they were > hired. Maybe they KNOW the tip money goes to the management. What > difference does it make to you? > > > Personally, I don't care for the "tip pot" where all tips are > deposited and then equally divided at the end of the shift. I bust my > butt and the lazy waitperson gets the same amount as I did. > > > |
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wrote:
>> Sorry totally illegal...... >> no ifs ands or buts... > >No, it is not. No ifs, ands, or buts. Get on a freeway...people speed. It is illegal....no ifs...no never mind. The best thing about dating a homeless person is that at the end of the date, you can drop them off anywhere. |
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> > The actual story is this. Tips on CC's are being used to pay the % > > that the restaurant owes the CC company for the use of their cards. > > (Sounds F'd up . the % is taken. out of the tip illegally... this is > > against the law > > You keep stating that it is against the law. Please show us that law, > statute, revised code, administrative code, constitiutional provision, or > something to verify your assertion. A store keeping tips, via credit card > line, tip jar, or money left on the table is, perhaps, ill-mannered, but > hardly illegal. From: http://www.dol.gov/esa/regs/compliance/whd/whdfs15.htm If an employer elects to use the tip credit provision the employer must: 1) Inform each tipped employee about the tip credit allowance (including amount to be credited) before the credit is utilized. 2) Be able to show that the employee receives at least the minimum wage when direct wages and the tip credit allowance are combined. 3) Allow the tipped employee to retain all tips, whether or not the employer elects to take a tip credit for tips received, except to the extent the employee participates in a valid tip pooling arrangement. From http://www.rules.utah.gov/publicat/c...610-001.htm#T4 R610-1-4. Tips, Gratuities, and Commissions. A. An employer may credit the tips received by tipped employees (an example would be waiters and waitresses) against the employer's minimum wage obligation. The tips must be received by the employee, reported to the employer, and must reach a threshold of at least $30.00 per month before credit can be allowed. B. An employer has a cash wage obligation in meeting the required minimum wage of at least $2.13 per hour. If an employee's tips combined with the employer's cash wage obligation of $2.13 per hour do not equal the minimum hourly wage requirement, the employer must increase its cash wage obligation to make up the difference. C. All tips or gratuities shall be retained by the employee receiving the tips or gratuities. However, this requirement does not preclude pooling of tips or gratuities to be divided equally between those employees who customarily and regularly receive tips or gratuities. 1. A bona fide tip pooling or sharing arrangement may include employees who customarily and regularly receive tips, such as waiters, bellhops, waitresses, countermen, busboys, and service bartenders. 2. Employees such as dishwashers, chefs, and janitors are not considered tipped employees and may not participate in tip pooling. D. Every employer intending to exercise the tip or gratuity credit must so inform each affected employee at the time of hire. E. Where tips are charged on a credit card, and the employer must pay the credit card company a percentage of the bill for its use, the employer may reduce the amount of the credit card tips paid over to the employee by a percentage no greater than that charged by the credit card company. F. In computing the minimum wage, tips, gratuities, and commissions must be counted in the payroll period in which the tip, gratuity or commission is earned. G. This section does not apply to tips or commissions as delineated in Section 34-40-104(1)(j). - - - - - - - - - - USA Business Information http://www.Network2020.com/go USA Legal Resources http://www.Network2020.com/resources Pre-Paid Legal Information http://www.Network2020.com |
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> > The actual story is this. Tips on CC's are being used to pay the %
