Home |
Search |
Today's Posts |
|
Preserving (rec.food.preserving) Devoted to the discussion of recipes, equipment, and techniques of food preservation. Techniques that should be discussed in this forum include canning, freezing, dehydration, pickling, smoking, salting, and distilling. |
Reply |
|
LinkBack | Thread Tools | Display Modes |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
Can anyone tell me how much citric acid is needed to lower the Ph of a
given ammount of water from Ph7 to Ph4 or 5. A search of the web has revealed nothing. ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com ** |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
Ray West <> wrote:
> Can anyone tell me how much citric acid is needed to lower the Ph of a > given ammount of water from Ph7 to Ph4 or 5. A search of the web has > revealed nothing. > ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com ** Have you Googled on 'citric acid pH' or 'citric acid pH reduction water'? -- Nick. Support severely wounded and disabled Veterans and their families! I've known US vets who served as far back as the Spanish American War. They are all my heroes! Thank a Veteran and Support Our Troops. You are not forgotten. Thanks ! ! ~Semper Fi~ |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
Ray West wrote: > Can anyone tell me how much citric acid is needed to lower the Ph of a > given ammount of water from Ph7 to Ph4 or 5. A search of the web has > revealed nothing. > ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com ** You question is not answerable. It depends on what is dissolved in the water. (if you have distilled water, just the CO2 from the air is enough to drive the pH down to about 6.) Bob |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
<Ray West> wrote in message
... > Can anyone tell me how much citric acid is needed to lower the Ph of a > given ammount of water from Ph7 to Ph4 or 5. A search of the web has > revealed nothing. Unfortunately cannot answer your (un)specific question, but have some remarks. First, what are you preserving or preparing or brewing? Or planting? and what country are you working from? We might be able to point you in the right direction. In our FAQ http://rfpfaq.jaclu.com/rfpFAQ.htm are some discussions on pH and how it works in food preservation, and iirc, we had a discussion last year on where to buy pH testing supplies on this newsgroup. The brewing newsgroup may have some answers for you. If this is a gardening question, many of us have gardens, and there are a number of gardening groups. BTW, I found that the garden test probes are not very accurate in my limited investigation. If it is important to your work, it's best to buy the goodest tools you can afford that will do the job. Some test equipment is not too terribly expensive, but you pay for what you get. A brewer's store or scientific supply shop are good places to start. All that said, I believe that 1 tablespoon of citric acid (sour salt) [not vitamin c (ascorbic acid)] in one pint of ordinary tomatoes will bring the pH down far enough to be healthfully kept after boiling water bath, i.e., 4.6 or below. These things are so varied as fruits, juices, and veggies have different pH according to time of year, watering schedule, place of origin, variety, and believe it or not - site in the field/garden. Our FAQ has some tables of substitution and the exact measurements, which I disremember as I have not had my coffee yet. hth, Edrena |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
I agree with Bob. From my experience trying to change the pH of an
aquarium, I've learned that it matters what else is in the water that might act as a buffer to changing the pH level. Dave On May 9, 12:07*pm, zxcvbob > wrote: > Ray West wrote: > > Can anyone tell me how much citric acid is needed to lower the Ph of a > > given ammount of water from Ph7 to Ph4 or 5. A search of the web has > > revealed nothing. > > ** Posted fromhttp://www.teranews.com** > > You question is not answerable. *It depends on what is dissolved in the > water. *(if you have distilled water, just the CO2 from the air is > enough to drive the pH down to about 6.) > > Bob |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
Thanks Nick... I must have got myself in rutt, your second suggestion
has opened new posibilities... thanks again from a Vietnam Vet. To the other replies.. The Question was quite specific and as simple as it could be... Nick Cramer> wrote: >Ray West <> wrote: >> Can anyone tell me how much citric acid is needed to lower the Ph of a >> given ammount of water from Ph7 to Ph4 or 5. A search of the web has >> revealed nothing. >> ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com ** > >Have you Googled on 'citric acid pH' or 'citric acid pH reduction water'? ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com ** |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
Ray West wrote:
