http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh

Labeling isn't everything.
Janet US

On 28/05/2011 12:23 AM, Janet Bostwick wrote:
> http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh
>
> Labeling isn't everything.
> Janet US

There was recently a documentary here in Aus where they exposed just how
the fish are reared in Vietnam. It was scary stuff when you realise
there are absolutely no controls on pesticides, growth hormones and the
like in Vietnam and similar countries.

Telling just what you're getting in the fishmarket here is very
difficult which is why my wife always buy the fish complete, with head,
tail and scales intact. Only ever buys occasional Tuna or Blue Grenadier
steaks as it's pretty hard to fake those.

Krypsis

On 2011-05-27, Janet Bostwick > wrote:
> http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh
>
> Labeling isn't everything.

Old news and mentioned here in rfc often. In fact I posted on it
within the last month. One article claimed 70% of the restaurant
salmon in NYC labeled wild caught was actually farmed. Jes yesterday,
a local mkt advertised wild CRS at $16 lb for filets. As if!

nb

On 2011-05-27, Krypsis > wrote:

> There was recently a documentary here in Aus where they exposed just how
> the fish are reared in Vietnam. It was scary stuff......

Likewise, a PBS documentary called Farming the Seas. Note the plural
on "Seas", as there's another one called Farming the Sea, put out by
the industry and no doubt paints a rosey picture (I've not seen it).
The PBS doc is horrific, showing how shrimp farming in Thailand is
literally destroying that whole area's ocean ecosystem, it being so
toxic and extensive.

http://www.pbs.org/emptyoceans/

I've looked for them online, but Bullfrog films seems to consider the
film too valuble to release to environmental websites for free viewing.
IOW, learn about ecology, but get that $$$ first! :\

nb

On 27 May 2011 15:07:55 GMT, notbob > wrote:

>On 2011-05-27, Janet Bostwick > wrote:
>> http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh
>>
>> Labeling isn't everything.
>
>Old news and mentioned here in rfc often. In fact I posted on it
>within the last month. One article claimed 70% of the restaurant
>salmon in NYC labeled wild caught was actually farmed. Jes yesterday,
>a local mkt advertised wild CRS at $16 lb for filets. As if!
>
>nb
I hadn't understood before that DNA checks were possible. If only we
had enough inspectors/inspections
Janet

On 28/05/2011 1:24 AM, Janet Bostwick wrote:
> On 27 May 2011 15:07:55 GMT, > wrote:
>
>> On 2011-05-27, Janet > wrote:
>>> http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh
>>>
>>> Labeling isn't everything.
>>
>> Old news and mentioned here in rfc often. In fact I posted on it
>> within the last month. One article claimed 70% of the restaurant
>> salmon in NYC labeled wild caught was actually farmed. Jes yesterday,
>> a local mkt advertised wild CRS at $16 lb for filets. As if!
>>
>> nb
> I hadn't understood before that DNA checks were possible. If only we
> had enough inspectors/inspections
> Janet

As long as there are ill gotten gains to be had, there will always be
someone who exploits this sort of thing. As well, there'll never be
enough inspectors/inspections unless/until a heap of people are made
extremely ill or killed. It takes a major disaster to get governments
off their backsides and do something.

Then, to add to the problem, the cures cost money.

But you know this already...

Krypsis

On 2011-05-27, Krypsis > wrote:

> Then, to add to the problem, the cures cost money.

Waaaay more $$$ than lobbyists are paying greedy pols to look the
other way.

nb

On Fri, 27 May 2011 10:57:58 -0500, Andy > wrote:

>Janet Bostwick > wrote:
>
>> http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh
>>
>> Labeling isn't everything.
>> Janet US
>
>
>Janet US,
>
>Interesting read.
>
>I imagine fish substitutes would happen more in restaurants since
>patrons only see the cooked fish. At fish markets, knowledgeable
>customers would quite easily spot substitutes. Getting caught would also
>quickly run them out of business.
>
>Aside from a handful of fish, I'd be easily tricked.
>
>Best,
>
>Andy

The article says that even pros have a hard time identifying some fish
when butchered and scaled.
Janet US

On Sat, 28 May 2011 01:00:58 +1000, Krypsis >
wrote:

>On 28/05/2011 12:23 AM, Janet Bostwick wrote:
>> http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh
>>
>> Labeling isn't everything.
>> Janet US
>
>There was recently a documentary here in Aus where they exposed just how
>the fish are reared in Vietnam. It was scary stuff when you realise
>there are absolutely no controls on pesticides, growth hormones and the
>like in Vietnam and similar countries.
>
>Telling just what you're getting in the fishmarket here is very
>difficult which is why my wife always buy the fish complete, with head,
>tail and scales intact. Only ever buys occasional Tuna or Blue Grenadier
>steaks as it's pretty hard to fake those.

