Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?

Chopsticks are disposable, which impacts the environment and uses up
trees.

They're ancient.

You can't cut up a piece of teriyaki chicken or a big piece of sushi
with chopsticks. You can't scoop up the soup with a chopstick. You
can't spear anything with a chopstick. It seems that modern utensils
make more sense but we still use chopsticks.

And, some of us aren't very good at using them, either. (me) Is
considered that eating with chopsticks tidier than eating with a knife
and fork? It seems less tidy to me and some slurping and splattering
occurs in the course of using chopsticks.

Why aren't chopsticks being phased out? Why do we use chopsticks for
certain types of food?

Do they make food taste better? Is the slender chopstick able to place
the food on the tongue in a location that may enhance the flavor?

Just wondering.

Karen

On Apr 19, 4:24 pm, Karen > wrote:
> Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
> knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?

Because they work.

> Chopsticks are disposable, which impacts the environment and uses up
> trees.

Not all chopsticks are disposable. I often get steel
chopsticks in Korean restaurants.

> They're ancient.

Well, so am I; I'll pretend you said that with admiration.

> You can't cut up a piece of teriyaki chicken or a big piece of sushi
> with chopsticks.

Teriyaki chicken should be cut into strips after cooking
and before serving; perhaps your Japanese restaurant
isn't up to par.

>You can't scoop up the soup with a chopstick. You
> can't spear anything with a chopstick.

You can't scoop up soup with a fork, either. If you
need to spear something when eating with chopsticks,
you're doing something wrong. I can handle a salmon
filet with chopsticks.

>It seems that modern utensils
> make more sense but we still use chopsticks.
>
> And, some of us aren't very good at using them, either. (me)

Well, don't use them, then. Ask for silverware.

>Is
> considered that eating with chopsticks tidier than eating with a knife
> and fork? It seems less tidy to me and some slurping and splattering
> occurs in the course of using chopsticks.

It can be as tidy if you are skillful with them.

> Why aren't chopsticks being phased out? Why do we use chopsticks for
> certain types of food?
>
> Do they make food taste better? Is the slender chopstick able to place
> the food on the tongue in a location that may enhance the flavor?

I suppose you avoid the taste of metal (with wooden or
bamboo chopsticks, of course).

Cindy Hamilton

Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>
> On Apr 19, 4:24 pm, Karen > wrote:
> > Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
> > knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?
>
> Because they work.
>
> > Chopsticks are disposable, which impacts the environment and uses up
> > trees.
>
> Not all chopsticks are disposable. I often get steel
> chopsticks in Korean restaurants.
>
> > They're ancient.
>
> Well, so am I; I'll pretend you said that with admiration.
>
> > You can't cut up a piece of teriyaki chicken or a big piece of sushi
> > with chopsticks.
>
> Teriyaki chicken should be cut into strips after cooking
> and before serving; perhaps your Japanese restaurant
> isn't up to par.
>
> >You can't scoop up the soup with a chopstick. You
> > can't spear anything with a chopstick.
>
> You can't scoop up soup with a fork, either. If you
> need to spear something when eating with chopsticks,
> you're doing something wrong. I can handle a salmon
> filet with chopsticks.
>
> >It seems that modern utensils
> > make more sense but we still use chopsticks.
> >
> > And, some of us aren't very good at using them, either. (me)
>
> Well, don't use them, then. Ask for silverware.
>
> >Is
> > considered that eating with chopsticks tidier than eating with a knife
> > and fork? It seems less tidy to me and some slurping and splattering
> > occurs in the course of using chopsticks.
>
> It can be as tidy if you are skillful with them.
>
> > Why aren't chopsticks being phased out? Why do we use chopsticks for
> > certain types of food?
> >
> > Do they make food taste better? Is the slender chopstick able to place
> > the food on the tongue in a location that may enhance the flavor?
>
> I suppose you avoid the taste of metal (with wooden or
> bamboo chopsticks, of course).
>
> Cindy Hamilton

Additionally, the disposable bamboo chopsticks are environmentally sound
since bamboo is very fast growing, far from threatened and
biodegradable.

Karen > wrote:
> Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
> knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?
>
> Chopsticks are disposable, which impacts the environment and uses up
> trees.

The vast majority of chopsticks are made of bamboo. Bamboo grows
faster than 10 billion Asians eating at the speed of light can use up
chopsticks. If not for chopsticks and Asians this planet would be
hurtling through space looking like a giant bambo quilled porcupine.

