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Default Who Was It That Recently Asked About A Hot Water Heater -- I'm In Hot Water!



"S Viemeister" > wrote in message
...
> On 3/15/2013 5:46 AM, Ophelia wrote:
>> "dsi1" > wrote
>>> On 3/14/2013 12:35 PM, Ophelia wrote:
>>>> Our unit looks exactly the same as the one Sheldon posted, and of
>>>> course
>>>> does both central heating and hot water
>>>>
>>> My step-mother said that the houses in her town (Gothenburg?) was
>>> heated by water coming in from a hot water factory and distributed by
>>> underground pipes. That was the nuttiest thing that I ever heard.
>>> Those Swedes!

>>
>> I saw that in Lincoln (UK)! About 30 years ago, a woman I knew moved
>> into a house on a new estate and all the houses were served by a central
>> boiler Never heard of it since though and I haven't been there for
>> many years, so I don't know if it is still in operation.
>>

> A place I stayed in central Reykyavik had radiators heated by volcanic hot
> water...


Cool ... er... or maybe ... not cool iyswim )

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Default Who Was It That Recently Asked About A Hot Water Heater -- I'm In Hot Water!


"dsi1" > wrote in message
...
> On 3/14/2013 12:35 PM, Ophelia wrote:
>>
>> Our unit looks exactly the same as the one Sheldon posted, and of course
>> does both central heating and hot water
>>

>
> My step-mother said that the houses in her town (Gothenburg?) was heated
> by water coming in from a hot water factory and distributed by underground
> pipes. That was the nuttiest thing that I ever heard. Those Swedes!


It is common in big cities like New York and Philadelphia to have steam heat
supplied by a central location. This is usually done for the large
commercial buildings down town. not for residential units. Steam can be
piped fairly long distance with high pressure and a high concentration of
energy per cubic foot compared to water. Many high rise building use
steam for that reason.

The highest temperature you can move water is 212 degrees. Steam, however
can be moved at temperatures exceeding 500 degrees. Then piped through
pressure regulators at the point of use to a lower temperature.


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Default Who Was It That Recently Asked About A Hot Water Heater -- I'm In Hot Water!


"sf" > wrote in message
>> You can add a circulation pump to a traditional standing water heater
>> tank. It's actually a very easy DIY. More difficult plumber job for the
>> tankless. The pump is installed under a sink furtherest from the tank.
>> You need an electrical source. It has a thermostat and when water in
>> the line cools it pulls hot water from the tank and pushes the cooled
>> water through the cold side back to the tank. I have had one before and
>> it works well.. not this brand though.
>>
>> http://tinyurl.com/bnrvhdd
>>

> I looked it up immediately after I posted and found this one
> http://www.rewci.com/whhohotwaci.html Looks like a great idea and not
> expensive at all. I wonder why they aren't touted more?
>


That is a very interesting system. Used to be, you needed a return line and
it was a fairly expensive installation. This setup eliminates that.

The need also varies with the layout of the house. My hot water is located
fairly close to both bathrooms and kitchen so I don't see the need. In a
house that is very long and utilities at the far end, it can be a long wait
for the hot water. and perhaps can be justified.


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Default Who Was It That Recently Asked About A Hot Water Heater -- I'm In Hot Water!

On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 09:49:49 -0400, "Ed Pawlowski" >
wrote:

> Units that make both hot water for domestic use and are combined with the
> heating water are boilers.


That's my point. Stand alone water heaters are called water heaters,
they may have a boiler inside them but they are not called boilers by
the public. Not interested in what plumbers and engineers call them.

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Default Who Was It That Recently Asked About A Hot Water Heater -- I'mIn Hot Water!

On 3/15/2013 10:12 AM, Ophelia wrote:
> "S Viemeister" > wrote
>> On 3/15/2013 5:46 AM, Ophelia wrote:
>>> "dsi1" > wrote
>>>> On 3/14/2013 12:35 PM, Ophelia wrote:
>>>>> Our unit looks exactly the same as the one Sheldon posted, and of
>>>>> course does both central heating and hot water
>>>> My step-mother said that the houses in her town (Gothenburg?) was
>>>> heated by water coming in from a hot water factory and distributed by
>>>> underground pipes. That was the nuttiest thing that I ever heard.
>>> I saw that in Lincoln (UK)! About 30 years ago, a woman I knew moved
>>> into a house on a new estate and all the houses were served by a central
>>> boiler Never heard of it since though and I haven't been there for
>>> many years, so I don't know if it is still in operation.
>>>

>> A place I stayed in central Reykyavik had radiators heated by volcanic
>> hot water...

