Why oh! Why? Do Americans celebrate Cinco de Mayo? Does anybody really
know why? I think this was started as advertising by Corona/Cuahtemoc
breweries as a way to get sales up.

If anybody knows more facts about how the 'holiday" got started please
post here.

and we want to.
Now, go research how Christmas was "developed", Mothers Day, Valentines
Day, The Easter Bunnys etc, etc.
Cinco de Mayo is not sancrosect but all of these Holidays have $$$$ behind
them, so don't be so stolid about it.

Celebrate or not. That is your right

Secret_Ingredient wrote:
> Why oh! Why? Do Americans celebrate Cinco de Mayo? Does anybody really
> know why? I think this was started as advertising by Corona/Cuahtemoc
> breweries as a way to get sales up.
>
> If anybody knows more facts about how the 'holiday" got started please
> post here.
>

Battle of Puebla in 1862.

Mexico defeated French troops in that battle.
Anytime any nation in the New World defeted the
French we should celebrate.

Randy Johnson wrote:

>
> I don't have facts, only opinion. We love any excuse to party; men embrace
> the idea to booze and eat in excess,

> women like the excuse to shop and eat
> out, rather than have more take-out KFC or pizza.

What's that supposed to mean?
--
Tp,

-------- __o
----- -\<. -------- __o
--- ( )/ ( ) ---- -\<.
-------------------- ( )/ ( )
-----------------------------------------

No Lawsuit Ever Fixed A Moron...

On Apr 28, 7:21?pm, Secret_Ingredient > wrote:

> If anybody knows more facts about how the 'holiday" got started please
> post here.

I can certainly understand why you feel that the commercialized
celebration of a foreign holiday seems so *alien* and WRONG.

But local Mexicans, who outnumber Americans by two to one in this
small county, also believe that the recent commercialization of Cinco
de Mayo from a "fiesta patria" into El Drunko de Mayo is inherently
wrong.

If you want to read about fiestas patrias, go he
http://www.tsha.utexas.edu/handbook/...s/FF/lkf6.html

I find it amazing that local Mexicans, descended as they are from
illegal aliens who jumped the border nearly a century ago could have
any sense whatever of absolute right or wrong or patriotism.

But, you have to understand that the Mexican culture is based upon the
pretense that mestizos are "Spanish", and not mestizos.

Under the Spanish colonial system of caste and class, the Spanish were
on top. Spaniards were first class citizens of Mexico and the Spanish
empire. They could go places and do things and carve out their own
empire, if they were energetic.

The next step down the social ladder was called "Castizo" (the
purified ones). The Castizos were Jews and Moors who had converted to
Roman Catholicism. It didn't much matter to the Spanish how dark their
skin color was, if they remained faithful to the church, they could be
second class citizens, and the Castizos would assert that they were
"Spanish", even if they looked like Usama bin Laden.

Many of Hernan Cortez' officers were Castizos who had left Spain to
seek their fortune in the New World. That's why you see so many evil-
looking Mexicans who could pass for Arabs. Their ancestors were Moors.
They had the blessing of the king of Spain to loot the riches of the
New World and bring it all back to Spain so the Holy Roman Emperor
could fight the Protestant Reformation.

If a Spaniard married an Indian woman, the offspring was called a
"mestizo", and was a third class citizen, depending upon whether he
lived as a European, wearing clothes, or lived like an Indian and ran
around nearly naked.

Each caste had an animal name. The third class mestizos were called
"coyotes" and the name has stuck until today, but "coyote" no longer
indicates racial mixture, it means that the person is a criminal who
smuggles illegal aliens across the border. That's actually amusing.
Coyotes are leading other coyotes across the border, and light-
complected Mexicans don't have to leave Mexico, they have it made.

The former were called "rational persons" and could own land, conduct
their business, and travel about the country. The latter were
considered to be "irrational persons", and could not conduct any
business of substance, own land or travel about the country freely.

"Irrational persons" were called "Indios" and were considered to be
fourth class citizens and they were kept in a pupillary status as
neophytes in the Catholic church, where it was expected that they
could be made into useful peasant citizens of the Spanish empire in
only ten years.

The majority of the neophytes died in the first two or three years of
captivity at the church or mission or were worked to death at the
encomiendas, which were temporary land grants given to first and
second class citizens.

There were also lower classed citizens. For instance, the child of a
Spaniard and a Negro woman was a racial mixture called "mulato" and
the animal symbol was a "mule". Mulatos were fifth class citizens.

You can easily see why it was important for anybody who lived in
Mexico to claim that they were a faithful Roman Catholic, and that
they were *Spanish*. And, since they usually couldn't own land, there
was nothing for them in Mexico, they had to migrate north.

Once they were somewhat "established" in the USA, they knew that they
could easily be deported back to Mexico, and they claimed to be
"Spanish", not Mexicans.

Their disaffected children felt that they didn't belong to either
country. They were called "pachucos" and formed into street gangs.

Pachucos tend to enjoy Cinco de Mayo as a party holiday instead of a
"fiesta patria".