On Long Island I would buy only fish directly off the local fishing
fleet or from fish mongers who sold only locally caught catch...
seafood would often still be alive... but I very rarely cooked fish at
home, it stinks up your house. Local seafood eateries, of which there
were many, sold only local seafood that was in season... I don't
remember ever seeing salmon on any Long Island seafood restaurant
menu... only some stupidmarkets sold salmon fillets, fresh but mostly
frozen. I ate salmon rarely, either cured or from a can. There was
never any shortage of fresh seafood on Lung Guyland. I always have
lots of canned salmon in my pantry, Fancy Feast!

Janet Bostwick wrote:
> http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh
>
> Labeling isn't everything.
> Janet US

Forgive me, but they don't say _where_ they tested their fish. That's
something I'd like to know because I, well, I hope that such a problem
is less pervasive at Whole Foods than at my local Stop 'N' Shop. For
all we know, they didn't test any fish markets - we have a great local
fish store that I've come to trust.

I just hate it when stuff like this is published with incomplete
information. If this information is actually in that article, which I
just finished reading, then I apologize for overlooking it but I
couldn't find it.

-S-

On Fri, 27 May 2011 13:44:17 -0400, "Steve Freides" >
wrote:

> Janet Bostwick wrote:
> > http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh
> >
> > Labeling isn't everything.
> > Janet US
>
> Forgive me, but they don't say _where_ they tested their fish. That's
> something I'd like to know because I, well, I hope that such a problem
> is less pervasive at Whole Foods than at my local Stop 'N' Shop. For
> all we know, they didn't test any fish markets - we have a great local
> fish store that I've come to trust.
>
> I just hate it when stuff like this is published with incomplete
> information. If this information is actually in that article, which I
> just finished reading, then I apologize for overlooking it but I
> couldn't find it.
>
It seems to be typical of reporting these days, leaving more questions
than answers.

--

Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held its ground.

Andy wrote:
> Janet Bostwick > wrote:
>
>> http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh
>>
>> Labeling isn't everything.
>> Janet US
>
>
> Janet US,
>
> Interesting read.
>
> I imagine fish substitutes would happen more in restaurants since
> patrons only see the cooked fish. At fish markets, knowledgeable
> customers would quite easily spot substitutes. Getting caught would also
> quickly run them out of business.
>
> Aside from a handful of fish, I'd be easily tricked.
>
> Best,
>
> Andy


I wonder how many people know that "mahi-mahi" is just a euphemism for
dolphin. HTH :-)

-Bob

On 2011-05-27, zxcvbob > wrote:

> I wonder how many people know that "mahi-mahi" is just a euphemism for
> dolphin. HTH :-)

It didn't.

Dolphins are mammals. Mahi-mahi are not.

"They are one of only two members of the Coryphaenidae family, the
other being the pompano dolphinfish."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahi-mahi

People are eating dolphin, the mammal, though. Watch the documentary,
The Cove.

http://www.takepart.com/thecove

Grim stuff.

nb

notbob wrote:
> On 2011-05-27, zxcvbob > wrote:
>
>> I wonder how many people know that "mahi-mahi" is just a euphemism for
>> dolphin. HTH :-)
>
> It didn't.
>
> Dolphins are mammals. Mahi-mahi are not.
>
> "They are one of only two members of the Coryphaenidae family, the
> other being the pompano dolphinfish."
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahi-mahi
>


Click on the picture on the upper right side of that wiki page and read
the caption. It says "Dolphin (Coryphaena hippurus)"

(I never said they were marine mammals, I just left that to the
imagination ;-)

-Bob

On Fri, 27 May 2011 18:15:16 -0500, zxcvbob >
wrote:

> I wonder how many people know that "mahi-mahi" is just a euphemism for
> dolphin. HTH :-)

And now you know why they stopped calling it dolphin.

--

Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held its ground.

