In article >,
"Michael \"Dog3\"" > wrote:

> > I've always just tossed Brie rind.
> > Thanks for the idea.
> >
> > Does it freeze well? It might make an interesting stock ingredient.
>
> I don't have any idea about freezing it. I never tried to freeze it. I'd
> probably not freeze it but maybe sometime I'll do it as an experiment.
> Maybe someone else will read this and has tried to freeze it.
>
> Michael

Thanks! :-)
--
Peace! Om

I find hope in the darkest of days, and focus in the brightest. I do not judge the universe. -- Dalai Lama

htn963 wrote:

> Believe me, I have tried in good faith to consider the moldy rinds as
> part of the overall cheese "experience", but their presence inevitably
> brings it down a notch. I suspect they're there just to make some of
> us appreciate what is within them more.

Here is what Patricia Wells writes in _The Food Lover's Guide to Paris_.

Victor

The Rind

The million dollar question: Should you eat the rind or shouldn't you?
Even the experts don't agree. According to _Larousse des Fromages_, the
French Cheese bible, it is all a question of personal taste. Larousse
advises, however, not to leave a messy plate full of little bits of
crust. Pierre Androuët, the former dean of Paris cheese merchants, is
more definite. Never eat the rind, he says, because it harbors all the
cheese's developing molds and yeasts and can emit an alkaline odor. The
truth? It is really up to you, though let logic rule. The rinds of
soft-ripened cheese such as Brie and Camembert are definitely edible,
and when the cheese is perfectly ripe, the thin, bloomy _croûte_ adds
both flavor and texture. However, with another soft cheese, Vacherin,
the rind is always removed, and the creamy cheese is scooped out with a
spoon. The rinds of semi-soft cheese, such as Reblochon, can have a
very nutty flavor. The crust is always discarded when eating hard
mountain cheese, such as Emmental, Gruyère, and _tête-de-moine_.

On Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:43:09 -0400, "pavane"
> shouted from the highest rooftop:

>
>"bob" > wrote in message
.. .
>| On 12 Mar 2009 21:16:22 GMT, Wim van Bemmel >
>| shouted from the highest rooftop:
>|
>| >On Fri, 13 Mar 2009 10:02:19 +1300, bob wrote:
>| >
>| >> On 12 Mar 2009 20:04:45 GMT, Wim van Bemmel >
>| >> shouted from the highest rooftop:
>| >>
>| >>>On Thu, 12 Mar 2009 07:18:52 +0000, Nick Cramer wrote:
>| >>>
>| >>>> "mom peagram" > wrote:
>| >>>>> "isw" > wrote in message
>| >>>>> > Gloria P > wrote:
>| >>>>> >> bob wrote:
>| >>>>> >> > Sqwertz > shouted :
>| >>>>> >> >
>| >>>>> >> >> I've been milking this chunk of Roquefort for 10 days now. I
>| >>>>> >> >> usually have about an ounce of it every other night for
>| >>>>> >> >> dessert. Then I go a whole week without, before buying another
>| >>>>> >> >> hunk.
>| >>>>> >> >
>| >>>>> >> > Not I. Give me a ripe, unpasteurised French Brie, a good, strong
>| >>>>> >> > Danish Blue, a powerful English Stilton or a chunk of Roquefort
>| >>>>> >> > crawling off the cheese dish and I'll be your friend for life.
>| >>>>
>| >>>>> >> Rosenborg Danish Blue
>| >>>>> >
>| >>>>> > Sharp and biting, not to mention a bit thin on flavor. OK in a
>| >>>>> > pinch, but certainly no competition to roquefort.
>| >>>>
>| >>>>> What you need is a good piece of Royal Blue Stilton!
>| >>>>
>| >>>> That's what makes a horserace, eh? I've had Bleu, Stilton and
>| >>>> Roquefort. They're all good. My favorite is Gorgonzola!
>| >>>
>| >>>I go with you !
>| >>
>| >> Forgot about Gorgonzola. I like them all ... but my favourite is a well
>| >> ripened unpasteurised French Brie. I could eat it every day ...
>| >
>| >If it comes to that type of cheese, I prefer an unpasteurized Pont
>| >l'Évêque. From Normandy. Or even a Camembert AOC. Unpasteurized by
>| >definition. Brie is too easy for me.
>|
>| Have you ever tried the "Charles VII" Camembert au lait cru? It's from
>| a dairy cooperative in Lochoise Region Verneuil Reignac and comes in a
>| 250g size which my wife's late Aunt introduced us to in England.
>| Unfortunately, we can't get it here in New Zealand.
>|
>| Photo: http://i12.ebayimg.com/03/i/001/2b/f3/c59f_12.JPG
>|
>
>Sorry, not available in US either due to the ageing restrictions
>on raw milk cheeses.

