"Bruce" wrote in message ...

On Wed, 31 May 2017 20:35:46 +0100, "Ophelia" >
wrote:

>"Bruce" wrote in message
.. .
>
>On Wed, 31 May 2017 19:55:56 +0100, "Ophelia" >
>wrote:
>
>>"Bruce" wrote in message
. ..
>>
>>On Wed, 31 May 2017 14:34:51 +0100, "Ophelia" >
>>wrote:
>>
>>>"Cindy Hamilton" wrote in message
...
>>>
>>>On Wednesday, May 31, 2017 at 7:07:43 AM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Pat Boone, Bing Crosby even Frank Sinatra.
>>>
>>>Depending on his backup band, Sinatra is ok.
>>>
>>>Cindy Hamilton
>>>
>>>==
>>>
>>>Not for me. I liked it all best when rock began)
>>>
>>>Who is your favourite now, both of you?
>>
>>Tom Waits. You?
>>
>>===
>>
>>Not heard him. Atm the popular music I like is Leonard Cohen)
>
>Yes, I like him too.
>
>==
>
>Sadly, he died. Have you heard his last one? Dark!

No, I haven't. So many have died recently.

==

Worth finding if you can be bothered.

--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

On 2017-05-31 4:15 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

> Good point. I listen to a lot of 40's on XM radio. Glenn Miller, Artie
> Shaw, etc. I was never a Beatles fan but I don't change the station if
> it comes on. Elvis was good, but so were many before him. There are so
> many types of music that have contributed to what Elvis drew from they
> should not be cast aside. His exposure to blues, gospel and other made
> him what he was.
>
> I like a lot of the 50's too, but I listen to some and think "did
> someone really write those silly lyrics?"

I always thought that 1950s American pop was the reason for the British
Invasion of the early 60s. There was a lot of good music in the 60s and
70s. Then there is the contemporary pop, which explains why oldies are
so popular and why there are so many classic rock stations.

On Wed, 31 May 2017 17:16:59 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

>On 2017-05-31 4:15 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>
>> Good point. I listen to a lot of 40's on XM radio. Glenn Miller, Artie
>> Shaw, etc. I was never a Beatles fan but I don't change the station if
>> it comes on. Elvis was good, but so were many before him. There are so
>> many types of music that have contributed to what Elvis drew from they
>> should not be cast aside. His exposure to blues, gospel and other made
>> him what he was.
>>
>> I like a lot of the 50's too, but I listen to some and think "did
>> someone really write those silly lyrics?"
>
>I always thought that 1950s American pop was the reason for the British
>Invasion of the early 60s. There was a lot of good music in the 60s and
>70s. Then there is the contemporary pop, which explains why oldies are
>so popular and why there are so many classic rock stations.

Dad rock stations exist because there are 50+ people, not because that
music was necessarily better than contemporary music.

On 2017-05-31 4:29 PM, Bruce wrote:

>> That's certainly your privilege, but it seems to sell short the
>> centuries of music that came before it.
>
> That sounds like we owe something to somebody. It's not that
> complicated. You hear something and you like it or you don't.
>


That only happens if you know nothing about music and it is surprising
to see how little some people know about it. In many cases they know so
little they should not be entitled to have an opinion about it. Years
ago a coworker had the radio on and commented on the song that was
playing. I remarked on the use of the acoustic guitar and he thought I
was BSing him and how did I know it was acoustic. I went a step further
and said it had nylon strings instead of steel. He thought there was no
way I could know that. Just about any guitar player could readily
distinguish an electric guitar from an acoustic, and steel strings from
nylon. Many could also identify the major makes of electric guitar by
the sound.

On Wed, 31 May 2017 17:24:21 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

>On 2017-05-31 4:29 PM, Bruce wrote:
>
>>> That's certainly your privilege, but it seems to sell short the
>>> centuries of music that came before it.
>>
>> That sounds like we owe something to somebody. It's not that
>> complicated. You hear something and you like it or you don't.
>>
>That only happens if you know nothing about music and it is surprising
>to see how little some people know about it. In many cases they know so
>little they should not be entitled to have an opinion about it. Years
>ago a coworker had the radio on and commented on the song that was
>playing. I remarked on the use of the acoustic guitar and he thought I
>was BSing him and how did I know it was acoustic. I went a step further
>and said it had nylon strings instead of steel. He thought there was no
>way I could know that. Just about any guitar player could readily
>distinguish an electric guitar from an acoustic, and steel strings from
>nylon. Many could also identify the major makes of electric guitar by
>the sound.

Each to their own. Some people know everything about cars or funnel
web spiders. I don't, but I still have an opinion about them.

On 2017-05-31 5:23 PM, Bruce wrote:
> On Wed, 31 May 2017 17:16:59 -0400, Dave Smith
> > wrote:
>
>> On 2017-05-31 4:15 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>
>>> Good point. I listen to a lot of 40's on XM radio. Glenn Miller, Artie
>>> Shaw, etc. I was never a Beatles fan but I don't change the station if
>>> it comes on. Elvis was good, but so were many before him. There are so
>>> many types of music that have contributed to what Elvis drew from they
>>> should not be cast aside. His exposure to blues, gospel and other made
>>> him what he was.
>>>
>>> I like a lot of the 50's too, but I listen to some and think "did
>>> someone really write those silly lyrics?"
>>
>> I always thought that 1950s American pop was the reason for the British
>> Invasion of the early 60s. There was a lot of good music in the 60s and
>> 70s. Then there is the contemporary pop, which explains why oldies are
>> so popular and why there are so many classic rock stations.
>
> Dad rock stations exist because there are 50+ people, not because that
> music was necessarily better than contemporary music.