>
> Cool ... er... or maybe ... not cool iyswim )
>

Warm and cosy in the middle of January!


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Default Who Was It That Recently Asked About A Hot Water Heater -- I'm In Hot Water!



"S Viemeister" > wrote in message
...
> On 3/15/2013 10:12 AM, Ophelia wrote:
>> "S Viemeister" > wrote
>>> On 3/15/2013 5:46 AM, Ophelia wrote:
>>>> "dsi1" > wrote
>>>>> On 3/14/2013 12:35 PM, Ophelia wrote:
>>>>>> Our unit looks exactly the same as the one Sheldon posted, and of
>>>>>> course does both central heating and hot water
>>>>> My step-mother said that the houses in her town (Gothenburg?) was
>>>>> heated by water coming in from a hot water factory and distributed by
>>>>> underground pipes. That was the nuttiest thing that I ever heard.
>>>> I saw that in Lincoln (UK)! About 30 years ago, a woman I knew moved
>>>> into a house on a new estate and all the houses were served by a
>>>> central
>>>> boiler Never heard of it since though and I haven't been there for
>>>> many years, so I don't know if it is still in operation.
>>>>
>>> A place I stayed in central Reykyavik had radiators heated by volcanic
>>> hot water...

>>
>> Cool ... er... or maybe ... not cool iyswim )
>>

> Warm and cosy in the middle of January!


)))

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Default Who Was It That Recently Asked About A Hot Water Heater -- I'mIn Hot Water!

On 3/14/2013 11:46 PM, Ophelia wrote:
>
>
> "dsi1" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On 3/14/2013 12:35 PM, Ophelia wrote:
>>>
>>> Our unit looks exactly the same as the one Sheldon posted, and of course
>>> does both central heating and hot water
>>>

>>
>> My step-mother said that the houses in her town (Gothenburg?) was
>> heated by water coming in from a hot water factory and distributed by
>> underground pipes. That was the nuttiest thing that I ever heard.
>> Those Swedes!

>
> I saw that in Lincoln (UK)! About 30 years ago, a woman I knew moved
> into a house on a new estate and all the houses were served by a central
> boiler Never heard of it since though and I haven't been there for
> many years, so I don't know if it is still in operation.
>


I live in the tropics and the homes here don't have any provisions for
heating so I'm pretty ignorant on the subject. I would like to see one
of those old fashioned heater. That would be cool. I've only seen them
in movies with Humphrey Bogart or the 3 Stooges. :-)
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"dsi1" > wrote in message
...
> On 3/14/2013 11:46 PM, Ophelia wrote:
>>
>>
>> "dsi1" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> On 3/14/2013 12:35 PM, Ophelia wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Our unit looks exactly the same as the one Sheldon posted, and of
>>>> course
>>>> does both central heating and hot water
>>>>
>>>
>>> My step-mother said that the houses in her town (Gothenburg?) was
>>> heated by water coming in from a hot water factory and distributed by
>>> underground pipes. That was the nuttiest thing that I ever heard.
>>> Those Swedes!

>>
>> I saw that in Lincoln (UK)! About 30 years ago, a woman I knew moved
>> into a house on a new estate and all the houses were served by a central
>> boiler Never heard of it since though and I haven't been there for
>> many years, so I don't know if it is still in operation.
>>

>
> I live in the tropics and the homes here don't have any provisions for
> heating so I'm pretty ignorant on the subject. I would like to see one of
> those old fashioned heater. That would be cool. I've only seen them in
> movies with Humphrey Bogart or the 3 Stooges. :-)


Which kind of heaters to you mean?

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Default Who Was It That Recently Asked About A Hot Water Heater -- I'mIn Hot Water!

On 3/15/2013 4:27 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> "dsi1" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On 3/14/2013 12:35 PM, Ophelia wrote:
>>>
>>> Our unit looks exactly the same as the one Sheldon posted, and of course
>>> does both central heating and hot water
>>>

>>
>> My step-mother said that the houses in her town (Gothenburg?) was heated
>> by water coming in from a hot water factory and distributed by underground
>> pipes. That was the nuttiest thing that I ever heard. Those Swedes!

>
> It is common in big cities like New York and Philadelphia to have steam heat
> supplied by a central location. This is usually done for the large
> commercial buildings down town. not for residential units. Steam can be
> piped fairly long distance with high pressure and a high concentration of
> energy per cubic foot compared to water. Many high rise building use
> steam for that reason.


That's interesting stuff. We're not interested in heating our houses in
the tropics. Cooling is another matter though. For heating water, our
condos use a heat pump which is essentially an air-conditioning system
run in reverse. Instead of purging the hot air into the environment, we
use it to heat water. Oddly enough, the cold air is just shot out of
exhaust ducts. Too bad. I could use some of that cold air.