Sheldon

Sheldon wrote:
> Karen > wrote:
>> Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
>> knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?
>>
>> Chopsticks are disposable, which impacts the environment and uses up
>> trees.
>
> The vast majority of chopsticks are made of bamboo. Bamboo grows
> faster than 10 billion Asians eating at the speed of light can use up
> chopsticks. If not for chopsticks and Asians this planet would be
> hurtling through space looking like a giant bambo quilled porcupine.
>
> Sheldon

ROFL!! Funny but true! We had a bamboo "grove" next to the driveway in
Bangkok. When we arrived it was fairly short, maybe 5 feet tall. By the
time we left 2 years later it was reaching for the stars and had expanded to
hide a number of wild animials without a problem. Enter the neighbors' pet
chimpanzee, which was a really bad idea!

It got away from them, hopped the 6 foot fence via the trees and wound up in
our bamboo. The neighbor (Jim) broke his arm trying to get the dang chimp.

OB Food: We also had a starfruit tree. Pretty fruit, but quite tart.

Jill

In article . com>,
says...
> Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
> knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?
>
> Chopsticks are disposable, which impacts the environment and uses up
> trees.
>
> They're ancient.
>
> You can't cut up a piece of teriyaki chicken or a big piece of sushi
> with chopsticks. You can't scoop up the soup with a chopstick. You
> can't spear anything with a chopstick. It seems that modern utensils
> make more sense but we still use chopsticks.
>
> And, some of us aren't very good at using them, either. (me) Is
> considered that eating with chopsticks tidier than eating with a knife
> and fork? It seems less tidy to me and some slurping and splattering
> occurs in the course of using chopsticks.
>
> Why aren't chopsticks being phased out? Why do we use chopsticks for
> certain types of food?
>
> Do they make food taste better? Is the slender chopstick able to place
> the food on the tongue in a location that may enhance the flavor?
>
> Just wondering.
>
> Karen
>
>

It's traditional with certain types of food (Chinese, Japanese, etc).
When these foods are prepared correctly, they are in pieces that can
easily be eaten with chopsticks. There's no need to dispose of
chopsticks, they go thru the dishwasher fine and can be used dozens of
times. When soup is involved, there is a spoon provided (CHinese) or it
is considered OK to drink from the bowl (Japanese).
--
Peter Aitken

Steve Wertz > wrote:

>Don't even get me started on those damned Chinese spoons.

Have you tried Korean spoons? They are metal and flat/shallow.

Steve

On Apr 19, 1:34 pm, Cindy Hamilton >
wrote:
> Well, so am I; I'll pretend you said that with admiration.

I'm not poking fun or trying to argue. Really. No offense!

Ancient tools are updated to modern tools all over the board. But
chopsticks remain on the table. I'm just wondering why. I suppose
tradition is the answer?

> You can't scoop up soup with a fork, either. If you
> need to spear something when eating with chopsticks,
> you're doing something wrong. I can handle a salmon
> filet with chopsticks.

Well, there's the invention of the spoon that one uses for soup. Of
course, noodles slide right over the edges.

> Well, don't use them, then. Ask for silverware.

I could, but I don't. I really don't want to use silverware when
everyone else is using chopsticks. So I struggle. But, then I wonder
why many struggle?

> I suppose you avoid the taste of metal (with wooden or
> bamboo chopsticks, of course).

Yeah, maybe.

A fork does good things when eating ice cream but I always forget and
use a spoon.

Anyway, NOT trying to pick a fight. Just wondering why we cling to
chopsticks when eating certain types of food. And, if those reasons
are valid (like avoiding the taste of metal), why not use chopsticks
exclusively, like for spaghetti, for example?

Karen

Karen

Karen wrote:
> Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
> knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?
>
> Chopsticks are disposable, which impacts the environment and uses up
> trees.

Mine aren't. I keep my washable, non-disposable chopsticks in the
silverware drawer.

>
> They're ancient.

So are hands. I'm not doing away with mine any time soon.


> You can't cut up a piece of teriyaki chicken or a big piece of sushi
> with chopsticks.

Maybe you can't. I can, and so can all the Japanese people I had the
good fortune to eat with in Tokyo for three weeks this past summer.

> You can't scoop up the soup with a chopstick.

Use a spoon? Drink from the bowl?

