On Wed, 28 Jan 2004 17:18:38 -0500, Nancy Young
> wrote:

>Did I read this the other day? 1 out of 4 Americans eat fast food
>every day. I couldn't find the exact quote.

From:

<http://www.nzherald.co.nz/entertainment/entertainmentstorydisplay.cfm?storyID=3545438&thes ection=entertainment&thesubsection=film&theseconds ubsection=general>

At the festival in Park City, Utah, he has had teams handing out
"Unhappy Meal" bags on the streets with a few "Fat Fun Facts". For
instance, one in four Americans visits a fast-food restaurant
every day. And did you know that McDonald's feeds more people
around the world every day than the population of Spain? The
makers have self-rated the film "F" - for "fat audiences".

What they don't say is 1 in 3 of those "1 of 4 Americans" visit a
fast food restaurant just to use the bathroom.

OK - So I just made that up.

>Okay, you have A, B, C & D. Do they mean A eats fast food every day?
>the rest who knows how often, or ...
>
>Does A eat fast food Sunday, B Monday, etc. If so, big whoop. That
>means A, B and C eats fast food twice a week. I don't think that is
>out of line.

It means out of 10,000 typical, random people, 2,500 of them will
eat from a fast food restaurant on any given day.

>What is fast food, anyway? Does my once a week pizza count? Or the
>occasional sub I order from the local deli? Or is it just the usual
>chain burger places?

There are plenty of definitions out there. It's bascially any
food prepared and/or served quickly. AKA "Quick Service" in the
industry. It's not limited to any type of food. It can even be
milkshake.

>60% of Americans are obese. Really, is that a fact? I would really
>love to hear where they came up with that one. Do doctors report
>that? because I don't recall the census asking my height or weight.

Like all studies, thay are taken from a random sampling of people.
DOing surverys is a whole industy in itself. How much do you
weigh, anyway? For my files...

"Obese", I beleive, is considered 25 or more lbs over the standard
weight for your height.

I would argue that if 60% of people are obese, how can the other
40% be a majority that deterines the average weight in the first
place? Maybe 40% of the people are underweight, insetad.

-sw

In article >, wrote:

> ... you know the rest.


> nancy (just really wondering how these numbers are formulated)


73.8% of all statisics are just made up.


:-)

--
Dan Abel
Sonoma State University
AIS

Steve Wertz wrote:
>
> On Wed, 28 Jan 2004 17:18:38 -0500, Nancy Young

> >Did I read this the other day? 1 out of 4 Americans eat fast food
> >every day. I couldn't find the exact quote.
>
> From:

> At the festival in Park City, Utah, he has had teams handing out
> "Unhappy Meal" bags on the streets with a few "Fat Fun Facts". For
> instance, one in four Americans visits a fast-food restaurant
> every day. And did you know that McDonald's feeds more people
> around the world every day than the population of Spain? The
> makers have self-rated the film "F" - for "fat audiences".

Ah, silly me, I searched on fast food, not fast-food.

> What they don't say is 1 in 3 of those "1 of 4 Americans" visit a
> fast food restaurant just to use the bathroom.
>
> OK - So I just made that up.

(laugh) Only when I'm on the road, and even then I can hold it, I
was a camel in a former life.

> >Okay, you have A, B, C & D. Do they mean A eats fast food every day?
> >the rest who knows how often, or ...
> >
> >Does A eat fast food Sunday, B Monday, etc. If so, big whoop. That
> >means A, B and C eats fast food twice a week. I don't think that is
> >out of line.
>
> It means out of 10,000 typical, random people, 2,500 of them will
> eat from a fast food restaurant on any given day.

I don't see a problem with that. Also, where are they finding these
random people? In the middle of farm country? Or Manhattan? I ate
calzone or a hot dog pretty much every day for lunch. Does that
count? What exactly is random about the study. (I'm not asking you,
I'm making my point)

> >What is fast food, anyway? Does my once a week pizza count? Or the
> >occasional sub I order from the local deli? Or is it just the usual
> >chain burger places?
>
> There are plenty of definitions out there. It's bascially any
> food prepared and/or served quickly. AKA "Quick Service" in the
> industry. It's not limited to any type of food. It can even be
> milkshake.

I ordered Chinese food tonight, they said I could pick it up in
10 minutes. So, Chinese food is fast food, my string beans in garlic
sauce and my egg roll. Probably more fat than a big mac, but I'll
get three meals out of it.

At any rate, if 'they' don't define fast food, this running around
saying '1 out of 4 people eats fast food every day' is meaningless.
I still think it's worded very badly for so called scientists.

> >60% of Americans are obese. Really, is that a fact? I would really
> >love to hear where they came up with that one. Do doctors report
> >that? because I don't recall the census asking my height or weight.
>
> Like all studies, thay are taken from a random sampling of people.
> DOing surverys is a whole industy in itself. How much do you
> weigh, anyway? For my files...

I would tell you, but I don't know. I'm not fat, but that is so not
bragging in any way.

> "Obese", I beleive, is considered 25 or more lbs over the standard
> weight for your height.

I'm not sure that would be fair, it must be a percentage. 25 pounds
on someone 7' tall is nothing, on someone short like me, it's more
fat.

> I would argue that if 60% of people are obese, how can the other
> 40% be a majority that deterines the average weight in the first
> place? Maybe 40% of the people are underweight, insetad.