>
> The highest temperature you can move water is 212 degrees. Steam, however
> can be moved at temperatures exceeding 500 degrees. Then piped through
> pressure regulators at the point of use to a lower temperature.


This makes a lot of sense. The only thing I know about this is that
boilers are famous for exploding in schools and churches - or does that
happen only in movies?

>
>


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On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 21:05:04 -0000, "Ophelia"
> wrote:

>
>
> "dsi1" > wrote in message
> ...
> >>

> >
> > I live in the tropics and the homes here don't have any provisions for
> > heating so I'm pretty ignorant on the subject. I would like to see one of
> > those old fashioned heater. That would be cool. I've only seen them in
> > movies with Humphrey Bogart or the 3 Stooges. :-)

>
> Which kind of heaters to you mean?
>
> --

If it's movies of the '30s, '40s, he's probably talking about
radiators.
http://img.ehowcdn.com/article-new/d...8460983_XS.jpg

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"sf" > wrote in message
...
> On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 21:05:04 -0000, "Ophelia"
> > wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> "dsi1" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> >>
>> >
>> > I live in the tropics and the homes here don't have any provisions for
>> > heating so I'm pretty ignorant on the subject. I would like to see one
>> > of
>> > those old fashioned heater. That would be cool. I've only seen them in
>> > movies with Humphrey Bogart or the 3 Stooges. :-)

>>
>> Which kind of heaters to you mean?
>>
>> --

> If it's movies of the '30s, '40s, he's probably talking about
> radiators.
> http://img.ehowcdn.com/article-new/d...8460983_XS.jpg


Hmm we call that a radiator. We see them like that in old buildings.

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On 3/15/2013 12:26 PM, sf wrote:
> On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 21:05:04 -0000, "Ophelia"
> > wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> "dsi1" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>>>
>>>
>>> I live in the tropics and the homes here don't have any provisions for
>>> heating so I'm pretty ignorant on the subject. I would like to see one of
>>> those old fashioned heater. That would be cool. I've only seen them in
>>> movies with Humphrey Bogart or the 3 Stooges. :-)

>>
>> Which kind of heaters to you mean?
>>
>> --

> If it's movies of the '30s, '40s, he's probably talking about
> radiators.
> http://img.ehowcdn.com/article-new/d...8460983_XS.jpg
>


That would be the one. According to the movies, you're supposed to hit
them with a big wrench in order to get them to work.
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On 3/15/2013 6:36 PM, Ophelia wrote:
>
>
> "sf" > wrote in message


>> If it's movies of the '30s, '40s, he's probably talking about
>> radiators.
>> http://img.ehowcdn.com/article-new/d...8460983_XS.jpg
>>

>
> Hmm we call that a radiator. We see them like that in old buildings.
>

Our NJ house has rads like that - a couple of them have fancy designs on
them. Massively heavy things, they are.
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On 3/15/2013 6:45 PM, dsi1 wrote:

> That would be the one. According to the movies, you're supposed to hit
> them with a big wrench in order to get them to work.


My parents used them as intercoms - they were both pretty good with
Morse code.
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On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 12:45:07 -1000, dsi1
> wrote:

> On 3/15/2013 12:26 PM, sf wrote:
> > On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 21:05:04 -0000, "Ophelia"
> > > wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>
> >> "dsi1" > wrote in message
> >> ...
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> I live in the tropics and the homes here don't have any provisions for
> >>> heating so I'm pretty ignorant on the subject. I would like to see one of
> >>> those old fashioned heater. That would be cool. I've only seen them in
> >>> movies with Humphrey Bogart or the 3 Stooges. :-)
> >>
> >> Which kind of heaters to you mean?
> >>
> >> --

> > If it's movies of the '30s, '40s, he's probably talking about
> > radiators.
> > http://img.ehowcdn.com/article-new/d...8460983_XS.jpg
> >

>
> That would be the one. According to the movies, you're supposed to hit
> them with a big wrench in order to get them to work.


I guess something is clogged, so they have to hit it. The old models
have been modernized now with a way to control how much heat it gives
off. Before they figured that out, people had to open up windows in
the dead of winter when it got too hot inside because there was no
other way to regulate it.

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"S Viemeister" > wrote in message
...
> On 3/15/2013 6:36 PM, Ophelia wrote:
>>
>>
>> "sf" > wrote in message

>
>>> If it's movies of the '30s, '40s, he's probably talking about
>>> radiators.
>>> http://img.ehowcdn.com/article-new/d...8460983_XS.jpg
>>>

>>
>> Hmm we call that a radiator. We see them like that in old buildings.
>>

> Our NJ house has rads like that - a couple of them have fancy designs on
> them. Massively heavy things, they are.


