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  #1 (permalink)   Report Post  
cathy
 
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Default Kosher salami

When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew National
kosher salami.

When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there is a
mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone know
what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
texture to a kosher salami?

Thanks,
Cathy
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Boron Elgar
 
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On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 23:41:24 GMT, cathy >
wrote:

>When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew National
>kosher salami.
>
>When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there is a
>mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone know
>what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
>texture to a kosher salami?
>
>Thanks,
>Cathy



The closest you will get to it in most markets is Hebrew National or
Best's.

HN is still made, though it belongs to ConAgra now & does not taste
nearly as good as it used to. It has flavorings and hydrolyzed soy
protein in it now.

Boron
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tuppy
 
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"Boron Elgar" > wrote in message
...
> On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 23:41:24 GMT, cathy >
> wrote:
>
> >When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew National
> >kosher salami.
> >
> >When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there is a
> >mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone know
> >what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
> >texture to a kosher salami?
> >
> >Thanks,
> >Cathy

>
>
> The closest you will get to it in most markets is Hebrew National or
> Best's.
>
> HN is still made, though it belongs to ConAgra now & does not taste
> nearly as good as it used to. It has flavorings and hydrolyzed soy
> protein in it now.
>
> Boron


Try Vienna Beef Salami out of Chicago.


  #4 (permalink)   Report Post  
Sheldon
 
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Default


Boron Elgar wrote:
> On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 23:41:24 GMT, cathy >
> wrote:
>
> >When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew National
> >kosher salami.
> >
> >When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there is a
> >mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone know
> >what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
> >texture to a kosher salami?
> >
> >Thanks,
> >Cathy

>
>
> The closest you will get to it in most markets is Hebrew National or
> Best's.
>
> HN is still made, though it belongs to ConAgra now & does not taste
> nearly as good as it used to. It has flavorings and hydrolyzed soy
> protein in it now.
>
> Boron


There are a couple other brands, Issac Gellis, Shofar.

But none today are like the real kosher salami of yesteryear, back then
kosher salami did not need refrigeration, it was a fermented salami,
just hung from a hook at the deli... the older/aged ones dripped fat
until they were pretty dry, those were what you got when you asked for
"hard salami", and cost a few cents extra, well, they lost weight.

You really can't compare today's kosher delis to those from even forty
years ago... there is no comparison... today's kosher delis (every one
of them with no exceptions whatsoever) serve phony baloney. I'll only
believe you've ever eaten real kosher deli if you can tell me what's a
"toot".

Sheldon

  #5 (permalink)   Report Post  
cathy
 
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On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 20:18:50 -0400, Boron Elgar
> wrote:

>On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 23:41:24 GMT, cathy >
>wrote:
>
>>When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew National
>>kosher salami.
>>
>>When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there is a
>>mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone know
>>what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
>>texture to a kosher salami?
>>
>>Thanks,
>>Cathy

>
>
>The closest you will get to it in most markets is Hebrew National or
>Best's.
>

I guess I wasn't clear. I know what all the different brands of kosher
salami are. What I meant was what kind of salami that =isn't= a kosher
salami might come the closest in taste and texture to a kosher salami.
Italian salami? Genoa salami? Summe sausage? Or one of the dozens of
other varieties I see in the deli case?

Cathy



  #6 (permalink)   Report Post  
Sheldon
 
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Default


cathy wrote:
> On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 20:18:50 -0400, Boron Elgar
> > wrote:
>
> >On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 23:41:24 GMT, cathy >
> >wrote:
> >
> >>When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew National
> >>kosher salami.
> >>
> >>When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there is a
> >>mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone know
> >>what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
> >>texture to a kosher salami?
> >>
> >>Thanks,
> >>Cathy

> >
> >
> >The closest you will get to it in most markets is Hebrew National or
> >Best's.
> >

> I guess I wasn't clear. I know what all the different brands of

kosher
> salami are. What I meant was what kind of salami that =isn't= a

kosher
> salami might come the closest in taste and texture to a kosher

salami.
> Italian salami? Genoa salami? Summe sausage? Or one of the dozens of
> other varieties I see in the deli case?
>
> Cathy


None.

  #7 (permalink)   Report Post  
Boron Elgar
 
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On Thu, 14 Apr 2005 01:12:02 GMT, cathy >
wrote:

>On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 20:18:50 -0400, Boron Elgar
> wrote:
>
>>On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 23:41:24 GMT, cathy >
>>wrote:
>>
>>>When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew National
>>>kosher salami.
>>>
>>>When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there is a
>>>mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone know
>>>what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
>>>texture to a kosher salami?
>>>
>>>Thanks,
>>>Cathy

>>
>>
>>The closest you will get to it in most markets is Hebrew National or
>>Best's.
>>

>I guess I wasn't clear. I know what all the different brands of kosher
>salami are. What I meant was what kind of salami that =isn't= a kosher
>salami might come the closest in taste and texture to a kosher salami.
>Italian salami? Genoa salami? Summe sausage? Or one of the dozens of
>other varieties I see in the deli case?
>
>Cathy



I cannot think of any.

You might actually want to experiment a bit with varieties of
kielbasa, if you can find a good Polish deli. Try one of the garlic
kielbasas. It won't be exactly the same as a kosher salami, but it
might remind you of one and it'll be damn good, nevertheless.

Boron
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cathy wrote:
> When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew National
> kosher salami.
>


I believe that is the fourth rule.

Cam

  #9 (permalink)   Report Post  
tuppy
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Sheldon" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> Boron Elgar wrote:
> > On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 23:41:24 GMT, cathy >
> > wrote:
> >
> > >When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew National
> > >kosher salami.
> > >
> > >When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there is a
> > >mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone know
> > >what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
> > >texture to a kosher salami?
> > >
> > >Thanks,
> > >Cathy

> >
> >
> > The closest you will get to it in most markets is Hebrew National or
> > Best's.
> >
> > HN is still made, though it belongs to ConAgra now & does not taste
> > nearly as good as it used to. It has flavorings and hydrolyzed soy
> > protein in it now.
> >
> > Boron

>
> There are a couple other brands, Issac Gellis, Shofar.
>
> But none today are like the real kosher salami of yesteryear, back then
> kosher salami did not need refrigeration, it was a fermented salami,
> just hung from a hook at the deli... the older/aged ones dripped fat
> until they were pretty dry, those were what you got when you asked for
> "hard salami", and cost a few cents extra, well, they lost weight.
>
> You really can't compare today's kosher delis to those from even forty
> years ago... there is no comparison... today's kosher delis (every one
> of them with no exceptions whatsoever) serve phony baloney. I'll only
> believe you've ever eaten real kosher deli if you can tell me what's a
> "toot".
>
> Sheldon
>

You can "hang" and dry Vienna's beef salami. Yes, it drips fat all over the
countertop. I have been doing that since the 1970's. I grew up in a strict
kosher household (and gave it up when I moved out) and can't tell you what a
toot is. I called a Hasidic friend of mine in Great Neck, NY and he couldn't
tell me either. What is a "toot?"