It is not just the boomers listening to them. My son and all his friends
like that stuff too. There was a lot of good music in the 60s and 70s.
Things went downhill in the 80s and 90s and never really went back up.

On Wed, 31 May 2017 17:54:57 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

>On 2017-05-31 5:23 PM, Bruce wrote:
>> On Wed, 31 May 2017 17:16:59 -0400, Dave Smith
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> On 2017-05-31 4:15 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>
>>>> Good point. I listen to a lot of 40's on XM radio. Glenn Miller, Artie
>>>> Shaw, etc. I was never a Beatles fan but I don't change the station if
>>>> it comes on. Elvis was good, but so were many before him. There are so
>>>> many types of music that have contributed to what Elvis drew from they
>>>> should not be cast aside. His exposure to blues, gospel and other made
>>>> him what he was.
>>>>
>>>> I like a lot of the 50's too, but I listen to some and think "did
>>>> someone really write those silly lyrics?"
>>>
>>> I always thought that 1950s American pop was the reason for the British
>>> Invasion of the early 60s. There was a lot of good music in the 60s and
>>> 70s. Then there is the contemporary pop, which explains why oldies are
>>> so popular and why there are so many classic rock stations.
>>
>> Dad rock stations exist because there are 50+ people, not because that
>> music was necessarily better than contemporary music.
>
>It is not just the boomers listening to them. My son and all his friends
>like that stuff too. There was a lot of good music in the 60s and 70s.
>Things went downhill in the 80s and 90s and never really went back up.

Nonsense. What really happened is that you got older.

On 2017-05-31 5:27 PM, Bruce wrote:

> Each to their own. Some people know everything about cars or funnel
> web spiders. I don't, but I still have an opinion about them.

Well, opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one. However, there are
people who are qualified to have one. People who cannot sing, or cannot
play an instrument, cannot read music and cannot identify the
instruments being played cannot make a credible judgement about the
relative merits of a piece of music. That would be like someone who
cannot identify the sweet, sour, salty and bitter, or distinguish
between the flesh of a mammal or the flesh of a fish judging a meal.

On 2017-05-31 5:55 PM, Bruce wrote:
> On Wed, 31 May 2017 17:54:57 -0400, Dave Smith
> > wrote:
>
>> On 2017-05-31 5:23 PM, Bruce wrote:
>>> On Wed, 31 May 2017 17:16:59 -0400, Dave Smith
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2017-05-31 4:15 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Good point. I listen to a lot of 40's on XM radio. Glenn Miller, Artie
>>>>> Shaw, etc. I was never a Beatles fan but I don't change the station if
>>>>> it comes on. Elvis was good, but so were many before him. There are so
>>>>> many types of music that have contributed to what Elvis drew from they
>>>>> should not be cast aside. His exposure to blues, gospel and other made
>>>>> him what he was.
>>>>>
>>>>> I like a lot of the 50's too, but I listen to some and think "did
>>>>> someone really write those silly lyrics?"
>>>>
>>>> I always thought that 1950s American pop was the reason for the British
>>>> Invasion of the early 60s. There was a lot of good music in the 60s and
>>>> 70s. Then there is the contemporary pop, which explains why oldies are
>>>> so popular and why there are so many classic rock stations.
>>>
>>> Dad rock stations exist because there are 50+ people, not because that
>>> music was necessarily better than contemporary music.
>>
>> It is not just the boomers listening to them. My son and all his friends
>> like that stuff too. There was a lot of good music in the 60s and 70s.
>> Things went downhill in the 80s and 90s and never really went back up.
>
> Nonsense. What really happened is that you got older.
>

Lots of people got older. I was in my 20s during the 70s when oldies
stations started playing the music of the 50s. Those songs were only 20
years old. We aren't seeing a lot of "oldies" stations playing the music
of the 90s. The music of the 50s was bad enough but managed a retro
comeback. Music of the 80s and 90s never managed to do that.

On Wed, 31 May 2017 18:07:10 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

>On 2017-05-31 5:55 PM, Bruce wrote:
>> On Wed, 31 May 2017 17:54:57 -0400, Dave Smith
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> On 2017-05-31 5:23 PM, Bruce wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 31 May 2017 17:16:59 -0400, Dave Smith
>>>> > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I always thought that 1950s American pop was the reason for the British
>>>>> Invasion of the early 60s. There was a lot of good music in the 60s and
>>>>> 70s. Then there is the contemporary pop, which explains why oldies are
>>>>> so popular and why there are so many classic rock stations.
>>>>
>>>> Dad rock stations exist because there are 50+ people, not because that
>>>> music was necessarily better than contemporary music.
>>>
>>> It is not just the boomers listening to them. My son and all his friends
>>> like that stuff too. There was a lot of good music in the 60s and 70s.
>>> Things went downhill in the 80s and 90s and never really went back up.
>>
>> Nonsense. What really happened is that you got older.
>>
>
>Lots of people got older. I was in my 20s during the 70s when oldies
>stations started playing the music of the 50s. Those songs were only 20
>years old. We aren't seeing a lot of "oldies" stations playing the music
>of the 90s. The music of the 50s was bad enough but managed a retro
>comeback. Music of the 80s and 90s never managed to do that.

Depends what you listen to. If you listen to dad rock stations, you'll
hear dad rock.

On 2017-05-31 6:09 PM, Bruce wrote:

>> Lots of people got older. I was in my 20s during the 70s when oldies
>> stations started playing the music of the 50s. Those songs were only 20
>> years old. We aren't seeing a lot of "oldies" stations playing the music
>> of the 90s. The music of the 50s was bad enough but managed a retro
>> comeback. Music of the 80s and 90s never managed to do that.
>
> Depends what you listen to. If you listen to dad rock stations, you'll
> hear dad rock.
>

You can't hear what is not out there.