No wonder what little unpasteurised Brie we get in New Zealand is so
expensive. It would have to be air-freighted from France and even if
the flight had only one refueling stop it would still take around 22
hours.


--

una cerveza mas por favor ...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~
Wax-up and drop-in of Surfing's Golden Years: <http://www.surfwriter.net>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~

In article >,
bob > wrote:

> On Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:43:09 -0400, "pavane"
> > shouted from the highest rooftop:

> >Sorry, not available in US either due to the ageing restrictions
> >on raw milk cheeses.
>
> No wonder what little unpasteurised Brie we get in New Zealand is so
> expensive. It would have to be air-freighted from France and even if
> the flight had only one refueling stop it would still take around 22
> hours.


I'm confused (not unusual). There's raw milk. There's raw milk cheese,
made from raw milk. There's cheese made from pasteurized milk. Then
there's cheese that's been pasteurized after manufacture and aging, but
before sale. Which one are you referring to above?

What kills people are raw milk and unaged raw milk cheese. Thus the
aging restrictions in the US, which say raw milk cheese must be aged at
least 60 days.

New Zealand has its own import laws, which gave me a headache after a
couple of minutes, so I gave up trying to read them.

--
Dan Abel
Petaluma, California USA

On Mon, 16 Mar 2009 16:19:23 -0700, Dan Abel > shouted
from the highest rooftop:

>In article >,
> bob > wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:43:09 -0400, "pavane"
>> > shouted from the highest rooftop:
>
>> >Sorry, not available in US either due to the ageing restrictions
>> >on raw milk cheeses.
>>
>> No wonder what little unpasteurised Brie we get in New Zealand is so
>> expensive. It would have to be air-freighted from France and even if
>> the flight had only one refueling stop it would still take around 22
>> hours.
>
>
>I'm confused (not unusual). There's raw milk. There's raw milk cheese,
>made from raw milk. There's cheese made from pasteurized milk. Then
>there's cheese that's been pasteurized after manufacture and aging, but
>before sale. Which one are you referring to above?
>
>What kills people are raw milk and unaged raw milk cheese. Thus the
>aging restrictions in the US, which say raw milk cheese must be aged at
>least 60 days.
>
>New Zealand has its own import laws, which gave me a headache after a
>couple of minutes, so I gave up trying to read them.

Whereas your confusion is entirely justified, mine is just ...
confusing.

I was referring to cheese made from unpasteurised milk, but I got the
ageing restriction thing completely assbackwards.

BTW - NZ has only allowed the importation of cheese made from
unpasteurised milk for the past couple of years. Locally produced raw
milk has been available for far longer, but is subject to strict
regulation. So are local cheeses made from unpasteurised milk. God
only knows what kind of bureaucratic hoops the government makes raw
milk cheese importers jump through.

Back in the late-seventies we used to live close to another coastal
property that was run as a dairy farm that produced goat milk and I'd
often walk a kilometre or so over to Sylvia's milking shed with a
clean, empty glass flagon bottle to exchange for a full flagon of
fresh raw goat's milk. Sometimes I'd even help milk the goats and knew
some of them by name.

My wife and the kids absolutely hated the taste and smell of goat's
milk, but I loved it and sometimes made my own cottage cheese and
yogurt with it.

There were a number of dairy & beef farms around the area back then,
but coastal property prices have forced all of them to close, albeit
making their former owners a lot richer in the process.