Cool We had those in our school

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On 3/15/2013 12:36 PM, Ophelia wrote:
>
>
> "sf" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 21:05:04 -0000, "Ophelia"
>> > wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "dsi1" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> > I live in the tropics and the homes here don't have any provisions for
>>> > heating so I'm pretty ignorant on the subject. I would like to see one
>>> > of
>>> > those old fashioned heater. That would be cool. I've only seen them in
>>> > movies with Humphrey Bogart or the 3 Stooges. :-)
>>>
>>> Which kind of heaters to you mean?
>>>
>>> --

>> If it's movies of the '30s, '40s, he's probably talking about
>> radiators.
>> http://img.ehowcdn.com/article-new/d...8460983_XS.jpg
>>

>
> Hmm we call that a radiator. We see them like that in old buildings.


I think they are actually called "radiators" in this country too. OTOH,
over here, all the radiators are in cars, not houses. Just as God
intended... :-)

>


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On 3/15/2013 12:59 PM, S Viemeister wrote:
> On 3/15/2013 6:45 PM, dsi1 wrote:
>
>> That would be the one. According to the movies, you're supposed to hit
>> them with a big wrench in order to get them to work.

>
> My parents used them as intercoms - they were both pretty good with
> Morse code.


Unfortunately, we had neither intercoms or radiators. We had no
shortages of big wrenches though since my dad was a plumber.
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On 3/15/2013 1:06 PM, sf wrote:
> On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 12:45:07 -1000, dsi1
> > wrote:
>
>> On 3/15/2013 12:26 PM, sf wrote:
>>> On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 21:05:04 -0000, "Ophelia"
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "dsi1" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I live in the tropics and the homes here don't have any provisions for
>>>>> heating so I'm pretty ignorant on the subject. I would like to see one of
>>>>> those old fashioned heater. That would be cool. I've only seen them in
>>>>> movies with Humphrey Bogart or the 3 Stooges. :-)
>>>>
>>>> Which kind of heaters to you mean?
>>>>
>>>> --
>>> If it's movies of the '30s, '40s, he's probably talking about
>>> radiators.
>>> http://img.ehowcdn.com/article-new/d...8460983_XS.jpg
>>>

>>
>> That would be the one. According to the movies, you're supposed to hit
>> them with a big wrench in order to get them to work.

>
> I guess something is clogged, so they have to hit it. The old models
> have been modernized now with a way to control how much heat it gives
> off. Before they figured that out, people had to open up windows in
> the dead of winter when it got too hot inside because there was no
> other way to regulate it.
>

When I was on the mainland, the heaters we had went alongside the
baseboards. They seemed to work OK but were probably not very efficient.
Sort of like having a row of toasters next to your walls.
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On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 13:26:59 -1000, dsi1
> wrote:
> >

> When I was on the mainland, the heaters we had went alongside the
> baseboards. They seemed to work OK but were probably not very efficient.
> Sort of like having a row of toasters next to your walls.


They're fine for individually heating a room, but I prefer forced air
to heat the entire house.

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On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 22:36:58 -0000, "Ophelia"
> wrote:



>>>
>>> Which kind of heaters to you mean?
>>>
>>> --

>> If it's movies of the '30s, '40s, he's probably talking about
>> radiators.
>> http://img.ehowcdn.com/article-new/d...8460983_XS.jpg

>
>Hmm we call that a radiator. We see them like that in old buildings.
>
>--


I rather like the old cast iron radiators. About the 1950's they were
starting to be phased out in favor of the newer baseboard heating
systems that were usually a copper tube with aluminum fins behind a
metal enclosure. There are cast iron baseboard units too and they are
often used in remodels where there will be a mix of baseboard and old
cast iron radiators.

The big hunks of cast iron had great thermal mass. They could keep
the temperature even for a long time, but they were slow to respond
when you did want to make a change.
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"Ed Pawlowski" > wrote in message
...
> On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 22:36:58 -0000, "Ophelia"
> > wrote:
>
>
>
>>>>
>>>> Which kind of heaters to you mean?
>>>>
>>>> --
>>> If it's movies of the '30s, '40s, he's probably talking about
>>> radiators.
>>> http://img.ehowcdn.com/article-new/d...8460983_XS.jpg

>>
>>Hmm we call that a radiator. We see them like that in old buildings.
>>
>>--

>
> I rather like the old cast iron radiators. About the 1950's they were
> starting to be phased out in favor of the newer baseboard heating
> systems that were usually a copper tube with aluminum fins behind a
> metal enclosure. There are cast iron baseboard units too and they are
> often used in remodels where there will be a mix of baseboard and old
> cast iron radiators.
>
> The big hunks of cast iron had great thermal mass. They could keep
> the temperature even for a long time, but they were slow to respond
> when you did want to make a change.