Rand


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Sheldon
 
Posts: n/a
Default


tuppy wrote:
> "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> >
> > Boron Elgar wrote:
> > > On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 23:41:24 GMT, cathy

>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > >When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew

National
> > > >kosher salami.
> > > >
> > > >When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there

is a
> > > >mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone

know
> > > >what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
> > > >texture to a kosher salami?
> > > >
> > > >Thanks,
> > > >Cathy
> > >
> > >
> > > The closest you will get to it in most markets is Hebrew National

or
> > > Best's.
> > >
> > > HN is still made, though it belongs to ConAgra now & does not

taste
> > > nearly as good as it used to. It has flavorings and hydrolyzed

soy
> > > protein in it now.
> > >
> > > Boron

> >
> > There are a couple other brands, Issac Gellis, Shofar.
> >
> > But none today are like the real kosher salami of yesteryear, back

then
> > kosher salami did not need refrigeration, it was a fermented

salami,
> > just hung from a hook at the deli... the older/aged ones dripped

fat
> > until they were pretty dry, those were what you got when you asked

for
> > "hard salami", and cost a few cents extra, well, they lost weight.
> >
> > You really can't compare today's kosher delis to those from even

forty
> > years ago... there is no comparison... today's kosher delis (every

one
> > of them with no exceptions whatsoever) serve phony baloney. I'll

only
> > believe you've ever eaten real kosher deli if you can tell me

what's a
> > "toot".
> >
> > Sheldon
> >

> You can "hang" and dry Vienna's beef salami. Yes, it drips fat all

over the
> countertop. I have been doing that since the 1970's. I grew up in a

strict
> kosher household (and gave it up when I moved out) and can't tell you

what a
> toot is. I called a Hasidic friend of mine in Great Neck, NY and he

couldn't
> tell me either. What is a "toot?"


Hasidics wouldn't have a clue about kosher delis... they don't frequent
them. And as to a "toot", I ain't giving it up... you either know or
you don't... if you grew up in a kosher home and don't know you're
probably fairly young.

Vienna Beef products are not kosher.

Not a very informative website: http://www.viennabeef.com/welcome1.htm

Sheldon



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tuppy
 
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Default


"Sheldon" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> tuppy wrote:
> > "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> > oups.com...
> > >
> > > Boron Elgar wrote:
> > > > On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 23:41:24 GMT, cathy

> >
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew

> National
> > > > >kosher salami.
> > > > >
> > > > >When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there

> is a
> > > > >mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone

> know
> > > > >what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
> > > > >texture to a kosher salami?
> > > > >
> > > > >Thanks,
> > > > >Cathy
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > The closest you will get to it in most markets is Hebrew National

> or
> > > > Best's.
> > > >
> > > > HN is still made, though it belongs to ConAgra now & does not

> taste
> > > > nearly as good as it used to. It has flavorings and hydrolyzed

> soy
> > > > protein in it now.
> > > >
> > > > Boron
> > >
> > > There are a couple other brands, Issac Gellis, Shofar.
> > >
> > > But none today are like the real kosher salami of yesteryear, back

> then
> > > kosher salami did not need refrigeration, it was a fermented

> salami,
> > > just hung from a hook at the deli... the older/aged ones dripped

> fat
> > > until they were pretty dry, those were what you got when you asked

> for
> > > "hard salami", and cost a few cents extra, well, they lost weight.
> > >
> > > You really can't compare today's kosher delis to those from even

> forty
> > > years ago... there is no comparison... today's kosher delis (every

> one
> > > of them with no exceptions whatsoever) serve phony baloney. I'll

> only
> > > believe you've ever eaten real kosher deli if you can tell me

> what's a
> > > "toot".
> > >
> > > Sheldon
> > >

> > You can "hang" and dry Vienna's beef salami. Yes, it drips fat all

> over the
> > countertop. I have been doing that since the 1970's. I grew up in a

> strict
> > kosher household (and gave it up when I moved out) and can't tell you

> what a
> > toot is. I called a Hasidic friend of mine in Great Neck, NY and he

> couldn't
> > tell me either. What is a "toot?"

>
> Hasidics wouldn't have a clue about kosher delis... they don't frequent
> them. And as to a "toot", I ain't giving it up... you either know or
> you don't... if you grew up in a kosher home and don't know you're
> probably fairly young.
>
> Vienna Beef products are not kosher.
>
> Not a very informative website: http://www.viennabeef.com/welcome1.htm
>
> Sheldon
>


I never said Vienna beef salami is kosher but their beef salami has no pork
nor pork derived products.. With regard to Hasidic not having a clue about
kosher delis, respectfully you don't know what you are talking about.
Hasidic and other orthodox friends of mine and I have gone to kosher NY
delis since probably about the time you were born. Yes, I am a young 53.


  #12 (permalink)   Report Post  
cathy
 
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Default

On 14 Apr 2005 10:18:00 -0700, "Sheldon" > wrote:

>
>tuppy wrote:
>> "Sheldon" > wrote in message
>> oups.com...
>> >
>> > Boron Elgar wrote:
>> > > On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 23:41:24 GMT, cathy

>
>> > > wrote:
>> > >
>> > > >When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew

>National
>> > > >kosher salami.
>> > > >
>> > > >When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there

>is a
>> > > >mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone

>know
>> > > >what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
>> > > >texture to a kosher salami?
>> > > >
>> > > >Thanks,
>> > > >Cathy
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > The closest you will get to it in most markets is Hebrew National

>or
>> > > Best's.
>> > >
>> > > HN is still made, though it belongs to ConAgra now & does not

>taste
>> > > nearly as good as it used to. It has flavorings and hydrolyzed

>soy
>> > > protein in it now.
>> > >
>> > > Boron
>> >
>> > There are a couple other brands, Issac Gellis, Shofar.
>> >
>> > But none today are like the real kosher salami of yesteryear, back

>then
>> > kosher salami did not need refrigeration, it was a fermented

>salami,
>> > just hung from a hook at the deli... the older/aged ones dripped

>fat
>> > until they were pretty dry, those were what you got when you asked

>for
>> > "hard salami", and cost a few cents extra, well, they lost weight.
>> >
>> > You really can't compare today's kosher delis to those from even

>forty
>> > years ago... there is no comparison... today's kosher delis (every

>one
>> > of them with no exceptions whatsoever) serve phony baloney. I'll

>only
>> > believe you've ever eaten real kosher deli if you can tell me

>what's a
>> > "toot".
>> >
>> > Sheldon
>> >

>> You can "hang" and dry Vienna's beef salami. Yes, it drips fat all

>over the
>> countertop. I have been doing that since the 1970's. I grew up in a

>strict
>> kosher household (and gave it up when I moved out) and can't tell you

>what a
>> toot is. I called a Hasidic friend of mine in Great Neck, NY and he

>couldn't
>> tell me either. What is a "toot?"

>
>Hasidics wouldn't have a clue about kosher delis... they don't frequent
>them. And as to a "toot", I ain't giving it up... you either know or
>you don't... if you grew up in a kosher home and don't know you're
>probably fairly young.
>
>Vienna Beef products are not kosher.
>
>Not a very informative website: http://www.viennabeef.com/welcome1.htm


I didn't grow up in a kosher home - my mother did and swore she'd
never do it when she got married. But certain things stick with you,
lile; both my parents drank their coffee black (to avoid mixing dairy
and meat - you can't have cream in your coffee if your having brisket
for dinner, in a kosher home). My mother rarely made ham, and bacon
was not often found in our refrigerator. We stuck to kosher-style
products, like HN salami and hot dogs because they were the flavors my
parents were accustomed to. It's stuck with me, too, because the only
hot dogs I'll eat are kosher style. The one time I ate an Oscar Mayer
hot dog I took one bite and spit it out, and tossed the rest in the
trash. It was one of the more revolting things I've been served. It
was so foreign to what I expected a hot dog to taste like, I couldn't
stand it.

