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Old 08-02-2018, 10:14 PM posted to rec.food.cooking
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I was reading "Multicultural Manners: New Rules of Etiquette for a Changing Society" by Norine Dresser. It's the 1996 edition (there's a 2005 edition as well), so I don't know how much got changed in between.

If you leave out the index and such, it's 260 pages, divided into three large parts. One 20-page subsection is "Foodways." Within that, you have "Cleaning Your Plate" (pp 75-76).

Here's the second half of that section:

"...The act of cleaning one's plate and emptying the glass has different meanings, depending on the culture. Jordanians leave a small amount as a sign of politeness. Filipinos keep a little on the plate to show that the hosts have provided well. Conversely, as with Marina's (Cambodian) family, cleaning the plate sometimes signals that the guest still wants more and the hosts have not provided sufficiently.

"With Koreans, the glass will not be refilled if there is still some liquid in it, and Egyptians leave some food on the plate as a symbol of abundance and a compliment to the host. For Thais, leaving food means you are finished or it was delicious. For Indonesians, leaving food on the plate means the diner is impolite. For the Japanese, cleaning one's plate means the guest appreciates the food. Finishing the rice in the bowl signals that the diner has finished the meal.

"Americans frequently caution their children to not waste food and to clean their plates, often citing some place in the world where people are starving. Parents elsewhere employ similar techniques for warning children not to waste food. A Chinese American recalls her childhood when her mother admonished that for every grain of rice left on the plate the youngster would have one pock mark on her face."

(end)

But, according to travel writer Roger Axtell, in SOME parts of China at least, they follow the Cambodian tradition. That is, as a guest, you are not supposed to eat the last dish served, which will be plain rice. To eat it would be insulting to the host.

Anyway, as I've always understood it, in the U.S., you're supposed to eat lightly. That is, if the host is the one filling your plate, you can have second servings after cleaning your plate IF the host offers them and/or if the other guests are seen to be helping themselves that way. If it's a buffet, you try not to take twice as much as the others are taking, at least!

But that leaves one potentially awkward situation that the book didn't mention - namely, when guests are allowed to fill their OWN plates - from platters that are passed around the table. See here (it's a 1965 Ann Landers column):

https://cdnc.ucr.edu/cgi-bin/cdnc?a=d&d=MT19650607.2.80

So it got me to wondering - chances are the in-laws were just selfish, greedy boors, but there could be more to it, unfortunately. ARE there many cultures where guests are truly expected just to eat as much as they like and not to care much about whether or not the host can afford it? Offhand, I can only think of two. One is the Gambia in West Africa, where even a well-off guest can't usually say to a dirt-poor host "no thanks, I couldn't possibly" even when eating the one egg would mean the host wouldn't have anything to eat for the next meal.

And:

From the juvenile book "Manners and Customs in the Middle Ages":

A Persian saying from the 900s A.D. explains: "Give all the food you have to your guest, even if you have only a drop of water for yourself."


Lenona.

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Old 10-02-2018, 12:17 AM posted to rec.food.cooking
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wrote:
I was reading "Multicultural Manners: New Rules of Etiquette for a Changing Society" by Norine Dresser. It's the 1996 edition (there's a 2005 edition as well), so I don't know how much got changed in between.

If you leave out the index and such, it's 260 pages, divided into three large parts. One 20-page subsection is "Foodways." Within that, you have "Cleaning Your Plate" (pp 75-76).

Here's the second half of that section:

"...The act of cleaning one's plate and emptying the glass has different meanings, depending on the culture. Jordanians leave a small amount as a sign of politeness. Filipinos keep a little on the plate to show that the hosts have provided well. Conversely, as with Marina's (Cambodian) family, cleaning the plate sometimes signals that the guest still wants more and the hosts have not provided sufficiently.

"With Koreans, the glass will not be refilled if there is still some liquid in it, and Egyptians leave some food on the plate as a symbol of abundance and a compliment to the host. For Thais, leaving food means you are finished or it was delicious. For Indonesians, leaving food on the plate means the diner is impolite. For the Japanese, cleaning one's plate means the guest appreciates the food. Finishing the rice in the bowl signals that the diner has finished the meal.