"Rechazo Todo" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> On Apr 28, 7:21?pm, Secret_Ingredient > wrote:
>
>> If anybody knows more facts about how the 'holiday" got started please
>> post here.
>
> I can certainly understand why you feel that the commercialized
> celebration of a foreign holiday seems so *alien* and WRONG.
>
> But local Mexicans, who outnumber Americans by two to one in this
> small county, also believe that the recent commercialization of Cinco
> de Mayo from a "fiesta patria" into El Drunko de Mayo is inherently
> wrong.
>
> If you want to read about fiestas patrias, go he
> http://www.tsha.utexas.edu/handbook/...s/FF/lkf6.html
>
> I find it amazing that local Mexicans, descended as they are from
> illegal aliens who jumped the border nearly a century ago could have
> any sense whatever of absolute right or wrong or patriotism.
>
> But, you have to understand that the Mexican culture is based upon the
> pretense that mestizos are "Spanish", and not mestizos.
>
> Under the Spanish colonial system of caste and class, the Spanish were
> on top. Spaniards were first class citizens of Mexico and the Spanish
> empire. They could go places and do things and carve out their own
> empire, if they were energetic.
>
> The next step down the social ladder was called "Castizo" (the
> purified ones). The Castizos were Jews and Moors who had converted to
> Roman Catholicism. It didn't much matter to the Spanish how dark their
> skin color was, if they remained faithful to the church, they could be
> second class citizens, and the Castizos would assert that they were
> "Spanish", even if they looked like Usama bin Laden.
>
> Many of Hernan Cortez' officers were Castizos who had left Spain to
> seek their fortune in the New World. That's why you see so many evil-
> looking Mexicans who could pass for Arabs. Their ancestors were Moors.
> They had the blessing of the king of Spain to loot the riches of the
> New World and bring it all back to Spain so the Holy Roman Emperor
> could fight the Protestant Reformation.
>
> If a Spaniard married an Indian woman, the offspring was called a
> "mestizo", and was a third class citizen, depending upon whether he
> lived as a European, wearing clothes, or lived like an Indian and ran
> around nearly naked.
>
> Each caste had an animal name. The third class mestizos were called
> "coyotes" and the name has stuck until today, but "coyote" no longer
> indicates racial mixture, it means that the person is a criminal who
> smuggles illegal aliens across the border. That's actually amusing.
> Coyotes are leading other coyotes across the border, and light-
> complected Mexicans don't have to leave Mexico, they have it made.
>
> The former were called "rational persons" and could own land, conduct
> their business, and travel about the country. The latter were
> considered to be "irrational persons", and could not conduct any
> business of substance, own land or travel about the country freely.
>
> "Irrational persons" were called "Indios" and were considered to be
> fourth class citizens and they were kept in a pupillary status as
> neophytes in the Catholic church, where it was expected that they
> could be made into useful peasant citizens of the Spanish empire in
> only ten years.
>
> The majority of the neophytes died in the first two or three years of
> captivity at the church or mission or were worked to death at the
> encomiendas, which were temporary land grants given to first and
> second class citizens.
>
> There were also lower classed citizens. For instance, the child of a
> Spaniard and a Negro woman was a racial mixture called "mulato" and
> the animal symbol was a "mule". Mulatos were fifth class citizens.
>
> You can easily see why it was important for anybody who lived in
> Mexico to claim that they were a faithful Roman Catholic, and that
> they were *Spanish*. And, since they usually couldn't own land, there
> was nothing for them in Mexico, they had to migrate north.
>
> Once they were somewhat "established" in the USA, they knew that they
> could easily be deported back to Mexico, and they claimed to be
> "Spanish", not Mexicans.
>
> Their disaffected children felt that they didn't belong to either
> country. They were called "pachucos" and formed into street gangs.
>
> Pachucos tend to enjoy Cinco de Mayo as a party holiday instead of a
> "fiesta patria".
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Secret_Ingredient wrote:
> Why oh! Why? Do Americans celebrate Cinco de Mayo? Does anybody really
> know why? I think this was started as advertising by Corona/Cuahtemoc
> breweries as a way to get sales up.
>
> If anybody knows more facts about how the 'holiday" got started please
> post here.
>

I may be wrong but remember that Macayo's restaurants in Phoenix started
advertising the Cinco de Mayo celebration back in the early 80s shortly
after they had sold out to a national chain.

Before that the only spring time drink fests were around St. Patty's day.

On Apr 29, 12:32?pm, "Gunner" <gunner@ spam.com> wrote:
> "Rechazo Todo" > wrote in message
>
> oups.com...

Where did the words "white" or "pride" appear in that message?

The Christian reconquest of Spain was a religious conflict, not a race
war.

The Spanish colonial class and caste system arose from that conflict
and we are still seeing the results of the struggle to gain control of
the Iberian peninsula in the mass migration of Mexicans from a country
that doesn't give mestizos a chance.

For that matter, ask a Filipino immigrant what *he* thinks of
centuries of Spanish imperialism, followed by 50 years of American
imperialism.

However, since you mentioned "White Pride", it reminded me of what
Carlos Mencia had to say about the apparent political incorrectness of
any expression of pride by a White person.

Carlos said that the Whites needed a "beaner" like himself to point
that out. Carlos is not from Mexico, he's from Honduras, and Central
Americans tend to think of Mexicans as being too violent.

Carlos makes fun of uneducated Mexican illegal aliens who think that
they are somehow being discriminated against because of racism,
when their real problem is that they have a fourth grade education.

On Apr 29, 3:22?pm, Sonoran Dude > wrote:

> I may be wrong but remember that Macayo's restaurants in Phoenix started
> advertising the Cinco de Mayo celebration back in the early 80s shortly
> after they had sold out to a national chain.
>
> Before that the only spring time drink fests were around St. Patty's day.

Well, you're wrong as usual. You don't know what the **** you're
talking about.

Cinco de Mayo is NOT a "spring time drink fest" for Mexicans here in
the San Joaquin valley. It's a "fiesta patria" just like the 4th of
July.

Mexicans began celebrating "fiestas patrias" in Texas, after they
realized they were a minority in the Lone Star Republic.

Mexicans are still celebrating their patriotism for a country that
they do not want to live in, they want to bring it here. There will be
parades and beauty contests and mariachi bands just like they had 80
years ago. There will probably be a car show.

And the local Mexicans who've been "living in the shadows" for decades
are now complaining that the commercialization of Cinco de Mayo is
ruining the event as a family occasion.

Hoardes of illegal alien border jumpers began arriving here during the
1910-1920 Mexican Revolution to work in the farms and orchards run by
American businessmen. The Mexicans didn't want to give up their
culture and ties to Mexico, so they joined organizations like
the "sociedades mutualistas" and the "comite patriotico mexicano".

And the "comission honorifica mexicana" formed by the Mexican
consulate helped them circumvent American laws, just like the Mexican
consulate is doing now by providing illegal aliens with matriculas
that they can use for identification to get bank accounts, credit
cards, and home loans.

Mexicans are driving up rents locally by occupying older housing and
they are driving up the cost of new homes and crowding schools and
hospital emergency rooms.

The recent cold weather destroyed about 3/4 of a billion dollars in
orange and other citrus crops, forcing American businessmen to lay off
their Mexicans.

But, they don't want to give up their "good workers", so they are
*rotating them*, so they will keep coming back, instead of leaving
the valley and returning to Mexico.

The taco stands and lunch wagons that made lunches for the "good
workers" are complaining that their business is down to nothing.

The established businessmen who have restaurants are complaining that
the taco wagons are stealing their customers, and a new law requires
the roach coaches to move a half mile every half hour.

In the minds of American businessmen, a cheap worker who will bust his
ass for 1/3rd the wages that an American will consider is a
"good worker".

In spite of the agricultural disaster, agrobusinesses are still
sending busses to the Unemployment Offices to pick up "good workers",
but no Americans need apply.