Cathy

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Arri London
 
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tuppy wrote:
>
> "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> >
> > Boron Elgar wrote:
> > > On Wed, 13 Apr 2005 23:41:24 GMT, cathy >
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > >When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew National
> > > >kosher salami.
> > > >
> > > >When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there is a
> > > >mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone know
> > > >what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
> > > >texture to a kosher salami?
> > > >
> > > >Thanks,
> > > >Cathy
> > >
> > >
> > > The closest you will get to it in most markets is Hebrew National or
> > > Best's.
> > >
> > > HN is still made, though it belongs to ConAgra now & does not taste
> > > nearly as good as it used to. It has flavorings and hydrolyzed soy
> > > protein in it now.
> > >
> > > Boron

> >
> > There are a couple other brands, Issac Gellis, Shofar.
> >
> > But none today are like the real kosher salami of yesteryear, back then
> > kosher salami did not need refrigeration, it was a fermented salami,
> > just hung from a hook at the deli... the older/aged ones dripped fat
> > until they were pretty dry, those were what you got when you asked for
> > "hard salami", and cost a few cents extra, well, they lost weight.
> >
> > You really can't compare today's kosher delis to those from even forty
> > years ago... there is no comparison... today's kosher delis (every one
> > of them with no exceptions whatsoever) serve phony baloney. I'll only
> > believe you've ever eaten real kosher deli if you can tell me what's a
> > "toot".
> >
> > Sheldon
> >

> You can "hang" and dry Vienna's beef salami. Yes, it drips fat all over the
> countertop. I have been doing that since the 1970's. I grew up in a strict
> kosher household (and gave it up when I moved out) and can't tell you what a
> toot is. I called a Hasidic friend of mine in Great Neck, NY and he couldn't
> tell me either. What is a "toot?"
>
> Rand


Taken from a German word for 'bag'. Means a twisted bit of paper to hold
mustard, separate from the sandwich.
Has nothing to do with eating 'real' kosher deli.
  #14 (permalink)   Report Post  
Charles Gifford
 
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"cathy" > wrote in message
...
> When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew National
> kosher salami.
>
> When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there is a
> mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone know
> what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
> texture to a kosher salami?
>
> Thanks,
> Cathy


Would not a kosher salami of any type taste the same as any salami of that
same type? It may be kosher but that has little or nothing to do with it's
taste or texture, non? I assume, also, that a HB salami would be of a
generic "American" salami nature rather than a specific type of salami.

Charliam


  #15 (permalink)   Report Post  
Sheldon
 
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Charles Gifford wrote:
> "cathy" > wrote in message
> ...
> > When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew National
> > kosher salami.
> >
> > When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there is a
> > mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone know
> > what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
> > texture to a kosher salami?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Cathy

>
> Would not a kosher salami of any type taste the same as any salami of

that
> same type? It may be kosher but that has little or nothing to do with

it's
> taste or texture, non? I assume, also, that a HB salami would be of a
> generic "American" salami nature rather than a specific type of

salami.
>
> Charliam


Kosher salami is essentially of only one type, whereas each recipe
varies, but so insignificantly as to be deemed negligible. There is
also kosher bologna, kosher hot dogs, and kosher knockwurst, all of
which vary only very slightly by brand. I know of no kosher salami
that is like say genoa. And I know of no kosher kielbasa... those who
keep kosher are not at all interested in provisions that emulate those
containing pork, regardless they're kosher. And kosher is like
pregnant, either is or ain't... no such thing as almost...

Sheldon



  #16 (permalink)   Report Post  
Steve Pope
 
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> Would not a kosher salami of any type taste the same as any
> salami of that same type? It may be kosher but that has little
> or nothing to do with it's taste or texture, non?


Kosher beef is processed a bit differently -- it has nearly
all the blood drained out of it, as opposed to about 60%.

Incidentally, there are people who believe that Hebrew National
ships somewhat better than average product to various customers
in New York City.

Steve

  #17 (permalink)   Report Post  
Stan Horwitz
 
Posts: n/a
Default

In article >,
cathy > wrote:

> When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew National
> kosher salami.
>
> When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there is a
> mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone know
> what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
> texture to a kosher salami?


Hebrew National salami of course! Its still made. Failing that, cooked
salami is pretty close, but not quite as strong a garlic flavor.
  #18 (permalink)   Report Post  
zxcvbob
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Charles Gifford wrote:
> "cathy" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew National
>>kosher salami.
>>
>>When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there is a
>>mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone know
>>what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
>>texture to a kosher salami?
>>
>>Thanks,
>>Cathy

>
>
> Would not a kosher salami of any type taste the same as any salami of that
> same type? It may be kosher but that has little or nothing to do with it's
> taste or texture, non? I assume, also, that a HB salami would be of a
> generic "American" salami nature rather than a specific type of salami.
>
> Charliam
>
>



A kosher salami would not have any pork, organ meats, nor milk products
added. All of those are commonly added to salami -- they're not bad
things, but they are not kosher. They all affect the taste and texture.

Other than that, I'm not sure what makes kosher-style salami. I would
expect a smoked garlicky all-beef summer sausage. (fermented and cooked
salami) Probably seasoned with mustard seed, black pepper, and either
coriander or nutmeg.

Best regards,
Bob
  #19 (permalink)   Report Post  
tuppy
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"zxcvbob" > wrote in message
...
> Charles Gifford wrote:
> > "cathy" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >
> >>When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew National
> >>kosher salami.
> >>
> >>When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there is a
> >>mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone know
> >>what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
> >>texture to a kosher salami?
> >>
> >>Thanks,
> >>Cathy

> >
> >
> > Would not a kosher salami of any type taste the same as any salami of

that
> > same type? It may be kosher but that has little or nothing to do with

it's
> > taste or texture, non? I assume, also, that a HB salami would be of a
> > generic "American" salami nature rather than a specific type of salami.
> >
> > Charliam
> >
> >

>
>
> A kosher salami would not have any pork, organ meats, nor milk products
> added. All of those are commonly added to salami -- they're not bad
> things, but they are not kosher. They all affect the taste and texture.
>
> Other than that, I'm not sure what makes kosher-style salami. I would
> expect a smoked garlicky all-beef summer sausage. (fermented and cooked
> salami) Probably seasoned with mustard seed, black pepper, and either
> coriander or nutmeg.
>
> Best regards,
> Bob


Regarding the laws of Kashruth, there are two components to making sure meat
is "approved." First relates to the actual "law" from the Old Testament,
particularly the books of Leviticus and Deuteronomy which precisely
describes what meats (and for that matter what food stuffs in general) are
allowed (and not allowed) to be consumed and under what circumstances (the
slaughter). While this is the basis for preparing kosher meat, there are
other later rabbinic sources which set up component #2, the certified and
ordained witness that ensures all proper preparation is conducted. This is
found in later writings of which the Talmud is the most renowned. Today,
meat is not considered kosher unless both conditions are met, so for example
explaining why Vienna Beef which meets component #1 isn't certified kosher
because they fail to meet condition #2. For further information that won't
burden you try:
http://www.shalomvillage.on.ca/kosher.htm


  #20 (permalink)   Report Post  
zxcvbob
 
Posts: n/a
Default

tuppy wrote:
> "zxcvbob" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>Charles Gifford wrote:
>>
>>>"cathy" > wrote in message
...
>>>
>>>
>>>>When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew National
>>>>kosher salami.
>>>>
>>>>When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there is a
>>>>mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone know
>>>>what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
>>>>texture to a kosher salami?
>>>>
>>>>Thanks,
>>>>Cathy
>>>
>>>
>>>Would not a kosher salami of any type taste the same as any salami of

>
> that
>
>>>same type? It may be kosher but that has little or nothing to do with

>
> it's
>
>>>taste or texture, non? I assume, also, that a HB salami would be of a
>>>generic "American" salami nature rather than a specific type of salami.
>>>
>>>Charliam
>>>
>>>

>>
>>
>>A kosher salami would not have any pork, organ meats, nor milk products
>>added. All of those are commonly added to salami -- they're not bad
>>things, but they are not kosher. They all affect the taste and texture.
>>
>>Other than that, I'm not sure what makes kosher-style salami. I would
>>expect a smoked garlicky all-beef summer sausage. (fermented and cooked
>>salami) Probably seasoned with mustard seed, black pepper, and either
>>coriander or nutmeg.
>>
>>Best regards,
>>Bob

>
>
> Regarding the laws of Kashruth, there are two components to making sure meat
> is "approved." First relates to the actual "law" from the Old Testament,
> particularly the books of Leviticus and Deuteronomy which precisely
> describes what meats (and for that matter what food stuffs in general) are
> allowed (and not allowed) to be consumed and under what circumstances (the
> slaughter). While this is the basis for preparing kosher meat, there are
> other later rabbinic sources which set up component #2, the certified and
> ordained witness that ensures all proper preparation is conducted. This is
> found in later writings of which the Talmud is the most renowned. Today,
> meat is not considered kosher unless both conditions are met, so for example
> explaining why Vienna Beef which meets component #1 isn't certified kosher
> because they fail to meet condition #2. For further information that won't
> burden you try:
> http://www.shalomvillage.on.ca/kosher.htm
>
>



That's why I said "kosher-style" rather than kosher. One could make a
sausage using certified kosher meat but using all the wrong spices and
it wouldn't be true-to-style.