If you don't like them, no one's saying you should use them, but
personally, they seem really comfortable for me to use, and I like them.

serene

Karen wrote:

> And, some of us aren't very good at using them, either. (me) Is
> considered that eating with chopsticks tidier than eating with a knife
> and fork? It seems less tidy to me and some slurping and splattering
> occurs in the course of using chopsticks.

Is that YOU can't use them the crux of the problem you have with them?
My skills with them have certainly improved over the years and with use.
I would rather see someone work to use chopsticks than hold their fork
like an entrenching tool and shoveling the food in their maw,
lipsmacking, dribbling sauce onto their chest or belly and feeling smug
over those heathen that use chopsticks.

A Chinese friend of mine told me that as a child he learned to use
chopsticks later in life, perhaps around 8 or so. He told me that to
help children learn they take a rubber band to the pair of chopsticks to
make them hold tight together better. As they become proficient, they
lost the band.

"Karen" > wrote

> Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
> knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?

You remind me of some comedian who said, Have the Chinese
*seen* the fork?? Made me laugh. My mother had some pretty
chopsticks, but she hardly used them

nancy

On Apr 19, 2:26 pm, Serene-y the Meanie >
wrote:
> So are hands. I'm not doing away with mine any time soon.

Another good example. Utensils were invented so that people could stop
eating with their hands, especially in western society.

But, something are definitely still eaten with hands... like
sandwiches, or French fries.

> Maybe you can't. I can, and so can all the Japanese people I had the
> good fortune to eat with in Tokyo for three weeks this past summer.

Well, Tokyo is certainly an area where the trend is to keep the
chopsticks. But, I am wondering why hasn't the fork, spoon and knife
caught on in Japan?

Aren't those utensils more efficient?

It must be so that chopsticks are more efficient than other utensils
for some people. If that is so, are chopsticks used exclusively, for
example, eating a baked potato in Japan?

> If you don't like them, no one's saying you should use them, but
> personally, they seem really comfortable for me to use, and I like them.

Keeping individual personalities aside, why do you like them and do
you like them for only certain foods?

Karen

On Apr 19, 4:47 pm, Sheldon > wrote:
> Karen > wrote:
> > Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
> > knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?
>
> > Chopsticks are disposable, which impacts the environment and uses up
> > trees.
>
> The vast majority of chopsticks are made of bamboo. Bamboo grows
> faster than 10 billion Asians eating at the speed of light can use up
> chopsticks. If not for chopsticks and Asians this planet would be
> hurtling through space looking like a giant bambo quilled porcupine.
>
> Sheldon

I like that image! Pity we can't figure out a way to use the
Japanese
knotweed aka Japanese bamboo that overtakes almost everything
once it gets a roothold. Impossible to dig out, too!

maxine in ri, ever vigilant against invasive alien species!

On Apr 19, 3:35 pm, "kilikini" > wrote:
> I use chopsticks on a daily basis and so does my husband. They're excellent
> to scoop up peas, rice, beans, corn........ we even bring our own to Asian
> restaurants, take them home and wash them. I eat salads with them, seafood,
> you name it. If something has a sauce to it, like baked beans, yes, I'll
> use a spoon or a fork, but other than that, we opt for chopsticks. It's
> somehow tidier; I tend to drop less food, believe it or not. In fact, we're
> raising 3 tiny baby blue jays (long story) and I'm feeding THEM with
> chopstix. (And picking up their poo with them. It's so much easier! - oh,
> not the same chopsticks for both things. 2 different sets.)

I bought a little stick in Japan that I thought was a chopstick for a
child with a little scoop on the end. It ended up being an ear-pick. I
keep it in my silverware drawer because it is so pretty.

> If I panko a fillet of fish, again, I use chopsticks. You can pry the fish
> into pieces and pick out the most minute slivers. I think they're the
> greatest invention of mankind.

Well, you are definitely not the only one. Millions of people agree
with you on that score. With all of the kitchen gadgets on the market,
it seems the chopstik is one that stands the test of time.

But, it is interesting, isn't it? We can put a man on the moon, and
NASA can technologically create things for efficiency, but a stick
remains favor?

Karen

Karen > wrote:

> Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
> knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?
>
> Chopsticks are disposable, which impacts the environment and uses up
> trees.

In the western society - the Chinese restaurant part of it - most
chopsticks are made of plastic. In Korean restaurants, metal chopsticks
are usual.

> They're ancient.

A lot of good things are.

> You can't cut up a piece of teriyaki chicken

They are supposed to be served already cut small enough.