--

una cerveza mas por favor ...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~
Wax-up and drop-in of Surfing's Golden Years: <http://www.surfwriter.net>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~

"pavane" > wrote in message
...
>
> "bob" > wrote in message
> ...
> | On 12 Mar 2009 21:16:22 GMT, Wim van Bemmel >
> | shouted from the highest rooftop:
> |
> | >On Fri, 13 Mar 2009 10:02:19 +1300, bob wrote:
> | >
> | >> On 12 Mar 2009 20:04:45 GMT, Wim van Bemmel >
> | >> shouted from the highest rooftop:
> | >>
> | >>>On Thu, 12 Mar 2009 07:18:52 +0000, Nick Cramer wrote:
> | >>>
> | >>>> "mom peagram" > wrote:
> | >>>>> "isw" > wrote in message
> | >>>>> > Gloria P > wrote:
> | >>>>> >> bob wrote:
> | >>>>> >> > Sqwertz > shouted :
> | >>>>> >> >
> | >>>>> >> >> I've been milking this chunk of Roquefort for 10 days now.
> I
> | >>>>> >> >> usually have about an ounce of it every other night for
> | >>>>> >> >> dessert. Then I go a whole week without, before buying
> another
> | >>>>> >> >> hunk.
> | >>>>> >> >
> | >>>>> >> > Not I. Give me a ripe, unpasteurised French Brie, a good,
> strong
> | >>>>> >> > Danish Blue, a powerful English Stilton or a chunk of
> Roquefort
> | >>>>> >> > crawling off the cheese dish and I'll be your friend for
> life.
> | >>>>
> | >>>>> >> Rosenborg Danish Blue
> | >>>>> >
> | >>>>> > Sharp and biting, not to mention a bit thin on flavor. OK in a
> | >>>>> > pinch, but certainly no competition to roquefort.
> | >>>>
> | >>>>> What you need is a good piece of Royal Blue Stilton!
> | >>>>
> | >>>> That's what makes a horserace, eh? I've had Bleu, Stilton and
> | >>>> Roquefort. They're all good. My favorite is Gorgonzola!
> | >>>
> | >>>I go with you !
> | >>
> | >> Forgot about Gorgonzola. I like them all ... but my favourite is a
> well
> | >> ripened unpasteurised French Brie. I could eat it every day ...
> | >
> | >If it comes to that type of cheese, I prefer an unpasteurized Pont
> | >l'Évêque. From Normandy. Or even a Camembert AOC. Unpasteurized by
> | >definition. Brie is too easy for me.
> |
> | Have you ever tried the "Charles VII" Camembert au lait cru? It's from
> | a dairy cooperative in Lochoise Region Verneuil Reignac and comes in a
> | 250g size which my wife's late Aunt introduced us to in England.
> | Unfortunately, we can't get it here in New Zealand.
> |
> | Photo: http://i12.ebayimg.com/03/i/001/2b/f3/c59f_12.JPG
> |
>
> Sorry, not available in US either due to the ageing restrictions
> on raw milk cheeses.
>
> pavane
>

I doubt if the restrictions are simply on ageing. The boutique
cheesemakers would take the time. The ban is on unpasteurized
milk entirely, but with a little leeway on how long vs. how hot.
And judging from President Obama's recent remarks on food safety,
there doesn't seem to be much prospect of modifying that ban.
The ADA will be pleased.

I can.

It's highly over rated.


You want *really* good cheese???


http://www.brunyislandcheese.com.au/

Check out Nicks Blog.......

http://www.brunyislandcheese.com.au/blog/


--
Peter Lucas
Brisbane
Australia

Killfile all Google Groups posters.........