It would be like biting into a "kosher dill pickle" and having it be
sweet/sour and loaded with cinnamon.

Best regards,
Bob


  #21 (permalink)   Report Post  
Sheldon
 
Posts: n/a
Default


zxcvbob wrote:
> tuppy wrote:
> > "zxcvbob" wrote:
> >>Charles Gifford wrote:
> >>>"cathy" wrote:
> >>>
> >>>>When I was a kid the only salami we ever bought was Hebrew

National
> >>>>kosher salami.
> >>>>
> >>>>When you go to the deli counter in the market these days there is

a
> >>>>mind-boggling array of salamis <sp?> and sausages. Does anyone

know
> >>>>what type/style of salami/sausage would be closest in flavor and
> >>>>texture to a kosher salami?
> >>>>
> >>>>Thanks,
> >>>>Cathy
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Would not a kosher salami of any type taste the same as any salami

of
> > that
> >>>same type? It may be kosher but that has little or nothing to do

with
> > it's
> >>>taste or texture, non? I assume, also, that a HB salami would be

of a
> >>>generic "American" salami nature rather than a specific type of

salami.
> >>>
> >>>Charliam
> >>
> >>A kosher salami would not have any pork, organ meats, nor milk

products
> >>added. All of those are commonly added to salami -- they're not

bad
> >>things, but they are not kosher. They all affect the taste and

texture.
> >>
> >>Other than that, I'm not sure what makes kosher-style salami. I

would
> >>expect a smoked garlicky all-beef summer sausage. (fermented and

cooked
> >>salami) Probably seasoned with mustard seed, black pepper, and

either
> >>coriander or nutmeg.
> >>
> >>Best regards,
> >>Bob

> >
> >
> > Regarding the laws of Kashruth, there are two components to making

sure meat
> > is "approved." First relates to the actual "law" from the Old

Testament,
> > particularly the books of Leviticus and Deuteronomy which precisely
> > describes what meats (and for that matter what food stuffs in

general) are
> > allowed (and not allowed) to be consumed and under what

circumstances (the
> > slaughter). While this is the basis for preparing kosher meat,

there are
> > other later rabbinic sources which set up component #2, the

certified and
> > ordained witness that ensures all proper preparation is conducted.

This is
> > found in later writings of which the Talmud is the most renowned.

Today,
> > meat is not considered kosher unless both conditions are met, so

for example
> > explaining why Vienna Beef which meets component #1 isn't certified

kosher
> > because they fail to meet condition #2. For further information

that won't
> > burden you try:
> > http://www.shalomvillage.on.ca/kosher.htm

>
> That's why I said "kosher-style" rather than kosher. One could make

a
> sausage using certified kosher meat but using all the wrong spices

and
> it wouldn't be true-to-style.
>
> It would be like biting into a "kosher dill pickle" and having it be
> sweet/sour and loaded with cinnamon.
>
> Best regards,
> Bob


Well put.

Sheldon

  #22 (permalink)   Report Post  
tuppy
 
Posts: n/a
Default

> > Regarding the laws of Kashruth, there are two components to making sure
meat
> > is "approved." First relates to the actual "law" from the Old

Testament,
> > particularly the books of Leviticus and Deuteronomy which precisely
> > describes what meats (and for that matter what food stuffs in general)

are
> > allowed (and not allowed) to be consumed and under what circumstances

(the
> > slaughter). While this is the basis for preparing kosher meat, there are
> > other later rabbinic sources which set up component #2, the certified

and
> > ordained witness that ensures all proper preparation is conducted. This

is
> > found in later writings of which the Talmud is the most renowned.

Today,
> > meat is not considered kosher unless both conditions are met, so for

example
> > explaining why Vienna Beef which meets component #1 isn't certified

kosher
> > because they fail to meet condition #2. For further information that

won't
> > burden you try:
> > http://www.shalomvillage.on.ca/kosher.htm
> >
> >

>
>
> That's why I said "kosher-style" rather than kosher. One could make a
> sausage using certified kosher meat but using all the wrong spices and
> it wouldn't be true-to-style.
>
> It would be like biting into a "kosher dill pickle" and having it be
> sweet/sour and loaded with cinnamon.
>
> Best regards,
> Bob


I guess the point of being all beef would be the first "Kosher style"
requirement. The rest as it appears in the rest of the food world would be
your particular tastes. I for one prefer a more garlicky salami, something
that my taste buds say Hebrew National is no longer.
Rand


  #23 (permalink)   Report Post  
Charles Gifford
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Sheldon" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>
>
> Kosher salami is essentially of only one type,


Yes. This is the important point Sheldon. There are many "kinds" of
salami.....the Hungarian varities being my favorites......I now gather that
"Kosher Salami" is a particular type of salami, with, as you mention,
slightly different variations in seasoning depending on the maker. It could
be made under non-kosher conditions as well as a real kosher product. The
rest of your post seems to be quite sensible too.

Charliam


  #24 (permalink)   Report Post  
Sheldon
 
Posts: n/a
Default


Charles Gifford wrote:
> "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> >
> >
> > Kosher salami is essentially of only one type,

>
> Yes. This is the important point Sheldon. There are many "kinds" of
> salami.....the Hungarian varities being my favorites......I now

gather that
> "Kosher Salami" is a particular type of salami, with, as you mention,
> slightly different variations in seasoning depending on the maker. It

could
> be made under non-kosher conditions as well as a real kosher product.

The
> rest of your post seems to be quite sensible too.
>
> Charliam


Yes, I suppose one could make non-kosher "kosher salami", but I've
never seen any sold commercially. But I'm sure many people make
"kosher salami" at home but don't use kosher meat or follow any laws of
kasruth. There's a recipe for "kosher style salami" in "Great Sausage
Rcipes and Sausage Meat Curing"
by Rytek Kutas... pg 216.

Sheldon

  #25 (permalink)   Report Post  
tuppy
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Sheldon" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> Charles Gifford wrote:
> > "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> > oups.com...
> > >
> > >
> > > Kosher salami is essentially of only one type,

> >
> > Yes. This is the important point Sheldon. There are many "kinds" of
> > salami.....the Hungarian varities being my favorites......I now

> gather that
> > "Kosher Salami" is a particular type of salami, with, as you mention,
> > slightly different variations in seasoning depending on the maker. It

> could
> > be made under non-kosher conditions as well as a real kosher product.

> The
> > rest of your post seems to be quite sensible too.
> >
> > Charliam

>
> Yes, I suppose one could make non-kosher "kosher salami", but I've
> never seen any sold commercially. But I'm sure many people make
> "kosher salami" at home but don't use kosher meat or follow any laws of
> kasruth. There's a recipe for "kosher style salami" in "Great Sausage
> Rcipes and Sausage Meat Curing"
> by Rytek Kutas... pg 216.
>
> Sheldon
>

And while I am really not trying to be a commercial for Vienna products here
in Chicago, I believe this is exactly what you are talking about apropos to
their salami.