> or a big piece of sushi
> with chopsticks.

Sushi pieces aren't supposed to be that big. Besides, traditionally,
sushi have always been picked up with fingers. Using chopsticks is
usual, too, but is a relatively new-fangled custom.

> You can't scoop up the soup with a chopstick.

Why would you want to? Solids are eaten with chopsticks; liquid is
supposed to be sipped straight from the bowl.

> You
> can't spear anything with a chopstick.

You do not have to. The food is nearly always cut in small pieces.

> It seems that modern utensils
> make more sense but we still use chopsticks.

Make sense where, when, to whom, and with what food? Western food has
long become rather popular in major Asian cities and it is almost
invariably eaten using knives, forks and spoons there, too.

> And, some of us aren't very good at using them, either. (me)

There, you have it, finally. :-)

Me, I come from a culture probably the least familiar with chopsticks,
yet I have learned to use them reasonably well a long time ago and in
fact, do use them nearly every day, sometimes even with foods totally
usuitable. The other day, I cooked Nürnberger Rostbratwürstchen with
sauerkraut and used chopsticks to lift the Würstchen out of the pan and
place them onto a plate.

> Is
> considered that eating with chopsticks tidier than eating with a knife
> and fork? It seems less tidy to me and some slurping and splattering
> occurs in the course of using chopsticks.

Once you have learned to use them well enough, it is just as tidy as
expertly using knife and fork. If you have not learned to use knife and
fork - and especially spoon - slurping and splattering will occur, too.
Also, slurping is not necessarily the result of using chopsticks, as it
is a part of Chinese and Japanese culture and is supposed to demonstrate
enjoyment and appreciation.

> Why aren't chopsticks being phased out? Why do we use chopsticks for
> certain types of food?

Because they are a part of a larger food culture, one that prepares food
for which chopsticks are peculiarly appropriate.

> Do they make food taste better?

Yes, invariably, Chinese, Korean, Vietnamese and Japanese food tastes
better when eaten with chopsticks. I do not know why, but it really
does.

Victor

Karen wrote:
> Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
> knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?

To celebrate diversity? To have something in which to rub the noses of
chopstick-less diners? Because we didn't get the other dishes washed in
time?

Just spitballing!


> Chopsticks are disposable, which impacts the environment and uses up
> trees.

I've seen bamboo, metal and plastic chopsticks. Only one of those is
disposable, and only one has a severe impact on the environment.


> They're ancient.

And from thriving cultures thousands of years old, no less, something
that Westerners have a devil of a time getting their heads around.


> You can't cut up a piece of teriyaki chicken or a big piece of sushi
> with chopsticks. You can't scoop up the soup with a chopstick. You
> can't spear anything with a chopstick. It seems that modern utensils
> make more sense but we still use chopsticks.

My understanding of it is that food is already cut to manageable
chopstick size before cooking. I also understand that sushi/sashimi can
be treated as finger foods and so utensils are not mandatory.


> And, some of us aren't very good at using them, either. (me) Is
> considered that eating with chopsticks tidier than eating with a knife
> and fork? It seems less tidy to me and some slurping and splattering
> occurs in the course of using chopsticks.

I never became proficient with them, either. So I don't use them. You
don't have to use them either. But you mustn't condemn them as outmoded
and impractical because you're not very good at using them. I'm
awestruck by those who use them well!


> Why aren't chopsticks being phased out? Why do we use chopsticks for
> certain types of food?

Why would anyone phase them out?


> Do they make food taste better? Is the slender chopstick able to place
> the food on the tongue in a location that may enhance the flavor?

> Just wondering.

How would you react if someone from another culture wrote a post such as
yours, but condemning the use of the knife and fork? Would you
understand that point of view?

Just wondering.

On Apr 19, 5:22 pm, Karen > wrote:

> Ancient tools are updated to modern tools all over the board. But
> chopsticks remain on the table. I'm just wondering why. I suppose
> tradition is the answer?

Tradition is nice. Traditional Asian foods are cut in the kitchen
or before serving so that they are bite sized when they arrive
at the table. I forget which famous Chinese said that knives
were weapons and should not be brought to the table, so
the food is bite-sized when it arrives so one can eat it with
whichever utensil one wishes.

> > Well, don't use them, then. Ask for silverware.
>
> I could, but I don't. I really don't want to use silverware when
> everyone else is using chopsticks. So I struggle. But, then I wonder
> why many struggle?