Ours are long slim things which fit by the walls. There are some very
fancy rads for sale these days

http://www.featureradiators.co.uk/?g...FYfJtAodAXUASw

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"dsi1" > wrote in message
...
> On 3/15/2013 12:36 PM, Ophelia wrote:
>>
>>
>> "sf" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 21:05:04 -0000, "Ophelia"
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "dsi1" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>> > I live in the tropics and the homes here don't have any provisions
>>>> > for
>>>> > heating so I'm pretty ignorant on the subject. I would like to see
>>>> > one
>>>> > of
>>>> > those old fashioned heater. That would be cool. I've only seen them
>>>> > in
>>>> > movies with Humphrey Bogart or the 3 Stooges. :-)
>>>>
>>>> Which kind of heaters to you mean?
>>>>
>>>> --
>>> If it's movies of the '30s, '40s, he's probably talking about
>>> radiators.
>>> http://img.ehowcdn.com/article-new/d...8460983_XS.jpg
>>>

>>
>> Hmm we call that a radiator. We see them like that in old buildings.

>
> I think they are actually called "radiators" in this country too. OTOH,
> over here, all the radiators are in cars, not houses. Just as God
> intended... :-)


lol yes, we have them in our cars too ...
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On 3/16/2013 6:36 AM, Ophelia wrote:

> Ours are long slim things which fit by the walls. There are some very
> fancy rads for sale these days
>
> http://www.featureradiators.co.uk/?g...FYfJtAodAXUASw
>

Oooh.
I've bookmarked that. I know we'll be needing to add/replace a few
radiators, and some of those are interesting.
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Default Who Was It That Recently Asked About A Hot Water Heater -- I'mIn Hot Water!

On 3/16/2013 12:36 AM, Ophelia wrote:
>
> Ours are long slim things which fit by the walls. There are some very
> fancy rads for sale these days
>
> http://www.featureradiators.co.uk/?g...FYfJtAodAXUASw
>


Those are very cool and beautiful!


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Default Who Was It That Recently Asked About A Hot Water Heater -- I'm In Hot Water!

On Sat, 16 Mar 2013 14:46:04 -1000, dsi1
> wrote:

>On 3/16/2013 12:36 AM, Ophelia wrote:
>>
>> Ours are long slim things which fit by the walls. There are some very
>> fancy rads for sale these days
>>
>> http://www.featureradiators.co.uk/?g...FYfJtAodAXUASw
>>

>
>Those are very cool.


Why would anyone want radiators that are cool?
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On 3/16/2013 3:47 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
> On Sat, 16 Mar 2013 14:46:04 -1000, dsi1
> > wrote:
>
>> On 3/16/2013 12:36 AM, Ophelia wrote:
>>>
>>> Ours are long slim things which fit by the walls. There are some very
>>> fancy rads for sale these days
>>>
>>> http://www.featureradiators.co.uk/?g...FYfJtAodAXUASw
>>>

>>
>> Those are very cool.

>
> Why would anyone want radiators that are cool?
>



Why the heck would anybody want a radiator that was painted a pastel
color? Could it be because it's cool? Oh yeah.
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Default Who Was It That Recently Asked About A Hot Water Heater -- I'mIn Hot Water!

On 3/16/2013 9:47 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
> On Sat, 16 Mar 2013 14:46:04 -1000, dsi1
> > wrote:
>
>> On 3/16/2013 12:36 AM, Ophelia wrote:
>>>
>>> Ours are long slim things which fit by the walls. There are some very
>>> fancy rads for sale these days
>>>
>>> http://www.featureradiators.co.uk/?g...FYfJtAodAXUASw
>>>

>>
>> Those are very cool.

>
> Why would anyone want radiators that are cool?
>

Perhaps they could double as air conditioners...
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Default Who Was It That Recently Asked About A Hot Water Heater -- I'mIn Hot Water!

On 16/03/2013 10:00 PM, S Viemeister wrote:
> On 3/16/2013 9:47 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
>> On Sat, 16 Mar 2013 14:46:04 -1000, dsi1
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> On 3/16/2013 12:36 AM, Ophelia wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Ours are long slim things which fit by the walls. There are some very
>>>> fancy rads for sale these days
>>>>
>>>> http://www.featureradiators.co.uk/?g...FYfJtAodAXUASw
>>>>
>>>
>>> Those are very cool.

