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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
I recently thought about going to an Italian restaurant near where I
live (Cincinnati), and I found out that they don't have a liquor license, but allow you to bring in your own wine. However, they charge you a $5.00 uncorking fee *even if you bring your own corkscrew and do it yourself*. I think that's nuts. I think uncorking fees make fine sense if a restaurant *already* serves wine. Then they're charging you a fee to allow you to bring in an outside wine, which cuts into their sales. Fair enough exchange in my eyes. But when we're talking about an Italian restaurant with no wine. Of course, 99% of the clientele are going to want wine with an Italian dish. So if I want to go to this place, it is incumbent on *me* to go to the store, buy wine, and haul it to the restaurant. Then for them to charge me for that wine that I took the trouble to get, *and* have me *tip* more on the basis of the total check, I'm getting charged *three* times for that wine. Crazy. And I don't buy it when people say "Oh, they're providing you with labor, glasses, and dishwashing, so they need to cover their costs." Look, I proposed that *I* will do the uncorking with *my* corkscrew, but she insisted they will still charge the fee. So labor is not an issue. If my lady and I ask for a couple of glasses of water, it "costs" the restaurant "labor, glasses, and dishwashing," so I don't see a difference there. If they started charging customers $5.00 for a couple of glasses of water, they'd all get up, walk out, and never come back. Once again, I think uncorking fees make perfect sense if the restaurant has a liquor license and offers wine. Frankly, it's crap otherwise. I know of other very nice restaurants without licenses that *don't* charge uncorking fees and are doing nicely. Bottom line: I'm not going to any license-less restaurant with corking fees, making sure restaurants that do this know how I feel, and I hope you guys do the same. Together we can change the world! (or at least put an end to a fee without any justification that only exists because people tolerate it due to lack of reflection on the issue.) Cheers! |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
"Afta12345" > wrote in message om... > Bottom line: I'm not going to any license-less restaurant with corking > fees, making sure restaurants that do this know how I feel, and I hope > you guys do the same. Together we can change the world! (or at least > put an end to a fee without any justification that only exists because > people tolerate it due to lack of reflection on the issue.) > > Cheers! Seems to me you're a cheap asshole and need to get a life. |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
On Sat, 06 Mar 2004 23:23:10 GMT, Afta > wrote:
>"Anthony" > wrote in news:NoudnQrbC9dE1dfdRVn- : > >> >> "Afta12345" > wrote in message >> om... >>> Bottom line: I'm not going to any license-less restaurant with corking >>> fees, making sure restaurants that do this know how I feel, and I hope >>> you guys do the same. Together we can change the world! (or at least >>> put an end to a fee without any justification that only exists because >>> people tolerate it due to lack of reflection on the issue.) >>> >>> Cheers! >> >> Seems to me you're a cheap asshole and need to get a life. >> >> >> > >Thanks for the thoughtful reply. It's always great having considerate, >mature, knowledgable adults like yourself generously helping others >through the exchange of ideas. You're a true asset to this newsgroup. But in this case, he's right. If I could always get away for a $5 corkage fee, I'd be ecstatic. Deal with something more significant -- like obscenely immoral restaurant wine markups -- before attaching the minutiae. -- Larry |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
Afta12345 wrote:
> > But when we're talking about an Italian restaurant with no wine. Of > course, 99% of the clientele are going to want wine with an Italian > dish. Neither my usual dining partner nor I partakes of alcoholic beverages. I guess we must be in that 1% of our local Italian restaurant's clientele that never even considers that Italian food is only consumed properly if it is served with wine. -- Please note my correct email address: rslitman [at-sign] infionline [dot] net |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
In many communities there is a limit to the number of liquor licenses which
are issued. I live in Pittsburgh, and a recent change in the state law, I think it was a change in the state law, allows a person to buy a liquor license in one "county or city" and then use it in another. Obtaining a liquor license in some areas can be difficult. I lived in Bazuklee, CA in the 70's, and the only thing that could be sold near the UC campus in a restaurant was beer. I remember they made a big deal when the law was changed, and a place on Telegraph was able to sell mixed drinks. Until recently Slippery Rock, which is a college town, would not allow beer to be sold in the town. When I lived in Arkansas there were "dry" counties, and when there was a vote to allow alcoholic beverages, and people oppossing it were said to be the Baptist ministers and the bootleggers. Tom Tom |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