Yeah, blame it on the skinny people, there you go, I can get behind
that premise.

nancy

Dan Abel wrote:
>
> In article >, wrote:
>
> > ... you know the rest.
>
> > nancy (just really wondering how these numbers are formulated)
>
> 73.8% of all statisics are just made up.
>
> :-)

(laughing!!!) That's funny.

nancy

> Nancy Young askes how are obesity statistics compiled:
>
>(laughing) Okay, I'm done now.
>
>nancy (just really wondering how these numbers are formulated)

Most all major US employers track their emplyee's physical well being via means
of periodical medical exams, whereas the statics gathered are shared with
disability insurance carriers, and most folks realize that insurers are in fact
actuaries... and if that's not enough there are many, many other means for
gathering health statistics. But by far the primary gatherer of obesity
statistics is the clothing industry... the tape measure doesn't lie.


---= BOYCOTT FRENCH--GERMAN (belgium) =---
---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =---
Sheldon
````````````
"Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation."

PENMART01 wrote:
>
> > Nancy Young askes how are obesity statistics compiled:
> >
> >(laughing) Okay, I'm done now.
> >
> >nancy (just really wondering how these numbers are formulated)
>
> Most all major US employers track their emplyee's physical well being via means
> of periodical medical exams,

Aside from being hired, I have never been forced to take a physical.
I worked for some major corporations. No one has weighed me in a
couple of decades.

nancy

"Nancy Young" > wrote in message
...
>
> ... you know the rest.
>
> I keep seeing all of these quotes, mostly here, about how many times
> people eat fast food, how many Americans are obese, etc.
>
> Did I read this the other day? 1 out of 4 Americans eat fast food
> every day. I couldn't find the exact quote.
>
> Okay, you have A, B, C & D. Do they mean A eats fast food every day?
> the rest who knows how often, or ...
>
> Does A eat fast food Sunday, B Monday, etc. If so, big whoop. That
> means A, B and C eats fast food twice a week. I don't think that is
> out of line.
>
> What is fast food, anyway? Does my once a week pizza count? Or the
> occasional sub I order from the local deli? Or is it just the usual
> chain burger places?
>
> 60% of Americans are obese. Really, is that a fact? I would really
> love to hear where they came up with that one. Do doctors report
> that? because I don't recall the census asking my height or weight.
> So, exactly how are they determining this number? If it's doctors,
> gee, maybe obese people go to the doctor more often? I don't know
> how much I weigh, how do these statistics reporters know?
>
> Because it comes up here so often, when I'm in large crowds (no pun
> intended), I sometimes take a quick look around. Go tailgating at
> a football game, look around, plenty of skinny people. Mall? Same
> deal. 60% obese? No. Perhaps it's a regional thing. Most of the
> people I see do not need to lose weight.
>
> While I'm at it, what is obese, anyway. I seem to recall that when
> I was a teenager, it was explained that 10% over your ideal weight is
> considered obese. Someone somewhere decided that my ideal weight at
> 5'2" is 108 to 115, something like that. By that rule, if I weigh
> much more than 125, I'm obese. But when the news shows go on about
> how many of us are obese, they drag out film footage of people who
> really should think about eating less. In other words, using the
> word obese and then showing the most extreme examples.
>
> (laughing) Okay, I'm done now.
>
> nancy (just really wondering how these numbers are formulated)

I don't have the answers for you, Nancy....but did you see the comics, I
think it was 2 Sundays ago, when they had the family around the table, the
Stats? They were each spouting off statistics and the last one says "64.3%
of statistics are incorrect" or something to that effect. It was funny.

kimberly

>Nancy Young writes:
>
>PENMART01 wrote:
>>
>> > Nancy Young askes how are obesity statistics compiled:
>> >
>> >nancy (wondering how these numbers are formulated)
>>
>> Most all major US employers track their emplyee's physical well being via
>means
>> of periodical medical exams,
>
>Aside from being hired, I have never been forced to take a physical.
>I worked for some major corporations. No one has weighed me in a
>couple of decades.

Somehow I knew you'd say that.

But you don't even adress my clothing industry comment... hmmm.

There are more plus size clothing purveyers than ever with new ones opening
constantly... even the old time mail order companies, like LL Bean, Eddie
Bauer, J Crew, and most all others have expanded their range of sizes to
include plus sizes. If they didn't they'd soon go out of business from loss of
sales. For mens clothing Xtra Large is now the most common size requested, and
for women it's mens Large. Now you're going to tell me how all those women
ordering Mens Large are six feet tall and over... yeah, right.

Americans are more and more becoming obese, not because they eat so much more,
but because more and more they excersize less and less... technology has made
our work and daily lives so that we hardly burn any more calories than those
burned during sleep.


---= BOYCOTT FRENCH--GERMAN (belgium) =---
---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =---
Sheldon
````````````
"Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation."

On Wed, 28 Jan 2004 19:08:17 -0500, Nancy Young
> wrote:

>> It means out of 10,000 typical, random people, 2,500 of them will
>> eat from a fast food restaurant on any given day.
>
>I don't see a problem with that. Also, where are they finding these
>random people? In the middle of farm country? Or Manhattan? I ate
>calzone or a hot dog pretty much every day for lunch. Does that
>count? What exactly is random about the study. (I'm not asking you,
>I'm making my point)

The restaurants report certain statistics to the National (and
local) Restaurant Association. Like number of people served in a
year, etc... By comparing them with the regional populations, it's
determined quite easily.

Note that of those 10,000 in the theoretical sample, 2,000 of them
probably eat fast food once every 6 months, while 2,000 eat it
every day. The other 6,000 eat it somewhere bwtween daily and
quarterly.