On Wed, 31 May 2017 17:59:52 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

>On 2017-05-31 5:27 PM, Bruce wrote:
>
>> Each to their own. Some people know everything about cars or funnel
>> web spiders. I don't, but I still have an opinion about them.
>
>Well, opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one. However, there are
>people who are qualified to have one. People who cannot sing, or cannot
>play an instrument, cannot read music and cannot identify the
>instruments being played cannot make a credible judgement about the
>relative merits of a piece of music. That would be like someone who
>cannot identify the sweet, sour, salty and bitter, or distinguish
>between the flesh of a mammal or the flesh of a fish judging a meal.

You eat something and you like it or not. You see something and you
like it or not. You hear something and you like it or not. Some things
are really not that complicated.

On Wed, 31 May 2017 18:11:34 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

>On 2017-05-31 6:09 PM, Bruce wrote:
>
>>> Lots of people got older. I was in my 20s during the 70s when oldies
>>> stations started playing the music of the 50s. Those songs were only 20
>>> years old. We aren't seeing a lot of "oldies" stations playing the music
>>> of the 90s. The music of the 50s was bad enough but managed a retro
>>> comeback. Music of the 80s and 90s never managed to do that.
>>
>> Depends what you listen to. If you listen to dad rock stations, you'll
>> hear dad rock.
>>
>
>You can't hear what is not out there.

Online radio playing 80s hits:

http://www.slacker.com/station/80s-hits

Enjoy.

"Cindy Hamilton" > wrote in message
...
> On Wednesday, May 31, 2017 at 12:27:23 PM UTC-4, Cheri wrote:
>> "Ophelia" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > "Cindy Hamilton" wrote in message
>> > ...
>> >
>> > On Wednesday, May 31, 2017 at 7:07:43 AM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
>> >> On Wed, 31 May 2017 03:31:35 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
>> >> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >On Tuesday, May 30, 2017 at 6:44:33 PM UTC-4, Wayne Boatwright wrote:
>> >> >> On Tue 30 May 2017 12:20:01p, Cheri told us...
>> >> >>
>> >> >> > "Cindy Hamilton" > wrote in message
>> >> >> > news:39995d27-b4cf-44bb-832c-
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> Oddly enough, I was completely unaware of the song.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> This is the one I had to live with:
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2jZVpTtYyPs>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Cindy Hamilton
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > I actually liked that song as well as this one.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gwMjiXcrHTI
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Who could resist Ricky Nelsom?
>> >> >
>> >> >Me, actually. I'm just young enough that I grew up with the
>> >> >Beatles and the Stones. A little earlier sounds like pabulum.
>> >> >Even earlier (big band) is ok. There's just that long, boring,
>> >> >postwar stretch in popular music that puts me right to sleep.
>> >>
>> >> Pat Boone, Bing Crosby even Frank Sinatra.
>> >
>> > Depending on his backup band, Sinatra is ok.
>> >
>> > Cindy Hamilton
>> >
>> > ==
>> >
>> > Not for me. I liked it all best when rock began)
>> >
>> > Who is your favourite now, both of you?
>>
>> I never could stand FS, and add Tony Bennett to that too. To me, music
>> started with Elvis and onto the British Invasion etc.
>
> That's certainly your privilege, but it seems to sell short the
> centuries of music that came before it.
>
> Cindy Hamilton


Well, that's when rock started for me, don't know much rock before then, but
liked a lot of the music that my parents listened to, just wasn't rock to
me.

Cheri

On 2017-05-31 6:17 PM, Bruce wrote:
> On Wed, 31 May 2017 18:11:34 -0400, Dave Smith
> > wrote:
>
>> On 2017-05-31 6:09 PM, Bruce wrote:
>>
>>>> Lots of people got older. I was in my 20s during the 70s when oldies
>>>> stations started playing the music of the 50s. Those songs were only 20
>>>> years old. We aren't seeing a lot of "oldies" stations playing the music
>>>> of the 90s. The music of the 50s was bad enough but managed a retro
>>>> comeback. Music of the 80s and 90s never managed to do that.
>>>
>>> Depends what you listen to. If you listen to dad rock stations, you'll
>>> hear dad rock.
>>>
>>
>> You can't hear what is not out there.
>
> Online radio playing 80s hits:
>
> http://www.slacker.com/station/80s-hits
>
> Enjoy.
>
I didn't say there would not be any. I can surf the radio and get lots
of oldies and classic rock stations.

"Bruce" > wrote in message
...

> You eat something and you like it or not. You see something and you
> like it or not. You hear something and you like it or not. Some things
> are really not that complicated.


+10,000, it ain't rocket science.

Cheri

On 5/31/2017 5:59 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
> On 2017-05-31 5:27 PM, Bruce wrote:
>
>> Each to their own. Some people know everything about cars or funnel
>> web spiders. I don't, but I still have an opinion about them.
>
> Well, opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one. However, there are
> people who are qualified to have one. People who cannot sing, or cannot
> play an instrument, cannot read music and cannot identify the
> instruments being played cannot make a credible judgement about the
> relative merits of a piece of music. That would be like someone who
> cannot identify the sweet, sour, salty and bitter, or distinguish
> between the flesh of a mammal or the flesh of a fish judging a meal.
>
>

I match the first three of your criteria. The fact that I cannot sing
has little to do with my ability to like or dislike certain music. I do
know where middle c is on a piano but I cannot tell the difference
listening if is played on a Steinway or Fazioli. But I do know I like
Edvard Greig's piano concerto.

"Cheri" wrote in message news
"Bruce" > wrote in message
...

> You eat something and you like it or not. You see something and you
> like it or not. You hear something and you like it or not. Some things
> are really not that complicated.