> > that the restaurant owes the CC company for the use of their cards. > > (Sounds F'd up . the % is taken. out of the tip illegally... this is > > against the law > > You keep stating that it is against the law. Please show us that law, > statute, revised code, administrative code, constitiutional provision, or > something to verify your assertion. A store keeping tips, via credit card > line, tip jar, or money left on the table is, perhaps, ill-mannered, but > hardly illegal. > -- Laws, as expected, vary by state: http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/cacodes/lab/350-356.html 351. No employer or agent shall collect, take, or receive any gratuity or a part thereof that is paid, given to, or left for an employee by a patron, or deduct any amount from wages due an employee on account of a gratuity, or require an employee to credit the amount, or any part thereof, of a gratuity against and as a part of the wages due the employee from the employer. Every gratuity is hereby declared to be the sole property of the employee or employees to whom it was paid, given, or left for. An employer that permits patrons to pay gratuities by credit card shall pay the employees the full amount of the gratuity that the patron indicated on the credit card slip, without any deductions for any credit card payment processing fees or costs that may be charged to the employer by the credit card company. Payment of gratuities made by patrons using credit cards shall be made to the employees not later than the next regular payday following the date the patron authorized the credit card payment. |
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wrote:
> From: http://www.dol.gov/esa/regs/compliance/whd/whdfs15.htm > > If an employer elects to use the tip credit provision the employer > must: You forgot to include this provisio from the same site: "Tipped employees are those who customarily and regularly receive more than $30 a month in tips. Tips actually received by tipped employees may be counted as wages for purposes of the FLSA, but the employer must pay not less than $2.13 an hour in direct wages. " Loopholes big enough to drive a Hummer hrough. That's why any employer can choose to keep the tips instead of allowing them to go to the employees. -- Dave Dave's Pit-Smoked Bar-B-Que http://davebbq.com/ |
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> > You forgot to include this provisio from the same site: > > "Tipped employees are those who customarily and regularly receive more than > $30 a month in tips. Tips actually received by tipped employees may be > counted as wages for purposes of the FLSA, but the employer must pay not > less than $2.13 an hour in direct wages. " > > Loopholes big enough to drive a Hummer hrough. That's why any employer can > choose to keep the tips instead of allowing them to go to the employees. > -- Sorry, but I don't see how the above, or any other statement on the web site permits employers to keep tips. Employers can offset the hourly wages down to 2.13 an hour in direct wages, but all tips are the employees. Dave |
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Ida Slapter wrote:
> > On 17 Jan 2005 15:13:22 -0800, "NYC XYZ" > > wrote: > > >Who do I go to about this? Better Business Bureau? Labor Dep't.? > >What's the law in a situation like this?? > > YOU buy the restaurant and then you can make up the rules. All > waitpeople must abide by the rules that were set up when they were > hired. Maybe they KNOW the tip money goes to the management. What > difference does it make to you? Well, I don't know what difference it would make to the OP, but it would make a difference to me! I would not tip if I knew it wasn't going to the waiters. Kate -- Kate Connally “If I were as old as I feel, I’d be dead already.” Goldfish: “The wholesome snack that smiles back, Until you bite their heads off.” What if the hokey pokey really *is* what it's all about? |
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On Wed, 19 Jan 2005 11:26:32 -0500, Kate Connally >
wrote: > I would not >tip if I knew it wasn't going to the waiters. You made a choice that I can abide with. It was your decision. How do you plan on finding out this information? Stand up and make a proclamation during dessert? |
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So who do I go to? I mean, I can't call the cops about this, illegal as it is. |
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"Dave Bugg" > wrote in message
... > wrote: > > > From: http://www.dol.gov/esa/regs/compliance/whd/whdfs15.htm > > > > If an employer elects to use the tip credit provision the employer > > must: > > You forgot to include this provisio from the same site: > > "Tipped employees are those who customarily and regularly receive more than > $30 a month in tips. Tips actually received by tipped employees may be > counted as wages for purposes of the FLSA, but the employer must pay not > less than $2.13 an hour in direct wages. " > > Loopholes big enough to drive a Hummer hrough. That's why any employer can > choose to keep the tips instead of allowing them to go to the employees. > -- IF they're paying the employees at least the minimum wage. And the likelihood of that in the OP's situation is....? |
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In article . com>,
NYC XYZ > wrote: > >So who do I go to? I mean, I can't call the cops about this, illegal >as it is. Call the Department of Labor and see what they have to say. Seth |
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Wrong ........