Making the statement "1 in 4 Americans eat FF every" is just a way
to simplify the statistic to make it easier to visualize (Except
in this case when busy-bodies like *you* start disecting them and
asking questions ;-)

-sw

On Wed, 28 Jan 2004 16:03:40 -0800, (Dan Abel)
wrote:

>In article >, wrote:
>
>> ... you know the rest.
>
>
>> nancy (just really wondering how these numbers are formulated)
>
>
>73.8% of all statisics are just made up.

There was actually a study that said that 68% of all studies were
seriosuly flawed.

-sw

On 29 Jan 2004 01:04:04 GMT, (PENMART01) wrote:
>But by far the primary gatherer of obesity
>statistics is the clothing industry... the tape measure doesn't lie.

This is why I buy/wear a lot of shorts - to throw off the industy
into thinking I'm much taller.

Bwhahahahah!

-sw

PENMART01 wrote:
> For mens clothing Xtra Large is now the most common size requested,
> and for women it's mens Large. Now you're going to tell me how all
> those women ordering Mens Large are six feet tall and over... yeah,
> right.

My wife is 6'1.5" and a 38DD. If she tried fitting into "normal" womens'
clothing I'd laugh. It's just not possible. You would see that there are
quite a few tall women if you'd just leave your farm, Sheldon.

> technology has made our work and daily lives so that we hardly burn
> any more calories than those burned during sleep.

The brain burns quite a few calories just to survive. I don't have exact
number because I want to hear you go on another Google rant, but I know
it burns quite a few more while awake. Of course other organs probably
work similarly.

--
John Gaughan
http://www.johngaughan.net/

il Wed, 28 Jan 2004 16:03:40 -0800, (Dan Abel) ha
scritto:

> 73.8% of all statisics are just made up.

"There are lies, damned lies, and statistics"
--
Cheers,
Loki [ Brevity is the soul of wit. W.Shakespeare ]

>John Gaughan writes:
>
>PENMART01 wrote:
>> For mens clothing Xtra Large is now the most common size requested,
>> and for women it's mens Large. Now you're going to tell me how all
>> those women ordering Mens Large are six feet tall and over... yeah,
>> right.
>
>My wife is 6'1.5" and a 38DD. If she tried fitting into "normal" womens'
>clothing I'd laugh.

Since you're being so indiscrete with your wife's measurements why are you
embarrassed to say that her waist and hips each measure 60" around, and she
weighs 600 pounds... and you transport her with a forklift... your wife is a
morbidly obese freak.

>> technology has made our work and daily lives so that we hardly burn
>> any more calories than those burned during sleep.
>
>The brain burns quite a few calories just to survive. I don't have exact
>number

Your pea brain doesn't burn any calories.