Several years ago, the county was offering unemployed meat cutters a
ticket to Iowa, so they could work in the slaughterhouses, buthering
hogs.

Now agrobusiness says there is a "shortage of good workers" and is
bringing in Mexicans to do jobs that they wouldn't pay Americans to
do. Anybody that wants to work at the chicken processing plant has to
be a "good worker".

Have you figured out what a "good worker" is by now?

If you read the local Spanish language newspaper, the stories are all
about the plight of the "trabajadores". You never see a word about
the "workers" in the English language daily that prints the weekly
Mexican newpaper.

"Rechazo Todo" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> On Apr 29, 3:22?pm, Sonoran Dude > wrote:
>

"Rechazo Todo" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> On Apr 29, 12:32?pm, "Gunner" <gunner@ spam.com> wrote:
>> "Rechazo Todo" > wrote in message
>>
>> oups.com...
>
> Where did the words "white" or "pride" appear in that message?
>
> The Christian reconquest of Spain was a religious conflict, not a race
> war.
>
> The Spanish colonial class and caste system arose from that conflict
> and we are still seeing the results of the struggle to gain control of
> the Iberian peninsula in the mass migration of Mexicans from a country
> that doesn't give mestizos a chance.
>
> For that matter, ask a Filipino immigrant what *he* thinks of
> centuries of Spanish imperialism, followed by 50 years of American
> imperialism.
>
> However, since you mentioned "White Pride", it reminded me of what
> Carlos Mencia had to say about the apparent political incorrectness of
> any expression of pride by a White person.
>
> Carlos said that the Whites needed a "beaner" like himself to point
> that out. Carlos is not from Mexico, he's from Honduras, and Central
> Americans tend to think of Mexicans as being too violent.
>
> Carlos makes fun of uneducated Mexican illegal aliens who think that
> they are somehow being discriminated against because of racism,
> when their real problem is that they have a fourth grade education.
>

Rechazo Todo wrote:
> On Apr 29, 3:22?pm, Sonoran Dude > wrote:
>
>> I may be wrong but remember that Macayo's restaurants in Phoenix started
>> advertising the Cinco de Mayo celebration back in the early 80s shortly
>> after they had sold out to a national chain.
>>
>> Before that the only spring time drink fests were around St. Patty's day.
>
> Well, you're wrong as usual. You don't know what the **** you're
> talking about.
>
> Cinco de Mayo is NOT a "spring time drink fest" for Mexicans here in
> the San Joaquin valley. It's a "fiesta patria" just like the 4th of
> July.
>

The question was why do "Americans" celebrate Cinco de Mayo not
Mexicans, read the question douche bag. I think my explanation is more
conducive to the US American phenomenon. It makes sense that a large
Mexican restaurant corporation would market this holiday in their own
interest of creating a "drink fest".

On Apr 30, 9:07?am, Sonoran Dude > wrote:
> Rechazo Todo wrote:

> > Cinco de Mayo is NOT a "spring time drink fest" for Mexicans here in
> > the San Joaquin valley. It's a "fiesta patria" just like the 4th of
> > July.
>
> The question was why do "Americans" celebrate Cinco de Mayo not
> Mexicans, read the question douche bag. I think my explanation is more
> conducive to the US American phenomenon. It makes sense that a large
> Mexican restaurant corporation would market this holiday in their own
> interest of creating a "drink fest".-

Not too bright, are you? You bought into the question, emphasizing
"Americans" and, by doing so, you alienate your Mexican American
fellow citizens. ;-)

Hehe. How ya gonna win the PC game?

Where's Gunner

Rechazo Todo wrote:
> On Apr 30, 9:07?am, Sonoran Dude > wrote:
>> Rechazo Todo wrote:
>
>>> Cinco de Mayo is NOT a "spring time drink fest" for Mexicans here in
>>> the San Joaquin valley. It's a "fiesta patria" just like the 4th of
>>> July.
>> The question was why do "Americans" celebrate Cinco de Mayo not
>> Mexicans, read the question douche bag. I think my explanation is more
>> conducive to the US American phenomenon. It makes sense that a large
>> Mexican restaurant corporation would market this holiday in their own
>> interest of creating a "drink fest".-
>
> Not too bright, are you? You bought into the question, emphasizing
> "Americans" and, by doing so, you alienate your Mexican American
> fellow citizens. ;-)
>
> Hehe. How ya gonna win the PC game?
>
> Where's Gunner
>

I answered the question in the context of the question. Before the food
and beverage industry embraced this "holiday" Most Mexican and Anglo
Americans had no idea what Cinco de Mayo was yet all of them knew what
the 4th of July was celebrated for and not considered a "drink fest".
Cinco de Mayo was a footnote in Mexican history and hardly observed in
Mexico before the "American" food service industry came up with an
excuse to start serving margaritas one weekend. Prove me wrong, go ask
your Mexican friends if you have any friends at all.

On Apr 30, 11:19?am, Sonoran Dude > wrote:
> Rechazo Todo wrote:

> > Not too bright, are you? You bought into the question, emphasizing
> > "Americans" and, by doing so, you alienate your Mexican American
> > fellow citizens. ;-)

> I answered the question in the context of the question. Before the food
> and beverage industry embraced this "holiday" Most Mexican and Anglo
> Americans had no idea what Cinco de Mayo was yet all of them knew what
> the 4th of July was celebrated for and not considered a "drink fest".
> Cinco de Mayo was a footnote in Mexican history and hardly observed in
> Mexico before the "American" food service industry came up with an
> excuse to start serving margaritas one weekend. Prove me wrong, go ask
> your Mexican friends if you have any friends at all.- Hide quoted text -

Fiestas patrias have been celebrated in the USA for 150 years, but the
recent
commercialization of Cinco de Mayos annoys both Mexicans who want a
patriotic family event and Americans who don't believe that Mexicans
should
hold a patriotic event on US soil.