+10,000, it ain't rocket science.

Cheri

==

Absolutely



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

On Wednesday, May 31, 2017 at 11:16:30 AM UTC-10, Dave Smith wrote:
> On 2017-05-31 4:15 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>
> > Good point. I listen to a lot of 40's on XM radio. Glenn Miller, Artie
> > Shaw, etc. I was never a Beatles fan but I don't change the station if
> > it comes on. Elvis was good, but so were many before him. There are so
> > many types of music that have contributed to what Elvis drew from they
> > should not be cast aside. His exposure to blues, gospel and other made
> > him what he was.
> >
> > I like a lot of the 50's too, but I listen to some and think "did
> > someone really write those silly lyrics?"
>
> I always thought that 1950s American pop was the reason for the British
> Invasion of the early 60s. There was a lot of good music in the 60s and
> 70s. Then there is the contemporary pop, which explains why oldies are
> so popular and why there are so many classic rock stations.

The Brits put their spin on some of the American music they heard. The blues mainly. That really resonated with them. Having white Brits playing/singing these tunes instead of black cats made it marketable in the US.

OTOH, The Beatles' Sargent Pepper's Album and all the others of that ilk that followed would not have come to being if not for Brian Wilson's Pet Sounds. Well, that's what they say anyway.

On Thu, 1 Jun 2017 02:33:23 -0700 (PDT), dsi1 >
wrote:

>On Wednesday, May 31, 2017 at 11:16:30 AM UTC-10, Dave Smith wrote:

>> I always thought that 1950s American pop was the reason for the British
>> Invasion of the early 60s. There was a lot of good music in the 60s and
>> 70s. Then there is the contemporary pop, which explains why oldies are
>> so popular and why there are so many classic rock stations.
>
>The Brits put their spin on some of the American music they heard. The blues
>mainly. That really resonated with them. Having white Brits
>playing/singing these tunes instead of black cats made it marketable
>in the US.

Nothing against British music from those days, Beatles, Stones, etc,
but I always find it a bit weird when white English guys start singing
blues and feel they're doing something authentic.

>OTOH, The Beatles' Sargent Pepper's Album and all the others of that ilk that followed would not have come to being if not for Brian Wilson's Pet Sounds. Well, that's what they say anyway.

I've never liked Pet Sounds nor do I see how that led to the Beatles.
Each to their own, of course.

On Wednesday, May 31, 2017 at 6:16:15 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
> On Wed, 31 May 2017 17:59:52 -0400, Dave Smith
> > wrote:
>
> >On 2017-05-31 5:27 PM, Bruce wrote:
> >
> >> Each to their own. Some people know everything about cars or funnel
> >> web spiders. I don't, but I still have an opinion about them.
> >
> >Well, opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one. However, there are
> >people who are qualified to have one. People who cannot sing, or cannot
> >play an instrument, cannot read music and cannot identify the
> >instruments being played cannot make a credible judgement about the
> >relative merits of a piece of music. That would be like someone who
> >cannot identify the sweet, sour, salty and bitter, or distinguish
> >between the flesh of a mammal or the flesh of a fish judging a meal.
>
> You eat something and you like it or not. You see something and you
> like it or not. You hear something and you like it or not. Some things
> are really not that complicated.

Sure. If you're unsophisticated in your tastes. Having knowledge,
whether it is music or food, increases my enjoyment. Isn't it better
to marvel over the perfect text painting in Handel's "For Unto Us a
Child Is Born" rather than to sit there like the dog in the Victrola
advertising:

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_Master%27s_Voice>

Cindy Hamilton

On Thu, 1 Jun 2017 03:46:25 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> wrote:

>On Wednesday, May 31, 2017 at 6:16:15 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
>> On Wed, 31 May 2017 17:59:52 -0400, Dave Smith
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >Well, opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one. However, there are
>> >people who are qualified to have one. People who cannot sing, or cannot
>> >play an instrument, cannot read music and cannot identify the
>> >instruments being played cannot make a credible judgement about the
>> >relative merits of a piece of music. That would be like someone who
>> >cannot identify the sweet, sour, salty and bitter, or distinguish
>> >between the flesh of a mammal or the flesh of a fish judging a meal.
>>
>> You eat something and you like it or not. You see something and you
>> like it or not. You hear something and you like it or not. Some things
>> are really not that complicated.
>
>Sure. If you're unsophisticated in your tastes. Having knowledge,
>whether it is music or food, increases my enjoyment. Isn't it better
>to marvel over the perfect text painting in Handel's "For Unto Us a
>Child Is Born" rather than to sit there like the dog in the Victrola
>advertising:
>
><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_Master%27s_Voice>

I can enjoy music without knowing exactly who plays which instrument,
that this instrument was first played at he court of Louis XIV and
which Cro Magnon man or woman was the first to turn a stick into a
flute. If I like it, I like it. If you're an expert on these matters,
good for you. Enjoy your sophistication.

On 2017-06-01 5:33 AM, dsi1 wrote:
> On Wednesday, May 31, 2017 at 11:16:30 AM UTC-10, Dave Smith wrote:
>> On 2017-05-31 4:15 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>
>>> Good point. I listen to a lot of 40's on XM radio. Glenn Miller, Artie
>>> Shaw, etc. I was never a Beatles fan but I don't change the station if
>>> it comes on. Elvis was good, but so were many before him. There are so
>>> many types of music that have contributed to what Elvis drew from they
>>> should not be cast aside. His exposure to blues, gospel and other made
>>> him what he was.
>>>
>>> I like a lot of the 50's too, but I listen to some and think "did
>>> someone really write those silly lyrics?"
>>
>> I always thought that 1950s American pop was the reason for the British
>> Invasion of the early 60s. There was a lot of good music in the 60s and
>> 70s. Then there is the contemporary pop, which explains why oldies are
>> so popular and why there are so many classic rock stations.
>
> The Brits put their spin on some of the American music they heard. The blues mainly. That really resonated with them. Having white Brits playing/singing these tunes instead of black cats made it marketable in the US.

