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On Fri, 11 Jun 2010 12:49:13 -0700 (PDT), Nancy2
> wrote:

>On Jun 5, 4:26*pm, Omelet > wrote:
>> In article >,
>>
>> *"gloria.p" > wrote:
>> > Lou Decruss wrote:

>>
>> > > All good points but the problem is anyone renting would need to work
>> > > and it's not close to anything. *Not many retired folks want to rent.
>> > > And there's a homeowners association which requires both the owner and
>> > > the renter to pay the dues. *Kinda sucky.

>>
>> > > Lou *

>>
>> > Kinda? * That sounds like the HOAs attempt to prohibit rentals w/o
>> > actually writing the rule into the covenants.

>>
>> > gloria p

>>
>> I'd love to see HOA's outlawed. Those *******s get too much power. *My
>> property is MY property! Not theirs! *I don't rent it from them.
>>
>> Can one refuse to join one when purchasing a home?
>> --
>> Peace! Om
>>
>> Web Albums: <http://picasaweb.google.com/OMPOmelet>
>> *Only Irish *coffee provides in a single glass all four *essential food groups: alcohol, caffeine, sugar *and fat. *--Alex Levine

>
>I've never heard of someone refusing to pay HOAs after buying a home.
>It would be in the purchase agreement.
>
>N>


You don't pay they'll put a lien on the home. There seems to be a few
pretty ignorant people here on the subject. HOA's don't collect money
for grins. They do things with it. Mine maintains roads, a lake,
parks, security, clubhouses, beaches, etc. We also pay taxes but none
of that goes towards our roads. About the only thing that goes to is
schools and security issues that the staff can't handle and the fire
department. Even our sewer and water is not associated with a city or
town. They're in the process is adding more fire hydrants and even
those are not funded by real estate taxes.

Those who don't know what they speak of should just shut up.

Lou






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On Fri, 11 Jun 2010 16:10:51 -0400, Goomba >
wrote:

>Nancy2 wrote:
>> I especially like the newer black chain link which tends
>> to disappear into the background.

>
>Yes, blank chain link does disappear into the landscape when done well.
>I wish people would use it more often. In my neighborhood you can only
>have fencing in the back yard up to the rear of the home.


It depends on the setting. Inner city lots in Chicago are only 25-30
feet wide. A solid wood fence for privacy is nice there and many are
fenced on all sides to the property line. Rural areas are different.
The only reason for a fence is to keep critters in or out. It's
pretty simple to decide if you want to live in an area that allows
them or not. I don't know why this is so hard for a few block-heads.

Lou
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On Fri, 11 Jun 2010 13:00:38 -0700 (PDT), Nancy2
> wrote:

>>
>> >Not every neighborhood lays within a city.

>>
>> If you have a zip code you're within a county, city, town, village,
>> hamlet, whatever yoose call it... and so there will be zoning
>> ordinances.. some are pretty lax but some are more strict than fusspot

>
>There are very few county ordinances, if any. Business in a home?
>Fine. Outdoor burning? Fine. Campers on the property? Fine. Want
>a horse barn? Shed? Commercial truck garden? Cows? Fine. I can't
>think of a single zoning ordinance in our rural areas....although
>there certainly could be some....


sheldon is full of shit again. The oldest daughter has a home an hour
from Chicago in an un-incorporated subdivision. It's too small for a
truck farm or horses but you don't need permits for remodeling or
additions. In Chicago you need a permit for window replacement or a
roof job but not there. There's no firewall between the garage and
the attic over the house. It's wide open. I don't think they know
what codes are there.

Lou
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On Fri, 11 Jun 2010 21:44:01 +0000 (UTC), Doug Freyburger
> wrote:

>Nancy2 wrote:
>>
>> I've never heard of someone refusing to pay HOAs after buying a home.
>> It would be in the purchase agreement.

>
>I don't get the reaction against HOAs. The function of an HOA is to
>keep the values up and the neighborhood nice. If I have good taste
>then what I do is not a problem with the HOA. If I have bad taste then
>chose to live in an HOA area to be able to tap someone else's good
>taste. HOA meetings can get petty but they are easily ignored as long
>as what you're doing is good stuff. If you want to leave junk in your
>yard or paint ugly colors I don't want you in my neighborhood anyways.
>Move to some place with no rules and so likely some place that looks bad.


Yes. This had turned rather silly and a few slobs have shown
themselves.

Lou
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On Fri, 11 Jun 2010 17:45:55 -0400, "Nancy Young"
> wrote:

>Nancy2 wrote:
>> On Jun 5, 4:26 pm, Omelet > wrote:

>
>>> Can one refuse to join one when purchasing a home?

>
>> I've never heard of someone refusing to pay HOAs after buying a home.
>> It would be in the purchase agreement.