Thanks for the replies. A few responses:
>Deal with something more significant -- like obscenely immoral >restaurant wine markups -- before attaching the minutiae. Granted the issue you mention is indeed more meaningful, but we could play a game of "address something more important" all day. Terrorists are bombing places around the world and this newsgroup is discussing food. Does that mean we should be discussing terrorism instead, since it's more significant? I assumed that since this is a newsgroup devoted to restaurants, that it was acceptable to discuss whatever restaurant-related topics we wanted to. Heck, I could subscribe to 90% of the newsgroups out there and spend all day everyday flaming people for not discussing what are obviously more important topics, such as economic, political, or psychological issues, but that's missing the point that people want to discuss whatever is on their mind and Usenet is a tool for enabling such discussion. If someone wants to talk about the color of napkins in restaurants, we should be tolerant and just let 'em talk. Respond if you've got something to add to the discussion. Let it go otherwise. >In any event, I wouldn't tip on the corkage fee, unless the cost of a >glass of soda was $5.00. I would make sure it was understood that you >were excluding the corkage fee from the tippable amount in some fashion. >(Hell hath no fury like an undertipped server). Thanks for the advice. If I ever go to that restaurant, I will at least not tip on that fee. >Well, I'd question the quality of the restaurant and it's food. How >serious can their dedication to their customers be if they won't >invest in a liquor license? I don't know, but that seems like a good question. I guess for me the practice suggests an owner with questionable judgment. How much does such a license cost? Is it that expensive? >In many communities there is a limit to the number of liquor licenses which >are issued. I didn't know that. You would think in a metropolitan area they would be open-ended enough not to limit it. Is anyone else familiar with such limits? |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
"Afta12345" > wrote in message om... > Thanks for the replies. A few responses: > Eeuw yer back. In my response to your OP I said you seemed like a cheap asshole. That judgement was obviously correct, but on the offchance, admittedly slim, that your mind is not as tightly shut as your purse (you do have a purse don't you?) here are some observations: 1. The restaurant business is extremely tough. Most people in it work astonishingly long, hard hours at unsocial times, very few get rich, most are miserably paid and many go broke. 2. It's like art or entertainment, we don't really need it but our lives are richer for it. 3. Those of us who value the experience of going to a good restaurant should give thanks that there are people who have the passion, stupidity or whatever to make it possible at prices which do not really give them a decent return on the risk and effort involved. I become extremely irritated when I read posts from people who's main objective is to chisel the restaurant owner or server out of a couple of bucks. Try walking a mile in their moccasins sometime. |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
>Eeuw yer back. In my response to your OP I said you seemed like a cheap
>asshole. That judgement was obviously correct, but on the offchance, >admittedly slim, that your mind is not as tightly shut as your purse (you do >have a purse don't you?) here are some observations: > >1. The restaurant business is extremely tough. Most people in it work >astonishingly long, hard hours at unsocial times, very few get rich, most >are miserably paid and many go broke. > >2. It's like art or entertainment, we don't really need it but our lives >are richer for it. > >3. Those of us who value the experience of going to a good restaurant >should give thanks that there are people who have the passion, stupidity or >whatever to make it possible at prices which do not really give them a >decent return on the risk and effort involved. > > I become extremely irritated when I read posts from people who's main >objective is to chisel the restaurant owner or server out of a couple of >bucks. Try walking a mile in their moccasins sometime. > > I've worked in the business for years. well said. Trevor |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
> Eeuw yer back. In my response to your OP I said you seemed like a cheap