Because unlike Asian children, we are not taught from early age
to use them properly. Unless you are dining in a traditional
Asian restaurant, (the kind with the roasted birds hanging in the
window, and food like you don't find in the majority of Asian
restaurants) ask for that silverware. Noone will take offense,
and you will enjoy your meal much more.

> Anyway, NOT trying to pick a fight. Just wondering why we cling to
> chopsticks when eating certain types of food. And, if those reasons
> are valid (like avoiding the taste of metal), why not use chopsticks
> exclusively, like for spaghetti, for example?
>
> Karen

My daughter will use chopsticks for everything. pasta, chicken,
asparagus, cookies and crackers. I picked up a few of the flat
shallow
spoons at the Asian market, and she uses those for all her soups.
Her dream is to live in Japan drawing graphic novels, so this sort of
makes sense. I picked up some nice chopsticks at the Japanese-Korean
store near my house, and we use them over and over. No waste.

It's a choice, they are traditional, and if you prefer cutlery to
them,
do not feel intimidated by your friends. Ask. Or else ask the wait-
staff for lessons. I cannot hold mine correctly and pick up
anything,
but the way I've learned to hold them works for me.

Whatever you do, enjoy the food and the company.

maxine in ri

Karen said...

> Do they make food taste better? Is the slender chopstick able to place
> the food on the tongue in a location that may enhance the flavor?


All I can remember about using chopsticks was they certainly made the food on
my plate last longer, being a klutz with chopsticks like I was.

Andy

Karen wrote on 19 Apr 2007 13:24:16 -0700:

K> Chopsticks are disposable, which impacts the environment and
K> uses up trees.

K> They're ancient.

K> You can't cut up a piece of teriyaki chicken or a big piece
K> of sushi with chopsticks. You can't scoop up the soup with a
K> chopstick. You can't spear anything with a chopstick. It
K> seems that modern utensils make more sense but we still use
K> chopsticks.

K> And, some of us aren't very good at using them, either. (me)
K> Is considered that eating with chopsticks tidier than eating
K> with a knife and fork? It seems less tidy to me and some
K> slurping and splattering occurs in the course of using
K> chopsticks.

K> Why aren't chopsticks being phased out? Why do we use
K> chopsticks for certain types of food?

K> Do they make food taste better? Is the slender chopstick
K> able to place the food on the tongue in a location that may
K> enhance the flavor?

Because they are fun and easy to use and because they are the
best implement for eating noodles and many other uses! Marco
Polo never really explained them when he brought noodles to
Italy even if they are better for eating spaghetti than a fork
(I've certainly tried) :-) Thais usually use a spoon and fork
for most foods but keep chopsticks for noodles. It is a
criterion for good Chinese cooking that the food should be
served in pieces small enough for chopsticks....no cutting! Mind
you, I once saw a Chinese lady older than me wielding chopsticks
in her right hand and a fork in the other. That was probably an
implicit criticism of the restaurant! I have seen Chinese
parents of friends of my kids cutting food up with chopsticks
while cooking but I can't do that!

James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

E-mail, with obvious alterations:
not.jim.silverton.at.comcast.not

Andy wrote:

> All I can remember about using chopsticks was they certainly made the food on
> my plate last longer, being a klutz with chopsticks like I was.
>
> Andy

Not an entirely bad thing when one takes into account how fast some
folks shovel food in. Overeaters often eat to excess before they give
themselves time to feel that "sated" message. Chopsticks are often
considered a dieters best friend!

Karen wrote:
> Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
> knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?
>
> Chopsticks are disposable, which impacts the environment and uses up
> trees.
>
> They're ancient.
>
> You can't cut up a piece of teriyaki chicken or a big piece of sushi
> with chopsticks. You can't scoop up the soup with a chopstick. You
> can't spear anything with a chopstick. It seems that modern utensils
> make more sense but we still use chopsticks.
>
> And, some of us aren't very good at using them, either. (me) Is
> considered that eating with chopsticks tidier than eating with a knife
> and fork? It seems less tidy to me and some slurping and splattering
> occurs in the course of using chopsticks.
>
> Why aren't chopsticks being phased out? Why do we use chopsticks for
> certain types of food?
>
> Do they make food taste better? Is the slender chopstick able to place
> the food on the tongue in a location that may enhance the flavor?
>
> Just wondering.
>
> Karen

I use chopsticks on a daily basis and so does my husband. They're excellent
to scoop up peas, rice, beans, corn........ we even bring our own to Asian
restaurants, take them home and wash them. I eat salads with them, seafood,
you name it. If something has a sauce to it, like baked beans, yes, I'll
use a spoon or a fork, but other than that, we opt for chopsticks. It's
somehow tidier; I tend to drop less food, believe it or not. In fact, we're
raising 3 tiny baby blue jays (long story) and I'm feeding THEM with
chopstix. (And picking up their poo with them. It's so much easier! - oh,
not the same chopsticks for both things. 2 different sets.)