>
>The HOA doesn't just collect money to be a pain in the ass, they
>pay for things that are spelled out in the agreement. Be it snow
>removal, or a guard at the gate, or a pool, whatever. If people
>refuse to pay, the bill doesn't go away, the other neighbors have to
>pay more to make up the shortfall.
>
>Of course you have to pay if you buy into an HOA neighborhood.
>By buying there you are a member of the HOA.


Good gawd OM is an idiot. To add to your list they keep a fund for
emergencies. A condo building would be really screwed if a major roof
leak developed and they had to knock on doors with a hat looking for
donations.

Lou


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Lou Decruss wrote:
> On Fri, 11 Jun 2010 17:45:55 -0400, "Nancy Young"
> > wrote:


>> The HOA doesn't just collect money to be a pain in the ass, they
>> pay for things that are spelled out in the agreement. Be it snow
>> removal, or a guard at the gate, or a pool, whatever. If people
>> refuse to pay, the bill doesn't go away, the other neighbors have to
>> pay more to make up the shortfall.
>>
>> Of course you have to pay if you buy into an HOA neighborhood.
>> By buying there you are a member of the HOA.

>
> Good gawd OM is an idiot. To add to your list they keep a fund for
> emergencies. A condo building would be really screwed if a major roof
> leak developed and they had to knock on doors with a hat looking for
> donations.


Yeah, good luck with that. We need $3000? Um, today? Right.
Heh. The thing with HOAs is that it's not like government to the extent
that most people have no chance of being elected; it's comprised of
people who live in that neighborhood. They aren't some outsiders
who just like shoving people around for fun, if they are out of control,
chances are people will be happy to vote new people in. They're your
neighbors. Don't like who's in charge, run against them.

nancy
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In article
>,
Nancy2 > wrote:

> On Jun 5, 4:26*pm, Omelet > wrote:
> > In article >,


> > Can one refuse to join one when purchasing a home?


Pretty much buying the place is joining. You can refuse to participate,
but you are still legally bound.

> I've never heard of someone refusing to pay HOAs after buying a home.
> It would be in the purchase agreement.


Oh yeah, happens all the time. There was a case north of me, at Sea
Ranch. That's a pretty exclusive place:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_Ranch,_California

Houses start around half a million dollars (US) for 2 bedrooms, 2 baths
and 1000 square feet.

The guy didn't pay his HOA, so they sold his house out from under him.
He sued, saying that they hadn't notified him. They replied, saying
that they had mailed him and put a notice on his front door for three
months. He said he didn't read his mail or use his front door. Of
course, the new owners had kicked him out.

--
Dan Abel
Petaluma, California USA

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Lou Decruss wrote:

>On Fri, 11 Jun 2010 13:00:38 -0700 (PDT), Nancy2
> wrote:
>
>>>
>>> >Not every neighborhood lays within a city.
>>>
>>> If you have a zip code you're within a county, city, town, village,
>>> hamlet, whatever yoose call it... and so there will be zoning
>>> ordinances.. some are pretty lax but some are more strict than fusspot

>>
>>There are very few county ordinances, if any. Business in a home?
>>Fine. Outdoor burning? Fine. Campers on the property? Fine. Want
>>a horse barn? Shed? Commercial truck garden? Cows? Fine. I can't
>>think of a single zoning ordinance in our rural areas....although
>>there certainly could be some....

>
>sheldon is full of shit again. The oldest daughter has a home an hour
>from Chicago in an un-incorporated subdivision. It's too small for a
>truck farm or horses but you don't need permits for remodeling or
>additions. In Chicago you need a permit for window replacement or a
>roof job but not there. There's no firewall between the garage and
>the attic over the house. It's wide open. I don't think they know
>what codes are there.


You're full of shit. As I said, in some areas codes are lax but there
are always minimal Federal code inspections for
electrical/plumbing/fire. Codes are always a lot stricter in
subdivisions... and home owner insurance always has a right to inspect
the premises for whatever their policy contract deems compliance... if
a mortgage so does the lender until a mortagage is fully satisfied,
and one owns no part of the property till the loan is fully paid,
they're only a caretaker. Folks can redo a bath/kitchen by forgoing
permits but just try extending the structure out or up... or adding a
structure. An HOA hasn't a whit to do with property taxes, those
still need to be paid, school tax and town tax. An HOA is
essentially a private club that by buying there one agrees to abide by
its bylaws... but one still needs to abide by local codes... an HOA
can make local codes stricter but cannot make them more lax. There's
good reason you're losing your house, you're an idiot... if that's
even your house, I doubt it... with how little you know about real
estate you come across more like a tenant. Why do you think I
suggested you rent it when no one else made that suggestion, I
strongly suspected you were a tenant, that's why you came up with all
those fercocktah alibis why you can't rent it... the first thing a
real homeowner would say is that they're afraid a tenant would destroy
their property, but not you, you came up with all the things a tenant
thinks about... it's obviously not yours to rent. Probably belongs to
an acquaintance/relative and you were visiting, that's what those sort
of pictures indicate. That's probably not even you, for all these
years you've been ascared to put your pic up on rfc mugs and now you
want folks to believe that's you, and your wife... doesn't make sense,
and when something doesn't make sense it's not true.
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Nancy2 wrote:

>
> Actually, in my opinion, properly installed chain link fences are much
> more attractive than any wooden or picket fence, unless you've got a
> horse farm. I especially like the newer black chain link which tends
> to disappear into the background. Wooden fences arbitrarily lean here
> and there, are uneven along the tops, break, discolor, etc. - and
> block your vision so that yards look like they're tiny. I think
> they're ugly.
>



Chain link looks very industrial to me or even institutional (have you
ever driven by a super-max prison compound?)

At least wood looks natural and organic unless it's the new "lifetime"
plastic fence that in no way resembles real wood.

I grew up in an area with lots of stone walls and still think a well-mde
one is beautiful.

gloria p
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Nancy2 wrote:
>>> Not every neighborhood lays within a city.

>> If you have a zip code you're within a county, city, town, village,
>> hamlet, whatever yoose call it... and so there will be zoning
>> ordinances.. some are pretty lax but some are more strict than fusspot

>
> There are very few county ordinances, if any. Business in a home?
> Fine. Outdoor burning? Fine. Campers on the property? Fine. Want
> a horse barn? Shed? Commercial truck garden? Cows? Fine. I can't
> think of a single zoning ordinance in our rural areas....although
> there certainly could be some....
>
> N.



It's different if you are in an urban/suburban area with relatively
small house lots. On large acreage what you do doesn't affect your
neighbors because they can't see it most of the time. When houses are
only feet apart, it matters a lot more.

gloria p


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On Fri, 11 Jun 2010 18:58:51 -0400, "Nancy Young"
> wrote:

>Lou Decruss wrote:
>> On Fri, 11 Jun 2010 17:45:55 -0400, "Nancy Young"
>> > wrote:

>
>>> The HOA doesn't just collect money to be a pain in the ass, they
>>> pay for things that are spelled out in the agreement. Be it snow
>>> removal, or a guard at the gate, or a pool, whatever. If people
>>> refuse to pay, the bill doesn't go away, the other neighbors have to
>>> pay more to make up the shortfall.
>>>
>>> Of course you have to pay if you buy into an HOA neighborhood.
>>> By buying there you are a member of the HOA.

>>
>> Good gawd OM is an idiot. To add to your list they keep a fund for
>> emergencies. A condo building would be really screwed if a major roof
>> leak developed and they had to knock on doors with a hat looking for
>> donations.

>
>Yeah, good luck with that. We need $3000? Um, today? Right.
>Heh. The thing with HOAs is that it's not like government to the extent
>that most people have no chance of being elected; it's comprised of
>people who live in that neighborhood. They aren't some outsiders
>who just like shoving people around for fun, if they are out of control,
>chances are people will be happy to vote new people in. They're your
>neighbors. Don't like who's in charge, run against them.


Exactly. Even if you don't win your points will be brought up. HOA's
have drastic differences from one to another. Painting a broad brush
over all of them as evil is ignorant. $3000 for a roof leak is
nothing. This association collects about 1.2 million a year. The
sewer and water is a separate issue and collects about 3/4 million a
year. The roads are chip and seal and were just done at the cost of
580K. Dues go up a few bucks a year but there was no assessment for
the roads because there was good planning involved. The
office-security-maintenance staff get paid but the elected folks get
nothing.

Lou
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On Fri, 11 Jun 2010 17:45:55 -0400, "Nancy Young"
> wrote:

> Nancy2 wrote:
> > On Jun 5, 4:26 pm, Omelet > wrote:

>
> >> Can one refuse to join one when purchasing a home?

>
> > I've never heard of someone refusing to pay HOAs after buying a home.
> > It would be in the purchase agreement.

>
> The HOA doesn't just collect money to be a pain in the ass, they
> pay for things that are spelled out in the agreement. Be it snow
> removal, or a guard at the gate, or a pool, whatever. If people
> refuse to pay, the bill doesn't go away, the other neighbors have to
> pay more to make up the shortfall.