  #26 (permalink)   Report Post  
Sheldon
 
Posts: n/a
Default


tuppy wrote:
> "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> >
> > Charles Gifford wrote:
> > > "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> > > oups.com...
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Kosher salami is essentially of only one type,
> > >
> > > Yes. This is the important point Sheldon. There are many "kinds"

of
> > > salami.....the Hungarian varities being my favorites......I now

> > gather that
> > > "Kosher Salami" is a particular type of salami, with, as you

mention,
> > > slightly different variations in seasoning depending on the

maker. It
> > could
> > > be made under non-kosher conditions as well as a real kosher

product.
> > The
> > > rest of your post seems to be quite sensible too.
> > >
> > > Charliam

> >
> > Yes, I suppose one could make non-kosher "kosher salami", but I've
> > never seen any sold commercially. But I'm sure many people make
> > "kosher salami" at home but don't use kosher meat or follow any

laws of
> > kasruth. There's a recipe for "kosher style salami" in "Great

Sausage
> > Rcipes and Sausage Meat Curing"
> > by Rytek Kutas... pg 216.
> >
> > Sheldon
> >

> And while I am really not trying to be a commercial for Vienna

products here
> in Chicago, I believe this is exactly what you are talking about

apropos to
> their salami.


Could well be... but I seriously doubt it... no one would buy it.
Those who keep kosher certainly wouldn't and even the goys who buy
kosher salami and are willing to pay the price want it should actually
be kosher, would they trust less, no ****ing way! I've never seen
Vienna products sold anywhere, certainly not anywhere in or around the
NYC area... from perusing their website I am absolutely positive that
their products, ALL of them, are shit!

Non-kosher kosher salami... yoose gotta be ****ING kidding... someone
tell me this tuppy ******* is a friggin' joke... anyone with the handle
"tuppy" who comes up with this garbage has gotta be a filthy dirty
scumbag anti semite jew hating garbage dump, probably some screwball
mooslim virus! YOOSE IMBECILES WANNA BUY THIS TUPPY CREEP'S CRAP, I
AIN'T.

Sheldon

  #27 (permalink)   Report Post  
Katra
 
Posts: n/a
Default

In article .com>,
"Sheldon" > wrote:

> Charles Gifford wrote:
> > "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> > oups.com...
> > >
> > >
> > > Kosher salami is essentially of only one type,

> >
> > Yes. This is the important point Sheldon. There are many "kinds" of
> > salami.....the Hungarian varities being my favorites......I now

> gather that
> > "Kosher Salami" is a particular type of salami, with, as you mention,
> > slightly different variations in seasoning depending on the maker. It

> could
> > be made under non-kosher conditions as well as a real kosher product.

> The
> > rest of your post seems to be quite sensible too.
> >
> > Charliam

>
> Yes, I suppose one could make non-kosher "kosher salami", but I've
> never seen any sold commercially. But I'm sure many people make
> "kosher salami" at home but don't use kosher meat or follow any laws of
> kasruth. There's a recipe for "kosher style salami" in "Great Sausage
> Rcipes and Sausage Meat Curing"
> by Rytek Kutas... pg 216.
>
> Sheldon
>


Is your salami Kosher Shel'? ;-D
--
K.
  #28 (permalink)   Report Post  
Sheldon
 
Posts: n/a
Default


Katra wrote:
> In article .com>,
> "Sheldon" > wrote:
>
> > Charles Gifford wrote:
> > > "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> > > oups.com...
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Kosher salami is essentially of only one type,
> > >
> > > Yes. This is the important point Sheldon. There are many "kinds"

of
> > > salami.....the Hungarian varities being my favorites......I now

> > gather that
> > > "Kosher Salami" is a particular type of salami, with, as you

mention,
> > > slightly different variations in seasoning depending on the

maker. It
> > could
> > > be made under non-kosher conditions as well as a real kosher

product.
> > The
> > > rest of your post seems to be quite sensible too.
> > >
> > > Charliam

> >
> > Yes, I suppose one could make non-kosher "kosher salami", but I've
> > never seen any sold commercially. But I'm sure many people make
> > "kosher salami" at home but don't use kosher meat or follow any

laws of
> > kasruth. There's a recipe for "kosher style salami" in "Great

Sausage
> > Rcipes and Sausage Meat Curing"
> > by Rytek Kutas... pg 216.
> >
> > Sheldon
> >

>
> Is your salami Kosher Shel'? ;-D
> --
> K.


Nah, it's seen too much porking!

Sheldon

  #29 (permalink)   Report Post  
tuppy
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Sheldon" > wrote in message
ups.com...
>
> tuppy wrote:
> > "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> > oups.com...
> > >
> > > Charles Gifford wrote:
> > > > "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> > > > oups.com...
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Kosher salami is essentially of only one type,
> > > >
> > > > Yes. This is the important point Sheldon. There are many "kinds"

> of
> > > > salami.....the Hungarian varities being my favorites......I now
> > > gather that
> > > > "Kosher Salami" is a particular type of salami, with, as you

> mention,
> > > > slightly different variations in seasoning depending on the

> maker. It
> > > could
> > > > be made under non-kosher conditions as well as a real kosher

> product.
> > > The
> > > > rest of your post seems to be quite sensible too.
> > > >
> > > > Charliam
> > >
> > > Yes, I suppose one could make non-kosher "kosher salami", but I've
> > > never seen any sold commercially. But I'm sure many people make
> > > "kosher salami" at home but don't use kosher meat or follow any

> laws of
> > > kasruth. There's a recipe for "kosher style salami" in "Great

> Sausage
> > > Rcipes and Sausage Meat Curing"
> > > by Rytek Kutas... pg 216.
> > >
> > > Sheldon
> > >

> > And while I am really not trying to be a commercial for Vienna

> products here
> > in Chicago, I believe this is exactly what you are talking about

> apropos to
> > their salami.

>
> Could well be... but I seriously doubt it... no one would buy it.
> Those who keep kosher certainly wouldn't and even the goys who buy
> kosher salami and are willing to pay the price want it should actually
> be kosher, would they trust less, no ****ing way! I've never seen
> Vienna products sold anywhere, certainly not anywhere in or around the
> NYC area... from perusing their website I am absolutely positive that
> their products, ALL of them, are shit!
>
> Non-kosher kosher salami... yoose gotta be ****ING kidding... someone
> tell me this tuppy ******* is a friggin' joke... anyone with the handle
> "tuppy" who comes up with this garbage has gotta be a filthy dirty
> scumbag anti semite jew hating garbage dump, probably some screwball
> mooslim virus! YOOSE IMBECILES WANNA BUY THIS TUPPY CREEP'S CRAP, I
> AIN'T.
>
> Sheldon
>


Well, your true colors have again shown their face, Shelly. You choose to
make this benign discussion something personal.

Obviously, you have never been to Chicago other than perhaps via a website
(you can spell Chicago, can't you?). The original question concerned finding
other salami that had a "kosher salami taste", other options not necessarily
kosher. I offered a brand that I believe does, according to my taste buds
which appear to be more worldly certainly than yours (do you ever get
outside of NYC. You might try the Long Island Railroad or better still,
Amtrak, I suggest going west). Instead of judging the taste of Vienna's
salami by their website and your keyboard, try one. If you can't afford it,
I will send you a "chub". If you think that the now soy laden Hebrew
National or Best brand salami remains the best salami around, you remain the
ignorant pudding head (saved you from having to look up the word "dolt")
that others have long alleged. And since you obviously know nothing about
Vienna products (again as you readily admit), you have no informed opinion
to offer, just more useless and unproductive banter. Vienna Beef products
are priced competitive with other beef only products. You aren't buying it
because you can't afford it.