On 27/05/2011 7:15 PM, zxcvbob wrote:

>
> I wonder how many people know that "mahi-mahi" is just a euphemism for
> dolphin. HTH :-)
>


Dolphinfish, not dolphin the mammal. Being inland, dolphinfish was rare
here. I never heard of it until about 20 years ago when fresh fish
started becoming more readily available. It was only known as
dolphinfish here for a short time and then was called mahi mahi. Around
the same time there were a number of other fish whose names were changed
to make them more appealing to shoppers.

On Fri, 27 May 2011 18:04:30 -0500, "cshenk" > wrote:

>sf wrote in rec.food.cooking:
>
>> On Fri, 27 May 2011 13:44:17 -0400, "Steve Freides" >
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Janet Bostwick wrote:
>> > > http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh
>> > >
>> > > Labeling isn't everything.
>> > > Janet US
>> >
>> > Forgive me, but they don't say where they tested their fish.
>> > That's something I'd like to know because I, well, I hope that such
>> > a problem is less pervasive at Whole Foods than at my local Stop
>> > 'N' Shop. For all we know, they didn't test any fish markets - we
>> > have a great local fish store that I've come to trust.
>> >
>> > I just hate it when stuff like this is published with incomplete
>> > information. If this information is actually in that article,
>> > which I just finished reading, then I apologize for overlooking it
>> > but I couldn't find it.
>> >
>> It seems to be typical of reporting these days, leaving more questions
>> than answers.
>
>It was sensationalist reporting at it's worst. There were no facts to
>backup most of the assertions. You get the 'can't test, too difficult'
>and then the results of 30% based on tests. Chuck that paper in the
>garbage where it belongs.

Here is the link to the original study. Please feel free to follow up
on all referenced studies and materials. The released study is from
Oceana, entitled "Bait and Switch: How Seafood Fraud Hurts Our Oceans,
Our Wallets and Our Health."
http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh
Janet US

On May 27, 4:45*pm, Dave Smith > wrote:

> Dolphinfish, not dolphin the mammal. Being inland, dolphinfish was rare
> here. I never heard of it until about 20 years ago when fresh fish
> started becoming more readily available. It was only known as
> dolphinfish here for a short time and then was called mahi mahi. *Around
> the same time there were a number of other fish whose names were changed
> to make them more appealing to shoppers.

I've been meaning to ask why there are several fish types that are
commonly available in grocery store seafood markets now, yet I never
heard of them back when I worked in the seafood dept. And several back
then that I have not seen in a long time.

For example, tilapia is something new to me. I have never tried it.
Sounds like it is more mild than I would like. years ago, I used to
see snapper (rockfish) and orange roughy as popular, though I did not
like those. Dover sole is still there. I can't think of some of the
newer names that I am not familiar with. I'll have to stop by and
look. I rarely see halibut anymore. Catfish comes and goes. We used to
have several types of cod (I remember ling cod, and true cod, seemed
like we had 3 or 4 types). e used to have sword fish steaks. Snow
crabs. We still have whole dungeness king crab legs, but the only
snow crab is the fake kind.

On May 27, 10:20*am, notbob > wrote:
> On 2011-05-27, Krypsis > wrote:
>
> > There was recently a documentary here in Aus where they exposed just how
> > the fish are reared in Vietnam. It was scary stuff......
>
> Likewise, a PBS documentary called Farming the Seas. *Note the plural
> on "Seas", as there's another one called Farming the Sea, put out by
> the industry and no doubt paints a rosey picture (I've not seen it).
> The PBS doc is horrific, showing how shrimp farming in Thailand is
> literally destroying that whole area's ocean ecosystem, it being so
> toxic and extensive. *
>
At the root of the problem is human overpopulation. It needs to be
reduced. Too bad hardly anyone has the guts to say that, fearing
they'll be compared to Hitler. Well I say it, and as far as Hitler
goes, it is known that he loved dogs. I don't even like the species.
Dog lovers are like Hitler. Hitler liked German food too. People who
like German food are like Hitler.

The useless penis man in Rome wants lots of children to be born so
that they can suffer from malnutrition and disease. He thinks that
glorifies God. Wanting to see masses of people suffer and die?
That's like Hitler. The Pope is like Hitler. I wonder if he loves
dogs too, and German food..
>
> nb *

--Bryan

Janet Bostwick wrote:

> Here is the link to the original study. Please feel free to follow up
> on all referenced studies and materials. The released study is from
> Oceana, entitled "Bait and Switch: How Seafood Fraud Hurts Our Oceans,
> Our Wallets and Our Health."
> http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh
> Janet US

It's not a link to any original study - it's a link to the same article.