>>
>> Why would anyone want radiators that are cool?
>>

> Perhaps they could double as air conditioners...



Not a good idea.... too much condensation.

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Default Who Was It That Recently Asked About A Hot Water Heater -- I'm In Hot Water!

sf > wrote:
> On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 06:11:23 -0400, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 14 Mar 2013 21:24:31 -0700, sf > wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>> Right.
>>>> Furnaces heat air, boilers heat water. The terms are often used
>>>> incorrectly.
>>>
>>> YES! I know old public buildings and some super old apartment
>>> buildings (and those converted to condos) still operate with a boiler
>>> system - but come on... single family HOUSES? The only "modern"
>>> heating water source I know about is fed by the water heater, not a
>>> boiler (mid-century modern Eichler houses and modern bathrooms with a
>>> floor heating system in the floor).

>>
>> As I said, if it heats water, the term used for the device is a
>> boiler. They range from smallish units for the house to large
>> industrial sized 100 HP units in industrial or commercial settings. If
>> you go to a 3000 room hotel in Las Vegas, chances are the domestic hot
>> water for you shower is heated by a big Cleaver Brooks boiler.
>>
>>
>>> Define the parameters if it's not
>>> a single family house, which is what I think most of the people here
>>> were talking about in generalized terms. I don't know enough about a
>>> whole building boiler systems to know if hot water from a faucet comes
>>> from the same place that provides heat to the buildings or not. What
>>> I do know is that boiler systems are not commonly used in single
>>> family housing here... like Aga stoves, they are out of the ordinary.

>>
>> If they are heating water, it is a boiler. Sorry, but that is the
>> proper term. Single family to big apartment complex, boilers heat the
>> water. In smaller units like the house, they do both the heating and
>> the domestic water.
>> http://www.weil-mclain.com/en/weil-mclain/pc-boilers/

>
> Like I said in another thread.... turn over enough rocks and you can
> prove any point.
>>
>> You will see units that do both.
>> http://www.weil-mclain.com/en/weil-m...ue-gas-boiler/
>> •Gas fired water boiler with cast aluminum heat exchanger
>> •Venturi mixing body mixes air and gas providing higher efficiency
>> •Designed to operate in low temperature condensing applications
>> •Outdoor reset and domestic hot water priority standard
>>
>> I don't know what is common in your town, but they are very common in
>> the cooler climates. Millions of residential boilers exist. Probably
>> 80% of the homes in New England have boilers. A few still have steam.
>>
>>

> We had a hot water heater, not a boiler, when I lived in Michigan.
> Water heaters have boilers in them, but no one and I mean NO ONE calls
> the entire unit a boiler. Like I said before, commercial and public
> buildings have large units called boilers but it is not a term used in
> single family residential.


Hot water heat systems use the term boiler, because it's a simple one word
description. What else would you call it using one word.

I know of huge sections of the city, with one main steam plant feeding many
high rise buildings, blocks wide.

I also think hot water, even worse steam, can be less efficient, unless
flew to air recovery is used.

Greg


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Default Who Was It That Recently Asked About A Hot Water Heater -- I'm In Hot Water!

dsi1 > wrote:
> On 3/14/2013 11:46 PM, Ophelia wrote:
>>
>>
>> "dsi1" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> On 3/14/2013 12:35 PM, Ophelia wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Our unit looks exactly the same as the one Sheldon posted, and of course
>>>> does both central heating and hot water
>>>>
>>>
>>> My step-mother said that the houses in her town (Gothenburg?) was
>>> heated by water coming in from a hot water factory and distributed by
>>> underground pipes. That was the nuttiest thing that I ever heard.
>>> Those Swedes!

>>
>> I saw that in Lincoln (UK)! About 30 years ago, a woman I knew moved
>> into a house on a new estate and all the houses were served by a central
>> boiler Never heard of it since though and I haven't been there for
>> many years, so I don't know if it is still in operation.
>>

>
> I live in the tropics and the homes here don't have any provisions for
> heating so I'm pretty ignorant on the subject. I would like to see one of
> those old fashioned heater. That would be cool. I've only seen them in
> movies with Humphrey Bogart or the 3 Stooges. :-)


Many houses, apartments, in the warmer regions have simple gas wall
heaters. Some have just one for the whole single story complex.