It appears that 8 million Chicagoans (metro area, of course) just might know
something you don't, heaven forbid. Just as Utz products for example,
aren't found this way mostly for distribution reasons, and the NYC's
renowned Sabretts gets minimal play west of the "Borscht Belt", Vienna
products aren't found in NYC. That is not an indictment of any of these
product lines. I suspect that you have no clue what real Chicago Italian
beef tastes like. Do you know what a Runza is besides from their website
(which you just looked up to say you know and offer yet another useless,
uninformed opinion)? I didn't think so. Just because it isn't available in
NYC doesn't make it bad. While I believe that greater NYC deli is the best
to be found overall in the U.S., there are other very good options west of
the high holy Hudson River. If you don't want to hear about other regional
products, then perhaps you need to re-join your alt.binaries.toots
newsgroup. Nobody outside NYC and emigrants from NYC know what toots are and
I am pretty sure most New Yorkers don't either. Could this be yet another
Sheldon fabrication, especially since it remains your private, little
secret? Probably.

"Filthy, dirty, anti-Semite Jew hating garbage dump" you call me? My
daughters insult better. It sounds like the only salami Shelly eats contains
the remnants of a tiny foreskin he lost a few years back at the knife of a
hospital nurses' aide. And because it was allegedly slaughtered in NYC,
Shel will tell you it tastes great and is kosher, too. And admittedly,
since you seem to be quite the expert on eating "shit", Shel, you should
continue to eat your fair share of New York's finest. "Being fat, drunk and
stupid is no way to go through life, son." Now, show us what you know, not
suppose from behind your computer.

Would you now like a sample of Vienna's salami? Rand


  #30 (permalink)   Report Post  
Sheldon
 
Posts: n/a
Default


tuppy wrote:
> "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> ups.com...
> >
> > tuppy wrote:
> > > "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> > > oups.com...
> > > >
> > > > Charles Gifford wrote:
> > > > > "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> > > > > oups.com...
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Kosher salami is essentially of only one type,
> > > > >
> > > > > Yes. This is the important point Sheldon. There are many

"kinds"
> > of
> > > > > salami.....the Hungarian varities being my favorites......I

now
> > > > gather that
> > > > > "Kosher Salami" is a particular type of salami, with, as you

> > mention,
> > > > > slightly different variations in seasoning depending on the

> > maker. It
> > > > could
> > > > > be made under non-kosher conditions as well as a real kosher

> > product.
> > > > The
> > > > > rest of your post seems to be quite sensible too.
> > > > >
> > > > > Charliam
> > > >
> > > > Yes, I suppose one could make non-kosher "kosher salami", but

I've
> > > > never seen any sold commercially. But I'm sure many people

make
> > > > "kosher salami" at home but don't use kosher meat or follow any

> > laws of
> > > > kasruth. There's a recipe for "kosher style salami" in "Great

> > Sausage
> > > > Rcipes and Sausage Meat Curing"
> > > > by Rytek Kutas... pg 216.
> > > >
> > > > Sheldon
> > > >
> > > And while I am really not trying to be a commercial for Vienna

> > products here
> > > in Chicago, I believe this is exactly what you are talking about

> > apropos to
> > > their salami.

> >
> > Could well be... but I seriously doubt it... no one would buy it.
> > Those who keep kosher certainly wouldn't and even the goys who buy
> > kosher salami and are willing to pay the price want it should

actually
> > be kosher, would they trust less, no ****ing way! I've never seen
> > Vienna products sold anywhere, certainly not anywhere in or around

the
> > NYC area... from perusing their website I am absolutely positive

that
> > their products, ALL of them, are shit!
> >
> > Non-kosher kosher salami... yoose gotta be ****ING kidding...

someone
> > tell me this tuppy ******* is a friggin' joke... anyone with the

handle
> > "tuppy" who comes up with this garbage has gotta be a filthy dirty
> > scumbag anti semite jew hating garbage dump, probably some

screwball
> > mooslim virus! YOOSE IMBECILES WANNA BUY THIS TUPPY CREEP'S CRAP,

I
> > AIN'T.
> >
> > Sheldon
> >

>
> Well, your true colors have again shown their face, Shelly. You

choose to
> make this benign discussion something personal.


Actually the truth beknown YOU are who chose to make this personal...
two days ago you couldn't resist taking this discussion out of the
public arena because it permitted YOU to appear as you really are... a
LOSER and a COWARD... sending me intimidating email wins you no
argument, merely shows YOUR true colors, you JEW HATER. I'm done with
you, tubby.

Sheldon



  #31 (permalink)   Report Post  
Margaret Suran
 
Posts: n/a
Default



Dog3 wrote:

>
> This thread has me questioning a few things with the deli I buy my
> kosher food at. I am not Jewish but about 1/2 my friends are and I
> am invited to their homes on holdays. I love kosher food. I buy
> kosher salami, kosher bologna, kosher potato salad and lots of
> other things. Now I wonder if what I am buying is really kosher. I
> love the taste of kosher foods. The deli is called Kopperman's Deli
> and the other is the Posh Knosh. Posh Knosh is in Clayton not to
> far from my house. Kopperman's is in my old neighborhood. Both have
> been around for decades.
>
> Michael
>
>

If the deli were a kosher one, you would certainly know it. First of
all, there would be a certificate in the window, signed by a rabbi,
which would attest to that fact. Also, the place would be closed on
all major Jewish holidays and every week from a couple of hours before
sundown on Friday, until either an hour after sundown on Saturday
night, or until Sunday.

Every single item in the store would have to be kosher and if the
place doubles as a restaurant, no dairy dishes would be available, not
milk or cream for the coffee.

  #32 (permalink)   Report Post  
Sheldon
 
Posts: n/a
Default


Dog3 wrote:
>
> This thread has me questioning a few things with the deli I buy my

kosher
> food at. I am not Jewish but about 1/2 my friends are and I am

invited to
> their homes on holdays. I love kosher food. I buy kosher salami,

kosher
> bologna, kosher potato salad and lots of other things. Now I wonder

if what
> I am buying is really kosher. I love the taste of kosher foods. The

deli is
> called Kopperman's Deli and the other is the Posh Knosh. Posh Knosh

is in
> Clayton not to far from my house. Kopperman's is in my old

neighborhood.
> Both have been around for decades.
>
> Michael


If it's a Certified Kosher deli then what's purchased/eaten there is
kosher. But once the product leaves the premises all bets are off.
The kasruth laws must be adhered to for the products to remain
kosher... once the products are comingled with non-kosher products
and/or brought into non-kosher premises then the integrity of what
constitutes kosher has been irreparably violated. Of course this in no
way suggests you still can't enjoy the products. The kosher salami
from the typical stupidmarket is not truly kosher anyway because
typically it's kept in too close proximity with similar non-kosher
products, and those who do keep kosher don't buy there. But those
kosher products are purchased and enjoyed by many who could care less
about keeping kosher per se. To be kosher it's not enough that say
kosher salami be made Certifiably Kosher, it must also be handled
accordingly at all times after it leaves the factory. For many the
kosher deli is not good enough, the ultra ortodox don't buy there, they
purchase their kosher provions from a kosher butcher shop, and usually
a special kosher butcher shop, Certified Glatt Kosher. Btw, other than
philosophical there is no logical reason for "kosher"... and everyone
who adheres does so at their own personal level... keeping kosher is
difficult and is purposely designed to be difficult, if for no other
reason but to make the eating aspect of ones life so tough that all
other terrible things that befall one seem trivial in comparison.
Michael, if you converted to Judaism and kept kosher then all the other
aspects of your life would seem so much easier and perhaps then you'd
not be such a drama queen. <G> Just a thought.