> asshole. That judgement was obviously correct, but on the offchance, > admittedly slim, that your mind is not as tightly shut as your purse (you do > have a purse don't you?) here are some observations: I guess I am at a loss to understand the source of your vitriol. You seem to assume an awful lot about people who post on newsgroups. How do you know I don't work or haven't worked in restaurants? Why do you think my issue with the uncorking fee at a license-less restaurant is based on the amount of money involved? I blow $40 - $50 a meal eating at local eateries all of the time. Did it ever occur to you that the fee bothered me because I considered it wrong *on principle*? Apparently not. It appears you decided based on an extremely scant amount of information that I fit a certain stereotype of a person that you appear to have encountered in your life before. And that these types of people are not deserving of any respect because they supposedly mistreat the always good, noble, slaving restaurant owners of the world. Well, I for one have noticed restaurant owners are just like the rest of us and are capable of acting ethically, unethically, with good intent, and at times out of ignorance. I have also noticed that some are in fact quite wealthy. I haven't been able to pigeon hole them all into the role that you primarily portray. Regardless of their standard of living, however, I make a conscious effort to frequent only local establishments, all but banning chain restaurants. This is partly because I consider the local eateries to be important to our cultural well being as you point out. If you are as serious about the concerns you list above as you appear to be, you would probably find yourself more successful in changing the opinions of others if you refrained from reducing the people you interact with into "good" and "evil". |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
"Afta12345" > wrote in message om... > Did it ever occur to you that the > fee bothered me because I considered it wrong *on principle*? Ah yes, nothing like good old "principle" for justifying ****ing people over. |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
"Anthony" > wrote in message ... > > "Afta12345" > wrote in message > om... > > Did it ever occur to you that the > > fee bothered me because I considered it wrong *on principle*? > > Ah yes, nothing like good old "principle" for justifying ****ing people > over. > It occurs to me that new readers may not know, and old readers may have forgotten, what this is all about. The OP is outraged that certain unlicensed restaurants propose a $5 corkage fee. For this they will provide glasses, open and pour the wine, do the washing up, clean up any spills and replace any breakages. In his opening salvo he urged us all to join with him in boycotting restaurants who engage in this nefarious practice thus bringing them to their knees and their senses. "On principle", of course so that makes it okay. I said he was a cheap asshole. I now say he's a cheap and prolix asshole. Self-justifying to boot. |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
"Anthony" > wrote:
>The OP is outraged that certain >unlicensed restaurants propose a $5 corkage fee. For this they will provide >glasses, open and pour the wine, do the washing up, clean up any spills and >replace any breakages. This is such an "ordinary" fee that we even have it here in the hills of East Tennessee. Corkage is just about even with tipping. The OP should stay home and make room for the rest of us. I am just outraged to see a crowded lobby in any restaurant. |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
"Anthony" > wrote in message ... > > "Anthony" > wrote in message > ... > > > > "Afta12345" > wrote in message > > om... > > > Did it ever occur to you that the > > > fee bothered me because I considered it wrong *on principle*? > > > > Ah yes, nothing like good old "principle" for justifying ****ing people > > over. > > > It occurs to me that new readers may not know, and old readers may have > forgotten, what this is all about. The OP is outraged that certain > unlicensed restaurants propose a $5 corkage fee. For this they will provide > glasses, open and pour the wine, do the washing up, clean up any spills and > replace any breakages. In his opening salvo he urged us all to join with > him in boycotting restaurants who engage in this nefarious practice thus > bringing them to their knees and their senses. "On principle", of course so > that makes it okay. I said he was a cheap asshole. I now say he's a cheap > and prolix asshole. Self-justifying to boot. > > <warning> pent up anger about tipping ****ing restauartant owners won't pay wait staff adequate wages and customers are supposed to carry the cost of this rip off ??? ****ing wait people and restaurant business are to sastify the paying cusomers - not the other way arouind you want our business you make us happy if I (the customer) is expected to pay the difference between an adequate livingw wage and what the restaurants will pay then I expect gratitiude and excellent service plus If I'm not happy then I should be able to fire the son of a bitches who don't make me happy ****ing assholes who expect me to make up for what the owners won't pay had better grow up and get their ****ing attitudes straightened out </warning> pan "you get what I think you deserve" |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
"pan" > wrote in message ... > ****ing assholes who expect me to make up for what the owners > won't pay had better grow up and get their ****ing attitudes > straightened out > Maybe you ought to go back on your meds? |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
"Anthony" > wrote in message >...