---= BOYCOTT FRENCH--GERMAN (belgium) =---
---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =---
Sheldon
````````````
"Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation."

Steve Wertz wrote:
> This is why I buy/wear a lot of shorts - to throw off the industy
> into thinking I'm much taller.

Amateur. I buy shorts because I'm a northerner living in the south. If I
wear jeans I will overheat and explode :-)

--
John Gaughan
http://www.johngaughan.net/

Steve Wertz > wrote in message >...
> On Wed, 28 Jan 2004 17:18:38 -0500, Nancy Young
> > wrote:

> >60% of Americans are obese. Really, is that a fact? I would really
> >love to hear where they came up with that one. Do doctors report
> >that? because I don't recall the census asking my height or weight.
>
> Like all studies, thay are taken from a random sampling of people.
> DOing surverys is a whole industy in itself. How much do you
> weigh, anyway? For my files...
>
> "Obese", I beleive, is considered 25 or more lbs over the standard
> weight for your height.
>
> I would argue that if 60% of people are obese, how can the other
> 40% be a majority that deterines the average weight in the first
> place? Maybe 40% of the people are underweight, insetad.

Obese is currently defined as having a BMI (body mass index) of over
30. Normal BMI is between 20-24.9, and overweight is between 25-29.9.

BMI = your weight in kg/(your height in cm)squared

Julie.

PENMART01 wrote:
> Since you're being so indiscrete with your wife's measurements why
> are you embarrassed to say that her waist and hips each measure 60"
> around, and she weighs 600 pounds... and you transport her with a
> forklift... your wife is a morbidly obese freak.

I didn't realize Ford makes a forklift called a "Taurus." But you'd know
better than I would.

> Your pea brain doesn't burn any calories.

I thought for sure you'd troll about the fact that I didn't use Google
to back up my facts. Instead you made a childish comment about the size
of my brain. I guess I'm not surprised.

--
John Gaughan
http://www.johngaughan.net/

Steve Wertz a écrit :

> "Obese", I beleive, is considered 25 or more lbs over the standard
> weight for your height.

There is now an official definition of obesity: an obese person has a BMI over 30. BMI under 19 means too thin, normal BMI between 19 and 25, "overweight" between
25 and 30.

Nathalie in Switzerland

"Nancy Young" > wrote in message
...
>
> ... you know the rest.
>
> I keep seeing all of these quotes, mostly here, about how many times
> people eat fast food, how many Americans are obese, etc.
>
> Did I read this the other day? 1 out of 4 Americans eat fast food
> every day. I couldn't find the exact quote.
>
> Okay, you have A, B, C & D. Do they mean A eats fast food every day?
> the rest who knows how often, or ...
>
> Does A eat fast food Sunday, B Monday, etc. If so, big whoop. That
> means A, B and C eats fast food twice a week. I don't think that is
> out of line.
>
> What is fast food, anyway? Does my once a week pizza count? Or the
> occasional sub I order from the local deli? Or is it just the usual
> chain burger places?

Fast Food, from M-W:

1 : of, relating to, or specializing in food that can be prepared and served
quickly <a fast-food restaurant>
2 : designed for ready availability, use, or consumption and with little
consideration given to quality or significance <fast-food TV programming>

'Fast food' is a newer name for old ideas. A hot dog from a cart is fast
food. Pizza is fast food and so is Chinese takeout. We didn't have a fancy
monicker for them then.


>
> 60% of Americans are obese. Really, is that a fact? I would really
> love to hear where they came up with that one. Do doctors report
> that? because I don't recall the census asking my height or weight.
> So, exactly how are they determining this number? If it's doctors,
> gee, maybe obese people go to the doctor more often? I don't know
> how much I weigh, how do these statistics reporters know?

Your driver's license has your height and weight on it. It's pretty much
public knowledge what your 'stats' are. Eye color too. Your insurance
company knows too. It's not like they're medical records or anything.

>
> Because it comes up here so often, when I'm in large crowds (no pun
> intended), I sometimes take a quick look around. Go tailgating at
> a football game, look around, plenty of skinny people. Mall? Same
> deal. 60% obese? No. Perhaps it's a regional thing. Most of the
> people I see do not need to lose weight.
>
> While I'm at it, what is obese, anyway. I seem to recall that when
> I was a teenager, it was explained that 10% over your ideal weight is
> considered obese. Someone somewhere decided that my ideal weight at
> 5'2" is 108 to 115, something like that. By that rule, if I weigh
> much more than 125, I'm obese. But when the news shows go on about
> how many of us are obese, they drag out film footage of people who
> really should think about eating less. In other words, using the
> word obese and then showing the most extreme examples.

There's obese and then there's morbidly obese. Of course, when the news
wants to drive the point home, they'll trot out the 'poster child' of
obesity, rather than the schlub who's merely 10 lbs overweight.

>
> (laughing) Okay, I'm done now.

No no, keep going; this was a good one.
>
> nancy (just really wondering how these numbers are formulated)

It's that guy. You know, when someone sez 'that guy said this' or 'that guy
said that'. Correlated to THEY, as in 'they say this' or 'they say that'.
Know what? THAT GUY is the president of THEY. <insert black helicopters
here>

Jack Amalgamatedivision

On Wed, 28 Jan 2004 17:18:38 -0500, Nancy Young
> wrote:

>... you know the rest.

The usual quote is "There are lies, damn[ed] lies, and statistics,"
variously attributed to Mark Twain who attributed it to Disraeli, and
Churchill, who may have also used the phrase.
>
>I keep seeing all of these quotes, mostly here, about how many times
>people eat fast food, how many Americans are obese, etc.

Looking up the quote, I came across reference to a book titled "Damned
Lies and Statistics" by Joel Best which looks pretty interesting.

http://tinyurl.com/3cyjy

The questions you ask are worth asking. Where *do* these numbers come
from? How are they meaningful? Obviously the 'researchers' don't ask
every single person (American?) how many times he/she ate in a fast
food joint. What was their sample population? Urban? Rural? Age?
Avaliability of alternatives? Many statistics are just re-pubished
from dubious source. A lot of footnotes and references does not a
truth make.

On Wed, 28 Jan 2004 19:08:17 -0500, Nancy Young
> wrote:
>
>> I would argue that if 60% of people are obese, how can the other
>> 40% be a majority that deterines the average weight in the first
>> place? Maybe 40% of the people are underweight, insetad.
>
>Yeah, blame it on the skinny people, there you go, I can get behind
>that premise.
>
>nancy

well, i'm a skinny person. but i bet you dollars to doughnuts that
you say more often to yourself, 'jesus, that person is fat' than
'jesus, that person is skinny.'

there's lots of round people out there. you can argue percentages if
you like.

your pal,
blake

blake murphy wrote:
>
> On Wed, 28 Jan 2004 19:08:17 -0500, Nancy Young