http://improve-usenet.org/

http://improve-usenet.org/filters_bg.html

"Joel Olson" > wrote in message
...
| "pavane" > wrote in message
| ...
| >
| > "bob" > wrote in message
| > ...
| > | On 12 Mar 2009 21:16:22 GMT, Wim van Bemmel >
| > | shouted from the highest rooftop:
| > |
| > | >On Fri, 13 Mar 2009 10:02:19 +1300, bob wrote:
| > | >
| > | >> On 12 Mar 2009 20:04:45 GMT, Wim van Bemmel >
| > | >> shouted from the highest rooftop:
| > | >>
| > | >>>On Thu, 12 Mar 2009 07:18:52 +0000, Nick Cramer wrote:
| > | >>>
| > | >>>> "mom peagram" > wrote:
| > | >>>>> "isw" > wrote in message
| > | >>>>> > Gloria P > wrote:
| > | >>>>> >> bob wrote:
| > | >>>>> >> > Sqwertz > shouted :
| > | >>>>> >> >
| > | >>>>> >> >> I've been milking this chunk of Roquefort for 10 days now.
| > I
| > | >>>>> >> >> usually have about an ounce of it every other night for
| > | >>>>> >> >> dessert. Then I go a whole week without, before buying
| > another
| > | >>>>> >> >> hunk.
| > | >>>>> >> >
| > | >>>>> >> > Not I. Give me a ripe, unpasteurised French Brie, a good,
| > strong
| > | >>>>> >> > Danish Blue, a powerful English Stilton or a chunk of
| > Roquefort
| > | >>>>> >> > crawling off the cheese dish and I'll be your friend for
| > life.
| > | >>>>
| > | >>>>> >> Rosenborg Danish Blue
| > | >>>>> >
| > | >>>>> > Sharp and biting, not to mention a bit thin on flavor. OK in a
| > | >>>>> > pinch, but certainly no competition to roquefort.
| > | >>>>
| > | >>>>> What you need is a good piece of Royal Blue Stilton!
| > | >>>>
| > | >>>> That's what makes a horserace, eh? I've had Bleu, Stilton and
| > | >>>> Roquefort. They're all good. My favorite is Gorgonzola!
| > | >>>
| > | >>>I go with you !
| > | >>
| > | >> Forgot about Gorgonzola. I like them all ... but my favourite is a
| > well
| > | >> ripened unpasteurised French Brie. I could eat it every day ...
| > | >
| > | >If it comes to that type of cheese, I prefer an unpasteurized Pont
| > | >l'Évêque. From Normandy. Or even a Camembert AOC. Unpasteurized by
| > | >definition. Brie is too easy for me.
| > |
| > | Have you ever tried the "Charles VII" Camembert au lait cru? It's from
| > | a dairy cooperative in Lochoise Region Verneuil Reignac and comes in a
| > | 250g size which my wife's late Aunt introduced us to in England.
| > | Unfortunately, we can't get it here in New Zealand.
| > |
| > | Photo: http://i12.ebayimg.com/03/i/001/2b/f3/c59f_12.JPG
| > |
| >
| > Sorry, not available in US either due to the ageing restrictions
| > on raw milk cheeses.
| >
| > pavane
| >
|
| I doubt if the restrictions are simply on ageing. The boutique
| cheesemakers would take the time. The ban is on unpasteurized
| milk entirely, but with a little leeway on how long vs. how hot.
| And judging from President Obama's recent remarks on food safety,
| there doesn't seem to be much prospect of modifying that ban.
| The ADA will be pleased.

The US restrictions are specifically on ageing. Here is an article from
Slate that explains it a bit, and a handy excerpt:

It is legal to use unpasteurized milk in cheese only if that cheese has
been aged more than 60 days (most potentially harmful bacteria die
in this time). Tragically, this rules out all the young Brie, Camembert
and Epoisses (most of which are aged around 30 days) that many
consider to be the pinnacle of the cheese-making art. Steven
Jenkins, author of "Cheese Primer" (Workman, 1996) and perhaps
America's leading authority on cheese, calls the pasteurized Brie
and Camembert available in America, "pretenders -- inauthentic
impostors bearing their names."

http://archive.salon.com/travel/food...ese/index.html

pavane

In article >,
"pavane" > wrote:

> "Joel Olson" > wrote in message
> ...

> | "pavane" > wrote in message
> | ...
> | >
> | > "bob" > wrote in message

> | > | >> Forgot about Gorgonzola. I like them all ... but my favourite is a
> | > well
> | > | >> ripened unpasteurised French Brie. I could eat it every day ...

> | > Sorry, not available in US either due to the ageing restrictions
> | > on raw milk cheeses.

> | I doubt if the restrictions are simply on ageing. The boutique
> | cheesemakers would take the time. The ban is on unpasteurized
> | milk entirely, but with a little leeway on how long vs. how hot.