> Thanks Nick... I must have got myself in rutt, your second suggestion > has opened new posibilities... thanks again from a Vietnam Vet. > > To the other replies.. The Question was quite specific and as simple > as it could be... > > Nick Cramer> wrote: > >> Ray West <> wrote: >>> Can anyone tell me how much citric acid is needed to lower the Ph of a >>> given ammount of water from Ph7 to Ph4 or 5. A search of the web has >>> revealed nothing. >>> ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com ** >> Have you Googled on 'citric acid pH' or 'citric acid pH reduction water'? > > ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com ** The question was specific, but it doesn't have an answer. Bob |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
zxcvbob wrote:
> Ray West wrote: >> Thanks Nick... I must have got myself in rutt, your second suggestion >> has opened new posibilities... thanks again from a Vietnam Vet. >> >> To the other replies.. The Question was quite specific and as simple >> as it could be... > The question was specific, but it doesn't have an answer. How high is up? B/ |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
On May 9, 4:12�am, Ray West <> wrote:
> Can anyone tell me how much citric acid is needed to lower the Ph of a > given ammount of water from Ph7 to Ph4 or 5. A search of the web has > revealed nothing. > ** Posted fromhttp://www.teranews.com** You may wish to purchase a ph meter on line or on eBay that is food grade (accurate enough to be of some value). I add no more than a teaspoon of citric acid to a quart of tomato products. It has less of a taste than lemon juice and is much more effective in bringing down ph without altering the taste of the original product. In jams and fruit products it may be desirable to use lemon juice because the flavor compliments the fruit. If not, tart it up (or lower ph) with citric acid or with an acid blend. Regards - Jim in So. Calif. |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
I've tried the ph metres, non of them work well enough to be of any
use, can't even relie on subsequent readings on the same test subject. Got my money back on them. It is well known that most tomatoes run at below ph 4.6 and do not need further acidification, however, it would not hurt to add a small amount of citric acid to be sure, certainly not the 1 tablespoon to a pint as suggested one. Like you I generally add half a teaspoon to 1 lt/qt of whatever I'm doing. I also use lemon juice, I also use vinegar in many applications, knowing that 5% white vinegar runs between ph 2.3 & 2.5 it's easy to work out. Anyway I have a number of ph strips arriving shortly so I should get a better idea. On Tue, 13 May 2008 22:29:46 -0700 (PDT), jimnginger >You may wish to purchase a ph meter on line or on eBay that is food >grade (accurate enough to be of some value). I add no more than a >teaspoon of citric acid to a quart of tomato products. It has less of >a taste than lemon juice and is much more effective in bringing down >ph without altering the taste of the original product. In jams and >fruit products it may be desirable to use lemon juice because the >flavor compliments the fruit. If not, tart it up (or lower ph) with >citric acid or with an acid blend. Regards - Jim in So. Calif. ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com ** |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
Ray West wrote:
> I've tried the ph metres, non of them work well enough to be of any > use, can't even relie on subsequent readings on the same test subject. > > Got my money back on them. > > It is well known that most tomatoes run at below ph 4.6 and do not > need further acidification, however, it would not hurt to add a small > amount of citric acid to be sure, certainly not the 1 tablespoon to a > pint as suggested one. Not absolutely true. Here in the USA there are many new varieties of tomatoes that are hardly acidic at all. Therefore the suggestion to add one tablespoon per pint of tomatoes. > > Like you I generally add half a teaspoon to 1 lt/qt of whatever I'm > doing. > > I also use lemon juice, I also use vinegar in many applications, > knowing that 5% white vinegar runs between ph 2.3 & 2.5 it's easy to > work out. > > Anyway I have a number of ph strips arriving shortly so I should get a > better idea. > > On Tue, 13 May 2008 22:29:46 -0700 (PDT), jimnginger > >> You may wish to purchase a ph meter on line or on eBay that is food >> grade (accurate enough to be of some value). I add no more than a >> teaspoon of citric acid to a quart of tomato products. It has less of >> a taste than lemon juice and is much more effective in bringing down >> ph without altering the taste of the original product. In jams and >> fruit products it may be desirable to use lemon juice because the >> flavor compliments the fruit. If not, tart it up (or lower ph) with >> citric acid or with an acid blend. Regards - Jim in So. Calif. > > ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com ** |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
In article >,