"Americans frequently caution their children to not waste food and to clean their plates, often citing some place in the world where people are starving. Parents elsewhere employ similar techniques for warning children not to waste food. A Chinese American recalls her childhood when her mother admonished that for every grain of rice left on the plate the youngster would have one pock mark on her face."

(end)

But, according to travel writer Roger Axtell, in SOME parts of China at least, they follow the Cambodian tradition. That is, as a guest, you are not supposed to eat the last dish served, which will be plain rice. To eat it would be insulting to the host.

Anyway, as I've always understood it, in the U.S., you're supposed to eat lightly. That is, if the host is the one filling your plate, you can have second servings after cleaning your plate IF the host offers them and/or if the other guests are seen to be helping themselves that way. If it's a buffet, you try not to take twice as much as the others are taking, at least!

But that leaves one potentially awkward situation that the book didn't mention - namely, when guests are allowed to fill their OWN plates - from platters that are passed around the table. See here (it's a 1965 Ann Landers column):

https://cdnc.ucr.edu/cgi-bin/cdnc?a=d&d=MT19650607.2.80

So it got me to wondering - chances are the in-laws were just selfish, greedy boors, but there could be more to it, unfortunately. ARE there many cultures where guests are truly expected just to eat as much as they like and not to care much about whether or not the host can afford it? Offhand, I can only think of two. One is the Gambia in West Africa, where even a well-off guest can't usually say to a dirt-poor host "no thanks, I couldn't possibly" even when eating the one egg would mean the host wouldn't have anything to eat for the next meal.

And:

From the juvenile book "Manners and Customs in the Middle Ages":

A Persian saying from the 900s A.D. explains: "Give all the food you have to your guest, even if you have only a drop of water for yourself."


Lenona.



Be not forgetful to entertain strangers: for thereby some have
entertained angels unawares.

When in Rome, do as the Romans do.

If you, a meat eater are entertaining and happenstance has it that all
your guests/friends are vegans, then it may behoove you to not serve meat.


You could say, that due to having a rather big meal before, you couldn't
possibly hold another bite, or: "Please take no offense, but as much as
I would love to finish the plate, I can't possibly for I am about to burst.

Sincerely,

A. H. Carter
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Old 10-02-2018, 06:56 AM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Default "Eat lightly when you're a guest" - question

On Sat, 10 Feb 2018 00:10:35 -0600, Sqwertz
wrote:

On Thu, 8 Feb 2018 14:14:27 -0800 (PST), wrote:

"...The act of cleaning one's plate and emptying the glass has
different meanings, depending on the culture. Jordanians leave a
small amount as a sign of politeness. Filipinos keep a little on
the plate to show that the hosts have provided well. Conversely, as
with Marina's (Cambodian) family, cleaning the plate sometimes
signals that the guest still wants more and the hosts have not
provided sufficiently.

"With Koreans, the glass will not be refilled if there is still
some liquid in it, and Egyptians leave some food on the plate as a
symbol of abundance and a compliment to the host. For Thais,
leaving food means you are finished or it was delicious. For
Indonesians, leaving food on the plate means the diner is impolite.
For the Japanese, cleaning one's plate means the guest appreciates
the food. Finishing the rice in the bowl signals that the diner has
finished the meal.


What does it mean when you turn the plate vertical and move your head
in a circular motion licking the plate clean?

-sw


Made me laugh.

My Mother would be horrified. Shortly before she died she saw one of
her favourite TV chefs do this and she never spoke his name again!

My grandmother made sure all her daughters were ladies, as did her
mother before her. Tough as nails, but ladies nontheless.

Food tonight - thick fillet steaks for everyone (7 of us tonight)
purchased at a super special from the used meat section and a large
kitchen sink salad. With my eating habits lately I will probably
forego the steak.

JB

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Old 10-02-2018, 08:35 AM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Default "Eat lightly when you're a guest" - question

Am Samstag, 10. Februar 2018 07:56:45 UTC+1 schrieb Golden One:
On Sat, 10 Feb 2018 00:10:35 -0600, Sqwertz
wrote:

On Thu, 8 Feb 2018 14:14:27 -0800 (PST), wrote:

"...The act of cleaning one's plate and emptying the glass has
different meanings, depending on the culture. Jordanians leave a
small amount as a sign of politeness. Filipinos keep a little on
the plate to show that the hosts have provided well. Conversely, as
with Marina's (Cambodian) family, cleaning the plate sometimes
signals that the guest still wants more and the hosts have not
provided sufficiently.