> The US restrictions are specifically on ageing. Here is an article from
> Slate that explains it a bit, and a handy excerpt:
>
> It is legal to use unpasteurized milk in cheese only if that cheese has
> been aged more than 60 days (most potentially harmful bacteria die
> in this time). Tragically, this rules out all the young Brie, Camembert
> and Epoisses (most of which are aged around 30 days) that many
> consider to be the pinnacle of the cheese-making art. Steven
> Jenkins, author of "Cheese Primer" (Workman, 1996) and perhaps
> America's leading authority on cheese, calls the pasteurized Brie
> and Camembert available in America, "pretenders -- inauthentic
> impostors bearing their names."

Still, are we referring to pasteurized cheese, or cheese made from
pasteurized milk?

--
Dan Abel
Petaluma, California USA

Michael \"Dog3\" wrote:
> Victor Sack > : in
> rec.food.cooking
>
>
>>Here is what Patricia Wells writes in _The Food Lover's Guide to
>
> Paris_.
>
>>Victor
>>
>> The Rind
>>
>>The million dollar question: Should you eat the rind or shouldn't you?
>>Even the experts don't agree. According to _Larousse des Fromages_,
>
> the
>
>>French Cheese bible, it is all a question of personal taste. Larousse
>>advises, however, not to leave a messy plate full of little bits of
>>crust. Pierre Androuët, the former dean of Paris cheese merchants, is
>>more definite. Never eat the rind, he says, because it harbors all the
>>cheese's developing molds and yeasts and can emit an alkaline odor.
>
> The
>
>>truth? It is really up to you, though let logic rule. The rinds of
>>soft-ripened cheese such as Brie and Camembert are definitely edible,
>>and when the cheese is perfectly ripe, the thin, bloomy _croûte_ adds
>>both flavor and texture. However, with another soft cheese, Vacherin,
>>the rind is always removed, and the creamy cheese is scooped out with a
>>spoon. The rinds of semi-soft cheese, such as Reblochon, can have a
>>very nutty flavor. The crust is always discarded when eating hard
>>mountain cheese, such as Emmental, Gruyère, and _tête-de-moine_.
>
>
> Interesting and pretty much how I've gone about it with my "taste test".
> Thanks for the post Victor.
>
> Michael

I have never tried it but i have read of people saving the 'rinds' and
placing them in a plastic bag with other cheese to flavor those other
cheeses.
--
JL

"Dan Abel" > wrote in message
...
| In article >,
| "pavane" > wrote:
|
| > "Joel Olson" > wrote in message
| > ...
|
| > | "pavane" > wrote in message
| > | ...
| > | >
| > | > "bob" > wrote in message
|
| > | > | >> Forgot about Gorgonzola. I like them all ... but my favourite is a
| > | > well
| > | > | >> ripened unpasteurised French Brie. I could eat it every day ...
|
| > | > Sorry, not available in US either due to the ageing restrictions
| > | > on raw milk cheeses.
|
| > | I doubt if the restrictions are simply on ageing. The boutique
| > | cheesemakers would take the time. The ban is on unpasteurized
| > | milk entirely, but with a little leeway on how long vs. how hot.
|
| > The US restrictions are specifically on ageing. Here is an article from
| > Slate that explains it a bit, and a handy excerpt:
| >
| > It is legal to use unpasteurized milk in cheese only if that cheese has
| > been aged more than 60 days (most potentially harmful bacteria die
| > in this time). Tragically, this rules out all the young Brie, Camembert
| > and Epoisses (most of which are aged around 30 days) that many
| > consider to be the pinnacle of the cheese-making art. Steven
| > Jenkins, author of "Cheese Primer" (Workman, 1996) and perhaps
| > America's leading authority on cheese, calls the pasteurized Brie
| > and Camembert available in America, "pretenders -- inauthentic
| > impostors bearing their names."
|
| Still, are we referring to pasteurized cheese, or cheese made from
| pasteurized milk?

Cheese made from pasteurized milk. The term "pasteurized
cheese" is understood but not too common, normally it is called
"processed pasteurized cheese," the "processed" part giving it shelf
and heat stability as in the supermarket sliced cheeses or the
Velveeta variants. Once the milk is made into cheese I don't believe
that it can be pasteurized any longer, the pasteurization refers to
action taken on the milk itself. Wikipedia has an interesting article
on the differences, and you can find a lot of semantic muddle around
the internet if you try. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Processed_cheese

pavane

In article >,
"pavane" > wrote:

> "Dan Abel" > wrote in message
> ...