Sheldon

  #33 (permalink)   Report Post  
Katra
 
Posts: n/a
Default

In article .com>,
"Sheldon" > wrote:

> Katra wrote:
> > In article .com>,
> > "Sheldon" > wrote:
> >
> > > Charles Gifford wrote:
> > > > "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> > > > oups.com...
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Kosher salami is essentially of only one type,
> > > >
> > > > Yes. This is the important point Sheldon. There are many "kinds"

> of
> > > > salami.....the Hungarian varities being my favorites......I now
> > > gather that
> > > > "Kosher Salami" is a particular type of salami, with, as you

> mention,
> > > > slightly different variations in seasoning depending on the

> maker. It
> > > could
> > > > be made under non-kosher conditions as well as a real kosher

> product.
> > > The
> > > > rest of your post seems to be quite sensible too.
> > > >
> > > > Charliam
> > >
> > > Yes, I suppose one could make non-kosher "kosher salami", but I've
> > > never seen any sold commercially. But I'm sure many people make
> > > "kosher salami" at home but don't use kosher meat or follow any

> laws of
> > > kasruth. There's a recipe for "kosher style salami" in "Great

> Sausage
> > > Rcipes and Sausage Meat Curing"
> > > by Rytek Kutas... pg 216.
> > >
> > > Sheldon
> > >

> >
> > Is your salami Kosher Shel'? ;-D
> > --
> > K.

>
> Nah, it's seen too much porking!
>
> Sheldon
>


Ooh that was BAD!!! <lol>
--
K.

Sprout the MungBean to reply

"I don't like to commit myself about heaven and hell‹you
see, I have friends in both places." --Mark Twain
  #34 (permalink)   Report Post  
Wayne Boatwright
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Sat 16 Apr 2005 06:43:31a, Margaret Suran wrote in rec.food.cooking:

>
>
> Dog3 wrote:
>
>>
>> This thread has me questioning a few things with the deli I buy my
>> kosher food at. I am not Jewish but about 1/2 my friends are and I
>> am invited to their homes on holdays. I love kosher food. I buy
>> kosher salami, kosher bologna, kosher potato salad and lots of
>> other things. Now I wonder if what I am buying is really kosher. I
>> love the taste of kosher foods. The deli is called Kopperman's Deli
>> and the other is the Posh Knosh. Posh Knosh is in Clayton not to
>> far from my house. Kopperman's is in my old neighborhood. Both have
>> been around for decades.
>>
>> Michael
>>
>>

> If the deli were a kosher one, you would certainly know it. First of
> all, there would be a certificate in the window, signed by a rabbi,
> which would attest to that fact. Also, the place would be closed on
> all major Jewish holidays and every week from a couple of hours before
> sundown on Friday, until either an hour after sundown on Saturday
> night, or until Sunday.
>
> Every single item in the store would have to be kosher and if the
> place doubles as a restaurant, no dairy dishes would be available, not
> milk or cream for the coffee.
>
>


Kopperman's is listed as a "kosher style" deli, and they are open on Friday
nights and Saturdays.

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
____________________________________________

Give me a smart idiot over a stupid genius any day.
Sam Goldwyn, 1882-1974
  #35 (permalink)   Report Post  
Wayne Boatwright
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Sat 16 Apr 2005 08:50:43a, Katra wrote in rec.food.cooking:

> In article .com>,
> "Sheldon" > wrote:
>
>> Katra wrote:
>> > In article .com>,
>> > "Sheldon" > wrote:
>> >
>> > > Charles Gifford wrote:
>> > > > "Sheldon" > wrote in message
>> > > > oups.com...
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Kosher salami is essentially of only one type,
>> > > >
>> > > > Yes. This is the important point Sheldon. There are many "kinds"
>> > > > of salami.....the Hungarian varities being my favorites......I
>> > > > now gather that "Kosher Salami" is a particular type of salami,
>> > > > with, as you mention, slightly different variations in seasoning
>> > > > depending on the maker. It could be made under non-kosher
>> > > > conditions as well as a real kosher product. The rest of your
>> > > > post seems to be quite sensible too.
>> > > >
>> > > > Charliam
>> > >
>> > > Yes, I suppose one could make non-kosher "kosher salami", but I've
>> > > never seen any sold commercially. But I'm sure many people make
>> > > "kosher salami" at home but don't use kosher meat or follow any
>> > > laws of kasruth. There's a recipe for "kosher style salami" in
>> > > "Great Sausage Rcipes and Sausage Meat Curing"
>> > > by Rytek Kutas... pg 216.
>> > >
>> > > Sheldon
>> > >
>> >
>> > Is your salami Kosher Shel'? ;-D --
>> > K.

>>
>> Nah, it's seen too much porking!
>>
>> Sheldon
>>

>
> Ooh that was BAD!!! <lol>


He should probably use a dry rub on it, then smoke it for 5-6 hours.

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
____________________________________________

Give me a smart idiot over a stupid genius any day.
Sam Goldwyn, 1882-1974


  #36 (permalink)   Report Post  
tuppy
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Sheldon" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> tuppy wrote:
> > "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> > ups.com...
> > >
> > > tuppy wrote:
> > > > "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> > > > oups.com...
> > > > >
> > > > > Charles Gifford wrote:
> > > > > > "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> > > > > > oups.com...
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Kosher salami is essentially of only one type,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Yes. This is the important point Sheldon. There are many

> "kinds"
> > > of
> > > > > > salami.....the Hungarian varities being my favorites......I

> now
> > > > > gather that
> > > > > > "Kosher Salami" is a particular type of salami, with, as you
> > > mention,
> > > > > > slightly different variations in seasoning depending on the
> > > maker. It
> > > > > could
> > > > > > be made under non-kosher conditions as well as a real kosher
> > > product.
> > > > > The
> > > > > > rest of your post seems to be quite sensible too.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Charliam
> > > > >
> > > > > Yes, I suppose one could make non-kosher "kosher salami", but

> I've
> > > > > never seen any sold commercially. But I'm sure many people

> make
> > > > > "kosher salami" at home but don't use kosher meat or follow any
> > > laws of
> > > > > kasruth. There's a recipe for "kosher style salami" in "Great
> > > Sausage
> > > > > Rcipes and Sausage Meat Curing"
> > > > > by Rytek Kutas... pg 216.
> > > > >
> > > > > Sheldon
> > > > >
> > > > And while I am really not trying to be a commercial for Vienna
> > > products here
> > > > in Chicago, I believe this is exactly what you are talking about
> > > apropos to
> > > > their salami.
> > >
> > > Could well be... but I seriously doubt it... no one would buy it.
> > > Those who keep kosher certainly wouldn't and even the goys who buy
> > > kosher salami and are willing to pay the price want it should

> actually
> > > be kosher, would they trust less, no ****ing way! I've never seen
> > > Vienna products sold anywhere, certainly not anywhere in or around

> the
> > > NYC area... from perusing their website I am absolutely positive

> that
> > > their products, ALL of them, are shit!
> > >
> > > Non-kosher kosher salami... yoose gotta be ****ING kidding...

> someone
> > > tell me this tuppy ******* is a friggin' joke... anyone with the

> handle
> > > "tuppy" who comes up with this garbage has gotta be a filthy dirty
> > > scumbag anti semite jew hating garbage dump, probably some

> screwball
> > > mooslim virus! YOOSE IMBECILES WANNA BUY THIS TUPPY CREEP'S CRAP,

> I
> > > AIN'T.
> > >
> > > Sheldon
> > >

> >
> > Well, your true colors have again shown their face, Shelly. You

> choose to
> > make this benign discussion something personal.