Greg
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Default Who Was It That Recently Asked About A Hot Water Heater -- I'm In Hot Water!

dsi1 > wrote:
> On 3/15/2013 12:26 PM, sf wrote:
>> On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 21:05:04 -0000, "Ophelia"
>> > wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "dsi1" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I live in the tropics and the homes here don't have any provisions for
>>>> heating so I'm pretty ignorant on the subject. I would like to see one of
>>>> those old fashioned heater. That would be cool. I've only seen them in
>>>> movies with Humphrey Bogart or the 3 Stooges. :-)
>>>
>>> Which kind of heaters to you mean?
>>>
>>> --

>> If it's movies of the '30s, '40s, he's probably talking about
>> radiators.
>> http://img.ehowcdn.com/article-new/d...8460983_XS.jpg
>>

>
> That would be the one. According to the movies, you're supposed to hit
> them with a big wrench in order to get them to work.


Steam heat versions, make a lot of sounds. Sometimes they hiss, bang, or
clank.

Greg
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Default Who Was It That Recently Asked About A Hot Water Heater -- I'm In Hot Water!

S Viemeister > wrote:
> On 3/16/2013 9:47 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
>> On Sat, 16 Mar 2013 14:46:04 -1000, dsi1
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> On 3/16/2013 12:36 AM, Ophelia wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Ours are long slim things which fit by the walls. There are some very
>>>> fancy rads for sale these days
>>>>
>>>> http://www.featureradiators.co.uk/?g...FYfJtAodAXUASw
>>>>
>>>
>>> Those are very cool.

>>
>> Why would anyone want radiators that are cool?
>>

> Perhaps they could double as air conditioners...


I worked in an old building that had what looked like radiators. They were
fed by hot or cold water. A separate air system would push air into the
unit, and expel it into the room. condensation had another exit feed.

Greg
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On Sun, 17 Mar 2013 02:25:13 +0000 (UTC), gregz >
wrote:

> S Viemeister > wrote:
> > On 3/16/2013 9:47 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
> >> On Sat, 16 Mar 2013 14:46:04 -1000, dsi1
> >> > wrote:
> >>
> >>> On 3/16/2013 12:36 AM, Ophelia wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> Ours are long slim things which fit by the walls. There are some very
> >>>> fancy rads for sale these days
> >>>>
> >>>> http://www.featureradiators.co.uk/?g...FYfJtAodAXUASw
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> Those are very cool.
> >>
> >> Why would anyone want radiators that are cool?
> >>

> > Perhaps they could double as air conditioners...

>
> I worked in an old building that had what looked like radiators. They were
> fed by hot or cold water. A separate air system would push air into the
> unit, and expel it into the room. condensation had another exit feed.
>

Wow, interesting! I would like to know how much it would cost to
replace an old forced air system with something like that, in say, a
1500 ft house?


--
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On Sun, 17 Mar 2013 02:06:10 +0000 (UTC), gregz >
wrote:

> Hot water heat systems use the term boiler, because it's a simple one word
> description. What else would you call it using one word.


By that, you're talking about something that supplies both heat and
hot water. This thread started off talking a single unit that
supplies only hot water, no mention of radiant heat. What are you
going to do next? Find something on the moon just to prove you're
right and I'm oh so wrong?
>
> I know of huge sections of the city, with one main steam plant feeding many
> high rise buildings, blocks wide.
>
> I also think hot water, even worse steam, can be less efficient, unless
> flew to air recovery is used.
>

Did you mean flue to air?


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On 3/16/2013 10:02 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
> On 16/03/2013 10:00 PM, S Viemeister wrote:
>> On 3/16/2013 9:47 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
>>> > wrote:
>>>> On 3/16/2013 12:36 AM, Ophelia wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Ours are long slim things which fit by the walls. There are some very
>>>>> fancy rads for sale these days
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.featureradiators.co.uk/?g...FYfJtAodAXUASw
>>>>
>>>> Those are very cool.
>>>
>>> Why would anyone want radiators that are cool?
>>>

>> Perhaps they could double as air conditioners...

>
> Not a good idea.... too much condensation.
>

Drip trays underneath. Channel them to water houseplants.
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On Sat, 16 Mar 2013 15:54:47 -1000, dsi1
> wrote:

>On 3/16/2013 3:47 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
>> On Sat, 16 Mar 2013 14:46:04 -1000, dsi1
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> On 3/16/2013 12:36 AM, Ophelia wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Ours are long slim things which fit by the walls. There are some very
>>>> fancy rads for sale these days
>>>>
>>>> http://www.featureradiators.co.uk/?g...FYfJtAodAXUASw
>>>>
>>>
>>> Those are very cool.

>>
>> Why would anyone want radiators that are cool?
>>

>
>
>Why the heck would anybody want a radiator that was painted a pastel
>color? Could it be because it's cool? Oh yeah.