> | Still, are we referring to pasteurized cheese, or cheese made from
> | pasteurized milk?
>
> Cheese made from pasteurized milk. The term "pasteurized
> cheese" is understood but not too common, normally it is called
> "processed pasteurized cheese," the "processed" part giving it shelf
> and heat stability as in the supermarket sliced cheeses or the
> Velveeta variants. Once the milk is made into cheese I don't believe
> that it can be pasteurized any longer, the pasteurization refers to
> action taken on the milk itself. Wikipedia has an interesting article
> on the differences, and you can find a lot of semantic muddle around
> the internet if you try. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Processed_cheese

Yeah, I've tried, and my brain has in fact gotten pretty muddled. It is
possible to pasteurize cheese after it is made and aged. This has the
effect of stopping the aging process, so the cheese keeps well (although
it still requires refrigeration) without going bad. Wiki mentions this
as the process for making "Laughing Cow", although that is not only
pasteurized, but also a processed cheese (made from aged cheese plus
other stuff).

The reason I keep harping on this is that there is a little cheese
factory outside of town that we have been going to for the last 35
years, and my father bought their cheese for many years before then:

http://www.marinfrenchcheese.com/

They have been making soft cheeses, in the style of brie and camembert,
since 1865. It was a small family operation, and then they sold out.
There was a slight problem with unwanted molds, and the stupid company
reacted by pasteurizing their cheese, at which point I stopped buying
it. They had always (in my memory) pasteurized their milk, and that
machine was the first stop in their tour (temporarily discontinued -
since December?). The cheese was made and aged in the factory, but the
aging wasn't long enough for my tastes. They have since stopped
pasteurizing the cheese, and I have started buying it again, although
it's awfully darned expensive. However, I can once again age it in my
fridge.

--
Dan Abel
Petaluma, California USA

"pavane" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Joel Olson" > wrote in message
> ...
> | "pavane" > wrote in message
> | ...
> | >
> | > "bob" > wrote in message
> | > ...
> | > | On 12 Mar 2009 21:16:22 GMT, Wim van Bemmel >
> | > | shouted from the highest rooftop:
> | > |
> | > | >On Fri, 13 Mar 2009 10:02:19 +1300, bob wrote:
> | > | >
> | > | >> On 12 Mar 2009 20:04:45 GMT, Wim van Bemmel
> >
> | > | >> shouted from the highest rooftop:
> | > | >>
> | > | >>>On Thu, 12 Mar 2009 07:18:52 +0000, Nick Cramer wrote:
> | > | >>>
> | > | >>>> "mom peagram" > wrote:
> | > | >>>>> "isw" > wrote in message
> | > | >>>>> > Gloria P > wrote:
> | > | >>>>> >> bob wrote:
> | > | >>>>> >> > Sqwertz > shouted :
> | > | >>>>> >> >
> | > | >>>>> >> >> I've been milking this chunk of Roquefort for 10 days
> now.
> | > I
> | > | >>>>> >> >> usually have about an ounce of it every other night for
> | > | >>>>> >> >> dessert. Then I go a whole week without, before buying
> | > another
> | > | >>>>> >> >> hunk.
> | > | >>>>> >> >
> | > | >>>>> >> > Not I. Give me a ripe, unpasteurised French Brie, a good,
> | > strong
> | > | >>>>> >> > Danish Blue, a powerful English Stilton or a chunk of
> | > Roquefort
> | > | >>>>> >> > crawling off the cheese dish and I'll be your friend for
> | > life.
> | > | >>>>
> | > | >>>>> >> Rosenborg Danish Blue
> | > | >>>>> >
> | > | >>>>> > Sharp and biting, not to mention a bit thin on flavor. OK in
> a
> | > | >>>>> > pinch, but certainly no competition to roquefort.
> | > | >>>>
> | > | >>>>> What you need is a good piece of Royal Blue Stilton!
> | > | >>>>
> | > | >>>> That's what makes a horserace, eh? I've had Bleu, Stilton and
> | > | >>>> Roquefort. They're all good. My favorite is Gorgonzola!
> | > | >>>
> | > | >>>I go with you !
> | > | >>
> | > | >> Forgot about Gorgonzola. I like them all ... but my favourite is
> a
> | > well
> | > | >> ripened unpasteurised French Brie. I could eat it every day ...
> | > | >
> | > | >If it comes to that type of cheese, I prefer an unpasteurized Pont
> | > | >l'Évêque. From Normandy. Or even a Camembert AOC. Unpasteurized by
> | > | >definition. Brie is too easy for me.
> | > |
> | > | Have you ever tried the "Charles VII" Camembert au lait cru? It's
> from
> | > | a dairy cooperative in Lochoise Region Verneuil Reignac and comes in
> a
> | > | 250g size which my wife's late Aunt introduced us to in England.
> | > | Unfortunately, we can't get it here in New Zealand.
> | > |
> | > | Photo: http://i12.ebayimg.com/03/i/001/2b/f3/c59f_12.JPG
> | > |
> | >
> | > Sorry, not available in US either due to the ageing restrictions
> | > on raw milk cheeses.
> | >
> | > pavane
> | >
> |
> | I doubt if the restrictions are simply on ageing. The boutique
> | cheesemakers would take the time. The ban is on unpasteurized
> | milk entirely, but with a little leeway on how long vs. how hot.
> | And judging from President Obama's recent remarks on food safety,
> | there doesn't seem to be much prospect of modifying that ban.
> | The ADA will be pleased.
>
> The US restrictions are specifically on ageing. Here is an article from
> Slate that explains it a bit, and a handy excerpt:
>
> It is legal to use unpasteurized milk in cheese only if that cheese has
> been aged more than 60 days (most potentially harmful bacteria die
> in this time). Tragically, this rules out all the young Brie, Camembert
> and Epoisses (most of which are aged around 30 days) that many
> consider to be the pinnacle of the cheese-making art. Steven
> Jenkins, author of "Cheese Primer" (Workman, 1996) and perhaps
> America's leading authority on cheese, calls the pasteurized Brie
> and Camembert available in America, "pretenders -- inauthentic
> impostors bearing their names."
>
> http://archive.salon.com/travel/food...ese/index.html
>
> pavane
>