sorry..... but you are 10000% wrong....... "Ida Slapter" > wrote in message news > On 17 Jan 2005 15:13:22 -0800, "NYC XYZ" > > wrote: > > >Who do I go to about this? Better Business Bureau? Labor Dep't.? > >What's the law in a situation like this?? > > YOU buy the restaurant and then you can make up the rules. All > waitpeople must abide by the rules that were set up when they were > hired. Maybe they KNOW the tip money goes to the management. What > difference does it make to you? > > > Personally, I don't care for the "tip pot" where all tips are > deposited and then equally divided at the end of the shift. I bust my > butt and the lazy waitperson gets the same amount as I did. > > > |
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better check your laws..
you can make them split the tip but you can't make them give it to management..... and the use of the tip to pay the CC is against the law............. look it up "Dave Bugg" > wrote in message ... > wrote: > > Sorry totally illegal...... > > no ifs ands or buts... > > No, it is not. No ifs, ands, or buts. > -- > Dave > Dave's Pit-Smoked Bar-B-Que > http://davebbq.com/ > > |
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Thanks.........
> wrote in message ... > > > > The actual story is this. Tips on CC's are being used to pay the % > > > that the restaurant owes the CC company for the use of their cards. > > > (Sounds F'd up . the % is taken. out of the tip illegally... this is > > > against the law > > > > You keep stating that it is against the law. Please show us that law, > > statute, revised code, administrative code, constitiutional provision, or > > something to verify your assertion. A store keeping tips, via credit card > > line, tip jar, or money left on the table is, perhaps, ill-mannered, but > > hardly illegal. > > From: http://www.dol.gov/esa/regs/compliance/whd/whdfs15.htm > > If an employer elects to use the tip credit provision the employer must: > > 1) Inform each tipped employee about the tip credit allowance (including > amount to be credited) before the credit is utilized. > > 2) Be able to show that the employee receives at least the minimum wage when > direct wages and the tip credit allowance are combined. > > 3) Allow the tipped employee to retain all tips, whether or not the employer > elects to take a tip credit for tips received, except to the extent the > employee participates in a valid tip pooling arrangement. > > From http://www.rules.utah.gov/publicat/c...610-001.htm#T4 > R610-1-4. Tips, Gratuities, and Commissions. > A. An employer may credit the tips received by tipped employees (an example > would be waiters and waitresses) against the employer's minimum wage > obligation. The tips must be received by the employee, reported to the > employer, and must reach a threshold of at least $30.00 per month before > credit can be allowed. > > B. An employer has a cash wage obligation in meeting the required minimum > wage of at least $2.13 per hour. If an employee's tips combined with the > employer's cash wage obligation of $2.13 per hour do not equal the minimum > hourly wage requirement, the employer must increase its cash wage obligation > to make up the difference. > > C. All tips or gratuities shall be retained by the employee receiving the > tips or gratuities. However, this requirement does not preclude pooling of > tips or gratuities to be divided equally between those employees who > customarily and regularly receive tips or gratuities. > > 1. A bona fide tip pooling or sharing arrangement may include employees who > customarily and regularly receive tips, such as waiters, bellhops, > waitresses, countermen, busboys, and service bartenders. > > 2. Employees such as dishwashers, chefs, and janitors are not considered > tipped employees and may not participate in tip pooling. > > D. Every employer intending to exercise the tip or gratuity credit must so > inform each affected employee at the time of hire. > > E. Where tips are charged on a credit card, and the employer must pay the > credit card company a percentage of the bill for its use, the employer may > reduce the amount of the credit card tips paid over to the employee by a > percentage no greater than that charged by the credit card company. > > F. In computing the minimum wage, tips, gratuities, and commissions must be > counted in the payroll period in which the tip, gratuity or commission is > earned. > > G. This section does not apply to tips or commissions as delineated in > Section 34-40-104(1)(j). > > - - - - - - - - - - > USA Business Information http://www.Network2020.com/go > USA Legal Resources http://www.Network2020.com/resources > Pre-Paid Legal Information http://www.Network2020.com > > > > > > |
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"Can Altinbay" > wrote in message
news 
> No, seeing that you have no concern for common decency, I'll just ignore > you > from now on. ---> killfile. Well, in lieu of an intelligent answer, I suppose killfiling me will do . . .. |
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I think it had to do with the rape thing in your tag line.........