Cast iron radiators are almost always painted with aluminized paint.
Today I'm sure that paint is available in several HOT colors! The
paint used on auto engines is chemically engineered to radiate engine
heat to help cool the engine, and engine paint is available in many
colors. Nowadays more than ever folks are installing metal roofs on
their homes, they are coated in many colors, the coating is designed
to radiate heat to help keep attics cooler.
http://www.tcpglobal.com/spraypaintd...ine-paint.aspx
http://www.oldhousejournal.com/magaz...radiator.shtml
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On Sun, 17 Mar 2013 02:25:13 +0000 (UTC), gregz >
wrote:

>S Viemeister > wrote:
>> On 3/16/2013 9:47 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
>>> On Sat, 16 Mar 2013 14:46:04 -1000, dsi1
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 3/16/2013 12:36 AM, Ophelia wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Ours are long slim things which fit by the walls. There are some very
>>>>> fancy rads for sale these days
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.featureradiators.co.uk/?g...FYfJtAodAXUASw
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Those are very cool.
>>>
>>> Why would anyone want radiators that are cool?
>>>

>> Perhaps they could double as air conditioners...

>
>I worked in an old building that had what looked like radiators. They were
>fed by hot or cold water. A separate air system would push air into the
>unit, and expel it into the room. condensation had another exit feed.


Another version of a swamp cooler.
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On Sun, 17 Mar 2013 02:06:10 +0000 (UTC), gregz >
wrote:

>sf > wrote:
>> On Fri, 15 Mar 2013 06:11:23 -0400, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
>>
>>> On Thu, 14 Mar 2013 21:24:31 -0700, sf > wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>> Right.
>>>>> Furnaces heat air, boilers heat water. The terms are often used
>>>>> incorrectly.
>>>>
>>>> YES! I know old public buildings and some super old apartment
>>>> buildings (and those converted to condos) still operate with a boiler
>>>> system - but come on... single family HOUSES? The only "modern"
>>>> heating water source I know about is fed by the water heater, not a
>>>> boiler (mid-century modern Eichler houses and modern bathrooms with a
>>>> floor heating system in the floor).
>>>
>>> As I said, if it heats water, the term used for the device is a
>>> boiler. They range from smallish units for the house to large
>>> industrial sized 100 HP units in industrial or commercial settings. If
>>> you go to a 3000 room hotel in Las Vegas, chances are the domestic hot
>>> water for you shower is heated by a big Cleaver Brooks boiler.
>>>
>>>
>>>> Define the parameters if it's not
>>>> a single family house, which is what I think most of the people here
>>>> were talking about in generalized terms. I don't know enough about a
>>>> whole building boiler systems to know if hot water from a faucet comes
>>>> from the same place that provides heat to the buildings or not. What
>>>> I do know is that boiler systems are not commonly used in single
>>>> family housing here... like Aga stoves, they are out of the ordinary.
>>>
>>> If they are heating water, it is a boiler. Sorry, but that is the
>>> proper term. Single family to big apartment complex, boilers heat the
>>> water. In smaller units like the house, they do both the heating and
>>> the domestic water.
>>> http://www.weil-mclain.com/en/weil-mclain/pc-boilers/

>>
>> Like I said in another thread.... turn over enough rocks and you can
>> prove any point.
>>>
>>> You will see units that do both.
>>> http://www.weil-mclain.com/en/weil-m...ue-gas-boiler/
>>> ?Gas fired water boiler with cast aluminum heat exchanger
>>> ?Venturi mixing body mixes air and gas providing higher efficiency
>>> ?Designed to operate in low temperature condensing applications
>>> ?Outdoor reset and domestic hot water priority standard
>>>
>>> I don't know what is common in your town, but they are very common in
>>> the cooler climates. Millions of residential boilers exist. Probably
>>> 80% of the homes in New England have boilers. A few still have steam.
>>>
>>>

>> We had a hot water heater, not a boiler, when I lived in Michigan.
>> Water heaters have boilers in them, but no one and I mean NO ONE calls
>> the entire unit a boiler. Like I said before, commercial and public
>> buildings have large units called boilers but it is not a term used in
>> single family residential.

>
>Hot water heat systems use the term boiler, because it's a simple one word
>description. What else would you call it using one word.


Boiler is the correct nomenclature used in the home heating trade...
same as hot water heater is used rather than the full terminoligy;
domestic hot water heater... most building trade workers couldn't
spell domestic (they can't use three syllable words). There are
several catagories of boilers; cast iron, sheet metal, wet base,
etc... "boiler" is the correct building trades jargon... same as most
folks use that four letter word in lieu of sexual intercourse... I'll
bet there's not a person here who has ever said to their mate let's
have sexual intercourse/coitus... sf says "C'mon, penetrate me!",
hubby replies "Which orifice?" Probably the one to shut her up! LOL
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