> > wrote:
> >
> >> I would argue that if 60% of people are obese, how can the other
> >> 40% be a majority that deterines the average weight in the first
> >> place? Maybe 40% of the people are underweight, insetad.
> >
> >Yeah, blame it on the skinny people, there you go, I can get behind
> >that premise.
> >
> >nancy
>
> well, i'm a skinny person. but i bet you dollars to doughnuts that
> you say more often to yourself, 'jesus, that person is fat' than
> 'jesus, that person is skinny.'
>
> there's lots of round people out there. you can argue percentages if
> you like.

I should make it clear that I am not making comment about people's
weight one way or another. As far as I'm concerned your weight is
your personal business. My comment was only about the media
constantly hitting us over the head with these statistics without
backing up the numbers. It's easy enough to skew a survey. Where
did they take the survey, what people did they target to take the
survey, what is their motive for taking the survey.

I'm just saying that my observations do not jibe with the numbers
'they' keep telling us. Just as a joke, I thought about my
neighborhood. 27 people in sight of my house. 3, maybe 4 could
stand to lose a few pounds, and not all that many, either.

Also, as in my question 'what exactly do they consider to be fast
food,' 1 out of 4 Americans eat fast food every day ... it doesn't
mean anything to me.

nancy

In article >, "Jack
Schidt®" > wrote:
(snip)
> Fast Food, from M-W:
>
> 1 : of, relating to, or specializing in food that can be prepared and
> served quickly <a fast-food restaurant> 2 : designed for ready
> availability, use, or consumption and with little consideration given
> to quality or significance <fast-food TV programming>
>
> 'Fast food' is a newer name for old ideas. A hot dog from a cart is
> fast food. Pizza is fast food and so is Chinese takeout. We didn't
> have a fancy monicker for them then.

Interesting. I think of fast food as already prepared just waiting for
me to step to the counter and make my selection so they can hand it to
me. McDonald's and their ilk. KFC and the like. Not pizza and not
Chinese takeout.
--
-Barb, <www.jamlady.eboard.com> updated 1/26/04
A good friend will come and bail you out of jail;
a true friend will be sitting next to you saying, "Damn,that was fun!"

Melba's Jammin' wrote:
> In article >, "Jack
> Schidt®" > wrote:
> (snip)
>
>>Fast Food, from M-W:
>>
>>1 : of, relating to, or specializing in food that can be prepared and
>>served quickly <a fast-food restaurant> 2 : designed for ready
>>availability, use, or consumption and with little consideration given
>>to quality or significance <fast-food TV programming>
>>
>>'Fast food' is a newer name for old ideas. A hot dog from a cart is
>>fast food. Pizza is fast food and so is Chinese takeout. We didn't
>>have a fancy monicker for them then.
>
>
> Interesting. I think of fast food as already prepared just waiting for
> me to step to the counter and make my selection so they can hand it to
> me. McDonald's and their ilk. KFC and the like. Not pizza and not
> Chinese takeout.

I don't think that Chinese take out food is fast food at all. In my
neighborhood, some very fine Chinese restaurants have both delivery
service and provide food for take out customers. It is all cooked to
order, as it would be if you ate in the premises and the long wait for
your dinner, unless you telephone in your order ahead of time will
prove that there is nothing "fast" about the food you are taking out.

It is the same with pizza. There is a Domino's in the immediate
neighborhood, but the only time I tasted it, it was so awful, I never
ate it again. Domino may be what is considered a fast food place, if
the pies are prepared ahead of time. Instead, there are some
wonderful Pizza places that deliver whole pies or pack up for take
out as little as a slice or as much as several pies for an occasion
such as a Super Bowl party. You can specify what kind of a crust you
want, what kind(s) of cheese, what kind(s) of topping. These places
have special wood burning pizza ovens and make each pie just the way
you want it. The cheese, when cool, does not turn into something akin
to yellow wax and if you reheat it, the cheese gets runny again. There
is nothing "fast" about these places.

However, there are also many gourmet shops that prepare many foods for
ready made dinners. Zabar, Fairway, Citarella, Agata and Valentina,
Grace's Market and many others are all over the city. You can go in
and order a whole dinner from soup to dessert and walk out with the
purchase within a couple of minutes. Everything is waiting for the
customer. Would not that be really fast food? Expensive, but fast,
with lobster salad at Citarella's going for $32.00 a pound. It is
only $10.00 at Zabar's.

So, what is fat food?

MS

Margaret Suran > wrote in
ink.net:

> So, what is fat food?
>

A Fast Food Restaurant is any place selling prepared food, where you don't
have to leave your car to get it.

--
Once during Prohibition I was forced to live for days on nothing but food
and water.
--------
FIELDS, W. C.

hahabogus wrote:
> Margaret Suran > wrote in
> ink.net:
>
>
>>So, what is fast food?
>>
>
>
> A Fast Food Restaurant is any place selling prepared food, where you don't
> have to leave your car to get it.
>
In NYC restaurants, such as KFC, McDonald, Burger King, etc., there is
no way to get food without leaving your car and going into the
restaurant. There are no drive through facilities to place your order
and no waiters to come out to take your order. So, a fast food
restaurant has to have a different definition.

Also, there have been many complaints about catered "fast food" for
schools, hospitals and hotels, all places that don't depend on
supplying food to automobile drivers and passengers.

MS

On Thu, 29 Jan 2004 14:41:09 GMT, Margaret Suran
> wrote:

>
>
>So, what is fat food?
>
In the case of my hips, anything I look at, I'm afraid.

Boron

>Margaret Suran says:
>
>hahabogus wrote:
>> Margaret Suran wrote:
>>
>>>So, what is fast food?
>>
>> A Fast Food Restaurant is any place selling prepared food, where you don't
>> have to leave your car to get it.
>>
>In NYC restaurants, such as KFC, McDonald, Burger King, etc., there is
>no way to get food without leaving your car and going into the
>restaurant. There are no drive through facilities to place your order
>and no waiters to come out to take your order. So, a fast food
>restaurant has to have a different definition.

Whether there's a drive-thru or car-hop service has no bearing on whether it's
fast food.

Chinese take-out and pizza definitely qualify as fast food... both can be
prepared quickly... anytime I've ever called in an order for either, regardless
how large or small my order, I've always been told "ten minutes"... in Chinese
everything takes "ten minutes-ten minutes"... that's abacus time, means twenty
minutes.

Merriam-Webster

fast-food
adjective
1951
1 : of, relating to, or specializing in food that can be prepared and served
quickly <a fast-food restaurant>
- fast food noun
---


---= BOYCOTT FRENCH--GERMAN (belgium) =---
---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =---
Sheldon
````````````
"Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation."