There is no doubt that the Beatles, the Rolling Stones and a few other
British bands were influenced by American music, but it was mostly what
was associated with black Americans, the stuff that white Americans were
not listening to.
>
> OTOH, The Beatles' Sargent Pepper's Album and all the others of that ilk that followed would not have come to being if not for Brian Wilson's Pet Sounds. Well, that's what they say anyway.
>

Really? It is more likely the other way around.
>

On Thursday, June 1, 2017 at 7:13:50 AM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
> On Thu, 1 Jun 2017 03:46:25 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> > wrote:
>
> >On Wednesday, May 31, 2017 at 6:16:15 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
> >> On Wed, 31 May 2017 17:59:52 -0400, Dave Smith
> >> > wrote:
> >>
> >> >Well, opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one. However, there are
> >> >people who are qualified to have one. People who cannot sing, or cannot
> >> >play an instrument, cannot read music and cannot identify the
> >> >instruments being played cannot make a credible judgement about the
> >> >relative merits of a piece of music. That would be like someone who
> >> >cannot identify the sweet, sour, salty and bitter, or distinguish
> >> >between the flesh of a mammal or the flesh of a fish judging a meal.
> >>
> >> You eat something and you like it or not. You see something and you
> >> like it or not. You hear something and you like it or not. Some things
> >> are really not that complicated.
> >
> >Sure. If you're unsophisticated in your tastes. Having knowledge,
> >whether it is music or food, increases my enjoyment. Isn't it better
> >to marvel over the perfect text painting in Handel's "For Unto Us a
> >Child Is Born" rather than to sit there like the dog in the Victrola
> >advertising:
> >
> ><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_Master%27s_Voice>
>
> I can enjoy music without knowing exactly who plays which instrument,
> that this instrument was first played at he court of Louis XIV and
> which Cro Magnon man or woman was the first to turn a stick into a
> flute. If I like it, I like it. If you're an expert on these matters,
> good for you. Enjoy your sophistication.

Let's turn this back to food. You can simply eat a dish and enjoy
it, or you can really dig into the tastes and textures and say
"Was that just a hint of dill? Nice." Or "I love how the creamy
sauce complements the crisp vegetables".

Cindy Hamilton

On 2017-06-01 9:59 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> On Thursday, June 1, 2017 at 7:13:50 AM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
>> On Thu, 1 Jun 2017 03:46:25 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> On Wednesday, May 31, 2017 at 6:16:15 PM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 31 May 2017 17:59:52 -0400, Dave Smith
>>>> > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Well, opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one. However, there are
>>>>> people who are qualified to have one. People who cannot sing, or cannot
>>>>> play an instrument, cannot read music and cannot identify the
>>>>> instruments being played cannot make a credible judgement about the
>>>>> relative merits of a piece of music. That would be like someone who
>>>>> cannot identify the sweet, sour, salty and bitter, or distinguish
>>>>> between the flesh of a mammal or the flesh of a fish judging a meal.
>>>>
>>>> You eat something and you like it or not. You see something and you
>>>> like it or not. You hear something and you like it or not. Some things
>>>> are really not that complicated.
>>>
>>> Sure. If you're unsophisticated in your tastes. Having knowledge,
>>> whether it is music or food, increases my enjoyment. Isn't it better
>>> to marvel over the perfect text painting in Handel's "For Unto Us a
>>> Child Is Born" rather than to sit there like the dog in the Victrola
>>> advertising:
>>>
>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_Master%27s_Voice>
>>
>> I can enjoy music without knowing exactly who plays which instrument,
>> that this instrument was first played at he court of Louis XIV and
>> which Cro Magnon man or woman was the first to turn a stick into a
>> flute. If I like it, I like it. If you're an expert on these matters,
>> good for you. Enjoy your sophistication.
>
> Let's turn this back to food. You can simply eat a dish and enjoy
> it, or you can really dig into the tastes and textures and say
> "Was that just a hint of dill? Nice." Or "I love how the creamy
> sauce complements the crisp vegetables".


I can appreciate that most people don't like everything and most can
describe what it is that they object to. Then there are those picky
eaters who just don't like something. I have a nephew who doesn't like
much. It is a pain in the butt to have him come for supper because there
are so few things he likes and he is so vocal about the things he does
not want, sort of like you might expect from a four year old, except he
is 44. He likes pizza, which is a major exception from one of his big
taboos, which is food that is red. Then there was a former co-worker who
didn't like much and could only describe his dislikes as being yucky.
People like that are not entitled to offer an opinion.

On 5/31/2017 8:43 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On 5/31/2017 5:59 PM, Dave Smith wrote:

>> Well, opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one. However, there
>> are people who are qualified to have one. People who cannot sing, or
>> cannot play an instrument, cannot read music and cannot identify the
>> instruments being played cannot make a credible judgement about the
>> relative merits of a piece of music. That would be like someone who
>> cannot identify the sweet, sour, salty and bitter, or distinguish
>> between the flesh of a mammal or the flesh of a fish judging a meal.
>>
>>
>
> I match the first three of your criteria. The fact that I cannot sing
> has little to do with my ability to like or dislike certain music. I do
> know where middle c is on a piano but I cannot tell the difference
> listening if is played on a Steinway or Fazioli. But I do know I like
> Edvard Greig's piano concerto.