Some HOA's pay for security guards and/or other permanent staff. They
pay for landscaping and maintenance of common grounds, they have to
save for future routine maintenance of shared facilities like a new
roof, outside paint, heating and cooling units, interior maintenance
of common areas etc. etc etc. Take what you'd do as a home owner and
multiply it. It's a big expense.
>
> Of course you have to pay if you buy into an HOA neighborhood.
> By buying there you are a member of the HOA.
>

Absolutely and it's one of those things you need to think about before
buying. If it's a condo, how well maintained is the building? Do
they have savings for routine maintenance and an emergency fund? Is
this a new development with artificially low HOA fee or is it well
established, fully funded and self governed by homeowners instead of
farmed out to a management firm?


--
Forget the health food. I need all the preservatives I can get.
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On Fri, 11 Jun 2010 16:09:59 -0700, Dan Abel > wrote:

> The guy didn't pay his HOA, so they sold his house out from under him.
> He sued, saying that they hadn't notified him. They replied, saying
> that they had mailed him and put a notice on his front door for three
> months. He said he didn't read his mail or use his front door. Of
> course, the new owners had kicked him out.


What an idiot! Sea Ranch is a wonderful place, love the "banana belt"
area.

--
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Lou Decruss wrote:
>"Nancy Young" wrote:
>>Nancy2 wrote:
>>>Omelet wrote:

>>
>>>> Can one refuse to join one when purchasing a home?

>>
>>> I've never heard of someone refusing to pay HOAs after buying a home.
>>> It would be in the purchase agreement.

>>
>>The HOA doesn't just collect money to be a pain in the ass, they
>>pay for things that are spelled out in the agreement. Be it snow
>>removal, or a guard at the gate, or a pool, whatever. If people
>>refuse to pay, the bill doesn't go away, the other neighbors have to
>>pay more to make up the shortfall.
>>
>>Of course you have to pay if you buy into an HOA neighborhood.
>>By buying there you are a member of the HOA.

>
>Good gawd OM is an idiot. To add to your list they keep a fund for
>emergencies. A condo building would be really screwed if a major roof
>leak developed and they had to knock on doors with a hat looking for
>donations.


That's not true. Condos are typically seperate units, sometimes
attached as town/row houses but separate nevertheless... no biggie to
repair one small roof. You obviously don't know the difference
between condo and co-op.

Om is not an idiot, you are, and you are a LIAR... typical of
druggies. WTF would a normal brained person announce on the net that
they are a drug addict unless their widdle brain were fried to a
crisp.

I may have my differences with Om otherwise but for a single woman
taking care of an aged parent, owning her own home, and holding down a
responsible job I think she is doing very well, I applaud her... Om is
a Mench... so what that her house is not the taj mahal, Om has never
been pretentious but she is doing much better than you.

Lou is only good at disparaging folks who are successful, what an
envious LOSER... why don't you shoot up, you know you're dying to.

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On Fri, 11 Jun 2010 19:39:29 -0600, "gloria.p" >
wrote:

>Nancy2 wrote:
>
>>
>> Actually, in my opinion, properly installed chain link fences are much
>> more attractive than any wooden or picket fence, unless you've got a
>> horse farm. I especially like the newer black chain link which tends
>> to disappear into the background. Wooden fences arbitrarily lean here
>> and there, are uneven along the tops, break, discolor, etc. - and
>> block your vision so that yards look like they're tiny. I think
>> they're ugly.
>>

>
>
>Chain link looks very industrial to me or even institutional (have you
>ever driven by a super-max prison compound?)
>
>At least wood looks natural and organic unless it's the new "lifetime"
>plastic fence that in no way resembles real wood.
>
>I grew up in an area with lots of stone walls and still think a well-mde
>one is beautiful.
>
>gloria p


Even a sloppily made old moss/lichen covered stone wall is beautiful.
My property is bounded by pre-revolutionary stone walls, not the
neatest but not going to fall down in this lifetime.

Yeah, chain link reninds me of prison compounds. Even a rotted split
rail/picket fence is better than chain link. And I agree, those new
plastic/aluminum fences are butt ugli. I don't know why people make
diparaging remarks about wasting trees, trees are a very renewable
resource... the paper in your printer is from tree farms-that are
renewable every fifteen years. I just don't like how they're
destroying the rain forests... didju know that rain forest trees are
used to make TP.


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In article >,
Lou Decruss > wrote:

> I don't have a problem with OM's house as it's what she can afford and
> I can't even afford my own. But bitching about the evils of HOA's is
> ignorant.
>
> Lou


If you did own your own property, you might understand...

It's MY property and I paid for it!
No blanking HOA has any right to tell me how many tulips I can plant, or
whether or not I can own a boat!
--
Peace! Om

Web Albums: <http://picasaweb.google.com/OMPOmelet>
Only Irish coffee provides in a single glass all four essential food groups: alcohol, caffeine, sugar and fat. --Alex Levine
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In article >,
sf > wrote:

> Seems pretty stupid to buy into a neighborhood (with full disclosure
> about the HOA) and then refuse to abide by the rules. Go ahead and
> not pay. You or your heirs will pay eventually, because your house
> will have a lean against it at the very least.


