> wrote in message
.net...
> In >, on 10/15/05
> at 07:33 PM, "Dee Randall" > said:
>
>
> wrote in message
re.net...
>>> In >, on 10/15/05
>>> at 01:45 AM, notbob > said:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>On 2005-10-14, <RJ> > wrote:
>>>
>>>>> There's something about a cone filter that makes a better pot of
>>>>> coffee.
>>>>> Maybe it directs more of the water through the grounds.
>>>
>>>>No. In fact, the paper cone filter absorbs some of the aroma and flavor
>>>>components of coffee. Try a French press for the best brew.
>>>
>>>>nb
>>>
>>> More importantly, it absorbs the coffee oils - that thin sheen you can
>>> see
>>> on a good cup of coffee. --
>>> -----------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> -----------------------------------------------------------
>
>>What are you saying: you want or don't want that thin sheen of oil?
>>Thanks,
>>Dee Dee
>
> You want it. Oil helps move the flavor around. The paper filters suck it
> up; presspots and gold filters pass it through to the cup.
>

I drink cream in my coffee (not half-half), so I suppose then my coffee
would really be super oily looking, right?
Dee

"Kevin_Sheehy" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> Dee Randall wrote on 10/15/2005:
>
> <snip>
>
>> What are you saying: you want or don't want that thin sheen of oil?
>> Thanks,
>> Dee Dee
>
> Sounds a little like the idea of a French press appeals to you. I like
> mine.
> Just one caution. If you make the full beaker and plunge vigorously,
> the
> hot water can come up over the top and spill onto your hand. I've never
> done it but I've known people who have. Just apply force to the plunger
> gingerly and you should be fine.

No, no, no -- I had one years ago, but I didn't like it at all; at that time
I was buying my favorite coffee bean, Sumatra, long before they started
labeling it as Sumatra-My.... (sp?) I was wondering if I should give it a
try again since I'm between decent coffee pots. You can buy them fairly
inexpensive now. I remember that I always had grinds at the bottom of my
cup, and it was a mess to make and I don't recall that the coffee was any
hotter than pouring it over cover thru a melita cone filter. I cannot stand
less than really hot coffee.
Dee Dee

On Sat, 15 Oct 2005 22:38:23 -0400, Dee Randall wrote:

>
> "Kevin_Sheehy" > wrote in message
> oups.com...

> > Sounds a little like the idea of a French press appeals to you. I like
> > mine.
> > Just one caution. If you make the full beaker and plunge vigorously,
> > the
> > hot water can come up over the top and spill onto your hand. I've never
> > done it but I've known people who have. Just apply force to the plunger
> > gingerly and you should be fine.
>
> No, no, no -- I had one years ago, but I didn't like it at all; at that time
> I was buying my favorite coffee bean, Sumatra, long before they started
> labeling it as Sumatra-My.... (sp?) I was wondering if I should give it a
> try again since I'm between decent coffee pots. You can buy them fairly
> inexpensive now. I remember that I always had grinds at the bottom of my
> cup, and it was a mess to make and I don't recall that the coffee was any
> hotter than pouring it over cover thru a melita cone filter. I cannot stand
> less than really hot coffee.

I have the plunger type... but (to me) it's not any better or any
worse than white paper filtered coffee. I remember that my SIL tried
a gold filter a few years ago, but she said it left sediment so you
wouldn't like it either. I think what you'd like is one of those
coffee makers that has a thermos container instead of sitting on a
burner. IMO, it will stay hot (let's say: as hot as a home coffee
maker will make it) longer and the flavor won't change because it
isn't being continuously heated.

That's my story and I'm stickin' to it.

In >, on 10/15/05
at 10:34 PM, "Dee Randall" > said:

> wrote in message
e.net...
>> In >, on 10/15/05
>> at 07:33 PM, "Dee Randall" > said:
>>
>>
> wrote in message
ere.net...
>>>> In >, on 10/15/05
>>>> at 01:45 AM, notbob > said:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>On 2005-10-14, <RJ> > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> There's something about a cone filter that makes a better pot of
>>>>>> coffee.
>>>>>> Maybe it directs more of the water through the grounds.
>>>>
>>>>>No. In fact, the paper cone filter absorbs some of the aroma and flavor
>>>>>components of coffee. Try a French press for the best brew.
>>>>
>>>>>nb
>>>>
>>>> More importantly, it absorbs the coffee oils - that thin sheen you can
>>>> see
>>>> on a good cup of coffee. --
>>>> -----------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> -----------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>>What are you saying: you want or don't want that thin sheen of oil?
>>>Thanks,
>>>Dee Dee
>>
>> You want it. Oil helps move the flavor around. The paper filters suck it
>> up; presspots and gold filters pass it through to the cup.
>>