If I panko a fillet of fish, again, I use chopsticks. You can pry the fish
into pieces and pick out the most minute slivers. I think they're the
greatest invention of mankind.

kili

Peter A wrote:
> In article . com>,
> says...
>> Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
>> knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?
>>
>> Chopsticks are disposable, which impacts the environment and uses up
>> trees.
>>
>> They're ancient.
>>
>> You can't cut up a piece of teriyaki chicken or a big piece of sushi
>> with chopsticks. You can't scoop up the soup with a chopstick. You
>> can't spear anything with a chopstick. It seems that modern utensils
>> make more sense but we still use chopsticks.
>>
>> And, some of us aren't very good at using them, either. (me) Is
>> considered that eating with chopsticks tidier than eating with a
>> knife and fork? It seems less tidy to me and some slurping and
>> splattering occurs in the course of using chopsticks.
>>
>> Why aren't chopsticks being phased out? Why do we use chopsticks for
>> certain types of food?
>>
>> Do they make food taste better? Is the slender chopstick able to
>> place the food on the tongue in a location that may enhance the
>> flavor?
>>
>> Just wondering.
>>
>> Karen
>>
>>
>
> It's traditional with certain types of food (Chinese, Japanese, etc).
> When these foods are prepared correctly, they are in pieces that can
> easily be eaten with chopsticks. There's no need to dispose of
> chopsticks, they go thru the dishwasher fine and can be used dozens of
> times. When soup is involved, there is a spoon provided (CHinese) or
> it is considered OK to drink from the bowl (Japanese).

I usually drink the broth from the bowl and fish out the rest of the
ingredients with chopsticks. And that can be Chicken Noodle soup down to
Wonton Soup.

kili

Karen wrote:
> On Apr 19, 1:34 pm, Cindy Hamilton >
> wrote:
>> Well, so am I; I'll pretend you said that with admiration.
>
> I'm not poking fun or trying to argue. Really. No offense!
>
> Ancient tools are updated to modern tools all over the board. But
> chopsticks remain on the table. I'm just wondering why. I suppose
> tradition is the answer?
>
>> You can't scoop up soup with a fork, either. If you
>> need to spear something when eating with chopsticks,
>> you're doing something wrong. I can handle a salmon
>> filet with chopsticks.
>
> Well, there's the invention of the spoon that one uses for soup. Of
> course, noodles slide right over the edges.
>
>> Well, don't use them, then. Ask for silverware.
>
> I could, but I don't. I really don't want to use silverware when
> everyone else is using chopsticks. So I struggle. But, then I wonder
> why many struggle?
>
>> I suppose you avoid the taste of metal (with wooden or
>> bamboo chopsticks, of course).
>
> Yeah, maybe.
>
> A fork does good things when eating ice cream but I always forget and
> use a spoon.
>
> Anyway, NOT trying to pick a fight. Just wondering why we cling to
> chopsticks when eating certain types of food. And, if those reasons
> are valid (like avoiding the taste of metal), why not use chopsticks
> exclusively, like for spaghetti, for example?
>
> Karen
>

There are lots of pasta-type Asian dishes. Lo-Mein, Chow Fun, Chow Mein,
Pad Thai, etc. It is perfectly acceptable to slurp the noodles from the
chopsticks. It's really the only way. It's everything your mother taught
you NOT to do, which is partly why it's fun. :~)

kili

Serene-y the Meanie wrote:
> Karen wrote:
>> Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
>> knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?
>>
>> Chopsticks are disposable, which impacts the environment and uses up
>> trees.
>
> Mine aren't. I keep my washable, non-disposable chopsticks in the
> silverware drawer.
>
>>
>> They're ancient.
>
> So are hands. I'm not doing away with mine any time soon.
>
>
>> You can't cut up a piece of teriyaki chicken or a big piece of sushi
>> with chopsticks.
>
> Maybe you can't. I can, and so can all the Japanese people I had the
> good fortune to eat with in Tokyo for three weeks this past summer.
>
> > You can't scoop up the soup with a chopstick.
>
> Use a spoon? Drink from the bowl?
>
> If you don't like them, no one's saying you should use them, but
> personally, they seem really comfortable for me to use, and I like
> them.
>
> serene