I would never, NEVER purchase a house that was part of an HOA.
Neither would many people.

IMHO that lowers property values.
--
Peace! Om

Web Albums: <http://picasaweb.google.com/OMPOmelet>
*Only Irish *coffee provides in a single glass all four *essential food groups: alcohol, caffeine, sugar *and fat. --Alex Levine
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Omelet > wrote:

> Lou Decruss > wrote:


>> I don't have a problem with OM's house as it's what she can afford and
>> I can't even afford my own. But bitching about the evils of HOA's is
>> ignorant.


>If you did own your own property, you might understand...


>It's MY property and I paid for it!
>No blanking HOA has any right to tell me how many tulips I can plant, or
>whether or not I can own a boat!


Why would bitching about HOA's be ignorant? They are truly
Dark Overlords.

Steve
>Peace! Om
>
>Web Albums: <http://picasaweb.google.com/OMPOmelet>
> Only Irish coffee provides in a single glass all four essential food
>groups: alcohol, caffeine, sugar and fat. --Alex Levine



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In article >,
brooklyn1 > wrote:

> >Good gawd OM is an idiot. To add to your list they keep a fund for
> >emergencies. A condo building would be really screwed if a major roof
> >leak developed and they had to knock on doors with a hat looking for
> >donations.

>
> That's not true. Condos are typically seperate units, sometimes
> attached as town/row houses but separate nevertheless... no biggie to
> repair one small roof. You obviously don't know the difference
> between condo and co-op.
>
> Om is not an idiot, you are, and you are a LIAR... typical of
> druggies. WTF would a normal brained person announce on the net that
> they are a drug addict unless their widdle brain were fried to a
> crisp.
>
> I may have my differences with Om otherwise but for a single woman
> taking care of an aged parent, owning her own home, and holding down a
> responsible job I think she is doing very well, I applaud her... Om is
> a Mench... so what that her house is not the taj mahal, Om has never
> been pretentious but she is doing much better than you.
>
> Lou is only good at disparaging folks who are successful, what an
> envious LOSER... why don't you shoot up, you know you're dying to.


Thank you Sheldon... :-)
--
Peace! Om

Web Albums: <http://picasaweb.google.com/OMPOmelet>
Only Irish coffee provides in a single glass all four essential food groups: alcohol, caffeine, sugar and fat. --Alex Levine
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On Fri, 11 Jun 2010 21:44:01 +0000 (UTC), Doug Freyburger
> wrote:

>I don't get the reaction against HOAs. The function of an HOA is to
>keep the values up and the neighborhood nice. If I have good taste
>then what I do is not a problem with the HOA. If I have bad taste then
>chose to live in an HOA area to be able to tap someone else's good
>taste. HOA meetings can get petty but they are easily ignored as long
>as what you're doing is good stuff. If you want to leave junk in your
>yard or paint ugly colors I don't want you in my neighborhood anyways.
>Move to some place with no rules and so likely some place that looks bad.


Yahbut...we needed to repaint the house, which was plenny 'spensive,
Loosey. We used the HOA chart of permissible colors and proceeded to
repaint the house. Between the choosing of the paint, the painting of
the house and the finish, the HOA took that particular color off the
palate. We had to re-repaint the house or risk getting sued by the
HOA. And the DH is a very good lawyer who figured it was less
expensive to re-repaint the house than go to war with the HOA.

And I have never seen an HOA board that didn't include the *most* anal
retentive morons in the development. I'd use the term "Nazi," but the
first one to toss that perjorative out...

Terry "Squeaks" Pulliam Burd

--

"If the soup had been as warm as the wine,
if the wine had been as old as the turkey,
and if the turkey had had a breast like the maid,
it would have been a swell dinner." Duncan Hines


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In article 0>,
Wayne Boatwright > wrote:

> Prospective buyers should read the CC&R very carefully before
> agreeing to its terms in insure that it doesn't contain anything they
> object to.


Which is why I'd simply reject a house and property in an HOA. Period.
There are plenty of properties/houses on the market. ;-)

There were two major requirements I told the real estate agent I was
working with when I bought this one. All electric (no gas) and no HOA.

I bought this house for 35K 23 years ago.
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In article >,
Terry Pulliam Burd > wrote:

> On Fri, 11 Jun 2010 21:44:01 +0000 (UTC), Doug Freyburger
> > wrote:
>
> >I don't get the reaction against HOAs. The function of an HOA is to
> >keep the values up and the neighborhood nice. If I have good taste
> >then what I do is not a problem with the HOA. If I have bad taste then
> >chose to live in an HOA area to be able to tap someone else's good
> >taste. HOA meetings can get petty but they are easily ignored as long
> >as what you're doing is good stuff. If you want to leave junk in your
> >yard or paint ugly colors I don't want you in my neighborhood anyways.
> >Move to some place with no rules and so likely some place that looks bad.