"With Koreans, the glass will not be refilled if there is still
some liquid in it, and Egyptians leave some food on the plate as a
symbol of abundance and a compliment to the host. For Thais,
leaving food means you are finished or it was delicious. For
Indonesians, leaving food on the plate means the diner is impolite.
For the Japanese, cleaning one's plate means the guest appreciates
the food. Finishing the rice in the bowl signals that the diner has
finished the meal.


What does it mean when you turn the plate vertical and move your head
in a circular motion licking the plate clean?


There's not enough bread (or whatever) to get all the good sauce!

Made me laugh.


Me too. Reminded me of a commercial for a sauce-from-the-box - in a
high-class restaurant, they run out of self-made gravy and use that stuff
instead. After a while, the staff ask themselves "Did they notice?"
because they hear not a sound from the guests. They take a peek - all
the patrons are busy licking their plates clean with only a low "mmmmm!"
audible...

My Mother would be horrified. Shortly before she died she saw one of
her favourite TV chefs do this and she never spoke his name again!

My grandmother made sure all her daughters were ladies, as did her
mother before her. Tough as nails, but ladies nontheless.


I bet she taught them to eat spaghetti noiselessly?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNAZmLmyCJk

Food tonight - thick fillet steaks for everyone (7 of us tonight)
purchased at a super special from the used meat section and a large
kitchen sink salad. With my eating habits lately I will probably
forego the steak.


I'm thinking Ratatouille.

Bye, Sanne
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Old 10-02-2018, 01:35 PM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Default "Eat lightly when you're a guest" - question

On 2018-02-09 11:56 PM, JBurns wrote:
On Sat, 10 Feb 2018 00:10:35 -0600, Sqwertz
wrote:

On Thu, 8 Feb 2018 14:14:27 -0800 (PST), wrote:

"...The act of cleaning one's plate and emptying the glass has
different meanings, depending on the culture. Jordanians leave a
small amount as a sign of politeness. Filipinos keep a little on
the plate to show that the hosts have provided well. Conversely, as
with Marina's (Cambodian) family, cleaning the plate sometimes
signals that the guest still wants more and the hosts have not
provided sufficiently.

"With Koreans, the glass will not be refilled if there is still
some liquid in it, and Egyptians leave some food on the plate as a
symbol of abundance and a compliment to the host. For Thais,
leaving food means you are finished or it was delicious. For
Indonesians, leaving food on the plate means the diner is impolite.
For the Japanese, cleaning one's plate means the guest appreciates
the food. Finishing the rice in the bowl signals that the diner has
finished the meal.


What does it mean when you turn the plate vertical and move your head
in a circular motion licking the plate clean?

-sw


Made me laugh.

My Mother would be horrified. Shortly before she died she saw one of
her favourite TV chefs do this and she never spoke his name again!

My grandmother made sure all her daughters were ladies, as did her
mother before her. Tough as nails, but ladies nontheless.

Did she go shopping wearing elbow length gloves during century
temperatures?:-)


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Old 10-02-2018, 01:50 PM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Default "Eat lightly when you're a guest" - question

On Sat, 10 Feb 2018 06:35:51 -0700, graham wrote:

On 2018-02-09 11:56 PM, JBurns wrote:
On Sat, 10 Feb 2018 00:10:35 -0600, Sqwertz
wrote:

On Thu, 8 Feb 2018 14:14:27 -0800 (PST), wrote:

"...The act of cleaning one's plate and emptying the glass has
different meanings, depending on the culture. Jordanians leave a
small amount as a sign of politeness. Filipinos keep a little on
the plate to show that the hosts have provided well. Conversely, as
with Marina's (Cambodian) family, cleaning the plate sometimes
signals that the guest still wants more and the hosts have not
provided sufficiently.

"With Koreans, the glass will not be refilled if there is still
some liquid in it, and Egyptians leave some food on the plate as a
symbol of abundance and a compliment to the host. For Thais,
leaving food means you are finished or it was delicious. For
Indonesians, leaving food on the plate means the diner is impolite.
For the Japanese, cleaning one's plate means the guest appreciates
the food. Finishing the rice in the bowl signals that the diner has
finished the meal.

What does it mean when you turn the plate vertical and move your head
in a circular motion licking the plate clean?