If you want to read about fiestas patrias, go he
http://www.tsha.utexas.edu/handbook/...s/FF/lkf6.html

Albrecht wrote:
> On Apr 30, 11:19?am, Sonoran Dude > wrote:
>> Rechazo Todo wrote:
>
>>> Not too bright, are you? You bought into the question, emphasizing
>>> "Americans" and, by doing so, you alienate your Mexican American
>>> fellow citizens. ;-)
>
>> I answered the question in the context of the question. Before the food
>> and beverage industry embraced this "holiday" Most Mexican and Anglo
>> Americans had no idea what Cinco de Mayo was yet all of them knew what
>> the 4th of July was celebrated for and not considered a "drink fest".
>> Cinco de Mayo was a footnote in Mexican history and hardly observed in
>> Mexico before the "American" food service industry came up with an
>> excuse to start serving margaritas one weekend. Prove me wrong, go ask
>> your Mexican friends if you have any friends at all.- Hide quoted text -
>
> Fiestas patrias have been celebrated in the USA for 150 years, but the
> recent
> commercialization of Cinco de Mayos annoys both Mexicans who want a
> patriotic family event and Americans who don't believe that Mexicans
> should
> hold a patriotic event on US soil.
>
> If you want to read about fiestas patrias, go he
> http://www.tsha.utexas.edu/handbook/...s/FF/lkf6.html
>

In my opinion if it were not for 2 for 1 margaritas the original poster
and most 2nd generation Mexican Americans probably would have never
heard of the holiday and it would still be small fiestas patrias as you
have well noted. If not for gringo marketing and promotion this holiday
would still be a footnote over the sound of some live mariachi music
down at the park. You don't see us gringos dressing up like leprechauns
and carrying around novelty margarita cups on Diez y Seis de Septiembre.
The simple reason is that it does not roll off the tongue like 4th of
July or 5th of May. My comments through this discussion have addressed
the marketing of the holiday not the significance or who or why someone
celebrates it. Be thankful that in our country we are free to celebrate
any holiday regardless of what others may think or what country it
originates so drop the victimization.

On Apr 30, 3:39�pm, Sonoran Dude > wrote:

>
> In my opinion if it were not for 2 for 1 margaritas the original poster
> and most 2nd generation Mexican Americans probably would have never
> heard of the holiday and it would still be small fiestas patrias as you
> have well noted.

You are so full of shit. The wetbacks are into their fifth generation
here in the San Joaquin valley, and they
still regard themselves as Mexicans, not Americans.

> If not for gringo marketing and promotion this holiday
> would still be a footnote over the sound of some live mariachi music
> down at the park.

Dude, the local Mexicans are taking over my whole gawddamned town with
their
Cinco de Mayo parade, car show, beauty pageant, etc.

The Cinco de Mayo celebrations are being sponsored by the Mexican
Consulate, through an American corporation that was originally
established by Mexicans to look out for the *welfare* of Mexicans in
the USA. During the Great Depression, this agency gave money
to Mexicans so they could voluntarily repatriate themselves to Mexico.
During WW2, the Mexicans came back to the valley. In the 1950's, the
US government deported them again. In the 1970's the Mexicans came
back again...

The parks in the larger towns in the SJV will be full of Mexicans from
all the little Tijuana towns this weekend. The local community college
will also be swarming with Mexicans celebrating Cinco de Mayo.
Mexicans have a flea market in the parking lot at the college every
Saturday anyway.

The Mexicans will be playing their conjuntos music, lighting
firecrackers, and shooting their guns into the air until midnight on
Saturday and Sunday, and they will have huge barbecues with meat
purchased by their welfare checks and the money they got from the
federal disaster relief fund.

When the federal government was slow to step in and fund disaster
relief, a local representative of the United Farm Workers threatened a
protest march. The Mexicans expect our government to take care of
them, instead of just going back to their country.

So many unemployed Mexicans, with so little to do, except drink beer
and raise hell. The local newpapers will be filled with
stories of their arrests. I was reading about two different Mexicans
yesterday. They were arrested for trying to kidnap little girls
near local schools so they could rape them.

Stop by any park in a SJV town, and you'll see Mexicans parking in
their cars under a shade tree to have sex. If you park next to a
car with horny Mexicans in it, they will give you angry looks, and
maybe even challenge you for looking in their direction. I stopped to
deposit some litter in a trashcan and the Mexican got out and wanted
to know what I was looking at. He was irate because he couldn't
have public sex with his girlfriend in the back seat of his SUV.

Another time, I was bird watching near the lake. The Mexicans trying
to have sex in their cars got mad because I was using binoculars.
One Mexican wanted to know if I was a "narc".

The local state prison has over 10,000 Mexicans locked up.

>*You don't see us gringos dressing up like leprechauns
> and carrying around novelty margarita cups on Diez y Seis de Septiembre.

You might just see something like that, if you were outnumbered two to
one in Tucson.

> * The simple reason is that it does not roll off the tongue like 4th of
> July or 5th of May. My comments through this discussion have addressed
> the marketing of the holiday not the significance or who or why someone
> celebrates it.

Hey, some Mexican reporter once asked Ronald Reagan if his family
celebrated Cinco de Mayo. Always a politician, and sensitive to
the possibility of a trap, Reagan responded that he couldn't remember
a time when his family *didn't* celebrate the alien holiday.

That was about the same time that K-Mart and all the department stores
and grocery chains and auto dealerships started advertising Cinco de
Mayo sales. They recognized that the Mexicans had a lot of money to
spend and they wanted it.

So don't say that Cinco de Mayo is just about drinking a lot of booze.

> Be thankful that in our country we are free to celebrate
> any holiday regardless of what others may think or what country it
> originates so drop the victimization.

Dude, my ancestors established this country, they fought and shed
their blood for liberty. But they never intended for *aliens* to
come over here and start telling us what the Declaration of
Independence and US Constitution meant. They never intended for
*aliens*
to tell us what the statue of liberty means.

And, there are probably plenty of foreign holidays that you would not
want to see celebrated here, so drop the holier-than-thou pretense.