>I drink cream in my coffee (not half-half), so I suppose then my coffee
>would really be super oily looking, right?
>Dee

Nope. BTW, I noted that in answer to someone else you said youc annot stand your coffee other than super hot. How do you accomplish that when your pour cream into it? Usually, cream is cold. What do you do - nuke it to re-heat it?


jim

--
-----------------------------------------------------------

-----------------------------------------------------------

On Sat, 15 Oct 2005 19:34:15 -0400, Dee Randall wrote:

> With the French Press do you get coffee grounds in the bottom of your
> drinking cup?

I don't

> wrote in message
.net...
> In >, on 10/15/05
> at 10:34 PM, "Dee Randall" > said:
>
> wrote in message
re.net...
>>> In >, on 10/15/05
>>> at 07:33 PM, "Dee Randall" > said:
>>>
>>>
> wrote in message
here.net...
>>>>> In >, on 10/15/05
>>>>> at 01:45 AM, notbob > said:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>On 2005-10-14, <RJ> > wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> There's something about a cone filter that makes a better pot of
>>>>>>> coffee.
>>>>>>> Maybe it directs more of the water through the grounds.
>>>>>
>>>>>>No. In fact, the paper cone filter absorbs some of the aroma and
>>>>>>flavor
>>>>>>components of coffee. Try a French press for the best brew.
>>>>>
>>>>>>nb
>>>>>
>>>>> More importantly, it absorbs the coffee oils - that thin sheen you can
>>>>> see
>>>>> on a good cup of coffee. --
>>>>> -----------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> -----------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>>>What are you saying: you want or don't want that thin sheen of oil?
>>>>Thanks,
>>>>Dee Dee
>>>
>>> You want it. Oil helps move the flavor around. The paper filters suck it
>>> up; presspots and gold filters pass it through to the cup.
>>>
>
>>I drink cream in my coffee (not half-half), so I suppose then my coffee
>>would really be super oily looking, right?
>>Dee
>
> Nope. BTW, I noted that in answer to someone else you said youc annot
> stand your coffee other than super hot. How do you accomplish that when
> your pour cream into it? Usually, cream is cold. What do you do - nuke it
> to re-heat it?
>
>
> jim
>
Jim, i watched last night the recommendations of coffee pots that American
Test Kitchen had on their program of yesterday morning. Interestingly
enough I can answer your question. First, I've always heard that cream will
naturally cool off the coffee when you pour it in, but with cream in the
coffee, it will maintain the temperature (the temperature that the cream
brought it to) longer than if there were no cream at all. But be that as it
may, I brewed a pot of coffee (eyes shut early a.m.) and as after I poured
my cream in it, it tasted a little too cool after I poured a little too much
cream in it. So I stuck a thermometer in the coffee pot and it was 170. My
cup was 140. The second cup the pot was still 170, and the proper amount of
cream registered 143 and was just right.

The ATK tests were as I recall 3 different "Types" of coffee makers, but the
only type that they recommended were two of the vacuum ones. The top
recommendation was the Black & Decker Infuse (abt $70.) The temperature
came out at 203; their recommendation for coffee coming out was 195-205. And
the time to brew it was recommended at 4-6 minutes. Which is what they said
was the length that coffee should be brewed for.

Quickly looking on the Black & Decker site, their coffee makers don't show
the B&D Infuse. It looked like it had a greyish plastic top instead of
glass. I wonder if the ATK program was an old one and B&D doesn't sell it
anymore. I will look forther.

The other recommendation was a Bodum or Bodun brand of the same vacuum type.
I'll have to look at it again to get the model. But the B&D was recommended
over the Bodum/Bodun.

23 taste testers tasted 8 brands of supermarket coffee (1 brand included a
Starbucks), Maxwell was least liked, Chock-a-Nuts they most liked and they
didn't like Starbucks. But Mr. Willy-Nilly liked best the store-bought
Starbucks. I don't know if it was beans, but I think it was. Also they
said in the storebought coffee, it made no difference whether the coffee was
alread ground or beans.
Dee Dee

"sf" > wrote in message
...
> On Sat, 15 Oct 2005 19:34:15 -0400, Dee Randall wrote:
>
>> With the French Press do you get coffee grounds in the bottom of your
>> drinking cup?
>
> I don't

Are you distinguishing between a French press and a 'plunger type' in your
previous email?
Dee Dee

On Sun, 16 Oct 2005 09:11:35 -0400, Dee Randall wrote:

> Are you distinguishing between a French press and a 'plunger type' in your
> previous email?