Google did come up with
http://www.nh.com/apps/pbcs.dll/arti...WS02/666478120
and http://www.rawmilkcheese.org/
which support what you say about the ageing.

Further searching came up with this for Roquefort:
http://frwebgate4.access.gpo.gov/cgi... ion=retrieve

and here are the pasteurization temperatures/times:
(from
http://frwebgate4.access.gpo.gov/cgi...i on=retrieve )

Subpart A_General Provisions


Sec. 133.3 Definitions.

(a) Milk means the lacteal secretion, practically free from
colostrum, obtained by the complete milking of one or more healthy cows,
which may be clarified and may be adjusted by separating part of the fat
therefrom; concentrated milk, reconstituted milk, and dry whole milk.
Water, in a sufficient quantity to reconstitute concentrated and dry
forms, may be added.
(b) Nonfat milk means skim milk, concentrated skim milk,
reconstituted skim milk, and nonfat dry milk. Water, in a sufficient
quantity to reconstitute concentrated and dry forms, may be added.

[[Page 341]]

(c) Cream means cream, reconstituted cream, dry cream, and plastic
cream. Water, in a sufficient quantity to reconstitute concentrated and
dry forms, may be added.
(d) Pasteurized when used to describe a dairy ingredient means that
every particle of such ingredient shall have been heated in properly
operated equipment to one of the temperatures specified in the table of
this paragraph and held continuously at or above that temperature for
the specified time (or other time/temperature relationship which has
been demonstrated to be equivalent thereto in microbial destruction):

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Temperature Time
------------------------------------------------------------------------
145 [deg]F\1\............................... 30 min.
161 [deg]F\1\............................... 15 s.
191 [deg]F.................................. 1 s.
204 [deg]F.................................. 0.05 s.
212 [deg]F.................................. 0.01 s.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
\1\ If the dairy ingredient has a fat content of 10 percent or more, the
specified temperature shall be increased by 5 [deg]F.

(e) Ultrapasteurized when used to describe a dairy ingredient means
that such ingredient shall have been thermally processed at or above 280
[deg]F for at least 2 seconds.