Rechazo Todo wrote:
> On Apr 30, 3:39�pm, Sonoran Dude > wrote:
>
>> In my opinion if it were not for 2 for 1 margaritas the original poster
>> and most 2nd generation Mexican Americans probably would have never
>> heard of the holiday and it would still be small fiestas patrias as you
>> have well noted.
>
> You are so full of shit. The wetbacks are into their fifth generation
> here in the San Joaquin valley, and they
> still regard themselves as Mexicans, not Americans.
>
>> If not for gringo marketing and promotion this holiday
>> would still be a footnote over the sound of some live mariachi music
>> down at the park.
>
> Dude, the local Mexicans are taking over my whole gawddamned town with
> their
> Cinco de Mayo parade, car show, beauty pageant, etc.
>
> The Cinco de Mayo celebrations are being sponsored by the Mexican
> Consulate, through an American corporation that was originally
> established by Mexicans to look out for the *welfare* of Mexicans in
> the USA. During the Great Depression, this agency gave money
> to Mexicans so they could voluntarily repatriate themselves to Mexico.
> During WW2, the Mexicans came back to the valley. In the 1950's, the
> US government deported them again. In the 1970's the Mexicans came
> back again...
>
> The parks in the larger towns in the SJV will be full of Mexicans from
> all the little Tijuana towns this weekend. The local community college
> will also be swarming with Mexicans celebrating Cinco de Mayo.
> Mexicans have a flea market in the parking lot at the college every
> Saturday anyway.
>
> The Mexicans will be playing their conjuntos music, lighting
> firecrackers, and shooting their guns into the air until midnight on
> Saturday and Sunday, and they will have huge barbecues with meat
> purchased by their welfare checks and the money they got from the
> federal disaster relief fund.
>
> When the federal government was slow to step in and fund disaster
> relief, a local representative of the United Farm Workers threatened a
> protest march. The Mexicans expect our government to take care of
> them, instead of just going back to their country.
>
> So many unemployed Mexicans, with so little to do, except drink beer
> and raise hell. The local newpapers will be filled with
> stories of their arrests. I was reading about two different Mexicans
> yesterday. They were arrested for trying to kidnap little girls
> near local schools so they could rape them.
>
> Stop by any park in a SJV town, and you'll see Mexicans parking in
> their cars under a shade tree to have sex. If you park next to a
> car with horny Mexicans in it, they will give you angry looks, and
> maybe even challenge you for looking in their direction. I stopped to
> deposit some litter in a trashcan and the Mexican got out and wanted
> to know what I was looking at. He was irate because he couldn't
> have public sex with his girlfriend in the back seat of his SUV.
>
> Another time, I was bird watching near the lake. The Mexicans trying
> to have sex in their cars got mad because I was using binoculars.
> One Mexican wanted to know if I was a "narc".
>
> The local state prison has over 10,000 Mexicans locked up.
>
>> �You don't see us gringos dressing up like leprechauns
>> and carrying around novelty margarita cups on Diez y Seis de Septiembre.
>
> You might just see something like that, if you were outnumbered two to
> one in Tucson.
>
>> � The simple reason is that it does not roll off the tongue like 4th of
>> July or 5th of May. My comments through this discussion have addressed
>> the marketing of the holiday not the significance or who or why someone
>> celebrates it.
>
> Hey, some Mexican reporter once asked Ronald Reagan if his family
> celebrated Cinco de Mayo. Always a politician, and sensitive to
> the possibility of a trap, Reagan responded that he couldn't remember
> a time when his family *didn't* celebrate the alien holiday.
>
> That was about the same time that K-Mart and all the department stores
> and grocery chains and auto dealerships started advertising Cinco de
> Mayo sales. They recognized that the Mexicans had a lot of money to
> spend and they wanted it.
>
> So don't say that Cinco de Mayo is just about drinking a lot of booze.
>
>> Be thankful that in our country we are free to celebrate
>> any holiday regardless of what others may think or what country it
>> originates so drop the victimization.
>
> Dude, my ancestors established this country, they fought and shed
> their blood for liberty. But they never intended for *aliens* to
> come over here and start telling us what the Declaration of
> Independence and US Constitution meant. They never intended for
> *aliens*
> to tell us what the statue of liberty means.
>
> And, there are probably plenty of foreign holidays that you would not
> want to see celebrated here, so drop the holier-than-thou pretense.
>

I have no idea what you are talking about. The "Mexican-American"
families me and my parents grew up with are just as American as my Anglo
family. You seem so bitter against these neighbors of yours. I was
talking about Mexican-Americans. The Mexican American families that I
grew up with and my parents grew up with served in the US American
forces fighting for the same liberty yours did. We went to the same
schools, we were free to date or socialize with each other without
prejudice. These Mexican American families I know speak English because
they are Americans not Mexicans just as my Italian friends or Jewish
friends are Americans and learned our language. The difference is that
the Mexican Americans were here when the US claimed this land and they
would take offense to your term "wet back".

I will again claim that prior to 1978 Cinco de Mayo was not a household
word. It became a household world after Macayo's and Garcia's
restaurants sold 2 for 1 Margaritas and the other chains followed suit.
That was about the time that Ronald Regan was thinking about running for
President. Regan was an artful liar. My favorite quote, "All I remember
is I forgot". It's still not the premier patriotic holiday in Mexico and
never will be because it is a footnote in their history.

Secret_Ingredient wrote:
> Why oh! Why? Do Americans celebrate Cinco de Mayo? Does anybody really
> know why? I think this was started as advertising by Corona/Cuahtemoc
> breweries as a way to get sales up.
>
> If anybody knows more facts about how the 'holiday" got started please
> post here.
>

There is some historical opinion that the Battle of Puebla,
May 5, 1862, was historically important to the United States
as well as Mexico. Some historians believe it might be MORE
historically significant to U.S. history than Mexican history.

The French, Spanish and English had come to Mexico supposedly
to collect debts. The Spanish and English quickly did so and
left. The French had more ambitious plans...annex Mexico,
support and supply the Confederate Army to ultimately divide
and destroy the United States. The underestimated Mexicans
kept the French pre-occupied long enough for the Union Army
to defeat the Confederates and preserve the Union. With the
Civil War over, the U.S. sent its support south with supplies,
arms and men to help the Mexicans defeat the French and win
their independence.

I'd say it's appropriate here in the U.S. to offer a toast
to the Mexican victory at Puebla and join the celebration.

Rich

On May 1, 2:57 pm, Rich McCormack > wrote:
> Secret_Ingredient wrote:
> > Why oh! Why? Do Americans celebrate Cinco de Mayo? Does anybody really
> > know why?

> I'd say it's appropriate here in the U.S. to offer a toast
> to the Mexican victory at Puebla and join the celebration.
>
> Rich

Thanks, Rich. I had let that historical significance drift away from
my old mind. Here's a web site that offers just a tiny bit more
information than what you wrote:

<http://www.vivacincodemayo.org/history.htm>

Would anyone here prefer to speak French as an everyday language?

David

On May 1, 11:40?am, Sonoran Dude > wrote:

> I have no idea what you are talking about. The "Mexican-American"
> families me and my parents grew up with are just as American as my Anglo
> family.

My ancestors came from England, Ireland, Scotland, France, Germany,
Portugal, Spain, Denmark, Africa and North America.

Racially, my relatives run the entire spectrum from Black to Brown to
Red to White.

But we are completely American, we wouldn't dream of calling ourselves
"Anglo-American", even though my surname is most decidedly Anglo-
Saxon.