No. I thought a french press *was* the plunger type. What do you
call the thingie that presses down the grounds if it's not a
"plunger"?

"sf" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 16 Oct 2005 09:11:35 -0400, Dee Randall wrote:
>
>> Are you distinguishing between a French press and a 'plunger type' in
>> your
>> previous email?
>
> No. I thought a french press *was* the plunger type.

What do you
> call the thingie that presses down the grounds if it's not a
> "plunger"?

A "thingie"? -- tee hee.
Dee Dee

In >, on 10/16/05
at 09:09 AM, "Dee Randall" > said:

> wrote in message
e.net...

SNIP


>So I stuck a thermometer in the coffee pot and it was 170. My
>cup was 140. The second cup the pot was still 170, and the proper amount of
>cream registered 143 and was just right.

That's not real hot. The coffee-in-the-lap lawsuit was about coffee coming
out the window at 180.



>The ATK tests were as I recall 3 different "Types" of coffee makers, but the
>only type that they recommended were two of the vacuum ones. The top
>recommendation was the Black & Decker Infuse (abt $70.) The temperature
>came out at 203; their recommendation for coffee coming out was 195-205. And
>the time to brew it was recommended at 4-6 minutes. Which is what they said
>was the length that coffee should be brewed for.

Recommendations are all over the place from 3-6 minutes. You have to find
what suits YOUR palate, not anyone else's. BTW, the Bodum Santos uses a
nylon filter to keep the grounds from being drawn back into the pot. How
they stack up to a gold filter, I do not know. But that is what comes with
it and I'm unaware of a gold replacement.


>Quickly looking on the Black & Decker site, their coffee makers don't show
>the B&D Infuse. It looked like it had a greyish plastic top instead of
>glass. I wonder if the ATK program was an old one and B&D doesn't sell it
>anymore. I will look forther.

Perhaps the ATK website can tell us . . . . I just searched the site for
"coffee" and it brings up nothing. Was it ATK or one of the FoodTV
programs?



>The other recommendation was a Bodum or Bodun brand of the same vacuum type.
>I'll have to look at it again to get the model. But the B&D was recommended
>over the Bodum/Bodun.

I was under the impression that B&D was getting out of the kitchen
appliance business and going back to tools. If that is so, it may explain
what is on the site (stuff that still hasn't sold). The are off my radar
screen. I'll look in a second or so . . . The only coffee brewers I saw
just now were drip/filter units. No vacuum units.
http://www.blackanddeckerappliances....tegory-66.html Granted, I didn't
spend much time there, but a search on "vacuum" only brings up food
storage.



>23 taste testers tasted 8 brands of supermarket coffee (1 brand included a
>Starbucks), Maxwell was least liked, Chock-a-Nuts they most liked and they
>didn't like Starbucks. But Mr. Willy-Nilly liked best the store-bought
>Starbucks. I don't know if it was beans, but I think it was. Also they
>said in the storebought coffee, it made no difference whether the coffee was
>alread ground or beans.


Store bought (thinking the program was talking about the local
supermarkets), the beans have been sitting around. The pre-ground stuff
starts going bad as soon as the vacuum pack is broken. Whole beans don't
degrade as fast - less surface area. If the beans are in those
self-service bins, they might be equal to the whole beans in the vacuum
packs at best, worse if they haven't sold well and have been sitting. I
would like to catch that program and see it, but it was well discussed on
alt.coffee if it was the FoodTV. You can google that group to find the
thread.

Comparing store bought to *$ is comparing apples to oranges. They are both
coffee, but there is a vast difference in the roasting philosophy and in
the people who drink it. Most of the US has been on a diluted coffee
standard that got set back during one of the World Wars when coffee wasn't
readily available and people watered it down or extended it with chicory.

I suggest that you come on over to alt.coffee and talk to some real
experts as well as visit www.coffeegeek.com (it is up and down due to
server problems). I'll go through my bookmarks and look for anything
specific to vacuum.


jim

--
-----------------------------------------------------------

-----------------------------------------------------------

In >, on 10/16/05
at 09:11 AM, "Dee Randall" > said:




>"sf" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Sat, 15 Oct 2005 19:34:15 -0400, Dee Randall wrote:
>>
>>> With the French Press do you get coffee grounds in the bottom of your
>>> drinking cup?
>>
>> I don't

>Are you distinguishing between a French press and a 'plunger type' in
>your previous email?

Same thing.


jim

--
-----------------------------------------------------------

-----------------------------------------------------------

The Black & Decker Infuze vacuum coffeemaker has been discontinued. Old
stock may still be available.