-sw


Made me laugh.

My Mother would be horrified. Shortly before she died she saw one of
her favourite TV chefs do this and she never spoke his name again!

My grandmother made sure all her daughters were ladies, as did her
mother before her. Tough as nails, but ladies nontheless.

Did she go shopping wearing elbow length gloves during century
temperatures?:-)


My grandmother, yes. Not elbow length though.

When I was a small child she never left the house without hat and
gloves, stockings too. By the 1970s she had stopped such things.

JB


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Old 10-02-2018, 02:17 PM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Default "Eat lightly when you're a guest" - question

On 2/10/2018 8:50 AM, JBurns wrote:

When I was a small child she never left the house without hat and
gloves, stockings too. By the 1970s she had stopped such things.


I've heard (well, seen) people say they miss the old days when
people got dressed up to go shopping, or worse, the airport.
Comfort is more important these days. If I'm clean and neat,
it'll have to be good enough.

nancy
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Old 10-02-2018, 02:58 PM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Default "Eat lightly when you're a guest" - question

On 2/10/2018 9:17 AM, Nancy Young wrote:
On 2/10/2018 8:50 AM, JBurns wrote:

When I was a small child she never left the house without hat and
gloves, stockings too. By the 1970s she had stopped such things.


I've heard (well, seen) people say they miss the old days when
people got dressed up to go shopping, or worse, the airport.
Comfort is more important these days.* If I'm clean and neat,
it'll have to be good enough.

nancy


I vaguely remember those Jackie Kennedy days. I have a drawer full of
gloves my mother owned. Long gloves for formal occasions (Marine Corps
Ball, no doubt) and short gloves for when she was going to a luncheon.
I have a couple of her old hats, too. I don't remember her wearing them
to go shopping, though.

Jill
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Old 10-02-2018, 03:07 PM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Default "Eat lightly when you're a guest" - question

On 2018-02-10 9:17 AM, Nancy Young wrote:
On 2/10/2018 8:50 AM, JBurns wrote:

When I was a small child she never left the house without hat and
gloves, stockings too. By the 1970s she had stopped such things.


I've heard (well, seen) people say they miss the old days when
people got dressed up to go shopping, or worse, the airport.
Comfort is more important these days.* If I'm clean and neat,
it'll have to be good enough.


People in this area tend to dress casually. There is an exception. A
couple years ago an outlet mall opened up and it attracts people from
out of town. It still surprises me to see people all dressed up to go
shopping.

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Old 10-02-2018, 04:23 PM posted to rec.food.cooking
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On 2/10/2018 9:58 AM, jmcquown wrote:
On 2/10/2018 9:17 AM, Nancy Young wrote:


I've heard (well, seen) people say they miss the old days when
people got dressed up to go shopping, or worse, the airport.
Comfort is more important these days.* If I'm clean and neat,
it'll have to be good enough.


I vaguely remember those Jackie Kennedy days.


If I was Jackie Kennedy I'd dress up all the time, too, because
every day she stepped out the door there were photographers. My idea
of hell.

I have a drawer full of
gloves my mother owned.* Long gloves for formal occasions (Marine Corps
Ball, no doubt) and short gloves for when she was going to a luncheon. I
have a couple of her old hats, too.* I don't remember her wearing them
to go shopping, though.


I came across some gloves at my mother's house, even a couple of
old hats. I don't recall ever seeing her wear anything like that.

nancy


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Old 10-02-2018, 04:28 PM posted to rec.food.cooking
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On 2/9/2018 11:10 PM, Sqwertz wrote:
What does it mean when you turn the plate vertical and move your head
in a circular motion licking the plate clean?


Get the **** outta here, you creep!

Steve Wertz - unrepentant woman stalker and total head case begging poor
Omelet to shoot him with a sniper rifle in austin.food:

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ost

3/18/2011 3:49 PM
Microsoft Internet News 4.70.1162
readnews.com - News for Geeks and ISPs
fa35d278.newsreader.readnews.com


Sorry I don't fit either of your Ideal Psycho Pal Profiles.