>
> Yahbut...we needed to repaint the house, which was plenny 'spensive,
> Loosey. We used the HOA chart of permissible colors and proceeded to
> repaint the house. Between the choosing of the paint, the painting of
> the house and the finish, the HOA took that particular color off the
> palate. We had to re-repaint the house or risk getting sued by the
> HOA. And the DH is a very good lawyer who figured it was less
> expensive to re-repaint the house than go to war with the HOA.
>
> And I have never seen an HOA board that didn't include the *most* anal
> retentive morons in the development. I'd use the term "Nazi," but the
> first one to toss that perjorative out...
>
> Terry "Squeaks" Pulliam Burd


Point and score!!!
THIS kind of thing is why I hate HOA's!
--
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Only Irish coffee provides in a single glass all four essential food groups: alcohol, caffeine, sugar and fat. --Alex Levine
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On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 00:27:18 -0500, Omelet >
wrote:

>In article >,
> sf > wrote:
>
>> Seems pretty stupid to buy into a neighborhood (with full disclosure
>> about the HOA) and then refuse to abide by the rules. Go ahead and
>> not pay. You or your heirs will pay eventually, because your house
>> will have a lean against it at the very least.

>
>I would never, NEVER purchase a house that was part of an HOA.
>Neither would many people.
>
>IMHO that lowers property values.


Absolutely... HOA resales are difficult to sell without taking a huge
loss because they're very over priced bare bones units when new that
require the original owners to put in a lot of upgrades at very
inflated prices. HOAs are no different from glorified trailer
park/trash living. There's really little difference between HOA and
KOA rules except that at least with KOA you can pull up stakes and
vamoose at any time. Some folks need to live with lots of imposed
rules/regulations, they are incapable of thinking/doing for
themselves, I found HOA living very much like the military...
institutionalized, with everyone constantly inspecting/spying on each
other, ratting each other out, and 24/7 rumor mongering about each
other, and for the most ridiculous infractions; wouldn't be an hour
after sun up before 600 families all know that the Greens didn't close
their garage door last night (that's right, many HOAs don't permit
garage doors to remain open at night, some don't permit any vehicles
in the driveway over night, some don't allow homes to be built with
the garage door facing the street, adds a lot of unnessesary cost to
construction). HOAs also are occupied by more transients, they have a
much higher rate of turnover and foreclosures than regular homes, HOAs
are more like apartment living. HOAs are occupied by a bunch of
impotent ******s who need a forced savings plan for forced
maintenence... and with much of the monies skimmed, and used to
contract someones BIL who happens to be in the landscaping business,
someones FIL who just happens to own a road maintenence business,
someones SIL who has a pool service, etc., all at inflated prices.
When one joins an HOA they are giving the board of directors free rein
to manage their money however they see fit and with little to no
detailed accounting. No thank-Q, I'm a big boy now, I don't need
mommy and daddy telling me how to live, I'll spend my money and live
my life how I see fit. And we already have too much government, I
don't want to live with an extra layer of politico.
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On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 00:27:18 -0500, Omelet >
wrote:

> I would never, NEVER purchase a house that was part of an HOA.


That's your choice, but don't think you can purchase inside an HOA and
get away without paying dues.

> Neither would many people.


Then they're nuts, idiots or conspiracy theorists. Choosing to live
or not live within an HOA is one thing but actually believing a well
run HOA lowers property value is not even close to rational thinking.
Is Glenn Beck is telling them that?
>
> IMHO that lowers property values.


Not as far as I'm concerned, nor do others who belong to an HOA
believe that baloney. A properly run HOA does not lower does property
value (the housing bubble bust was not their fault); it helps maintain
or increase property value because, neighborhood common areas (such as
parks, meridians, pool and tennis courts) are maintained and
individual homes retain their curb appeal.


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On Fri, 11 Jun 2010 23:16:44 -0700, Terry Pulliam Burd
> wrote:

> And I have never seen an HOA board that didn't include the *most* anal
> retentive morons in the development. I'd use the term "Nazi," but the
> first one to toss that perjorative out...


I guess it's like anything else, those who are the most interested
volunteer their time. How about your nonanal retentive self
volunteering to serve on the board and unconstipating them?

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On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 09:09:18 -0500, Omelet >
wrote:

> Point and score!!!
> THIS kind of thing is why I hate HOA's!