"The Joneses" > wrote: > All that said, I believe that 1 tablespoon of citric acid (sour salt) [not > vitamin c (ascorbic acid)] in one pint of ordinary tomatoes will bring the > pH down far enough to be healthfully kept after boiling water bath, i.e., > 4.6 or below. > hth, Edrena > You'd better get that coffee, Woman. Make that 1/4 TEASPOON of citric acid to a pint of tomatoes. Here's from the NCHFP site regarding same: "Acidification: To ensure safe acidity in whole, crushed, or juiced tomatoes, add two tablespoons of bottled lemon juice or 1/2 teaspoon of citric acid per quart of tomatoes. For pints, use one tablespoon bottled lemon juice or 1/4 teaspoon citric acid. Acid can be added directly to the jars before filling with product. Add sugar to offset acid taste, if desired. Four tablespoons of a 5 percent acidity vinegar per quart may be used instead of lemon juice or citric acid. However, vinegar may cause undesirable flavor changes." On my third cuppa now. '-) -- -Barb, Mother Superior, HOSSSPoJ Check my new ride: http://www.jamlady.eboard.com |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
In article >, Ray West <>
wrote: > Can anyone tell me how much citric acid is needed to lower the Ph of a > given ammount of water from Ph7 to Ph4 or 5. A search of the web has > revealed nothing. > ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com ** Ray, it doesn't seem that you're liking the responses you've gotten here. Maybe you'd have better results with the folks at sci.bio.food-science. They are professionals. Their FAQ file was posted in two parts on May 1. There's also a May 1 post for new users. They're serious folks. -- -Barb, Mother Superior, HOSSSPoJ Check my new ride: http://www.jamlady.eboard.com |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
"Melba's Jammin'" > wrote in message
... > In article >, Ray West <> > wrote: > >> Can anyone tell me how much citric acid is needed to lower the Ph of a >> given ammount of water from Ph7 to Ph4 or 5. A search of the web has >> revealed nothing. >> ** Posted from http://www.teranews.com ** > > Ray, it doesn't seem that you're liking the responses you've gotten here. > Maybe you'd have better results with the folks at sci.bio.food-science. > They are professionals. Their FAQ file was posted in two parts on May > 1. There's also a May 1 post for new users. They're serious folks. > -- > -Barb, Mother Superior, HOSSSPoJ > Check my new ride: http://www.jamlady.eboard.com Yeah, i was wrong. Damn Rx anyway. That's the bad part about remembering, the ink fades so fast... But I did add our faq for Ray to double check. I found that food grade pH meters (I paid about $69US for my wine meter) work very well indeed, providing I test both the liquid and the chopped food. And here in the US the US Dept of Agri folks have found low tomato pH, especially them tomatoids in the supermarket which are bred to ship n' shape, and not taste like tomatoes. Edrena |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
Ray West wrote:
> I've tried the ph metres, non of them work well enough to be of any > use, can't even relie on subsequent readings on the same test subject. > > Got my money back on them. > > It is well known that most tomatoes run at below ph 4.6 and do not > need further acidification, Everything I've read lately has said that tomatoes are being bred to be less acidic, so this isn't true any more. I'm a little confused now. Serene |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
Serene wrote:
> Ray West wrote: >> I've tried the ph metres, non of them work well enough to be of any >> use, can't even relie on subsequent readings on the same test subject. >> >> Got my money back on them. >> >> It is well known that most tomatoes run at below ph 4.6 and do not >> need further acidification, > > Everything I've read lately has said that tomatoes are being bred to be > less acidic, so this isn't true any more. I'm a little confused now. > > Serene Don't be, more and more tomatoes and tomato seeds sold in the USA are only mildly acidic and need the citric acid added or some other acidifier. George |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
George Shirley wrote:
> Serene wrote: >> Ray West wrote: >>> I've tried the ph metres, non of them work well enough to be of any >>> use, can't even relie on subsequent readings on the same test subject. >>> >>> Got my money back on them. >>> >>> It is well known that most tomatoes run at below ph 4.6 and do not >>> need further acidification, >> Everything I've read lately has said that tomatoes are being bred to be >> less acidic, so this isn't true any more. I'm a little confused now. >> >> Serene > Don't be, more and more tomatoes and tomato seeds sold in the USA are > only mildly acidic and need the citric acid added or some other acidifier. Okay, cool. Thanks! I'm hoping to have enough tomatoes this summer to put it to the test. I'll almost certainly have more zucchini than I can use, but mostly I don't think that cans or freezes all that well. Serene |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
Serene wrote:
> George Shirley wrote: >> Serene wrote: >>> Ray West wrote: >>>> I've tried the ph metres, non of them work well enough to be of any >>>> use, can't even relie on subsequent readings on the same test subject. >>>> >>>> Got my money back on them. >>>> >>>> It is well known that most tomatoes run at below ph 4.6 and do not >>>> need further acidification, >>> Everything I've read lately has said that tomatoes are being bred to >>> be less acidic, so this isn't true any more. I'm a little confused now. >>> >>> Serene >> Don't be, more and more tomatoes and tomato seeds sold in the USA are >> only mildly acidic and need the citric acid added or some other >> acidifier. > > Okay, cool. Thanks! I'm hoping to have enough tomatoes this summer to > put it to the test. I'll almost certainly have more zucchini than I can > use, but mostly I don't think that cans or freezes all that well. > > Serene I've not found a summer squash that freezes well at all. What we can't eat as it ripens we give to friends and neighbors. Some winter squashes can be canned but, to me, the texture is lacking. George |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