> "Anthony" > wrote in message > ... > > > > "Afta12345" > wrote in message > > om... > > > Did it ever occur to you that the > > > fee bothered me because I considered it wrong *on principle*? > > > > Ah yes, nothing like good old "principle" for justifying ****ing people > > over. > > > It occurs to me that new readers may not know, and old readers may have > forgotten, what this is all about. The OP is outraged that certain > unlicensed restaurants propose a $5 corkage fee. For this they will provide > glasses, open and pour the wine, do the washing up, clean up any spills and > replace any breakages. In his opening salvo he urged us all to join with > him in boycotting restaurants who engage in this nefarious practice thus > bringing them to their knees and their senses. "On principle", of course so > that makes it okay. I said he was a cheap asshole. I now say he's a cheap > and prolix asshole. Self-justifying to boot. Well, I can see this is going nowhere. You're used to interacting with adolescents, trying to "win" arguments against imagined foes by thinking up vulgar comebacks to strawmen instead of intelligently offering opinions or reasons that *really* touch on the issue. And if the jury here consists of those with the intellect and emotional maturity of 12-year olds, then I'm sure you've already won the day. So I won't bother you anymore. Bye. |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
"pan" > wrote:
>fuc get back in school and learn vocabulary. You display knowledge of few words. It could be the key to any success in life. |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
If I were a Restaurant (without having or applying for a liquor license)
owner, would welcome ANY bottle carrying customers AND make them feel like Kings & Queens.... Giving then two wine glasses & a corkscrew (I would NEVER expect my good guest to carry a corkscrew with them to an Italian or French, or for the matter, any upscale restaurant, unless they were fond of the one they owned) would be as SIMPLE as setting the table.........AS SIMPLE...... To mingle with the customers, be it the owner, chef or manager & complement on the wine selection (possibly be invited to sample it) would endear any diner to become a faithful customer.... WHEN will Restaurant owners comprehend that they have the unique opportunity to have a customer become part of their family? Joe "Afta12345" > wrote in message om... > I recently thought about going to an Italian restaurant near where I > live (Cincinnati), and I found out that they don't have a liquor > license, but allow you to bring in your own wine. However, they > charge you a $5.00 uncorking fee *even if you bring your own corkscrew > and do it yourself*. I think that's nuts. > > I think uncorking fees make fine sense if a restaurant *already* > serves wine. Then they're charging you a fee to allow you to bring in > an outside wine, which cuts into their sales. Fair enough exchange in > my eyes. > > But when we're talking about an Italian restaurant with no wine. Of > course, 99% of the clientele are going to want wine with an Italian > dish. So if I want to go to this place, it is incumbent on *me* to go > to the store, buy wine, and haul it to the restaurant. Then for them > to charge me for that wine that I took the trouble to get, *and* have > me *tip* more on the basis of the total check, I'm getting charged > *three* times for that wine. Crazy. > > And I don't buy it when people say "Oh, they're providing you with > labor, glasses, and dishwashing, so they need to cover their costs." > Look, I proposed that *I* will do the uncorking with *my* corkscrew, > but she insisted they will still charge the fee. So labor is not an > issue. If my lady and I ask for a couple of glasses of water, it > "costs" the restaurant "labor, glasses, and dishwashing," so I don't > see a difference there. If they started charging customers $5.00 for > a couple of glasses of water, they'd all get up, walk out, and never > come back. > > Once again, I think uncorking fees make perfect sense if the > restaurant has a liquor license and offers wine. Frankly, it's crap > otherwise. I know of other very nice restaurants without licenses > that *don't* charge uncorking fees and are doing nicely. > > Bottom line: I'm not going to any license-less restaurant with corking > fees, making sure restaurants that do this know how I feel, and I hope > you guys do the same. Together we can change the world! (or at least > put an end to a fee without any justification that only exists because > people tolerate it due to lack of reflection on the issue.) > > Cheers! |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
I don't understand what all of the fuss is over.