Me too, Serene. I use them 2 to 3 times a day. I love my chopsticks.

kili

On 19 Apr 2007 13:24:16 -0700, Karen > magnanimously
proffered:

>Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
>knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?
>
>Chopsticks are disposable, which impacts the environment and uses up
>trees.
>
>They're ancient.
>
>You can't cut up a piece of teriyaki chicken or a big piece of sushi
>with chopsticks. You can't scoop up the soup with a chopstick. You
>can't spear anything with a chopstick. It seems that modern utensils
>make more sense but we still use chopsticks.

Firstly, a piece of teriyaki chicken or sushi shouldn't be that big in
the first place, IMO. In any event, I've never had any trouble using
chopsticks with either.

Secondly, I usually eat Asian noodle soups using both chopsticks and a
porcelain spoon.

Last but not least, one certainly *can* spear things with a chopstick.
Especially something that is difficult to pick up with two chopsticks,
such as a whole cherry tomato, for example.

>And, some of us aren't very good at using them, either. (me) Is
>considered that eating with chopsticks tidier than eating with a knife
>and fork? It seems less tidy to me and some slurping and splattering
>occurs in the course of using chopsticks.

I nearly always eat my salads with chopsticks and put out sets of
chopsticks for guests when serving salad with an informal lunch or
dinner. Eating a salad with chopsticks makes major sense.

>Why aren't chopsticks being phased out? Why do we use chopsticks for
>certain types of food?
>
>Do they make food taste better? Is the slender chopstick able to place
>the food on the tongue in a location that may enhance the flavor?

Don't know. But I do know that using chopsticks with certain foods
makes eating them easier and more pleasurable. And I have several
different "personal" pairs that I use - some that are narrow
(Japanese) and some that are fatter and longer (Chinese). Depends on
what I'm using them for. But don't try cleaning your ears with one ...


>Just wondering.
>
>Karen

On Apr 19, 2:58 pm, (Victor Sack) wrote:
>> Make sense where, when, to whom, and with what food? Western food has
> long become rather popular in major Asian cities and it is almost
> invariably eaten using knives, forks and spoons there, too.

So, Western food is eaten with Western ware, and Asian food is eaten
with Asian ware, whether in a Western or Eastern country, generally
speaking, because of efficiency and enjoyment.

As cultures cross, and the races blend, which will stand the test of
time and cross-over in the end?

Karen

Karen said...

> As cultures cross, and the races blend, which will stand the test of
> time and cross-over in the end?
>
> Karen


Karen,

Races is a terrible choice of words.

Cultures shouldn't change and rather be preserved.

Assimilation into other societies has been best exhibited by the Aborgines
forced into the Australian culture.

The internet for the past 20 years has, in part, thanks to the rapid
communication channels such as usnet, forced many cultures to debate and
failing that, change due to "popular opinion." This is the worst side-
effect of the Internet on mankind.

Not in my humble opnion.

Andy

James Silverton wrote:

> Because they are fun and easy to use and because they are the best
> implement for eating noodles and many other uses! Marco Polo never
> really explained them when he brought noodles to Italy even if they are
> better for eating spaghetti than a fork (I've certainly tried) :-)
> Thais usually use a spoon and fork for most foods but keep chopsticks
> for noodles. It is a criterion for good Chinese cooking that the food
> should be served in pieces small enough for chopsticks....no cutting!
> Mind you, I once saw a Chinese lady older than me wielding chopsticks in
> her right hand and a fork in the other. That was probably an implicit
> criticism of the restaurant! I have seen Chinese parents of friends of
> my kids cutting food up with chopsticks while cooking but I can't do that!
>
> James Silverton
> Potomac, Maryland
>
> E-mail, with obvious alterations: not.jim.silverton.at.comcast.not

It is interesting to watch someone use them who has extra good
dexterity. I have seen people casually peel and eat an orange with them
while reading/holding a book in the other hand.

Sometimes people have too much "fun" with them. We were in a authentic
Vietnamese restaurant the other night and a (western) family came in.
The "adult" of the group picked up a pair and started playing drums on
the table and condiment holder. Then monkey see monkey do the kids got
into it. They got lots of dirty looks but kept at it for quite a while.

