Don't laugh, this may be the worst idea of the year but I'll
ask anyway:

I've made eisbier before by freezing my beer and only keeping the
alcoholic parts that don't freeze. This makes for a very strong beer
(12% or so) that doesn't taste much different than the non-ice
version. You've probably seen large beer company quasi-versions as
well.

Have you ever heard of or tried making ice wine with the same method?
I guess I could test it out on a single glass but I'm just wondering
what alcohol percentages and taste can be expected from such a process
with wine.

Ok, go ahead and laugh...



Next topic: ZimaWine

If I understand your question, certainly people do it. It is called freeze
distilation. A good process if you live outside the USA, In the US it is
absolutely illegal for wine or beer.

Ray

"Mark E" > wrote in message
...
> Don't laugh, this may be the worst idea of the year but I'll
> ask anyway:
>
> I've made eisbier before by freezing my beer and only keeping the
> alcoholic parts that don't freeze. This makes for a very strong beer
> (12% or so) that doesn't taste much different than the non-ice
> version. You've probably seen large beer company quasi-versions as
> well.
>
> Have you ever heard of or tried making ice wine with the same method?
> I guess I could test it out on a single glass but I'm just wondering
> what alcohol percentages and taste can be expected from such a process
> with wine.
>
> Ok, go ahead and laugh...
>
>
>
> Next topic: ZimaWine

> "Mark E" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Don't laugh, this may be the worst idea of the year but I'll
> > ask anyway:
> >
> > I've made eisbier before by freezing my beer and only keeping the
> > alcoholic parts that don't freeze. This makes for a very strong beer
> > (12% or so) that doesn't taste much different than the non-ice
> > version. You've probably seen large beer company quasi-versions as
> > well.
> >
> > Have you ever heard of or tried making ice wine with the same method?
> > I guess I could test it out on a single glass but I'm just wondering
> > what alcohol percentages and taste can be expected from such a process
> > with wine.
> >
> > Ok, go ahead and laugh...
> >
>Ray" > wrote in message
m...> If I understand your
question, certainly people do it. It is called freeze
> distilation. A good process if you live outside the USA, In the US it is
> absolutely illegal for wine or beer.
>
> Ray



Mark, it would probably not taste remotely close to Ice Wine. It would lack
the sweetness of Ice Wine and even if you back sweetened it would likely not
taste the same. Alot of the bouquet and fruity notes associated with Ice
Wine (apricot, tropical, honey etc) result from fermenting the high BRIX
must. My guess is that your proposed process, legalities aside, would
likely produce something closer to White Port. That said, people do
produce "cryo-extracted" or "Ice Box" Ice Wines (from the juice, grape or
apple etc.), although, I am of the opinion there is no substitute for the
real thing. Ron
>
>

> "Mark E" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Don't laugh, this may be the worst idea of the year but I'll
> > ask anyway:
> >
> > I've made eisbier before by freezing my beer and only keeping the
> > alcoholic parts that don't freeze. This makes for a very strong beer
> > (12% or so) that doesn't taste much different than the non-ice
> > version. You've probably seen large beer company quasi-versions as
> > well.
> >
> > Have you ever heard of or tried making ice wine with the same method?
> > I guess I could test it out on a single glass but I'm just wondering
> > what alcohol percentages and taste can be expected from such a process
> > with wine.
> >
> > Ok, go ahead and laugh...
> >
>Ray" > wrote in message
m...> If I understand your
question, certainly people do it. It is called freeze
> distilation. A good process if you live outside the USA, In the US it is
> absolutely illegal for wine or beer.
>
> Ray



Mark, it would probably not taste remotely close to Ice Wine. It would lack
the sweetness of Ice Wine and even if you back sweetened it would likely not
taste the same. Alot of the bouquet and fruity notes associated with Ice
Wine (apricot, tropical, honey etc) result from fermenting the high BRIX
must. My guess is that your proposed process, legalities aside, would
likely produce something closer to White Port. That said, people do
produce "cryo-extracted" or "Ice Box" Ice Wines (from the juice, grape or
apple etc.), although, I am of the opinion there is no substitute for the
real thing. Ron
>
>