On May 15, 3:56�pm, George Shirley > wrote:
> Serene wrote: > > Ray West wrote: > >> I've tried the ph metres, non of them work well enough to be of any > >> use, can't even relie on subsequent readings on the same test subject. > > >> Got my money back on them. > > >> It is well known that most tomatoes run at below ph 4.6 and do not > >> need further acidification, > > > Everything I've read lately has said that tomatoes are being bred to be > > less acidic, so this isn't true any more. I'm a little confused now. > > > Serene > > Don't be, more and more tomatoes and tomato seeds sold in the USA are > only mildly acidic and need the citric acid added or some other acidifier. > > George I think you MAY BE WRONG. From what I have read, tomatoes are not becoming less acidic across the board but what is happening is that tomatoes are being bread the have INCREASED sugar levels. When you increase the SUGAR, it covers the acidic "bite" to one's tongue. Thank goodness someone covered how much citric acid to use in tomatoes. I use one teaspoon as I often add some bell pepper and onion (very small amount) and this is dangerous because these are NoN- ACID items and add danger to any canned product unless they are pressure canned. If you think that a tablespoon in a pint of tomatoes is appropriate, then I say you have NEVER canned any tomatoes. Citric Acid, or Sour Salt, is horribley TART and it has to be covered with added SUGAR to the tomatoes to keep them from tasting like little children's sour candy. Just take a pinch of Citric Acid and place it on your tongue. You will then see what I mean. Regards - Jim in So. California |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
In article >,
Serene > wrote: > Ray West wrote: > > I've tried the ph metres, non of them work well enough to be of any > > use, can't even relie on subsequent readings on the same test subject. > > > > Got my money back on them. > > > > It is well known that most tomatoes run at below ph 4.6 and do not > > need further acidification, > > Everything I've read lately has said that tomatoes are being bred to > be less acidic, so this isn't true any more. I'm a little confused now. > > Serene It's a precaution, Serene. The tomatoes may be below 4.6 -- or they may not. I'd venture to say that most folks couldn't name the varietal they purchase for canning and the acidification is cheap insurance. -- -Barb, Mother Superior, HOSSSPoJ Check my new ride: http://www.jamlady.eboard.com |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
Melba's Jammin' wrote:
> In article >, > Serene > wrote: > >> Ray West wrote: >>> I've tried the ph metres, non of them work well enough to be of any >>> use, can't even relie on subsequent readings on the same test subject. >>> >>> Got my money back on them. >>> >>> It is well known that most tomatoes run at below ph 4.6 and do not >>> need further acidification, >> Everything I've read lately has said that tomatoes are being bred to >> be less acidic, so this isn't true any more. I'm a little confused now. >> >> Serene > > It's a precaution, Serene. The tomatoes may be below 4.6 -- or they may > not. I'd venture to say that most folks couldn't name the varietal they > purchase for canning and the acidification is cheap insurance. > Rutgers. ;-) |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
zxcvbob wrote:
>> It's a precaution, Serene. The tomatoes may be below 4.6 -- or >> they may not. I'd venture to say that most folks couldn't name the >> varietal they purchase for canning and the acidification is cheap >> insurance. Better safe than being unable to say you're sorry. B/ |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
Melba's Jammin' wrote:
> It's a precaution, Serene. The tomatoes may be below 4.6 -- or they may > not. I'd venture to say that most folks couldn't name the varietal they > purchase for canning and the acidification is cheap insurance. > Thanks, Barb! So I have a question, then -- if I do know the varietal (because I grew them myself), then is there someplace I could look to see what their acidity typically is? This stuff really fascinates the science geek in me. Serene |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
jimnginger wrote:
> On May 15, 3:56�pm, George Shirley > wrote: >> Serene wrote: >>> Ray West wrote: >>>> I've tried the ph metres, non of them work well enough to be of any >>>> use, can't even relie on subsequent readings on the same test subject. >>>> Got my money back on them. >>>> It is well known that most tomatoes run at below ph 4.6 and do not >>>> need further acidification, >>> Everything I've read lately has said that tomatoes are being bred to be >>> less acidic, so this isn't true any more. I'm a little confused now. >>> Serene >> Don't be, more and more tomatoes and tomato seeds sold in the USA are >> only mildly acidic and need the citric acid added or some other acidifier. >> >> George > > I think you MAY BE WRONG. From what I have read, tomatoes are not > becoming less acidic across the board but what is happening is that > tomatoes are being bread the have INCREASED sugar levels. When you > increase the SUGAR, it covers the acidic "bite" to one's tongue. Thank > goodness someone covered how much citric acid to use in tomatoes. I > use one teaspoon as I often add some bell pepper and onion (very small > amount) and this is dangerous because these are NoN- ACID items and > add danger to any canned product unless they are pressure canned. If > you think that a tablespoon in a pint of tomatoes is appropriate, then > I say you have NEVER canned any tomatoes. Citric Acid, or Sour Salt, > is horribley TART and it has to be covered with added SUGAR to the > tomatoes to keep them from tasting like little children's sour candy. > Just take a pinch of Citric Acid and place it on your tongue. You will > then see what I mean. Regards - Jim in So. California And where, exactly, in my post did I say you had to add a tablespoon of citric acid? Jim, I've been canning tomatoes and other veggies for more than sixty years but I'm actually quoting what the USDA has to say about modern tomatoes. If you don't have an accurate pH meter or are not using pH strips that are somewhat accurate then you need to add citric acid or lemon juice in the USDA recommended amounts. |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
On Thu, 15 May 2008 23:12:32 -0700, Serene >
wrote: >Melba's Jammin' wrote: > >> It's a precaution, Serene. The tomatoes may be below 4.6 -- or they may >> not. I'd venture to say that most folks couldn't name the varietal they >> purchase for canning and the acidification is cheap insurance. >> > >Thanks, Barb! So I have a question, then -- if I do know the >varietal (because I grew them myself), then is there someplace I >could look to see what their acidity typically is? > >This stuff really fascinates the science geek in me. > >Serene In the book "All About Tomatoes" that was published by Ortho in 1976 says this: "There is probably as much variation in the pH and acidity of tomatoes due to climate, soil, cultural practices and ripeness as to variety differences." --U. S. D. A. Pink, yellow, white, etc tomatoes are not necessarily lower in acid. Newer varieties may be higher or lower in pH than the old varieties. Another quote from the book. "You can't always taste acidity. Note on the chart at right that honey is high in acidity" The chart lists honey as having a pH of 4.0. -- Susan N. "Moral indignation is in most cases two percent moral, 48 percent indignation, and 50 percent envy." Vittorio De Sica, Italian movie director (1901-1974) |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
In article >,
Serene > wrote: > Melba's Jammin' wrote: > > > It's a precaution, Serene. The tomatoes may be below 4.6 -- or they may > > not. I'd venture to say that most folks couldn't name the varietal they > > purchase for canning and the acidification is cheap insurance. > > > > Thanks, Barb! So I have a question, then -- if I do know the > varietal (because I grew them myself), then is there someplace I > could look to see what their acidity typically is? > > This stuff really fascinates the science geek in me. > > Serene I don't know. Ask at rec.gardens.edible (I think that's what they're called). I'm pretty sure that if you asked the NCHFP folks they'd tell you to acidify regardless ‹ they *have* to err on the side of caution. The U of MN has a list (I don't know how current it is) of tomatoes with a higher pH than 4.6. Maybe you could trace back to wherever your plants or seeds came from to find out more info about it. Or Google the varietal. Or check with your local state University's ag department (assuming there is one). Some thoughts. -- -Barb, Mother Superior, HOSSSPoJ Check my new ride: http://www.jamlady.eboard.com |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
The Cook wrote:
> In the book "All About Tomatoes" that was published by Ortho in 1976 > says this: "There is probably as much variation in the pH and acidity > of tomatoes due to climate, soil, cultural practices and ripeness as > to variety differences." --U. S. D. A. > > Pink, yellow, white, etc tomatoes are not necessarily lower in acid. > Newer varieties may be higher or lower in pH than the old varieties. > > Another quote from the book. "You can't always taste acidity. Note > on the chart at right that honey is high in acidity" The chart lists > honey as having a pH of 4.0. Thank you! Serene |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
In article >,