-sw
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'd prefer you use a sniper rifle on me from a few hundred yards away.
There you go - a reason for you to buy yet another gun and ammo.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

https://www.centraltexasfoodbank.org...ntation-057jpg

Hide the Ho Ho's!!!
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Old 10-02-2018, 04:31 PM posted to rec.food.cooking
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On 2/10/2018 10:07 AM, Dave Smith wrote:
On 2018-02-10 9:17 AM, Nancy Young wrote:
I've heard (well, seen) people say they miss the old days when
people got dressed up to go shopping, or worse, the airport.
Comfort is more important these days.* If I'm clean and neat,
it'll have to be good enough.


People in this area tend to dress casually. There is an exception. A
couple years ago an outlet mall opened up and it attracts people from
out of town. It still surprises me to see people all dressed up to go
shopping.


Wow, for an outlet mall, no less? There is a mall we go to where
we do feel a bit like hookers at a Baptist convention, it's very
expensive and rich people do walk around expecting to be seen by
other rich people, I guess. Still, I don't dress up to go there.
Much.

nancy
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Old 10-02-2018, 04:55 PM posted to rec.food.cooking
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On 2/10/2018 11:23 AM, Nancy Young wrote:
On 2/10/2018 9:58 AM, jmcquown wrote:
On 2/10/2018 9:17 AM, Nancy Young wrote:


I've heard (well, seen) people say they miss the old days when
people got dressed up to go shopping, or worse, the airport.
Comfort is more important these days.* If I'm clean and neat,
it'll have to be good enough.


I vaguely remember those Jackie Kennedy days.


If I was Jackie Kennedy I'd dress up all the time, too, because
every day she stepped out the door there were photographers.* My idea
of hell.

Mine, too. But hey, Jackie set trends! Not that the average American
could afford those trends.

I have a drawer full of gloves my mother owned.* Long gloves for
formal occasions (Marine Corps Ball, no doubt) and short gloves for
when she was going to a luncheon. I have a couple of her old hats,
too.* I don't remember her wearing them to go shopping, though.


I came across some gloves at my mother's house, even a couple of
old hats.* I don't recall ever seeing her wear anything like that.

nancy


It's funny what mothers' hang onto. I don't know what I'm supposed to
do with these gloves or the couple of hats.

Here's a little velvet hat with a veil:

https://s13.postimg.org/3o2plj993/velvet_veil.jpg

And this thing from Woodward & Lothrop in Washington, DC. Mohair with a
rhinestone embellishment:

https://s13.postimg.org/su3nsi807/mohair.jpg

The era fits Jackie Kennedy because that's when we lived right outside
of Washington, DC. Dad was stationed at Quantico, VA and we lived in
off-base housing in Woodbridge. Mom apparently bought a couple of hats
in DC.

Jill
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Old 10-02-2018, 05:04 PM posted to rec.food.cooking
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On 2018-02-10 11:31 AM, Nancy Young wrote:
On 2/10/2018 10:07 AM, Dave Smith wrote:


People in this area tend to dress casually. There is an exception. A
couple years ago an outlet mall opened up and it attracts people from
out of town. It still surprises me to see people all dressed up to go
shopping.


Wow, for an outlet mall, no less?



Indeed. If you go to the local malls people are likely to be wearing
jeans and other casual attire. The outlet mall tends to attract a lot
of Chinese and eastern Europeans from larger cities, and they tend to
dress very nicely.

There is a mall we go to where
we do feel a bit like hookers at a Baptist convention, it's very
expensive and rich people do walk around expecting to be seen by
other rich people, I guess.* Still, I don't dress up to go there.
Much.



My wife is not much of a shopper, but she always dresses up to do it.

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Old 10-02-2018, 05:21 PM posted to rec.food.cooking
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"Nancy Young" wrote in message ...

On 2/10/2018 10:07 AM, Dave Smith wrote:
On 2018-02-10 9:17 AM, Nancy Young wrote:
I've heard (well, seen) people say they miss the old days when
people got dressed up to go shopping, or worse, the airport.
Comfort is more important these days. If I'm clean and neat,
it'll have to be good enough.


People in this area tend to dress casually. There is an exception. A
couple years ago an outlet mall opened up and it attracts people from
out of town. It still surprises me to see people all dressed up to go
shopping.


Wow, for an outlet mall, no less? There is a mall we go to where
we do feel a bit like hookers at a Baptist convention, it's very
expensive and rich people do walk around expecting to be seen by
other rich people, I guess. Still, I don't dress up to go there.
Much.

nancy

==

lol




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