<shrug> You have to paint your house anyway. I'd rather live next to
a beige one (and I hate beige) than pumpkin orange with green trim or
royal purple with pink trim. You can have all the boats, RV's you
want parked in driveways or in front of homes in your neighborhood.
Is that your neighbor's Mac truck parked over there? Isn't it lovely
to wake up to the smell of your neighbor's tar truck firing up every
morning? I'll stick with an HOA, however toothless.

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"brooklyn1" > wrote in message
...
>
> I may have my differences with Om otherwise but for a single woman
> taking care of an aged parent, owning her own home, and holding down a
> responsible job I think she is doing very well, I applaud her... Om is
> a Mench... so what that her house is not the taj mahal, Om has never
> been pretentious but she is doing much better than you.


I don't know what a Mench is, but that is one good post!

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On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 17:50:52 +0100, "Ophelia" >
wrote:

> I don't know what a Mench is,


Google - define Mench

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On Jun 5, 5:26*pm, Omelet > wrote:
> In article >,
>
> *"gloria.p" > wrote:
> > Lou Decruss wrote:

>
> > > All good points but the problem is anyone renting would need to work
> > > and it's not close to anything. *Not many retired folks want to rent.



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On Jun 7, 10:08*pm, Omelet > wrote:
> In article >,
>
>
>
> *"gloria.p" > wrote:
> > Lou Decruss wrote:

>
> > > If someone wants to paint their house orange, not mow the lawn and
> > > keep old rusty cars and appliances on it then a HOA isn't for them.
> > > Many others do just fine with the rules.

>
> > Exactly. *People move in to a neighborhood because they like the house
> > and the ambiance, then too many of them want to make radical changes in
> > their own yards and resent the HOA enforcing the covenants the owner
> > agreed to in the beginning.

>
> > HOAs (if run fairly) protect both your investment as well as your
> > neighbors'. *An Architectural Control subcommittee of our HOA
> > fields requests for changes, mostly investigating whether the
> > application meets covenants. *Unfortunately too many people are happy
> > only when the HOA applies the agreed-on regulations to OTHER people's
> > houses or yards.

>
> > gloria p

>
> I'd just as soon let the city ordinances that are VOTED on take care of
> issues with trashy people.
>
> They don't tell me how short to keep my lawn or how many tulips per bed
> I can plant.
>
> And yes, it really can get that ridiculous with HOA'S! *
>
> Petty little groups of tyrants...


Then don't buy a house in one, or live in one. Or a condo, since
those come with associations as well. Plenty of single family houses
(especially now :-() that are affordable and only subject to local
government regs. Leave the HOA's to the folks who like the certainty
that they afford.

maxine in ri
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"sf" > wrote in message
...
> On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 17:50:52 +0100, "Ophelia" >
> wrote:
>
>> I don't know what a Mench is,

>
> Google - define Mench


Yes, sf I do know how to google. I didn't say I couldn't search for it, I
said I didn't know what it meant.
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cshenk wrote:

> But the real point is that they vary. Sure, thousands of horror stories
> like Terry had, but many have a happy relationship with simple basics in
> the HOA. It's when they get overtly restrictive that they are bad. (I
> can't imagine one telling me what color I can paint my house!)


You can if you live in a historic neighborhood. Try to picture elegant
Charleston, SC neighborhood when someone lets their house go to weed, it
affects the entire area. Some historic area HOAs try to limit additions
or changes to the style of house on the public side so as to maintain
the historic integrity of the neighborhood.
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cshenk wrote:

> Oh on your color choices? Consider a lovely old wood victorian in
> wisteria with eggshell pale trim. Probably not allowed in some HOA's.
>

Actually, many Victorians were quite colorful! So it should depend on
the historical aspect of the home. A little house like Om's would look
stupid painted in 5 colors, yet a true Victorian could have that many
colors and still be true.
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Wayne Boatwright wrote:
> On Fri 11 Jun 2010 10:24:31p, Omelet told us...
>


>> No blanking HOA has any right to tell me how many tulips I can
>> plant, or whether or not I can own a boat!


I doubt the tulip restriction was ever in the covenants.
The HOA doesn;t acre if you own a boat, they only care if you
store it in your front yard.


>
> Prospective buyers should read the CC&R very carefully before
> agreeing to its terms in insure that it doesn't contain anything they
> object to.
>



To be fair, Wayne, it's not usually the CC&R the owners object to, but
the arbitrary "rules" the HOA invokes at monthly meetings at the nagging
of just a few owners.