George Shirley > wrote: > jimnginger wrote: > > On May 15, 3:56?pm, George Shirley > wrote: > >> Serene wrote: > >>> Ray West wrote: > >>>> I've tried the ph metres, non of them work well enough to be of any > >>>> use, can't even relie on subsequent readings on the same test subject. > >>>> Got my money back on them. > >>>> It is well known that most tomatoes run at below ph 4.6 and do not > >>>> need further acidification, > >>> Everything I've read lately has said that tomatoes are being bred to be > >>> less acidic, so this isn't true any more. I'm a little confused now. > >>> Serene > >> Don't be, more and more tomatoes and tomato seeds sold in the USA are > >> only mildly acidic and need the citric acid added or some other acidifier. > >> > >> George > > > > I think you MAY BE WRONG. From what I have read, tomatoes are not > > becoming less acidic across the board but what is happening is that > > tomatoes are being bread the have INCREASED sugar levels. When you > > increase the SUGAR, it covers the acidic "bite" to one's tongue. Thank > > goodness someone covered how much citric acid to use in tomatoes. I > > use one teaspoon as I often add some bell pepper and onion (very small > > amount) and this is dangerous because these are NoN- ACID items and > > add danger to any canned product unless they are pressure canned. If > > you think that a tablespoon in a pint of tomatoes is appropriate, then > > I say you have NEVER canned any tomatoes. Citric Acid, or Sour Salt, > > is horribley TART and it has to be covered with added SUGAR to the > > tomatoes to keep them from tasting like little children's sour candy. > > Just take a pinch of Citric Acid and place it on your tongue. You will > > then see what I mean. Regards - Jim in So. California > And where, exactly, in my post did I say you had to add a tablespoon of > citric acid? Jim, I've been canning tomatoes and other veggies for more > than sixty years but I'm actually quoting what the USDA has to say about > modern tomatoes. > > If you don't have an accurate pH meter or are not using pH strips that > are somewhat accurate then you need to add citric acid or lemon juice in > the USDA recommended amounts. I think Jim was responding to combined ideas from separate posts, Jorge €” and one of them was not your writing. Ms. Edrena (being coffee deficient and suffering from the vapors) had stated a tablespoon of citric acid to a pint of tomatoes in her 5/9 post. She was corrected and contrite for her flub on 5/14. No harm, no foul. Pet the dog and stay calm. (I have a great sign that says "Pour the coffee and back away slowly." "-) -- -Barb, Mother Superior, HOSSSPoJ Check my new ride: http://www.jamlady.eboard.com |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
In article
>, jimnginger > wrote: > increase the SUGAR, it covers the acidic "bite" to one's tongue. Thank > goodness someone covered how much citric acid to use in tomatoes. I > use one teaspoon as I often add some bell pepper and onion (very small > amount) Do you use an actual recipe when you're making your "stewed-type" tomatoes, Jim? The U of MN (Gophers, go!!) has a tested recipe for them. It's pretty good. :-) http://www.extension.umn.edu/foodsaf.../tomatomixture NOTE that that recipe has times for processing in a BWB and that it doesn't include any specific acidification information. The two most recently-published tomes I own have recipes for stewed tomatoes (I haven't compared the proportions of the ingredients, though) but have processing times for pressure canning. I might have to ask the folks at the U about that. :-/ -- -Barb, Mother Superior, HOSSSPoJ Check my new ride: http://www.jamlady.eboard.com |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
"George Shirley" wrote
> than sixty years but I'm actually quoting what the USDA has to say about > modern tomatoes. > > If you don't have an accurate pH meter or are not using pH strips that are > somewhat accurate then you need to add citric acid or lemon juice in the > USDA recommended amounts. George, can we cut to the chase slightly for me? I'd like to try this for the first time. I have access only to the water boiling methods. If I make a thick sauce with just tomatoes and a few dried spices such as black pepper and a little cayenne, how much lemon juice should I add to a quart? What I have right now is the 'real lemon concentrate' but I can find out how much water to add to that to make 'equal to one lemon' pretty easy <grin>. I don't want 'leomony sauce' but I also don't want to be unsafe. I have 3 versions of tomatoes and no way to know if they are 'reduced acid' so it's safer to assume they are. |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
cshenk wrote:
> "George Shirley" wrote > >> than sixty years but I'm actually quoting what the USDA has to say about >> modern tomatoes. >> >> If you don't have an accurate pH meter or are not using pH strips that are >> somewhat accurate then you need to add citric acid or lemon juice in the >> USDA recommended amounts. > > George, can we cut to the chase slightly for me? I'd like to try this for > the first time. I have access only to the water boiling methods. If I make > a thick sauce with just tomatoes and a few dried spices such as black pepper > and a little cayenne, how much lemon juice should I add to a quart? What I > have right now is the 'real lemon concentrate' but I can find out how much > water to add to that to make 'equal to one lemon' pretty easy <grin>. > > I don't want 'leomony sauce' but I also don't want to be unsafe. I have 3 > versions of tomatoes and no way to know if they are 'reduced acid' so it's > safer to assume they are. > > Go here for the answer to your question: http://www.uga.edu/nchfp/how/can_03/tomato_intro.html The primary URL for U of Georgia and food safety is a big help to all of us. It has the safety recommendations from the foods science folks at UofG and the USDA. |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