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
_____________________________

http://tinypic.com/eikz78.jpg

Meet Mr. Bailey

Carole,

About 9 months ago, I bought a 12 cup, programable auto-brew and
adjustable Mr. Coffee at Costco for $29 and it's terrific ad quite a
bargain. We use it every morning, making 8 to 10 cups. It only cost
a little more than the carafe that broke for the Braun and the Mr.
Coffee makes better coffee. We grind Eight O'Clock Columbia Supremo
and love it.

On Fri, 14 Oct 2005 10:35:29 -0400, "C & S"
> wrote:

>I am looking to buy a quality coffee maker and would greatly appreciate the
>opinion of this group regarding the brand they judge to make a decent cup of
>coffee. I've had a Black & Decker, a Mr. Coffee and a Phillips (soon to be
>buried). I've looked into the Bunn NHB Professional Home Brewer, which has
>have a four and 1/4 star review on Amazon. However, before I make the
>splurge, I would appreciate your opinion. What brand do you own and would
>you recommend it? Thank you for your imput.

> wrote in message
.net...
> In >, on 10/16/05
> at 09:09 AM, "Dee Randall" > said:
>
> wrote in message
re.net...
>
> SNIP
>
>
>>So I stuck a thermometer in the coffee pot and it was 170. My
>>cup was 140. The second cup the pot was still 170, and the proper amount
>>of
>>cream registered 143 and was just right.
>
> That's not real hot. The coffee-in-the-lap lawsuit was about coffee coming
> out the window at 180.
>
>
>
>>The ATK tests were as I recall 3 different "Types" of coffee makers, but
>>the
>>only type that they recommended were two of the vacuum ones. The top
>>recommendation was the Black & Decker Infuse (abt $70.) The temperature
>>came out at 203; their recommendation for coffee coming out was 195-205.
>>And
>>the time to brew it was recommended at 4-6 minutes. Which is what they
>>said
>>was the length that coffee should be brewed for.
>
> Recommendations are all over the place from 3-6 minutes. You have to find
> what suits YOUR palate, not anyone else's. BTW, the Bodum Santos uses a
> nylon filter to keep the grounds from being drawn back into the pot. How
> they stack up to a gold filter, I do not know. But that is what comes with
> it and I'm unaware of a gold replacement.
>
>
>>Quickly looking on the Black & Decker site, their coffee makers don't show
>>the B&D Infuse. It looked like it had a greyish plastic top instead of
>>glass. I wonder if the ATK program was an old one and B&D doesn't sell it
>>anymore. I will look forther.
>
> Perhaps the ATK website can tell us . . . . I just searched the site for
> "coffee" and it brings up nothing. Was it ATK or one of the FoodTV
> programs?
>
>
>
>>The other recommendation was a Bodum or Bodun brand of the same vacuum
>>type.
>>I'll have to look at it again to get the model. But the B&D was
>>recommended
>>over the Bodum/Bodun.
>
> I was under the impression that B&D was getting out of the kitchen
> appliance business and going back to tools. If that is so, it may explain
> what is on the site (stuff that still hasn't sold). The are off my radar
> screen. I'll look in a second or so . . . The only coffee brewers I saw
> just now were drip/filter units. No vacuum units.
> http://www.blackanddeckerappliances....tegory-66.html Granted, I didn't
> spend much time there, but a search on "vacuum" only brings up food
> storage.
>
>
>
>>23 taste testers tasted 8 brands of supermarket coffee (1 brand included a
>>Starbucks), Maxwell was least liked, Chock-a-Nuts they most liked and they
>>didn't like Starbucks. But Mr. Willy-Nilly liked best the store-bought
>>Starbucks. I don't know if it was beans, but I think it was. Also they
>>said in the storebought coffee, it made no difference whether the coffee
>>was
>>alread ground or beans.
>
>
> Store bought (thinking the program was talking about the local
> supermarkets), the beans have been sitting around. The pre-ground stuff
> starts going bad as soon as the vacuum pack is broken. Whole beans don't
> degrade as fast - less surface area. If the beans are in those
> self-service bins, they might be equal to the whole beans in the vacuum
> packs at best, worse if they haven't sold well and have been sitting. I
> would like to catch that program and see it, but it was well discussed on
> alt.coffee if it was the FoodTV. You can google that group to find the
> thread.
>
> Comparing store bought to *$ is comparing apples to oranges. They are both
> coffee, but there is a vast difference in the roasting philosophy and in
> the people who drink it. Most of the US has been on a diluted coffee
> standard that got set back during one of the World Wars when coffee wasn't
> readily available and people watered it down or extended it with chicory.
>
> I suggest that you come on over to alt.coffee and talk to some real
> experts as well as visit www.coffeegeek.com (it is up and down due to
> server problems). I'll go through my bookmarks and look for anything
> specific to vacuum.
>
>
> jim


Re
Perhaps the ATK website can tell us . . . . I just searched the site for
"coffee" and it brings up nothing. Was it ATK or one of the FoodTV
programs?