I can't carve marble but I appreciate David. Can't play an instrument
so I don't know good music? That doesn't make sense.

nancy

On 6/1/2017 10:20 AM, Nancy Young wrote:
> On 5/31/2017 8:43 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>> On 5/31/2017 5:59 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>
>>> Well, opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one. However, there
>>> are people who are qualified to have one. People who cannot sing, or
>>> cannot play an instrument, cannot read music and cannot identify the
>>> instruments being played cannot make a credible judgement about the
>>> relative merits of a piece of music. That would be like someone who
>>> cannot identify the sweet, sour, salty and bitter, or distinguish
>>> between the flesh of a mammal or the flesh of a fish judging a meal.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> I match the first three of your criteria. The fact that I cannot sing
>> has little to do with my ability to like or dislike certain music. I
>> do know where middle c is on a piano but I cannot tell the difference
>> listening if is played on a Steinway or Fazioli. But I do know I like
>> Edvard Greig's piano concerto.
>
> I can't carve marble but I appreciate David. Can't play an instrument
> so I don't know good music? That doesn't make sense.
>
> nancy
>

Mikey did some nice work.
There is an updated version
https://www.thisiswhyimbroke.com/obese-statue-of-david/

On 2017-06-01 10:20 AM, Nancy Young wrote:
> On 5/31/2017 8:43 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>> On 5/31/2017 5:59 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>
>>> Well, opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one. However, there
>>> are people who are qualified to have one. People who cannot sing, or
>>> cannot play an instrument, cannot read music and cannot identify the
>>> instruments being played cannot make a credible judgement about the
>>> relative merits of a piece of music. That would be like someone who
>>> cannot identify the sweet, sour, salty and bitter, or distinguish
>>> between the flesh of a mammal or the flesh of a fish judging a meal.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> I match the first three of your criteria. The fact that I cannot sing
>> has little to do with my ability to like or dislike certain music. I
>> do know where middle c is on a piano but I cannot tell the difference
>> listening if is played on a Steinway or Fazioli. But I do know I like
>> Edvard Greig's piano concerto.
>
> I can't carve marble but I appreciate David. Can't play an instrument
> so I don't know good music? That doesn't make sense.
>


Does it make more sense if you deal with it the way I wrote it.... being
able to make a credible judgement about the relative merits.

On 6/1/2017 12:44 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
> On 2017-06-01 10:20 AM, Nancy Young wrote:
>> On 5/31/2017 8:43 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>> On 5/31/2017 5:59 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>>
>>>> Well, opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one. However, there
>>>> are people who are qualified to have one. People who cannot sing, or
>>>> cannot play an instrument, cannot read music and cannot identify the
>>>> instruments being played cannot make a credible judgement about the
>>>> relative merits of a piece of music. That would be like someone who
>>>> cannot identify the sweet, sour, salty and bitter, or distinguish
>>>> between the flesh of a mammal or the flesh of a fish judging a meal.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> I match the first three of your criteria. The fact that I cannot
>>> sing has little to do with my ability to like or dislike certain
>>> music. I do know where middle c is on a piano but I cannot tell the
>>> difference listening if is played on a Steinway or Fazioli. But I do
>>> know I like Edvard Greig's piano concerto.
>>
>> I can't carve marble but I appreciate David. Can't play an instrument
>> so I don't know good music? That doesn't make sense.
>>
>
>
> Does it make more sense if you deal with it the way I wrote it.... being
> able to make a credible judgement about the relative merits.

Because it sounds like a bunch of hooey meant to make some people
feel superior.

I can tell an acoustic guitar if it helps.

nancy

On Thursday, June 1, 2017 at 9:13:59 AM UTC-5, Dave Smith wrote:
>
> I can appreciate that most people don't like everything and most can
> describe what it is that they object to. Then there are those picky
> eaters who just don't like something. I have a nephew who doesn't like
> much. It is a pain in the butt to have him come for supper because there
> are so few things he likes and he is so vocal about the things he does
> not want, sort of like you might expect from a four year old, except he
> is 44. He likes pizza, which is a major exception from one of his big
> taboos, which is food that is red. Then there was a former co-worker who
> didn't like much and could only describe his dislikes as being yucky.
> People like that are not entitled to offer an opinion.
>
>
I wouldn't invite him to supper and if you insist on having him
at the table tell him to bring his own food. I simply would not
cater to him and his silly whims.

On 6/1/2017 12:42 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On 6/1/2017 10:20 AM, Nancy Young wrote:

>> I can't carve marble but I appreciate David. Can't play an instrument
>> so I don't know good music? That doesn't make sense.

> Mikey did some nice work.
> There is an updated version
> https://www.thisiswhyimbroke.com/obese-statue-of-david/

(laugh) David should lay off the tiramisu.

nancy

On 2017-06-01 12:59 PM, Nancy Young wrote:
> On 6/1/2017 12:44 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>> On 2017-06-01 10:20 AM, Nancy Young wrote:
>>> On 5/31/2017 8:43 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>> On 5/31/2017 5:59 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>>>
>>>>> Well, opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one. However, there
>>>>> are people who are qualified to have one. People who cannot sing,
>>>>> or cannot play an instrument, cannot read music and cannot identify
>>>>> the instruments being played cannot make a credible judgement about
>>>>> the relative merits of a piece of music. That would be like
>>>>> someone who cannot identify the sweet, sour, salty and bitter, or
>>>>> distinguish between the flesh of a mammal or the flesh of a fish
>>>>> judging a meal.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I match the first three of your criteria. The fact that I cannot
>>>> sing has little to do with my ability to like or dislike certain
>>>> music. I do know where middle c is on a piano but I cannot tell the
>>>> difference listening if is played on a Steinway or Fazioli. But I
>>>> do know I like Edvard Greig's piano concerto.
>>>
>>> I can't carve marble but I appreciate David. Can't play an instrument
>>> so I don't know good music? That doesn't make sense.
>>>
>>
>>
>> Does it make more sense if you deal with it the way I wrote it....
>> being able to make a credible judgement about the relative merits.
>
> Because it sounds like a bunch of hooey meant to make some people
> feel superior.