cshenk wrote:
> "George Shirley" wrote > >> than sixty years but I'm actually quoting what the USDA has to say about >> modern tomatoes. >> >> If you don't have an accurate pH meter or are not using pH strips that are >> somewhat accurate then you need to add citric acid or lemon juice in the >> USDA recommended amounts. > > George, can we cut to the chase slightly for me? I'd like to try this for > the first time. I have access only to the water boiling methods. If I make > a thick sauce with just tomatoes and a few dried spices such as black pepper > and a little cayenne, how much lemon juice should I add to a quart? What I > have right now is the 'real lemon concentrate' but I can find out how much > water to add to that to make 'equal to one lemon' pretty easy <grin>. > > I don't want 'leomony sauce' but I also don't want to be unsafe. I have 3 > versions of tomatoes and no way to know if they are 'reduced acid' so it's > safer to assume they are. > > Use bottled lemon juice -- the cheap stuff in a quart bottle. 1 Tbsp per pint jar, or 2 Tbsp per quart. That's the recommended amount, and it shouldn't be enough to make your tomatoes taste "lemony". Bob |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
"cshenk" > wrote in message
... > "George Shirley" wrote > >> than sixty years but I'm actually quoting what the USDA has to say about >> modern tomatoes. >> >> If you don't have an accurate pH meter or are not using pH strips that >> are somewhat accurate then you need to add citric acid or lemon juice in >> the USDA recommended amounts. > > George, can we cut to the chase slightly for me? I'd like to try this for > the first time. I have access only to the water boiling methods. If I > make a thick sauce with just tomatoes and a few dried spices such as black > pepper and a little cayenne, how much lemon juice should I add to a quart? > What I have right now is the 'real lemon concentrate' but I can find out > how much water to add to that to make 'equal to one lemon' pretty easy > <grin>. > > I don't want 'leomony sauce' but I also don't want to be unsafe. I have 3 > versions of tomatoes and no way to know if they are 'reduced acid' so it's > safer to assume they are. > If you get a chance, call around to local drug stores or better yet, Jewish, Mediterranean or Middle Eastern ethnic groceries to find citric acid (sour salt). One has to use so little of it (!) and it has little taste (just sour). Good luck, and let us know how you do. Have your read some of our posts about letting the jars rest in the water with the heat turned off after the timing is done for about 5 min or so? Reduces chances of cracking jar. And don't can nekkid. Edrena |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
The Joneses wrote:
> "cshenk" > wrote in message > ... >> "George Shirley" wrote >> >>> than sixty years but I'm actually quoting what the USDA has to say about >>> modern tomatoes. >>> >>> If you don't have an accurate pH meter or are not using pH strips that >>> are somewhat accurate then you need to add citric acid or lemon juice in >>> the USDA recommended amounts. >> George, can we cut to the chase slightly for me? I'd like to try this for >> the first time. I have access only to the water boiling methods. If I >> make a thick sauce with just tomatoes and a few dried spices such as black >> pepper and a little cayenne, how much lemon juice should I add to a quart? >> What I have right now is the 'real lemon concentrate' but I can find out >> how much water to add to that to make 'equal to one lemon' pretty easy >> <grin>. >> >> I don't want 'leomony sauce' but I also don't want to be unsafe. I have 3 >> versions of tomatoes and no way to know if they are 'reduced acid' so it's >> safer to assume they are. >> > If you get a chance, call around to local drug stores or better yet, Jewish, > Mediterranean or Middle Eastern ethnic groceries to find citric acid (sour > salt). One has to use so little of it (!) and it has little taste (just > sour). > Good luck, and let us know how you do. Have your read some of our posts > about letting the jars rest in the water with the heat turned off after the > timing is done for about 5 min or so? Reduces chances of cracking jar. And > don't can nekkid. > Edrena > > And don't ask how anyone knows not to can nekkid. George |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
"George Shirley" wrote
> cshenk wrote: >> George, can we cut to the chase slightly for me? I'd like to try this >> for > Go here for the answer to your question: > > http://www.uga.edu/nchfp/how/can_03/tomato_intro.html I suppose if I hunt around 30 mins I might even find the info. Thanks |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
"zxcvbob" wrote