E.G. Our neighborhood has a pedestrian gate at one end that faces the
high school, very convenient for our kids. When we moved here it was
unlocked from 6AM-10PM. About 10 years ago the Board voted, because of
a few complaints of "trespassing" to lock the gate 24/7 and provide keys
to the owners--for a $50 deposit (and $50 replacement every time a kid
misplaces one.) The end result is that kids prop the gate open for
friends or break the lock. No Board has ever dared to try to rescind
that vote because a few owners would be up in arms over the "lax
security" complaints that would be raised.

gloria p


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In article >,
"gloria.p" > wrote:

> > On Fri, 11 Jun 2010 16:09:59 -0700, Dan Abel > wrote:
> >
> >> The guy didn't pay his HOA, so they sold his house out from under him.
> >> He sued, saying that they hadn't notified him. They replied, saying
> >> that they had mailed him and put a notice on his front door for three
> >> months. He said he didn't read his mail or use his front door. Of
> >> course, the new owners had kicked him out.

> >

>
> The laws regarding HOA powers vary from state to state. The most they
> can do in Colorado is put a lien on the property after a few months of
> non-payment. If there is a sale the lien is either paid by the old
> owner or attached to the new owner's deed. In a foreclosure the HOA
> claim comes in second or third place after the mortgage holder's.
> Usually the HOA is SOL for the back dues.


The owner above must have been pretty eccentric. I believe a lien
holder can force a sale, at least somewhere, but yes, I think they have
to pay off all the prior lienholders first. Since most places financing
the purchase of a house want a solid lien, they make sure they are the
first filings. And having a lien transfer to a subsequent owner doesn't
sound very frequent, either. It's the same deal, the bank won't finance
a property with prior liens on it.

--
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Petaluma, California USA

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Terry Pulliam Burd wrote:

>
> Yahbut...we needed to repaint the house, which was plenny 'spensive,
> Loosey. We used the HOA chart of permissible colors and proceeded to
> repaint the house. Between the choosing of the paint, the painting of
> the house and the finish, the HOA took that particular color off the
> palate. We had to re-repaint the house or risk getting sued by the
> HOA.



That is insane! How could they change color choices when you were in
midstream and hold you liable for repainting?

Our HOA doesn't have an "acceptable" color range. They ask for color
chips to be submitted with the application for exterior work to be done
and vote at the next Architectural Control meeting to approve or ask for
a change. Most houses are southwestern earth tones with an occasionally
bold foray into blue or green trim. ;-)

With all respect to Bill, I would have tried to negotiate an exception
with the HOA. I HATE arbitrary rulings.

gloria p
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brooklyn1 wrote:

> I'll spend my money and live
> my life how I see fit. And we already have too much government, I
> don't want to live with an extra layer of politico.




Then it sounds as though you have selected the perfect place to live, in
the boonies with no one to bother you. Other people have other
priorities. Your way isn't the right way for everyone.

gloria p
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In article >,
sf > wrote:

> On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 09:09:18 -0500, Omelet >
> wrote:
>
> > Point and score!!!
> > THIS kind of thing is why I hate HOA's!

>
> <shrug> You have to paint your house anyway.


But Terry and Bill had just finished painting their house! The wrong
color. It was an approved color when they picked it, but then it wasn't
any more. So they repainted the house that they had just finished
painting.

Although I have argued with Om about HOAs in general, I would never buy
a house (SFR) with a HOA. I just don't want to do that. Too many
people have gotten screwed. My brother was one. There was a big fight
between the HOA and the owner/builder/developer. Real estate had gone
bad, and the owner/builder just wanted to dump the remaining lots as
fast as possible. The owner/builder completely ignored the rules of the
HOA. The HOA didn't have the power to fight the owner/builder, so they
took it out on the buyers. My brother didn't know about this. Of
course, the salesperson didn't tell him, and the HOA didn't either. My
brother was the first resident of his house. The inside wasn't quite
finished, so he got to choose carpet, tile, drapes and colors. The
front yard was landscaped, and looked fine, and the back yard was pure
dirt, so my brother could do what he wanted with it. It was just the
package he wanted. So, after getting settled in, and doing some
planning, and talking to landscape folks, he decided what he wanted. He
went to the HOA, and they turned him down flat. They refused to look at
anything, or talk about anything. They wanted him to rip out his front
yard, the one the builder/developer had put in before he even saw the
property. My brother protested. No good. They wanted the front yard
redone, properly, he wanted a back yard. They had the power, and there
was nothing my brother could do. So my brother negotiated. They wanted
him to hire a fancy landscape architect, for US$50,000 to start with.
My brother thought that the other front yards looked like overbuilt crap.

--
Dan Abel
Petaluma, California USA

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On Sat, 12 Jun 2010 14:19:17 -0700, Dan Abel > wrote:

> But Terry and Bill had just finished painting their house! The wrong
> color. It was an approved color when they picked it, but then it wasn't
> any more. So they repainted the house that they had just finished
> painting.


I missed that post. I thought they bought the house with the paint
already on it. Well, she's married to a lawyer so apparently they
decided it wasn't worth protesting because in a situation like that
the color could have been grandfathered in until they repainted.

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