It's one thing to like or dislike something, but there should be good
reasons for it. I remember the words of advice my first year English
professor.... Don't say something is bullshit. Say it is bullshit and
give at least three good reasons why it is bullshit.



> I can tell an acoustic guitar if it helps.
>

On 6/1/2017 12:59 PM, Nancy Young wrote:
> On 6/1/2017 12:44 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>> On 2017-06-01 10:20 AM, Nancy Young wrote:
>>> On 5/31/2017 8:43 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>> On 5/31/2017 5:59 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>>>
>>>>> Well, opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one. However, there
>>>>> are people who are qualified to have one. People who cannot sing,
>>>>> or cannot play an instrument, cannot read music and cannot identify
>>>>> the instruments being played cannot make a credible judgement about
>>>>> the relative merits of a piece of music. That would be like
>>>>> someone who cannot identify the sweet, sour, salty and bitter, or
>>>>> distinguish between the flesh of a mammal or the flesh of a fish
>>>>> judging a meal.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I match the first three of your criteria. The fact that I cannot
>>>> sing has little to do with my ability to like or dislike certain
>>>> music. I do know where middle c is on a piano but I cannot tell the
>>>> difference listening if is played on a Steinway or Fazioli. But I
>>>> do know I like Edvard Greig's piano concerto.
>>>
>>> I can't carve marble but I appreciate David. Can't play an instrument
>>> so I don't know good music? That doesn't make sense.
>>>
>>
>>
>> Does it make more sense if you deal with it the way I wrote it....
>> being able to make a credible judgement about the relative merits.
>
> Because it sounds like a bunch of hooey meant to make some people
> feel superior.
>
> I can tell an acoustic guitar if it helps.
>
> nancy

It is not that hard. I'm a classically trained musician so I know. I
played the triangle in the Kindergarten show we put on. Experience counts.

"Ed Pawlowski" > wrote in message
...
> On 6/1/2017 12:59 PM, Nancy Young wrote:
>> On 6/1/2017 12:44 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>>> On 2017-06-01 10:20 AM, Nancy Young wrote:
>>>> On 5/31/2017 8:43 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>>> On 5/31/2017 5:59 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> Well, opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one. However, there
>>>>>> are people who are qualified to have one. People who cannot sing, or
>>>>>> cannot play an instrument, cannot read music and cannot identify the
>>>>>> instruments being played cannot make a credible judgement about the
>>>>>> relative merits of a piece of music. That would be like someone who
>>>>>> cannot identify the sweet, sour, salty and bitter, or distinguish
>>>>>> between the flesh of a mammal or the flesh of a fish judging a meal.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I match the first three of your criteria. The fact that I cannot sing
>>>>> has little to do with my ability to like or dislike certain music. I
>>>>> do know where middle c is on a piano but I cannot tell the difference
>>>>> listening if is played on a Steinway or Fazioli. But I do know I like
>>>>> Edvard Greig's piano concerto.
>>>>
>>>> I can't carve marble but I appreciate David. Can't play an instrument
>>>> so I don't know good music? That doesn't make sense.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Does it make more sense if you deal with it the way I wrote it.... being
>>> able to make a credible judgement about the relative merits.
>>
>> Because it sounds like a bunch of hooey meant to make some people
>> feel superior.
>>
>> I can tell an acoustic guitar if it helps.
>>
>> nancy
>
> It is not that hard. I'm a classically trained musician so I know. I
> played the triangle in the Kindergarten show we put on. Experience
> counts.


LOL

On 6/1/2017 1:36 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On 6/1/2017 12:59 PM, Nancy Young wrote:

>> I can tell an acoustic guitar if it helps.

> It is not that hard. I'm a classically trained musician so I know. I
> played the triangle in the Kindergarten show we put on. Experience counts.

(laugh) Hey, I play the radio, so there's that.

nancy

On Thursday, June 1, 2017 at 3:23:03 AM UTC-10, Dave Smith wrote:
> On 2017-06-01 5:33 AM, dsi1 wrote:
> > On Wednesday, May 31, 2017 at 11:16:30 AM UTC-10, Dave Smith wrote:
> >> On 2017-05-31 4:15 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> >>
> >>> Good point. I listen to a lot of 40's on XM radio. Glenn Miller, Artie
> >>> Shaw, etc. I was never a Beatles fan but I don't change the station if
> >>> it comes on. Elvis was good, but so were many before him. There are so
> >>> many types of music that have contributed to what Elvis drew from they
> >>> should not be cast aside. His exposure to blues, gospel and other made
> >>> him what he was.
> >>>
> >>> I like a lot of the 50's too, but I listen to some and think "did
> >>> someone really write those silly lyrics?"
> >>
> >> I always thought that 1950s American pop was the reason for the British
> >> Invasion of the early 60s. There was a lot of good music in the 60s and
> >> 70s. Then there is the contemporary pop, which explains why oldies are
> >> so popular and why there are so many classic rock stations.
> >
> > The Brits put their spin on some of the American music they heard. The blues mainly. That really resonated with them. Having white Brits playing/singing these tunes instead of black cats made it marketable in the US.
>
> There is no doubt that the Beatles, the Rolling Stones and a few other
> British bands were influenced by American music, but it was mostly what
> was associated with black Americans, the stuff that white Americans were
> not listening to.
> >
> > OTOH, The Beatles' Sargent Pepper's Album and all the others of that ilk that followed would not have come to being if not for Brian Wilson's Pet Sounds. Well, that's what they say anyway.
> >
>
> Really? It is more likely the other way around.
> >