>> George, can we cut to the chase slightly for me? I'd like to try this >> for the first time. I have access only to the water boiling methods. If >> I make a thick sauce with just tomatoes and a few dried spices such as >> black pepper and a little cayenne, how much lemon juice should I add to a >> quart? What I have right now is the 'real lemon concentrate' but I can >> find out how much water to add to that to make 'equal to one lemon' >> pretty easy <grin>. > Use bottled lemon juice -- the cheap stuff in a quart bottle. 1 Tbsp per > pint jar, or 2 Tbsp per quart. That's the recommended amount, and it > shouldn't be enough to make your tomatoes taste "lemony". Thanks Bob! Thats what i needed. I'm not adding onions or bell peppers or sugar or anything but a small amount of seasoning. I plan to decant then seaon it if you get my drift. |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
"The Joneses" wrote
> If you get a chance, call around to local drug stores or better yet, > Jewish, Mediterranean or Middle Eastern ethnic groceries to find citric > acid (sour salt). One has to use so little of it (!) and it has little > taste (just sour). Humm! Local 'Star of Israel' place here. How much citric acid per quart? > Good luck, and let us know how you do. Have your read some of our posts > about letting the jars rest in the water with the heat turned off after > the timing is done for about 5 min or so? Reduces chances of cracking jar. > And don't can nekkid. Hehehe wasnt planning to can nekkid and no, I'm new here so havent seen the earlier posts much. My next project will be to remind myself how to make some of th simple jellies I did years ago. Used the pectin pouches and had nice home stuff. |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
cshenk wrote:
> "George Shirley" wrote > >>cshenk wrote: > > >>>George, can we cut to the chase slightly for me? I'd like to try this >>>for >> >>Go here for the answer to your question: >> >>http://www.uga.edu/nchfp/how/can_03/tomato_intro.html > > > I suppose if I hunt around 30 mins I might even find the info. Thanks > > > You would have to be a really slow reader because it is in the very first paragraph, because of its safety importance, I presume Ellen |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
cshenk wrote:
> "George Shirley" wrote >> cshenk wrote: > >>> George, can we cut to the chase slightly for me? I'd like to try this >>> for >> Go here for the answer to your question: >> >> http://www.uga.edu/nchfp/how/can_03/tomato_intro.html > > I suppose if I hunt around 30 mins I might even find the info. Thanks > > > Took me less than 30 seconds at that site to see what you wanted. |
Posted to rec.food.preserving
|
|||
|
|||
Citric Acid question
"cshenk" > wrote in message ... > "The Joneses" wrote > >> If you get a chance, call around to local drug stores or better yet, >> Jewish, Mediterranean or Middle Eastern ethnic groceries to find citric >> acid (sour salt). One has to use so little of it (!) and it has little >> taste (just sour). > > Humm! Local 'Star of Israel' place here. How much citric acid per quart? > >> Good luck, and let us know how you do. Have your read some of our posts >> about letting the jars rest in the water with the heat turned off after >> the timing is done for about 5 min or so? Reduces chances of cracking >> jar. And don't can nekkid. > > Hehehe wasnt planning to can nekkid and no, I'm new here so havent seen > the earlier posts much. > > My next project will be to remind myself how to make some of th simple > jellies I did years ago. Used the pectin pouches and had nice home > stuff. > I haven't bwb canned tomato products without a recipe. You have to look up the correct data yerownself by using USDA approved recipes (or method) or using a calibrated test meter. Checking latest edition canning books outa the liberry, or emailing your County Extension Agent will get some good recipes. Leetle work for good health for self & loved ones. There, all that's proper. The sour salt from the Jeruselem Grocery was the cheapest in my city. Drug store wanted to special order..... The USDA and our experience shows that leaving the jars in the water for a bit equalizes the pressures/temps and there is less a chance of cooler air causing the hot jars to explode. Hence the canning with at least an apron on. And not barefoot either. Sooner or later y'all might have an exploder, or knock a jar enough to crack it. We've shared some dandy jam/jelly stuff here, would do you good to google recipes from just this group for the past couple years. Not really all that many, unlike the rest of the web, but ours have been tested and we mostly use USDA approved methods. My favorites were the triple apricot jam (I adapted that one cause I only had part of the stuff - I called it Apricot Squared), an apricot pineapple one, a few combination spreads with nuts or chiles from Minnesota, not to mention Boozeberry Jam. Pickle talk otoh, makes me high from the vinegar fumes, so we'll leave that for another chat. Edrena, faithful disciple of St. Vinaigrette Holy Order of the Sacred Sisters & Brothers of St. Pectina of Jella (HOSS&BSPJ) (a wholly non-partisan, seriously silly group) |
Reply |
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Forum | |||
Ascorbic acid (vitamin c) vs. citric acid | Preserving | |||
Citric acid | General Cooking | |||
Vinegar is poison , use citric acid | General Cooking | |||
citric acid amount | Preserving | |||
Citric Acid Overdone | Winemaking |