"Karl Hungus" > wrote in message ... > "Can Altinbay" > wrote in message > news
>> > No, seeing that you have no concern for common decency, I'll just ignore > > you > > from now on. ---> killfile. > > > Well, in lieu of an intelligent answer, I suppose killfiling me will do . .. > . > > |
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> wrote in message news 
>I think it had to do with the rape thing in your tag line......... You know, now that you mention it, that might've been it . . . Of course, incendiary as it may be - and as improbable a choice of forum for it's display as r.f.r might be - the statement's still true. |
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In article >, slim > wrote:
>Seth Breidbart wrote: >> In article >, >> > wrote: >> >> >2. Employees such as dishwashers, chefs, and janitors are not considered >> >tipped employees and may not participate in tip pooling. >> >> Definitely not true at sushi bars. > >ALL sushi bars? You know this for a FACT...how????? At all the ones I've been to, the sushi chefs get tips. Seth |
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In article >, slim > wrote:
>Seth Breidbart wrote: >> In article >, slim > wrote: >> >Seth Breidbart wrote: >> >> In article >, >> >> > wrote: >> >> >> >> >2. Employees such as dishwashers, chefs, and janitors are not considered >> >> >tipped employees and may not participate in tip pooling. >> >> >> >> Definitely not true at sushi bars. >> > >> >ALL sushi bars? You know this for a FACT...how????? >> >> At all the ones I've been to, the sushi chefs get tips. > >You see a tip cup on the counter, we all have seen it. > >What you do NOT see is ALL the money going directly >into the chef's pocket! I was disagreeing with the claim that chefs are not tipped employees and may not participate in tip pooling. In at least one sushi bar I know, they definitely do participate in tip pooling. In others, they are tipped; whether those tips are pooled or not I don't know. Seth |
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why will they get tip when they get a Chef salary ?
Wait staff makes about $2.25 an hour ( take off the taxes from credit card tips on those ) I worked in restaurant business for about 7 years, and i think chef SHOULD not get any tips whatsoever ! They get salary !! |
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In article .com>,
XCINEMAX.COM > wrote: [sushi chef] >why will they get tip when they get a Chef salary ? Because they do. >Wait staff makes about $2.25 an hour ( take off the taxes from credit >card tips on those ) You should pay taxes on _all_ tips, not just the credit card tips. >I worked in restaurant business for about 7 years, and i think chef >SHOULD not get any tips whatsoever ! I think you should be turned in to the IRS for not paying taxes on all your income. Seth |
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No tip For the cheF, i declare my cash tips always.
Chef gets to eat fro free, we dont.... When restaurant is slow front staff don't Make a dollar the chef makes his money no matter what !! |
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In article . com>,
XCINEMAX.COM > wrote: >No tip For the cheF, If you don't want to tip him, then don't. > i declare my cash tips always. Then why did you complain about paying taxes only on the credit card tips? >Chef gets to eat fro free, we dont.... Take it up with restaurant management. >When restaurant is slow front staff don't Make a dollar the chef makes >his money no matter what !! There are very few restaurants where customers go because of the waitstaff rather than the chefs. Seth |
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you just dont tip chef restaurant , that s the way it is,
I had my load of regular customers because of me and also cause of the good quality of the food, why would i tip a chef that makes 60 000 dollars a year???? |
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In article .com>,
XCINEMAX.COM > wrote: >you just dont tip chef restaurant , that s the way it is, The facts don't support you. At sushi bars, the sushi chef gets tips. >I had my load of regular customers because of me and also cause of the >good quality of the food, Then they tipped you a lot, right? >why would i tip a chef that makes 60 000 dollars a year???? Some waiters make more than that. Should they stop being tipped? Some chefs make less. Does that make it OK to tip them? Seth |
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