Do the customers that object to an uncorking fee think that Reidel glasses are free? The original poster balked at a nominal fee. If you (restaurant owner / operator) can't even cover your breakage costs why bother? The original poster also scoffed at restaurants that don't have a liquor license. Are you aware that in some parts of the country the liquor license can cost upwards of $500,000. Just some food for thought. trevor |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
Afta12345 > posted in message
om... > I recently thought about going to an Italian restaurant near > where I live (Cincinnati), and I found out that they don't > have a liquor license, but allow you to bring in your own > wine. However, they charge you a $5.00 uncorking fee > *even if you bring your own corkscrew and do it yourself*. > I think that's nuts. First, I don't feel you have a case to complain about being charged a corking fee. The restaurant is providing you a service, whether you agree or not, and that service is as simple as a table and roof from which to enjoy your wine. (And, no, not everyone expects wine with their Italian meals.) The fact that they don't have a liquor license is insignificant. > I think uncorking fees make fine sense if a restaurant *already* > serves wine. Why? Both business are charging you for the privilege of using their restaurant and servers. > Then they're charging you a fee to allow you to > bring in an outside wine, which cuts into their sales. Fair > enough exchange in my eyes. That's fine but it's a tangent that needent be considered, either. You could as easily ordered water and there would have been no additional charge. > But when we're talking about an Italian restaurant with no wine. > Of course, 99% of the clientele are going to want wine with an > Italian dish. Is this a fine-dining restaurant or a family restaurant. There's a BIG difference and the manner in which sales are conducted are different as a result. > So if I want to go to this place, it is incumbent on > *me* to go to the store, buy wine, and haul it to the restaurant. > Then for them to charge me for that wine that I took the trouble > to get, *and* have me *tip* more on the basis of the total check, > I'm getting charged *three* times for that wine. Crazy. No, it's not, and the reason is you are bringing in a special wine (whether it's special or not, you went to all that trouble to find, purchase, port, cork, and pour it in a restaurant you already know doesn't serve alchohol.) They are then providing you a table and a roof where you may enjoy your tipple. It's not crazy at all. > And I don't buy it when people say "Oh, they're providing you > with labor, glasses, and dishwashing, so they need to cover their > costs." Look, I proposed that *I* will do the uncorking with > *my* corkscrew, but she insisted they will still charge the fee. > So labor is not an issue. If my lady and I ask for a couple of > glasses of water, it "costs" the restaurant "labor, glasses, and > dishwashing," so I don't see a difference there. Wine glasswares are higher in cost than institutional water glassware. (Not by much but in a business that only has an average ROI of 7-8%, that adds up quickly.) > If they started charging customers $5.00 for a couple of glasses > of water, they'd all get up, walk out, and never come back. No, the customers would stop getting water. > Once again, I think uncorking fees make perfect sense if the > restaurant has a liquor license and offers wine. You keep repeating this but it's not a valid point. They are still providing you a service, whether you believe it true or not. They cannot provide things for free (for long) so the business model adapts and revenues streams are sourced to assist in their continued livelihood. > Frankly, it's > crap otherwise. I know of other very nice restaurants without > licenses that *don't* charge uncorking fees and are doing nicely. Yet you don't eat there; why? > Bottom line: I'm not going to any license-less restaurant with > corking fees, That's your right. > making sure restaurants that do this know how I feel, Please do. You should always let management know how you feel (in writing) when you feel something is unfair, or not up to expectations. They appreciate non-provocative* feedback. > and I hope you guys do the same. Together we can change the world! I don't and hope corkage fees continue. Corkage fees are justified and assist the business. The Ranger * A Letter should always be professional in approach, error-free, and concise. The moment A Letter contains any of the following -- personal innuendoes, swearing, or poor spelling and grammar -- it is rarely acknowledged. |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
Thanks for the thoughtful reply. You make many provoking comments.