15. According to Beatles producer George Martin, "Without Pet Sounds, Sgt. Pepper never would have happened....Pepper was an attempt to equal Pet Sounds."

http://mentalfloss.com/article/59457...out-pet-sounds

On Thu, 1 Jun 2017 09:59:34 -0700 (PDT), "
> wrote:

>On Thursday, June 1, 2017 at 9:13:59 AM UTC-5, Dave Smith wrote:
>>
>> I can appreciate that most people don't like everything and most can
>> describe what it is that they object to. Then there are those picky
>> eaters who just don't like something. I have a nephew who doesn't like
>> much. It is a pain in the butt to have him come for supper because there
>> are so few things he likes and he is so vocal about the things he does
>> not want, sort of like you might expect from a four year old, except he
>> is 44. He likes pizza, which is a major exception from one of his big
>> taboos, which is food that is red. Then there was a former co-worker who
>> didn't like much and could only describe his dislikes as being yucky.
>> People like that are not entitled to offer an opinion.
>>
>>
>I wouldn't invite him to supper and if you insist on having him
>at the table tell him to bring his own food. I simply would not
>cater to him and his silly whims.

What is with the red food thing, like all red things taste the same?

People who reject all sorts of food outright have often never even
ventured to try some of their stated dislikes.

I have one grandson who dislikes most vegetables if they are cooked. I
just put them on his plate raw as I am preparing the vegetables. He
likes them raw and I am OK with that, although I have tempted him into
eating lovely little sweet baby carrots just cooked. OTOH I have two
little granddaughters that hardly reject anything. THeir mother has
done a great job of introducing a wide variety of foods despite not
being a very inspired cook. If they reject something I know they have
tried it and it is a real dislike.

JB

On 2017-06-01 12:59 PM, wrote:
> On Thursday, June 1, 2017 at 9:13:59 AM UTC-5, Dave Smith wrote:
>>
>> I can appreciate that most people don't like everything and most can
>> describe what it is that they object to. Then there are those picky
>> eaters who just don't like something. I have a nephew who doesn't like
>> much. It is a pain in the butt to have him come for supper because there
>> are so few things he likes and he is so vocal about the things he does
>> not want, sort of like you might expect from a four year old, except he
>> is 44. He likes pizza, which is a major exception from one of his big
>> taboos, which is food that is red. Then there was a former co-worker who
>> didn't like much and could only describe his dislikes as being yucky.
>> People like that are not entitled to offer an opinion.
>>
>>
> I wouldn't invite him to supper and if you insist on having him
> at the table tell him to bring his own food. I simply would not
> cater to him and his silly whims

The last time he was her with his parents we told them to bring
something to eat. That was a slight improvement, but it was about 4
years ago and he has not been invited back. His parents seemed to be
under the impression that any invitation would naturally include the 40
year old who lives in their basement.

On Thursday, June 1, 2017 at 10:11:15 PM UTC-5, Dave Smith wrote:
>
> On 2017-06-01 12:59 PM, wrote:
> >
> > I wouldn't invite him to supper and if you insist on having him
> > at the table tell him to bring his own food. I simply would not
> > cater to him and his silly whims
>
> The last time he was her with his parents we told them to bring
> something to eat. That was a slight improvement, but it was about 4
> years ago and he has not been invited back. His parents seemed to be
> under the impression that any invitation would naturally include the 40
> year old who lives in their basement.
>
>
Mommy has probably catered to him since the day he popped out and
both probably still think of him as a pre-teen. Thus he shows up
at all dinner invitations.

On 2017-06-02 12:25 AM, Wayne Boatwright wrote:
> On Thu 01 Jun 2017 08:11:11p, Dave Smith told us...

>> The last time he was her with his parents we told them to bring
>> something to eat. That was a slight improvement, but it was about
>> 4 years ago and he has not been invited back. His parents seemed
>> to be under the impression that any invitation would naturally
>> include the 40 year old who lives in their basement.
>
> We have a very small but congenial circle friends that we get
> together with occasionally, either at someone's home or at a
> restaurant. I know that some may have an issue with certain foods
> but they would never mention it, nor would I. If we're serving a
> meal, we choose what will be served. If someone chooses not to eat
> something, that's fine. Nothing is said. I often use chocolate in
> some of the desserts I make and one friend cannot eat chocolate for
> dietary reasons. In that particular case I make sure that I have an
> individual non-chocolate dessert for him. Even if I didn't consider
> that, he would never feel slighted.
>
> OTOH, my partner David is very picky and has a very limited range of
> foods that he will eat. However, he never makes an issue of what is
> served when there is a group of people. At home with just the two of
> us I have always cooked either something we both like, or I will make
> two different meals so that we each get what we want. We've done
> that for 25 years. :-)
>
> If I knew someone like your nephew, I would absolutely never invite
> them. It's just plain rude of people like that.

There are somethings that I am not crazy about and some foods that
bother me. The list is short, and I usually try a little to be polite.
I have posted before about the time he was here for Christmas and we had
more than a dozen choices for dessert. Between me, my mother and his
mother there were was Christmas pudding, several types of cookies,
squares, biscuits, tarts, cakes and a fruit platter. He stood there
whined there was nothing he liked. Everyone else tried just about
everything. I is disappointing to go to the effort to make sure there is
something for everyone, but to have a grown man pouting about us not
being able to appease his peculiar tastes is infuriating.

He was invited back at my wife's insistence. Apparently you cannot have
a family Christmas dinner and not include one person. However, the
parents were told to bring something for him to eat.