>
> Actually the truth beknown YOU are who chose to make this personal...
> two days ago you couldn't resist taking this discussion out of the
> public arena because it permitted YOU to appear as you really are... a
> LOSER and a COWARD... sending me intimidating email wins you no
> argument, merely shows YOUR true colors, you JEW HATER. I'm done with
> you, tubby.
>
> Sheldon
>

Yup..I hit the wrong button but sent the very same email to the group, now
didn't I? Coward?? If you say so. Jew hater? Again, an example of you
not knowing what you are talking about. Shel the hate monger. Your done
with me? Oh that hurts....LOL.


  #37 (permalink)   Report Post  
tuppy
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Sheldon" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> Dog3 wrote:
> >
> > This thread has me questioning a few things with the deli I buy my

> kosher
> > food at. I am not Jewish but about 1/2 my friends are and I am

> invited to
> > their homes on holdays. I love kosher food. I buy kosher salami,

> kosher
> > bologna, kosher potato salad and lots of other things. Now I wonder

> if what
> > I am buying is really kosher. I love the taste of kosher foods. The

> deli is
> > called Kopperman's Deli and the other is the Posh Knosh. Posh Knosh

> is in
> > Clayton not to far from my house. Kopperman's is in my old

> neighborhood.
> > Both have been around for decades.
> >
> > Michael

>
> If it's a Certified Kosher deli then what's purchased/eaten there is
> kosher. But once the product leaves the premises all bets are off.
> The kasruth laws must be adhered to for the products to remain
> kosher... once the products are comingled with non-kosher products
> and/or brought into non-kosher premises then the integrity of what
> constitutes kosher has been irreparably violated. Of course this in no
> way suggests you still can't enjoy the products. The kosher salami
> from the typical stupidmarket is not truly kosher anyway because
> typically it's kept in too close proximity with similar non-kosher
> products, and those who do keep kosher don't buy there. But those
> kosher products are purchased and enjoyed by many who could care less
> about keeping kosher per se. To be kosher it's not enough that say
> kosher salami be made Certifiably Kosher, it must also be handled
> accordingly at all times after it leaves the factory. For many the
> kosher deli is not good enough, the ultra ortodox don't buy there, they
> purchase their kosher provions from a kosher butcher shop, and usually
> a special kosher butcher shop, Certified Glatt Kosher. Btw, other than
> philosophical there is no logical reason for "kosher"... and everyone
> who adheres does so at their own personal level... keeping kosher is
> difficult and is purposely designed to be difficult, if for no other
> reason but to make the eating aspect of ones life so tough that all
> other terrible things that befall one seem trivial in comparison.
> Michael, if you converted to Judaism and kept kosher then all the other
> aspects of your life would seem so much easier and perhaps then you'd
> not be such a drama queen. <G> Just a thought.
>
> Sheldon
>

Sheldon is partially right in his discussion of Kashruth. While the Old
Testament does not tell us why we should keep Kosher, it is universally
accepted by rabbinic writers of the Talmud that we are required to do so
because G-d tells us to in the OT scripture. Talmudic writings suggest that
the disciplines of Kashruth are G-d's way of telling us to moderate our
lives, that something's we in fact do without because we need to do without
them. Kashruth is not only for food prep and certification; the combination
of wool and linen is also strictly forbidden.

With Passover a week away, there are an entire new set of rules for this
wonderful celebration of freedom which precludes us from consuming almost
anything containing yeast and any sort of flour except specifically
designated "meal." And with Passover, there is some disagreement as to what
vegetable are permitted depending whether you are Northern European
(Ashkenazic) or African or Middle Eastern (Sephardic) Jewish. The biggest
disagreement has to do with the consumption of corn, peas and beans during
this period.

There are many symbols that are found on products that imply they are
Kosher. Among them are the letters U and K in a circle, K in a 5 pointed
star (not star of David) and the letter K in the Hebrew letter chaf. These
are called hekhshers. However, some manufactures just put the letter K on
their products when most every expert agrees these items are NOT Kosher.
The best example is Jell-o which every reliable Orthodox Jewish authority
agrees is not Kosher. It is because one can not trademark just a letter of
the alphabet. So caution is the rule.

As a side note, Koshering meat and the way meat is prepared in Islam, called
Hallal are not the same and the dietary rules for both a significantly
different. While both abstain from any contact with pork products, Hallal
allows for the consumption of shellfish, fish without any scales, and
preparation of meat with milk.

Rand


  #38 (permalink)   Report Post  
zxcvbob
 
Posts: n/a
Default

tuppy wrote:
>
> Sheldon is partially right in his discussion of Kashruth. While the Old
> Testament does not tell us why we should keep Kosher, it is universally
> accepted by rabbinic writers of the Talmud that we are required to do so
> because G-d tells us to in the OT scripture. Talmudic writings suggest that
> the disciplines of Kashruth are G-d's way of telling us to moderate our
> lives, that something's we in fact do without because we need to do without
> them. Kashruth is not only for food prep and certification; the combination
> of wool and linen is also strictly forbidden.
>


Also, the ancient Jews were chosen by God and set apart. All the
Kashruth laws made it obvious who was a Jew and who was not, and it
helped prevent Jews from comingling with the Canaanites, attending their
festivals, etc. Without these cultural incompatabilites, the Jews would
have just been absorbed the native inhabitants of the Promised Land and
disappeared.

Best regards,
Bob
  #39 (permalink)   Report Post  
OmManiPadmeOmelet
 
Posts: n/a
Default

In article >,
Wayne Boatwright > wrote:

> On Sat 16 Apr 2005 08:50:43a, Katra wrote in rec.food.cooking:
>
> > In article .com>,
> > "Sheldon" > wrote:
> >
> >> Katra wrote:
> >> > In article .com>,
> >> > "Sheldon" > wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > Charles Gifford wrote:
> >> > > > "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> >> > > > oups.com...
> >> > > > >
> >> > > > >
> >> > > > > Kosher salami is essentially of only one type,
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Yes. This is the important point Sheldon. There are many "kinds"
> >> > > > of salami.....the Hungarian varities being my favorites......I
> >> > > > now gather that "Kosher Salami" is a particular type of salami,
> >> > > > with, as you mention, slightly different variations in seasoning
> >> > > > depending on the maker. It could be made under non-kosher
> >> > > > conditions as well as a real kosher product. The rest of your
> >> > > > post seems to be quite sensible too.
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Charliam
> >> > >
> >> > > Yes, I suppose one could make non-kosher "kosher salami", but I've
> >> > > never seen any sold commercially. But I'm sure many people make
> >> > > "kosher salami" at home but don't use kosher meat or follow any
> >> > > laws of kasruth. There's a recipe for "kosher style salami" in
> >> > > "Great Sausage Rcipes and Sausage Meat Curing"
> >> > > by Rytek Kutas... pg 216.
> >> > >
> >> > > Sheldon
> >> > >
> >> >
> >> > Is your salami Kosher Shel'? ;-D --
> >> > K.
> >>
> >> Nah, it's seen too much porking!
> >>
> >> Sheldon
> >>

> >
> > Ooh that was BAD!!! <lol>

>
> He should probably use a dry rub on it, then smoke it for 5-6 hours.


Heheheh!

You're worse than he is! ;-D
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson
  #40 (permalink)   Report Post  
Steve Pope
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Margaret Suran > wrote:

>If the deli were a kosher one, you would certainly know it. First of
>all, there would be a certificate in the window, signed by a rabbi,
>which would attest to that fact. Also, the place would be closed on
>all major Jewish holidays and every week from a couple of hours before
>sundown on Friday, until either an hour after sundown on Saturday
>night, or until Sunday.


Except for 2nd Avenue Deli in NYC, which is certified as
kosher yet stays open seven days a week.

Steve
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