I'll address each one below: > First, I don't feel you have a case to complain about being charged a > corking fee. The restaurant is providing you a service, whether you agree or > not, and that service is as simple as a table and roof from which to enjoy > your wine. (And, no, not everyone expects wine with their Italian meals.) Well, in a sense, you're right. If someone doesn't like the way restaurants charge for the dining experience, then they just shouldn't go there. It's entirely up to the restaurant owner to decide how he wants to break up the charges (mark up the wine, mark down the dishes, charge a corking fee or not, etc.). I guess my issue with uncorking-fees-at-licenseless-restaurants (UFLR) is that the practice strikes me as unfair and arbitrary. Again, you're right that it's their call, their right to charge what they want for whatever. I guess my original post was basically a venting of sorts at what I perceived as unfair and hence it was unfortunate that there goes a potentially good restaurant that I won't be trying. Imagine going to a restaurant and being told that there is a $5.00 "table-setting fee". Every reason people have given against my initial response to UFLR (it's the owner's right to charge what he wants, they're providing services, a roof, dishes, labor) could be used to justify a "table-setting fee." I suppose some of you would have no problem with paying a "table-setting fee" for those reasons. However, such a fee would bug me and I would not go to that restaurant because of what I perceived to be an arbitrary fee. So the question I would ask is would such a fee bother you, and if so, why? Am I the only one who has felt a tad put off by the oodles of fees that show up at the end of your monthly phone bills and cellular bills? If you've ever felt like any of those fees were annoying or unfair, well then that's where I'm at with UFLR. > > I think uncorking fees make fine sense if a restaurant *already* > > serves wine. > > Why? Both business are charging you for the privilege of using their > restaurant and servers. Well, the historically understood justification for an uncorking fee at a restaurant that serves wine is that they are letting you bring in an outside wine *instead* of buying one of theirs. Clearly that justification can't fully apply to UFLR. > Is this a fine-dining restaurant or a family restaurant. There's a BIG > difference and the manner in which sales are conducted are different as a > result. This restaurant attempts fine-dining. I never went, so I can't say how well it succeeds. > Wine glasswares are higher in cost than institutional water glassware. (Not > by much but in a business that only has an average ROI of 7-8%, that adds up > quickly.) Fair enough. > > If they started charging customers $5.00 for a couple of glasses > > of water, they'd all get up, walk out, and never come back. > > No, the customers would stop getting water. I suppose we would see a variety of responses by customers. However, at minimum, such a fee for water would be a foolish business practice as there *are* people who would consider it preposterous and not return to that restaurant. Some of my surprise at UFLR is it seems like poor business practice. If a restaurant owner can't afford a license (which I can understand), then he should realize he is at a *disadvantage* to those similar restaurants that do have a license, and that charging an uncorking fee while without a license will seem arbitrary to at least a few people, and hence put himself at an even *further* disadvantage overall. If it's $5.00 a visit he needs, then he ought to consider putting those charges *into* other items. If dinner there costs $45 for two people normally, how many people who are willing to pay that will be upset if each item costs $1.00 more, resulting in $50 for the overall check? Probably not that many. > > Frankly, it's > > crap otherwise. I know of other very nice restaurants without > > licenses that *don't* charge uncorking fees and are doing nicely. > > Yet you don't eat there; why? I *do* eat at those restaurants. Did I say somewhere that I didn't? > > making sure restaurants that do this know how I feel, > > Please do. You should always let management know how you feel (in writing) > when you feel something is unfair, or not up to expectations. They > appreciate non-provocative* feedback. Thanks for the tip. I told them over the phone in a polite way. > Corkage fees are justified and assist the business. But from your reasoning, so would be table-setting fees, busboy fees, candle-lighting fees, draping-your-coat-on-the-chair fees, smile-from-the-owner fees, and background-music fees. It wouldn't bother you to see any of these fees show up on your check? Thanks again for the intelligent and level-headed response! |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
> Do the customers that object to an uncorking fee think that Reidel glasses