-S-

"Janet Bostwick" > wrote in message
...
> http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh
>
> Labeling isn't everything.
> Janet US
>
Last year, I bought some barramundi from Safeway and the brand implied that
it was Australian when in fact it was farm-raised in Vietnam.
Graham

On Sat, 28 May 2011 14:51:33 -0600, "graham" > wrote:

>
> "Janet Bostwick" > wrote in message
> ...
> > http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh
> >
> > Labeling isn't everything.
> > Janet US
> >
> Last year, I bought some barramundi from Safeway and the brand implied that
> it was Australian when in fact it was farm-raised in Vietnam.

How did you figure out it came from Vietnam?

--

Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held its ground.

On 5/28/2011 4:03 PM, sf wrote:
> On Sat, 28 May 2011 14:51:33 -0600, > wrote:
>
>>
>> "Janet > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh
>>>
>>> Labeling isn't everything.
>>> Janet US
>>>
>> Last year, I bought some barramundi from Safeway and the brand implied that
>> it was Australian when in fact it was farm-raised in Vietnam.
>
> How did you figure out it came from Vietnam?
>
My question, too. Was it printed somewhere on the wrapper that you
hadn't noticed?

--
Janet Wilder
Way-the-heck-south Texas
Spelling doesn't count. Cooking does.

"Janet Wilder" > wrote in message
.com...
> On 5/28/2011 4:03 PM, sf wrote:
>> On Sat, 28 May 2011 14:51:33 -0600, > wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> "Janet > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh
>>>>
>>>> Labeling isn't everything.
>>>> Janet US
>>>>
>>> Last year, I bought some barramundi from Safeway and the brand implied
>>> that
>>> it was Australian when in fact it was farm-raised in Vietnam.
>>
>> How did you figure out it came from Vietnam?
>>
> My question, too. Was it printed somewhere on the wrapper that you hadn't
> noticed?
>
Yes, in *very* small print inside the gusset forming the base of the
package. But it was double packed and the inside packet had a big label of
origin that no-one could miss.
There is no doubt in my mind that the brand label was meant to deceive.
Graham

On Sat, 28 May 2011 16:12:01 -0400, "Steve Freides" >
wrote:

>Janet Bostwick wrote:
>
>> Here is the link to the original study. Please feel free to follow up
>> on all referenced studies and materials. The released study is from
>> Oceana, entitled "Bait and Switch: How Seafood Fraud Hurts Our Oceans,
>> Our Wallets and Our Health."
>> http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh
>> Janet US
>
>It's not a link to any original study - it's a link to the same article.
>
>-S-
>
Rats!!! How did that happen? Something has happened to the links
since yesterday. However, if you click on this link
http://www.enn.com/top_stories/article/42740
and go to the bottom of the page, there is a link that will allow you
to download the PDF file of the report.
Janet US

Janet Bostwick wrote:
> On Sat, 28 May 2011 16:12:01 -0400, "Steve Freides" >
> wrote:
>
>> Janet Bostwick wrote:
>>
>>> Here is the link to the original study. Please feel free to follow
>>> up on all referenced studies and materials. The released study is
>>> from Oceana, entitled "Bait and Switch: How Seafood Fraud Hurts Our
>>> Oceans, Our Wallets and Our Health."
>>> http://tinyurl.com/3garzrh
>>> Janet US
>>
>> It's not a link to any original study - it's a link to the same
>> article.
>>
>> -S-
>>
> Rats!!! How did that happen? Something has happened to the links
> since yesterday. However, if you click on this link
> http://www.enn.com/top_stories/article/42740
> and go to the bottom of the page, there is a link that will allow you
> to download the PDF file of the report.
> Janet US

Thank you - I just read that one, and it's still inconclusive. The
article cites several concrete examples of fraud, and it rightly laments
the lack of proof of origin of much fish, but the main conclusion one
draws from the article is that we ought to ask for more information. It
doesn't suggest or conclude, that I can find, that the majority of our
purchases are of fraudulently identified fish, and it doesn't help me at
all in determining if any one retail source of fish is going to be safer
than another.

-S-