> "Mark E" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Don't laugh, this may be the worst idea of the year but I'll
> > ask anyway:
> >
> > I've made eisbier before by freezing my beer and only keeping the
> > alcoholic parts that don't freeze. This makes for a very strong beer
> > (12% or so) that doesn't taste much different than the non-ice
> > version. You've probably seen large beer company quasi-versions as
> > well.
> >
> > Have you ever heard of or tried making ice wine with the same method?
> > I guess I could test it out on a single glass but I'm just wondering
> > what alcohol percentages and taste can be expected from such a process
> > with wine.
> >
> > Ok, go ahead and laugh...
> >
>Ray" > wrote in message
m...> If I understand your
question, certainly people do it. It is called freeze
> distilation. A good process if you live outside the USA, In the US it is
> absolutely illegal for wine or beer.
>
> Ray



Mark, it would probably not taste remotely close to Ice Wine. It would lack
the sweetness of Ice Wine and even if you back sweetened it would likely not
taste the same. Alot of the bouquet and fruity notes associated with Ice
Wine (apricot, tropical, honey etc) result from fermenting the high BRIX
must. My guess is that your proposed process, legalities aside, would
likely produce something closer to White Port. That said, people do
produce "cryo-extracted" or "Ice Box" Ice Wines (from the juice, grape or
apple etc.), although, I am of the opinion there is no substitute for the
real thing. Ron
>
>

"Mark E" > wrote in message
...
> Don't laugh, this may be the worst idea of the year but I'll
> ask anyway:

> Have you ever heard of or tried making ice wine with the same method?
Apple jack is the product of frozen cider with the ice crystals removed.

You wont make icewine from that method, all you get is fortified wine. To
make "ice wine" you have to freeze the juice prior to fermenting to reduce
the water to a juice concentrate.

> I guess I could test it out on a single glass but I'm just wondering
> what alcohol percentages and taste can be expected from such a process
> with wine.
>
I'd hazard a guess that high teens is about as far as you go as the
increased alcohol level will act as antifreeze and then if you cold enough
the alcohol is start to crystalize as well.

"Mark E" > wrote in message
...
> Don't laugh, this may be the worst idea of the year but I'll
> ask anyway:

> Have you ever heard of or tried making ice wine with the same method?
Apple jack is the product of frozen cider with the ice crystals removed.

You wont make icewine from that method, all you get is fortified wine. To
make "ice wine" you have to freeze the juice prior to fermenting to reduce
the water to a juice concentrate.

> I guess I could test it out on a single glass but I'm just wondering
> what alcohol percentages and taste can be expected from such a process
> with wine.
>
I'd hazard a guess that high teens is about as far as you go as the
increased alcohol level will act as antifreeze and then if you cold enough
the alcohol is start to crystalize as well.

On Sat, 27 Nov 2004 10:28:34 -0500, "J F" > wrote:

>> Have you ever heard of or tried making ice wine with the same method?
>Apple jack is the product of frozen cider with the ice crystals removed.

I tried it once, but my filtration procedure was too clumsy to make
anything very nice.

>I'd hazard a guess that high teens is about as far as you go as the
>increased alcohol level will act as antifreeze and then if you cold enough
>the alcohol is start to crystalize as well.

The alcohol will NOT start to crystallize- the freezing point of
ethanol (-114.1 oC) is well below any temperature you're going to
encounter.

Any time you cool a mixture of two compounds, the higher-melting one
will start to crystallize (and precipitate out), rather than having
the entire solution freeze. The remaining liquid will then be richer
in low-melting component, and it will take a lower temperature to
cause more of the first component to precipitate.

So, to do this properly, you would have to chill the wine to the point
where it -just- starts to freeze. If you cool it too much, then you
have a bottle of slush, which is impossible to filter properly (in
-this- respect, I'm speaking from experience). If you have a
manageble quanitity of ice forming, you can filter off the wine, which
will have a higher percentage of alcohol than it started with. To get
ice to precipitate from this wine, you cool it a few more degrees.
This gives you a liquor with a higher percent alcohol again. Repeat
as required.

I don't have a phase diagram for the ethanol-water system, but I do
know that at -40oC, the remaining liquid will be 40% ethanol. As to
its potability, I'm not going to hazard a guess.

Cheers,

---The Mad Alchemist---
http://www.mad-alchemy.com
Email sent to the above address, unless clearly marked
as wine or heraldry, will be deleted unread.