are > free? ALL...All Restaurants can have inexpensive wine glasses....no one in their right mind would expect crystal when bringing their own bottle. READ MY POST AND COMMENT....Please! I deal with quite a few restaurant owners, most are lucky enough to have a liquor license, but the others find profit, even if you don't charge the "obscene" dork cork fee! Even Burger King gave/still gives McDonald's a run for simply one reason....."Have it your way".....not to mean the customer can do anything, but at least has some input........Even McDonald's now, will let you change things....I know it not like bringing wine into a Fast Food place, but I have seen Fast Food employees giving cups to people that bring bottled /spring water & exotic brands while ordering a meal! I refuse to eat at a restaurant that is unwavering in menu..........NO RESTAURANT CAN BE THAT ARROGANT...and keep customers in the long run...EXCUSE ME.....there are a few restaurants with food so outstanding they can do this, but theses are exceptions. Joe "Opus X225" > wrote in message ... > I don't understand what all of the fuss is over. > > Do the customers that object to an uncorking fee think that Reidel glasses are > free? > > The original poster balked at a nominal fee. If you (restaurant owner / > operator) can't even cover your breakage costs why bother? > > The original poster also scoffed at restaurants that don't have a liquor > license. Are you aware that in some parts of the country the liquor license > can cost upwards of $500,000. > > Just some food for thought. > > > trevor |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
>
>> Do the customers that object to an uncorking fee think that Reidel glasses >are >> free? > >ALL...All Restaurants can have inexpensive wine glasses....no one in their >right mind would expect crystal when bringing their own bottle. > >READ MY POST AND COMMENT....Please! I did read your post. You are just trolling. Even inexpensive stem ware breaks at a much higher rate than other glassware. What do fast food joints have to do with your original arguement? Trevor |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
Opus X225 wrote: > > What do fast food joints have to do with your original arguement? > > Trevor Maybe he is referring to the Micky D's outside the West wall of Windsor Castle, where they have waitress service and a wine list. JJ |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
"Opus X225" > wrote in message ... > > > > I did read your post. You are just trolling. > That or he has waaaaaay too much time on his hands and anger in his heart. Not sure you should be stoking his fire! |
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Uncorking fees at restaurants w/o liquor licenses
LOL.....
Yea, I guess this subject is beat........see you on the next trolling....;-) "Bartender pleass get that lady a drink"....Bartender states "I wouldn't do that if I was you, she's a hooker". "ell maybe she needs another golf instructor, hic, anyways, get her a drink". "Anthony" > wrote in message ... > > "Opus X225" > wrote in message > ... > > > > > > > I did read your post. You are just trolling. > > > That or he has waaaaaay too much time on his hands and anger in his heart. > Not sure you should be stoking his fire! > > |
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I think perhaps that you missed the basis for the corkage fee - it is to
recover a loss from a (potential, but probable) beverage sale. Your 'table setting fee' doesn't relate, and is already built into the menu prices (to cover the labor for whomever is setting your table). Along the same lines, would you expect a restaurant to allow you to bring in your own meal? Would a 'plating fee' be reasonable to you if they did? Many restaurants *do* charge to split entrees between more than one guest - for the same reason as the corkage fee. Keep in mind that most restaurants are extremely lucky if their net profit is 1% of sales. Now that I've stated my question ... here is my answer One casual dining restaurant I managed had a group of about 12 that came in weekly (they sold magnets that were supposed to cure all your ails - don't ask!). Two were on special diets and brought their own (weight watchers) meals. I happily let them do it as long as they gave the meals to us so we could insure that they were served at the proper temperature (I can just see the lawsuit now ... 