Frogleg wrote:
>
> On Wed, 28 Jan 2004 17:18:38 -0500, Nancy Young
> > wrote:
>
> >... you know the rest.
>
> The usual quote is "There are lies, damn[ed] lies, and statistics,"
> variously attributed to Mark Twain who attributed it to Disraeli, and
> Churchill, who may have also used the phrase.

Yeah, I knew the instant I sent it, wrong quote and misspelled at
that. I figured people would know what I meant.

> >
> >I keep seeing all of these quotes, mostly here, about how many times
> >people eat fast food, how many Americans are obese, etc.
>
> Looking up the quote, I came across reference to a book titled "Damned
> Lies and Statistics" by Joel Best which looks pretty interesting.
>
> http://tinyurl.com/3cyjy
>
> The questions you ask are worth asking. Where *do* these numbers come
> from? How are they meaningful? Obviously the 'researchers' don't ask
> every single person (American?) how many times he/she ate in a fast
> food joint. What was their sample population? Urban? Rural? Age?
> Avaliability of alternatives? Many statistics are just re-pubished
> from dubious source. A lot of footnotes and references does not a
> truth make.

I should buy that book, he's saying exactly what I was getting at.

nancy

On Wed, 28 Jan 2004 22:29:20 -0600, John Gaughan
> wrote:

>Steve Wertz wrote:
>> This is why I buy/wear a lot of shorts - to throw off the industy
>> into thinking I'm much taller.
>
>Amateur. I buy shorts because I'm a northerner living in the south. If I
>wear jeans I will overheat and explode :-)

That is so very true, but why the long sleave sweatshirt with the
shorts. :-)

Pan Ohco

On 29 Jan 2004 02:58:30 GMT, (PENMART01) wrote:

>
>There are more plus size clothing purveyers than ever with new ones opening
>constantly... even the old time mail order companies, like LL Bean, Eddie
>Bauer, J Crew, and most all others have expanded their range of sizes to
>include plus sizes. If they didn't they'd soon go out of business from loss of
>sales. For mens clothing Xtra Large is now the most common size requested, and
>for women it's mens Large. Now you're going to tell me how all those women
>ordering Mens Large are six feet tall and over... yeah, right.

Fashion? My son is a varsity wrestler, not an ounce of fat on him
during the season (wrestlers tend to be on a constant diet to get in a
lower weight class). If you based his weight on the clothes he bought,
you would guess he was overweight or obese - he wears pants waist 4 - 6
inches too large and shirts way too large.

The sales of underwear might be a better indicator. At least on him
they tend to fit properly.

The other datapoint about sizes - S/M/L... and 0,1,2,... - is that they
are relative and have changed over time. This is particularly true for
women's fashions. The sizes have actually gotten smaller to adapt to
the increase of smaller immigrant populations in the US.

Pan Ohco wrote:
> That is so very true, but why the long sleave sweatshirt with the
> shorts. :-)

Either you're just trying to make fun of me or you looked at the picture
on my site with me wearing a sweatshirt. I was wearing jeans in that
picture, since I took it up north in the winter ;-)

--
John Gaughan
http://www.johngaughan.net/

Dog3 wrote:

> Like Margaret, I don't think of Chinese food or pizza as fast-food. AFAIK,
> Chinese food and pizza are made to order.

I can't think of a pizzaria where I can't go and just grab a slice
(or two) of already made pizza. In the city (Manhattan especially),
you can get all kinds of food already made up at various delis,
whatnot.

At any rate, they say fast food like it's a bad thing, and who's to
say what the surveyed people thought fast food was.

> To me fast food is driving
> 'round to the drive up window. You put your order in to some static
> mystery voice. A bag of food is thrown out of the window at you. Once on
> the road again, one discovers the order is completely wrong.

(laugh) You've heard of my excursion to McDonald's, how annoying.

However, this McDonald's has no drive in. It's they only way they
got a permit to be in my town. No big ugly arches, either. No
disembodied voice, just an idiot in person one.

nancy

"Dog3" <dognospam@adjfkdla;not> wrote in message
4...
> Melba's Jammin' > deliciously posted in
> :
>
> > In article >, "Jack
> > Schidt®" > wrote:
> > (snip)
> >> Fast Food, from M-W:
> >>
> >> 1 : of, relating to, or specializing in food that can be prepared and
> >> served quickly <a fast-food restaurant> 2 : designed for ready
> >> availability, use, or consumption and with little consideration given
> >> to quality or significance <fast-food TV programming>
> >>
> >> 'Fast food' is a newer name for old ideas. A hot dog from a cart is
> >> fast food. Pizza is fast food and so is Chinese takeout. We didn't
> >> have a fancy monicker for them then.
> >
> > Interesting. I think of fast food as already prepared just waiting for
> > me to step to the counter and make my selection so they can hand it to
> > me. McDonald's and their ilk. KFC and the like. Not pizza and not
> > Chinese takeout.
>
> Like Margaret, I don't think of Chinese food or pizza as fast-food.
AFAIK,
> Chinese food and pizza are made to order. To me fast food is driving
> 'round to the drive up window. You put your order in to some static
> mystery voice. A bag of food is thrown out of the window at you. Once on
> the road again, one discovers the order is completely wrong.
>


I gotsta disagree on the 'made to order' status of pizza or takeout chinese.
Can you request the crust be thick or thin or somewhere in between? Can you
ask that the lo mein noodles be cooked al dente? Could you substitute wide
noodles for narrow ones? Just my impression of what's 'fast food'. I know
my local chinese takeout joint has vats of stuff cooking all day and they
then mix them and put them in the cartons for takeout. It's always '10
minute'.

The driveup window scenario rings so true. Recently I'd read where someone
with 2 way radios on same frequency as their local fast food drive up
(forget the brand) hijacked the airwaves, so to speak, and took to insulting
the customers. Too funny.