There's no such thing as a hyphenated American, you're either an
American or you're not. Teddy Roosevelt made that clear a century ago.
America has no place for people like "Mexican-Americans" who are
actually committed to another country.

And the Mexican kids that I went to elementary school and high school
with in the 1950's were well-behaved and respectful, too. I used to
share my lunches with a Mexican kid whose mother sent him off to
school without anything to eat every day. But that was in a much more
upscale neighborhood before the racial problems started in the big
cities.

When the US government rounded up illegal aliens during the 1930's and
again in the 1950's, a lot of the farm workers went off to hide in the
barrios of Los Angeles. They realized that they weren't Mexicans and
they weren't Americans either.

Their disaffected teenaged kids started calling themselves "pachucos"
and they formed street gangs to defend small areas of east Los Angeles
just like the Puerto Ricans were defending parts of New York City from
the Irish street gangs.

The loyalty of Mexican gang members was seriously questioned by other
Americans during WW2.

While Americans were making sacrifices to help the war effort, Mexican
street gang members were strutting around dressed like pimps.

American sailors visiting Los Angeles on leave didn't like the
pachucos at all, and there were riots and the pachucos got their asses
kicked.

I personally know one of those pachucos. I used to talk to him
frequently. He's a an 80-year old Mexican-Indian man.

He told me about how his family walked from northern Mexico during the
last revolution. They stopped for a while in Arizona and he was born
there. He said that he could have gone to school on the Indian
reservation, but he didn't want that.

Then the Mexican-Indians continued on to this county, where the
farmers were very glad to get desperate laborers who would work for
little of nothing.

He said it took about two years of walking for his Mexican-Indian
family to get here

The Mexicans lived in company housing and bought groceries at the
company store. They were little more than serfs on a manorial estate,
working for the White owners.

During the Great Depression, the US government decided that Americans
should be employed and that the Mexicans should go back home. The
Mexican government agreed and they formed a commision with the help of
the Mexican consulate. That commision gave money to Mexicans to go
back to Mexico, and many did so voluntarily. They had to go back to
Mexican villages and compete for work with Mexicans who had never left
Mexico.

Everybody is familiar with John Steinbeck's Pulitzer prize winning
novel, "Grapes of Wrath". What Steinbeck described actually happened
right here in this county, when impoverished share croppers from
Oklahoma came here and tried to work in the agricultural jobs vacated
by the illegal aliens who went back to Mexico or went to hide in East
Los Angeles, where the rundown Mexican barrios were growing bigger and
bigger. That's where my pachuco friend went to live.

During WW2, my pachuco acquaintance began to see that he wasn't going
to be able to take a city job that had been vacated by an American who
had voluntarily enlisted or been drafted, it was either come back here
and maybe get deported, or enlist, so he volunteered to go into the
Army. He claims that he was in Normandy in 1944 when he got his leg
blown offf by a German mortar shell.

That was the '"million dollar wound" that got him out of the military
and supported him for 60 years. He went back to east Los Angeles and
became a gang member again. Drinking and fighting caused him to be
arrested and imprisoned and then he was an alcoholic for about 30
years while his wife kept his family together.

He told me that he made a decision that he was never going to become a
heroin addict. Finally, he got involved with motorcycle riding and
gave up drinking.

> You seem so bitter against these neighbors of yours.

Hey, the pachuco acquaintance that I described above is typical of
your beloved "Mexican Americans". How many stories do you need to read
to understand these refugees from Mexico.

> I was talking about Mexican-Americans. The Mexican American families that I
> grew up with and my parents grew up with served in the US American
> forces fighting for the same liberty yours did.

Anybody with any sense at all knows that youngsters don't enlist in
the military to "fight for liberty". Kids go into the military becasue
it's a place to spend four years when they cannot get a decent job and
maybe save some money for college.

I don't believe for a second that the National Guard troops serving in
Iraq are over there to fight for democracy or "Iraqi Freedom". They
are over there because they couldn't get a decent job in the USA after
out industry has been offshored, first to Mexico, and now to Asia.

The troops got into the military for the money, thinking that they
would never have to fight. Now many of them have died to help the
globalist capitalist expand their commercial empires.

> We went to the same schools, we were free to date or socialize with each other without
> prejudice. These Mexican American families I know speak English because
> they are Americans not Mexicans just as my Italian friends or Jewish
> friends are Americans and learned our language.

Hey, it wasn't nearly as violent in schools when I was a teenager in
the 1950's as it is today, but I still had to be careful where I went
and who I associated with.

> The difference is that the Mexican Americans were here when the US claimed this land and they would take offense to your term "wet back".

Well, let them get as mad as they want to get. There were NO Mexican-
Americans in the Mexican Cession of 1848 when my relative
Ambrose Sevier (descendant of a Spaniard who left northern Spain 300
years ago) presented the final version of the Treaty of Guadalupe
Hidalgo to the Mexican minister De la Rosa for his signature at
Queretaro.

If you want to look up the details of the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo
and the Queretaro Protocol, you can easilt find analyses of the
treaty. We had previously offered Mexico $30 million dollars for the
Spanish territory that they were claiming.

Mexico didn't want to develop the land, but they didn't want to sell
it either. It seemed to be some kind of matter of pride. After the
Mexican Revolution, there were factions who wanted to spread out, but
the more powerful faction wanted to centralize Mexico around the old
Spanish colonial area.

In 1847, the US government wanted to move the border 100 miles south,
from the Nueces River to the Rio Grande. The Mexicans didn't want to
give up this small amount of land, so they ambushed US soldiers
patrolling south of the Nueces River.

American forces chased their asses all the way back to Mexico City.
Mexico surrendered and agreed to sell the land to the USA for $12
million and the USA forgave $3 million in Mexican debt.

The Treaty of Guadlupe Hidalgo protected the civil rights of several
thousand unidentified Mexican landowners who were established in the
Mexican Cession of 1848. The Mexican citizens were given the option of
staying in the US as Mexican citizens, or declaring their intent to
become US citiizens.

If the Mexican citizen did not declare his intent one way or another,
the Treaty said that it would be assumed that he had declared his
intent to become a citizen of the USA

Nothing was ever said about them being "Mexican-Americans" with dual
nationality, and remaining loyal to Mexico.

The treaty promised that Mexicans who became citizens would have full
civil rights, when Congress saw fit to pass laws to that effect.

The treaty was signed and returned to Congress for review. Congress
met in secret session, so there is no Congressional Record of the
debate. The offer to make Mexicans into US citizens was stricken from
the treaty. The promise to protect the Catholic church was stricken
from the treaty.