Yes, it definitely was ATK. It was the program where the woman was making
cinnamon buns.

I did see a picture of the Bodum at
http://www.cooking.com/products/shpr...m%252bvacuu m

One review said
"The Santos comes in a clear, heat-resistant polycarbonate." What? I expect
polycarbonate for a water tank, but surely that's not the coffee container.
And this review turns me off about the Bodum:,
"Only thing that I don't like about this coffee maker is that the cleanup of
the used grounds is a pain and I would like it to stay a little warmer than
it keeps the coffee."

Maybe the television program was older and B&D is truly out of the business
of coffee makers.
Ah Ha -- I just read Wayne's reply -- "Out of Business! May have old stock."

Thanks for the nice answer and www.coffeegeek.com
I subscribe now and then to the coffee ng. I like it, but sometimes it gets
a little too in-depth and intense for me -- tee hee - it's like the wine
group -- a little out of my league, but quite interesting.
Dee Dee






Dee Dee

Alan,

We had a Mr Coffee and the problem we had was, if the carafe wasn't just
right on the burner, coffee would spill all over the counter (and in the
drawers if not caught on time) due to the no drip device (overflow from
filter system). There's nothing like having to clean coffee and grind mess
in the early hours to start your day on the wrong foot. Do you have that
problem? Perhaps the problem has been solved.

Carole



"alan" > wrote in message
...
> Carole,
>
> About 9 months ago, I bought a 12 cup, programable auto-brew and
> adjustable Mr. Coffee at Costco for $29 and it's terrific ad quite a
> bargain. We use it every morning, making 8 to 10 cups. It only cost
> a little more than the carafe that broke for the Braun and the Mr.
> Coffee makes better coffee. We grind Eight O'Clock Columbia Supremo
> and love it.
>
> On Fri, 14 Oct 2005 10:35:29 -0400, "C & S"
> > wrote:
>
> >I am looking to buy a quality coffee maker and would greatly appreciate
the
> >opinion of this group regarding the brand they judge to make a decent cup
of
> >coffee. I've had a Black & Decker, a Mr. Coffee and a Phillips (soon to
be
> >buried). I've looked into the Bunn NHB Professional Home Brewer, which
has
> >have a four and 1/4 star review on Amazon. However, before I make the
> >splurge, I would appreciate your opinion. What brand do you own and
would
> >you recommend it? Thank you for your imput.

In >, on 10/17/05
at 09:28 AM, "Dee Randall" > said:



>I did see a picture of the Bodum at
>http://www.cooking.com/products/shpr...m%252bvacuu m

Here's another site that will help you a bit: www.tinyurl.com - you can
reduce that URL to about eight characters in length.


>One review said
>"The Santos comes in a clear, heat-resistant polycarbonate." What? I
>expect polycarbonate for a water tank, but surely that's not the coffee
>container. And this review turns me off about the Bodum:,
>"Only thing that I don't like about this coffee maker is that the cleanup
>of the used grounds is a pain and I would like it to stay a little
>warmer than it keeps the coffee."

Polycarbonite is a clear substance that has advantages and disadvantages
compared to glass.

Grounds are a minor issue and if that is all this reviewer has to say, it
amounts to nothing. I would rather have the problem of grounds and the
flavor than a lesser flavor and a throwaway paper filter out of a drip
basket. Gold filters present the same problem as does disposing of grounds
from a vacuum pot.

You need to decide what is most important to you - good taste or ease of
use.

Most everyone at alt.coffee elects taste. In fact, once done with this ng,
I'll make another press of Kona (from www.smithfarms.com) that I roasted a
couple of days ago.



>Maybe the television program was older and B&D is truly out of the
>business of coffee makers.
>Ah Ha -- I just read Wayne's reply -- "Out of Business! May have old
>stock."

That is specific to the vacuum. They make dozens of autodrips, if that is
your cup.


>Thanks for the nice answer and www.coffeegeek.com
>I subscribe now and then to the coffee ng. I like it, but sometimes it
>gets a little too in-depth and intense for me -- tee hee - it's like the
>wine group -- a little out of my league, but quite interesting.
>Dee Dee



jim




>Dee Dee


--
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