'I brought my own meal and got food poisoning, now I'm suing them!'). If this had been other than a casual dining restaurant my actions would likely have been different. In this instance, my loss was more than made up for by the other guests at their table, and I wanted them to feel welcomed in my establishment. If *all* of them had done it, I certainly have charged them a 'room rental' or 'beverage service' fee. Brett "doodoogle" > wrote in message m... > Thanks for the thoughtful reply. You make many provoking comments. > I'll address each one below: > >> First, I don't feel you have a case to complain about being charged a >> corking fee. The restaurant is providing you a service, whether you agree >> or >> not, and that service is as simple as a table and roof from which to >> enjoy >> your wine. (And, no, not everyone expects wine with their Italian meals.) > > Well, in a sense, you're right. If someone doesn't like the way > restaurants charge for the dining experience, then they just shouldn't > go there. It's entirely up to the restaurant owner to decide how he > wants to break up the charges (mark up the wine, mark down the dishes, > charge a corking fee or not, etc.). > > I guess my issue with uncorking-fees-at-licenseless-restaurants (UFLR) > is that the practice strikes me as unfair and arbitrary. Again, > you're right that it's their call, their right to charge what they > want for whatever. I guess my original post was basically a venting > of sorts at what I perceived as unfair and hence it was unfortunate > that there goes a potentially good restaurant that I won't be trying. > > Imagine going to a restaurant and being told that there is a $5.00 > "table-setting fee". Every reason people have given against my > initial response to UFLR (it's the owner's right to charge what he > wants, they're providing services, a roof, dishes, labor) could be > used to justify a "table-setting fee." I suppose some of you would > have no problem with paying a "table-setting fee" for those reasons. > However, such a fee would bug me and I would not go to that restaurant > because of what I perceived to be an arbitrary fee. So the question I > would ask is would such a fee bother you, and if so, why? > > Am I the only one who has felt a tad put off by the oodles of fees > that show up at the end of your monthly phone bills and cellular > bills? If you've ever felt like any of those fees were annoying or > unfair, well then that's where I'm at with UFLR. > >> > I think uncorking fees make fine sense if a restaurant *already* >> > serves wine. >> >> Why? Both business are charging you for the privilege of using their >> restaurant and servers. > > Well, the historically understood justification for an uncorking fee > at a restaurant that serves wine is that they are letting you bring in > an outside wine *instead* of buying one of theirs. Clearly that > justification can't fully apply to UFLR. > >> Is this a fine-dining restaurant or a family restaurant. There's a BIG >> difference and the manner in which sales are conducted are different as a >> result. > > This restaurant attempts fine-dining. I never went, so I can't say > how well it succeeds. > >> Wine glasswares are higher in cost than institutional water glassware. >> (Not >> by much but in a business that only has an average ROI of 7-8%, that adds >> up >> quickly.) > > Fair enough. > >> > If they started charging customers $5.00 for a couple of glasses >> > of water, they'd all get up, walk out, and never come back. >> >> No, the customers would stop getting water. > > I suppose we would see a variety of responses by customers. However, > at minimum, such a fee for water would be a foolish business practice > as there *are* people who would consider it preposterous and not > return to that restaurant. Some of my surprise at UFLR is it seems > like poor business practice. If a restaurant owner can't afford a > license (which I can understand), then he should realize he is at a > *disadvantage* to those similar restaurants that do have a license, > and that charging an uncorking fee while without a license will seem > arbitrary to at least a few people, and hence put himself at an even > *further* disadvantage overall. If it's $5.00 a visit he needs, then > he ought to consider putting those charges *into* other items. If > dinner there costs $45 for two people normally, how many people who > are willing to pay that will be upset if each item costs $1.00 more, > resulting in $50 for the overall check? Probably not that many. > >> > Frankly, it's >> > crap otherwise. I know of other very nice restaurants without >> > licenses that *don't* charge uncorking fees and are doing nicely. >> >> Yet you don't eat there; why? > > I *do* eat at those restaurants. Did I say somewhere that I didn't? > >> > making sure restaurants that do this know how I feel, >> >> Please do. You should always let management know how you feel (in >> writing) >> when you feel something is unfair, or not up to expectations. They >> appreciate non-provocative* feedback. > > Thanks for the tip. I told them over the phone in a polite way. > >> Corkage fees are justified and assist the business. > > But from your reasoning, so would be table-setting fees, busboy fees, > candle-lighting fees, draping-your-coat-on-the-chair fees, > smile-from-the-owner fees, and background-music fees. It wouldn't > bother you to see any of these fees show up on your check? > > Thanks again for the intelligent and level-headed response! |
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