My relative, minister to mexico Ambrose Hundley Sevier took the
Queretaro Protocol to Mexico and it was signed by Mexican minister
De la Rosa. Sevier died that same year, without writing about it is
his memoires.

The Mexican governement attempted to repatriate its citizens from the
Cession of 1848. Some were relocated into the territory that became
the Gasden Purchase, and had to be moved again.

The US government around Santa Fe, NM, refused to allow Mexican
consular agents to contact Mexican citizens in that area, so the
Mexican community remained fairly intact.

But American citizens wondered what the Mexican War was all about, if
it wasn't for the land, and why did we have to *pay* Mexico, if we had
won the war?

About 1851, the Congress legislated a homestead act for the ceded
territories. The Mexican land grant holders were given until 1853 to
prove the titles to their land grants.

But, many Mexicans had lost their paperwork, or they had illegally
subdivided their grants with their children, or had simply failed to
go to the nearest regional capital to register their grants.

In 1853, all unregistered land titles were extinguished, and the lands
of the Mexican Cession were available to anyone who wanted to buy them
or claim them.

And, many Mexicans still had to be evicted from the lands they were
illegally occupying, but continued to live in a country that did not
want them to stay there.

How's that for stubborn?
>
> I will again claim that prior to 1978 Cinco de Mayo was not a household
> word. It became a household world after Macayo's and Garcia's
> restaurants sold 2 for 1 Margaritas and the other chains followed suit.
> That was about the time that Ronald Regan was thinking about running for
> President. Regan was an artful liar. My favorite quote, "All I remember
> is I forgot". It's still not the premier patriotic holiday in Mexico and
> never will be because it is a footnote in their history.- Hide quoted text -

You can claim whatever you want. Cinco de Mayo still annoys law
abiding Americans who object to illegal aliens trying to form an
alternate state within our state.

That is the way most fairey tales start out.

Booger, I gotta admit you are entertaining, phychotic as hell, but
definately entertaining.

Just remember this is still Cooking, so go learn to cook something and get
off your bloody pulpit with your twisted history..

"Rich McCormack" > wrote in message
t...
>
> Secret_Ingredient wrote:
>> Why oh! Why? Do Americans celebrate Cinco de Mayo? Does anybody really
>> know why? I think this was started as advertising by Corona/Cuahtemoc
>> breweries as a way to get sales up.
>>
>> If anybody knows more facts about how the 'holiday" got started please
>> post here.
>>
>
> There is some historical opinion that the Battle of Puebla,
> May 5, 1862, was historically important to the United States
> as well as Mexico. Some historians believe it might be MORE
> historically significant to U.S. history than Mexican history.
>
> The French, Spanish and English had come to Mexico supposedly
> to collect debts. The Spanish and English quickly did so and
> left. The French had more ambitious plans...annex Mexico,
> support and supply the Confederate Army to ultimately divide
> and destroy the United States. The underestimated Mexicans
> kept the French pre-occupied long enough for the Union Army
> to defeat the Confederates and preserve the Union. With the
> Civil War over, the U.S. sent its support south with supplies,
> arms and men to help the Mexicans defeat the French and win
> their independence.
>
> I'd say it's appropriate here in the U.S. to offer a toast
> to the Mexican victory at Puebla and join the celebration.
>
> Rich

On May 1, 2:43�pm, "Gunner" <gunner@ spam.com> wrote:

> Just remember this is still Cooking, *so go learn to cook something and get
> off your bloody pulpit with your twisted history..

Si entende Espanyol, Djudezmo es es fasil ambezar...

http://www.arrakis.es/~clmt/Recetas.htm

KEFTES DE PATATA KON KARNE

Materiales (6 porsiones):

7-8 patatas grandes
300 gramos de karne mulida
2 guevos
sal a gusto
arina o migas de pan
azeyte para friyir

Preparasion:

Mundar, lavar i eskaldar las patatas. Kuando estan bien blandas
azerlas puree i desharlas yelar un poko. Adjustar la karne i la sal i
finyir asta ke se obtiene una meskla omojena.

Kon manos umidas tomar balikas de la grandor de un guevo i entre las
dos manos formar las keftes. Untarlas en la arina i el guevo i
friyirlas en la azeyte ke ya fue kaentada de antes. Meter las keftes
sovre un papel absorbiente para embever la azeyte i servirlas kaentes.

Gunner <gunner@ spam.com> wrote in message
...
[snip]
> Booger, I gotta admit you are entertaining, phychotic
[snip]

Is he _still_ here? That guy's like a ragged ribbon: warn out and
tired, needing to be cut up and recycled.

ObFood: Quesadillas with scallions and queso fresco fried in
canola oil. Good eats!

The Ranger
==
"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of
arriving safely, in an attractive and well-preserved body. Rather
one should skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, martini in the
other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out while screaming
'WOO HOO! What a ride!'"

Gunner wrote:
> That is the way most fairey tales start out.
>
> Booger, I gotta admit you are entertaining, phychotic as hell, but
> definately entertaining.
>
> Just remember this is still Cooking, so go learn to cook something and get
> off your bloody pulpit with your twisted history..
>
>
Too funny... You go Gunner!

Rich McCormack wrote:
>
> Secret_Ingredient wrote:
>> Why oh! Why? Do Americans celebrate Cinco de Mayo? Does anybody really
>> know why? I think this was started as advertising by Corona/Cuahtemoc
>> breweries as a way to get sales up.
>>
>> If anybody knows more facts about how the 'holiday" got started please
>> post here.
>>
>
> There is some historical opinion that the Battle of Puebla,
> May 5, 1862, was historically important to the United States
> as well as Mexico. Some historians believe it might be MORE
> historically significant to U.S. history than Mexican history.
>
> The French, Spanish and English had come to Mexico supposedly
> to collect debts. The Spanish and English quickly did so and
> left. The French had more ambitious plans...annex Mexico,
> support and supply the Confederate Army to ultimately divide
> and destroy the United States. The underestimated Mexicans
> kept the French pre-occupied long enough for the Union Army
> to defeat the Confederates and preserve the Union. With the
> Civil War over, the U.S. sent its support south with supplies,
> arms and men to help the Mexicans defeat the French and win
> their independence.
>
> I'd say it's appropriate here in the U.S. to offer a toast
> to the Mexican victory at Puebla and join the celebration.
>
> Rich

I can buy that... Nice post

Rechazo Todo wrote in message
.com>...
>
>I can certainly understand why you feel that the commercialized
>celebration of a foreign holiday seems so *alien* and WRONG.