Jack Marconi&Cheese

Jack Schidt® wrote:

> I gotsta disagree on the 'made to order' status of pizza or takeout chinese.
> Can you request the crust be thick or thin or somewhere in between? Can you
> ask that the lo mein noodles be cooked al dente? Could you substitute wide
> noodles for narrow ones? Just my impression of what's 'fast food'. I know
> my local chinese takeout joint has vats of stuff cooking all day and they
> then mix them and put them in the cartons for takeout. It's always '10
> minute'.

I am used to ask for no added salt and at times, no soy sauce in some
of the dishes I order from the Chinese restaurant. I have asked for
some dishes with a different vegetable, for no water chestnuts, but
sugar peas, instead. I have just recently asked for those long green
beans, that are sautéed with garlic, to be made without the garlic,
because someone who was eating with us, is allergic to it.

I have never tried to ask for different noodles, I like the ones that
are used for lo mein, but some of the restaurants actually specialize
in noodle dishes and then you have a choice of many different kinds.

When I order Pizza, I order either thin crust or regular crust, but I
have asked for more or less cheese, to add a different one if it is
available, which is not always the case and other minor changes. I
have to admit, I do it only when someone who will eat the pizza with
me, asks me to ask for these changes. I can't even remember what kind
of cheese the last person asked me to order on the pie.

The restaurants, mostly small pizzarias, that sell pizza by the slice,
have pizza pies in the oven at all times, but the ones that sell only
whole pies, even if they are only individual ones, make and bake them
only after the customer orders them. In that case you can order them
any way you want them. We have several of these places near by,
Totonno's is one that I like, even if I have heard that the one in
Queens is much better than the one near me.
>
> The driveup window scenario rings so true. Recently I'd read where someone
> with 2 way radios on same frequency as their local fast food drive up
> (forget the brand) hijacked the airwaves, so to speak, and took to insulting
> the customers. Too funny.

That cannot happen here. No drive up windows, no two way radios,
nothing but old fashioned ways of ordering food in the Big Apple. You
can go to the restaurant or you can telephone.
>
> Jack Marconi&Cheese

You make me hungry for that dish. I only ate it once, but it was
really good. Four friends and I (we had met on the internet) went to
Lake Tahoe for a long week end almost three years ago. We rented a
condo with a kitchen and on the last day, one of the women took all
the left over cheeses, the left over eggs, the left over bacon and
kosher Zabar salami, found a box of elbow macaroni and while the rest
of us went for a walk, she made lunch for us. As a surprise. The
pasta was incredibly tasty, with little flecks of crunchy bacon and
chunks of salami and there was a marvelous crust on top of the dish.
I could never make anything that would taste that good.

My mother loved the macaroni and cheese that came in a box. From Kraft.

>
>

"Margaret Suran" > wrote in message
ink.net...
>
>
> Jack Schidt® wrote:
>
> > I gotsta disagree on the 'made to order' status of pizza or takeout
chinese.
> > Can you request the crust be thick or thin or somewhere in between? Can
you
> > ask that the lo mein noodles be cooked al dente? Could you substitute
wide
> > noodles for narrow ones? Just my impression of what's 'fast food'. I
know
> > my local chinese takeout joint has vats of stuff cooking all day and
they
> > then mix them and put them in the cartons for takeout. It's always '10
> > minute'.
>
> I am used to ask for no added salt and at times, no soy sauce in some
> of the dishes I order from the Chinese restaurant. I have asked for
> some dishes with a different vegetable, for no water chestnuts, but
> sugar peas, instead. I have just recently asked for those long green
> beans, that are sautéed with garlic, to be made without the garlic,
> because someone who was eating with us, is allergic to it.

I should clarify; my local Chinese joint is takeout only, not a restaurant
where one can sit down and enjoy a meal.
>
> I have never tried to ask for different noodles, I like the ones that
> are used for lo mein, but some of the restaurants actually specialize
> in noodle dishes and then you have a choice of many different kinds.
>
> When I order Pizza, I order either thin crust or regular crust, but I
> have asked for more or less cheese, to add a different one if it is
> available, which is not always the case and other minor changes. I
> have to admit, I do it only when someone who will eat the pizza with
> me, asks me to ask for these changes. I can't even remember what kind
> of cheese the last person asked me to order on the pie.
>
> The restaurants, mostly small pizzarias, that sell pizza by the slice,
> have pizza pies in the oven at all times, but the ones that sell only
> whole pies, even if they are only individual ones, make and bake them
> only after the customer orders them. In that case you can order them
> any way you want them. We have several of these places near by,
> Totonno's is one that I like, even if I have heard that the one in
> Queens is much better than the one near me.
> >
> > The driveup window scenario rings so true. Recently I'd read where
someone
> > with 2 way radios on same frequency as their local fast food drive up
> > (forget the brand) hijacked the airwaves, so to speak, and took to
insulting
> > the customers. Too funny.
>
> That cannot happen here. No drive up windows, no two way radios,
> nothing but old fashioned ways of ordering food in the Big Apple. You
> can go to the restaurant or you can telephone.
> >
> > Jack Marconi&Cheese
>
> You make me hungry for that dish. I only ate it once, but it was
> really good. Four friends and I (we had met on the internet) went to
> Lake Tahoe for a long week end almost three years ago. We rented a
> condo with a kitchen and on the last day, one of the women took all
> the left over cheeses, the left over eggs, the left over bacon and
> kosher Zabar salami, found a box of elbow macaroni and while the rest
> of us went for a walk, she made lunch for us. As a surprise. The
> pasta was incredibly tasty, with little flecks of crunchy bacon and
> chunks of salami and there was a marvelous crust on top of the dish.
> I could never make anything that would taste that good.
>
> My mother loved the macaroni and cheese that came in a box. From Kraft.
>

I'm jonesing for some mac and cheese too, especially since Nancy Young
admitted to putting some cayenne on top. Put the bug in my ear, big time.