Yeah I am so glad they kept St Patrick's holy sacred and pure.

Thank GOD no one exploits Paddy

and thanks gott no one has come up with a way to make money of baby Jesus

mk5000

"Wouldnt be somthing that would make my Science Fiction list of books to
read.
What i find surprising is that you were in Forbidden Planet and bought a
book?
I cant do that i would have gone downstairs and bought comics, comics oh and
some comics.
Luckily i get my comics delivered so i dont have to go in there
anymore."--archdoombringer

Randy Johnson wrote in message ...

>
>It means the women around here are affluent, superficial, Volvo-wagon
>driving soccer moms; Cinco de Mayo gives them an excuse to run out, buy a
>brightly colored "mexican" outfit and go out to lunch and/or dinner at a
>"mexican" restaurant and suck down pitchers of margaritas and eat nachos
and
>fajitas.

Howdy Doody!!
be sure and let meknow if & when the next party is!!

>Their husbands, go to the same place, such down Corona's and eat
>nachos and deep-fried jalapeno poppers.

to the husbands of the women around here,
I am so glad you will have a good time on Cinco de Mayo. . .

mk5000

'If not for me. If not for her. That is how it goes. Not just with you and
her but with everyone. There is no end to it. Nor can anyone remember how it
all began.' --Custodian of Paradise, Wayne Johnston

dtwright37 wrote in message
. com>...

>
><http://www.vivacincodemayo.org/history.htm>
>
>Would anyone here prefer to speak French as an everyday language?
>


sure why not. especially the French among us. Maybe even the Canadians,
Swiss, Haitians, Guyanians, Algerians and what not

mk5000

"the wickedest city in the world"--Jamaica's Port Royal

Rechazo Todo wrote in message
.com>...

>
>Racially, my relatives run the entire spectrum from Black to Brown to
>Red to White.


not blue then?

mk5000

"After a tragic event, Kvothe spent a part of his early life as a near feral
street urchin. He eventually breaks free of the poverty and downward spiral,
travelling to become a student of The University, the school of magic. The
Good: Man, where to start. This is simply a great story. "--Brian Brown on
"The Name of the wind"

marika wrote:
> Rechazo Todo wrote in message
> .com>...
>
>> Racially, my relatives run the entire spectrum from Black to Brown to
>> Red to White.
>
>
> not blue then?

Marika, you rock! are you single?

On May 1, 5:18?pm, Sonoran Dude > wrote:
> Rich McCormack wrote:

> > I'd say it's appropriate here in the U.S. to offer a toast
> > to the Mexican victory at Puebla and join the celebration.

> I can buy that... Nice post.

I suppose you are going to celebrate the French defeat at Dien Bien
Phu on May 7th, then?

On May 1, 8:19?pm, "marika" > wrote:
> Rechazo Todo wrote in message

> >Racially, my relatives run the entire spectrum from Black to Brown to
> >Red to White.
>
> not blue then?

No blue people in my family tree, but it sounds like you're descended
from smurfs.

Sonoran Dude wrote in message ...

>
>Marika, you rock!

thanks for the props

>are you single?

yes

I went to the Rio Grande Cafe today.
It was my second time, got a shrimp and fajita plate.
I got that before, so I was just controlling for quality.
Last time they gave me 6 shrimp wrapped in bacon this time 3.
Last time they gave me about 3 fried jalapenos, this time 1.
When I took half my stuff home for later the previous time, they gave me
fresh wraps, this time no.
They cleared the table of the chips before I packed the food. Just to make
sure that they could throw it away rather than me taking the excess home.
Then, of course, the waitress never really listened to me. She brought me
and charged me for sides I didn't request.

That should tell me everything I need to know.

What's worse is that they make the most atrocious margaritas ever.
How does one screw up margaritas.

mk5000

“More aggressive than thoughtful, [William Paterson of New Jersey] proposed
acidly that the only fair way to follow the Virginia Plan’s approach would
be to carve the nation into thirteen states of exactly equal size. . . .
Never short on truculence, and ever prepared to point out lacunae in the
logic of others, James Wilson of Pennsylvania met ultimatum with ultimatum,
gauntlet thrown with gauntlet thrown. "--"Summer of 1787", David O Stewart

Rechazo Todo wrote in message
. com>...
>
>No blue people in my family tree, but it sounds like you're descended
>from smurfs.
>

no not me. We're descended from a nomadic tribe of blue gnomes. We've been
at war with the smurfs for centuries, nay, millenia.

btw, have you ever tasted blue poppy seeds?

awesome

mk5000

"In general I was meticulous, except in this case and some others [for
people] who aren’t well known where I decided, “You know, it’s fiction, I
can make stuff up.” In [Prime’s] case it was useful to have a real guy, I
thought about changing the name altogether, and frankly I was worried about
some descendent writing, and then this woman was so nice."--kurt andersen

marika wrote:
> Sonoran Dude wrote in message ...
>
>> Marika, you rock!
>
> thanks for the props
>
>> are you single?
>
> yes
>
> I went to the Rio Grande Cafe today.
> It was my second time, got a shrimp and fajita plate.
> I got that before, so I was just controlling for quality.
> Last time they gave me 6 shrimp wrapped in bacon this time 3.
> Last time they gave me about 3 fried jalapenos, this time 1.
> When I took half my stuff home for later the previous time, they gave me
> fresh wraps, this time no.
> They cleared the table of the chips before I packed the food. Just to make
> sure that they could throw it away rather than me taking the excess home.
> Then, of course, the waitress never really listened to me. She brought me
> and charged me for sides I didn't request.

I hate that! We had a new Chinese place open up here in Oro Valley
outside of Tucson. I had an old friend here from Australia visiting and
she is used to excellent seafood on the Gold Coast of Australia.

We ordered a dish called Mango Shrimp that was one of the best shrimp
dishes that either of us had ever tasted. It was large 16/20 butterflied
and deveined shrimp fried perfectly crisp in an Asian batter served with
hot chunks of Mango, veggies and spicy chilies. The food was plated hot
and with artistic care.

Went back 2 weeks later and the food was just as good. Last week about 4
months after the grand opening I took a business associate there and the
place was less full and the food was terrible. Gone were the 16/20 and
replaced with small 26/30 shrimp that were fried in old oil and dumped
on the plate.

Inconsistency is the best way to go out business in my opinion. If the
food is mediocre and people come, keep it that way. If it is different
every time you will loose your customers.