Jack Kraft

John Gaughan > wrote in message >...
> PENMART01 wrote:
> > For mens clothing Xtra Large is now the most common size requested,
> > and for women it's mens Large. Now you're going to tell me how all
> > those women ordering Mens Large are six feet tall and over... yeah,
> > right.

That's the way kids wear them these days. It's a hip hop thing. I'm
5'4", weigh 135 lb and usually buy extra large sweat shirts and
t-shirts (the decorative kind), not that I'm hip hop (more like hip
hurts).

>
> My wife is 6'1.5" and a 38DD. If she tried fitting into "normal" womens'
> clothing I'd laugh. It's just not possible. You would see that there are
> quite a few tall women if you'd just leave your farm, Sheldon.
>

-bwg

Frogleg > wrote in message >. ..
> On Wed, 28 Jan 2004 17:18:38 -0500, Nancy Young
> > wrote:
>
> >... you know the rest.
>
> The usual quote is "There are lies, damn[ed] lies, and statistics,"
> variously attributed to Mark Twain who attributed it to Disraeli, and
> Churchill, who may have also used the phrase.
> >
> >I keep seeing all of these quotes, mostly here, about how many times
> >people eat fast food, how many Americans are obese, etc.
>
> Looking up the quote, I came across reference to a book titled "Damned
> Lies and Statistics" by Joel Best which looks pretty interesting.
>
> http://tinyurl.com/3cyjy
>

Another well known book is "How to Lie With Statistics" by Darell Huff
and Irving Geis. This book is often mentioned and occasionally
required reading in introductory statistics courses.

<http://www.sciencesbookreview.com/How_to_Lie_With_Statistics_0393310728.html>

-bwg

>> Jack Schidt® wrote:
>>
>>> I gotsta disagree on the 'made to order' status of pizza or takeou
> chinese.
>
>>> Can you request the crust be thick or thin or somewhere in
between? Can you
>
>>> ask that the lo mein noodles be cooked al dente? Could you
substitute wide
>
>>> noodles for narrow ones? Just my impression of what's 'fast
food'. I know
>
>>> my local chinese takeout joint has vats of stuff cooking all day
>>>and they
>
>>> then mix them and put them in the cartons for takeout. It's
>>>always '10 minute'.


I don't think the ones where I order food to be delivered, do that. At
least, not when I pass by to order something for take out and have to
wait for it.

Also, except for such things as the complimentary white rice, which
probably is cooked ahead of time, most Chinese restaurants no longer
use paper cartons. Now the food is put into plastic containers, with
see-through tops, so that the contents may be heated in the micro wave
oven. The containers are reusable and quite attractive.

>>
>> I am used to ask for no added salt and at times, no soy sauce in some
>> of the dishes I order from the Chinese restaurant. I have asked for
>> some dishes with a different vegetable, for no water chestnuts, but
>> sugar peas, instead. I have just recently asked for those long green
>> beans, that are sautéed with garlic, to be made without the garlic,
>> because someone who was eating with us, is allergic to it.
>
>
>
> I should clarify; my local Chinese joint is takeout only, not a
restaurant
> where one can sit down and enjoy a meal.


I am only referring to take out or delivery food. Of course, if you
eat in the restaurant, you may ask the chef to prepare the food to
your liking. Fortunately, I order from several places, that will do
the same for their telephone orders. Just the other day, I ordered
some food from Chef Ho's restaurant. I wanted no salt and no soy
sauce, as I have to watch my blood pressure. The man who took my
telephone order repeated: "No salt, no soy sauce", then added "no
taste". Honest, that's what he said.

MS

In article >,
Robert Klute > wrote:

> On 29 Jan 2004 02:58:30 GMT, (PENMART01) wrote:
>
> >
> >There are more plus size clothing purveyers than ever with new ones opening
> >constantly... even the old time mail order companies, like LL Bean, Eddie
> >Bauer, J Crew, and most all others have expanded their range of sizes to
> >include plus sizes. If they didn't they'd soon go out of business from loss
> >of
> >sales. For mens clothing Xtra Large is now the most common size requested,
> >and
> >for women it's mens Large. Now you're going to tell me how all those women
> >ordering Mens Large are six feet tall and over... yeah, right.
>
> Fashion? My son is a varsity wrestler, not an ounce of fat on him
> during the season (wrestlers tend to be on a constant diet to get in a
> lower weight class). If you based his weight on the clothes he bought,
> you would guess he was overweight or obese - he wears pants waist 4 - 6
> inches too large and shirts way too large.
>
> The sales of underwear might be a better indicator. At least on him
> they tend to fit properly.
>
> The other datapoint about sizes - S/M/L... and 0,1,2,... - is that they
> are relative and have changed over time. This is particularly true for
> women's fashions. The sizes have actually gotten smaller to adapt to
> the increase of smaller immigrant populations in the US.

You didn't read Jane Brody's column a week or two ago. The trend is
actually the opposite of what you describe. A women's size 8 today is
what used to be a size 12 20 years ago. The higher end clothing
manufacturers have initiated "vanity sizing", to satisfy women who want
to claim they're still a size 8 despite the middle aged spread.

--
C.J. Fuller

Delete the obvious to email me