Goomba38 wrote:
> Andy wrote:
>
>> All I can remember about using chopsticks was they certainly made
>> the food on my plate last longer, being a klutz with chopsticks like
>> I was.
>>
>> Andy
>
> Not an entirely bad thing when one takes into account how fast some
> folks shovel food in. Overeaters often eat to excess before they give
> themselves time to feel that "sated" message. Chopsticks are often
> considered a dieters best friend!

Isn't that the truth?

kili

On Apr 19, 4:25 pm, Andy <q> wrote:
> Karen,
>
> Races is a terrible choice of words.
>
> Cultures shouldn't change and rather be preserved.
>
> Assimilation into other societies has been best exhibited by the Aborgines
> forced into the Australian culture.
>
> The internet for the past 20 years has, in part, thanks to the rapid
> communication channels such as usnet, forced many cultures to debate and
> failing that, change due to "popular opinion." This is the worst side-
> effect of the Internet on mankind.
>
> Not in my humble opnion.

But races are blending, aren't they? Cultures are changing. Isn't the
world, not just "America," one big melting pot?

What is authentic? Nothing or everything?

Maybe it's only terrible if one can't embrace it.

Karen

"George" > wrote in message
. ..
> James Silverton wrote:
>
>> Because they are fun and easy to use and because they are the
>> best implement for eating noodles and many other uses! Marco
>> Polo never
>
> It is interesting to watch someone use them who has extra good
> dexterity. I have seen people casually peel and eat an orange
> with them while reading/holding a book in the other hand.
>
> Sometimes people have too much "fun" with them. We were in a
> authentic Vietnamese restaurant the other night and a
> (western) family came in. The "adult" of the group picked up a
> pair and started playing drums on the table and condiment
> holder. Then monkey see monkey do the kids got into it. They
> got lots of dirty looks but kept at it for quite a while.

I have to admit that there is a certain feeling of undeserved
superiority sometimes gotten by looking at others when I use
chopsticks :-) My kids could use them when they were about 10
years old and it was interesting to watch the waiters' faces
when we asked for four sets in Rocky Mountain Chinese
restaurants in resorts. The basic idea that makes them easy if
explained is that the lower stick does not move and the control
of the upper is like using a pencil. I have found that this idea
has had people from Europe making a reasonable job within
minutes.


--
James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

We use chopsticks with Japanese and Chinese food because it's
traditional and fun.

We even have the Chinese soup spoons at home for when we have Chinese
delivered. I like to use those spoons even for other soups.

--
Caryn
Caryn Nadelberg - Mommy to Sam and Queen of the May
www.carynen.blogspot.com

On Apr 19, 2:43 pm, "Nancy Young" > wrote:
> You remind me of some comedian who said, Have the Chinese
> *seen* the fork?? Made me laugh. My mother had some pretty
> chopsticks, but she hardly used them

I'm beginning to think that utensils are indeed like language. Not
everyone speaks English and to think that they should is sort of like
being a snob.

But, it's good to laugh at our egocentricities. That makes us laugh at
ourselves, not at others.

<smile>

Thanks for the thread, everyone.

Karen

On Apr 19, 5:04 pm, Caryn Nadelberg > wrote:
> We use chopsticks with Japanese and Chinese food because it's
> traditional and fun.
>
> We even have the Chinese soup spoons at home for when we have Chinese
> delivered. I like to use those spoons even for other soups.

Yeah, I was just coming to the conclusion that even if it makes sense
to me in one way, it doesn't make sense that it needs to be right in
all ways.

I guess that's why I use chopsticks.

Karen

On Apr 19, 4:24 pm, Karen > wrote:
> Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
> knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?
>
> Chopsticks are disposable, which impacts the environment and uses up
> trees.

Well, I've had some for 15 years and they look fine

> They're ancient.


So? Knives are too.
>
> You can't cut up a piece of teriyaki chicken or a big piece of sushi
> with chopsticks.
Get a better cook, one who knows how to use a knife.

You can't scoop up the soup with a chopstick.
I don't drink soup with a fork either.

>You
> can't spear anything with a chopstick.
Well actually you can if you try. Japanese style chopsticks seem
to be sharpened for exactly that purpose.

>It seems that modern utensils
> make more sense but we still use chopsticks.

Modern ? When, in heaven's name do you think knives and spoons were
invented. At the opening of the first Macdonalds?
>
> And, some of us aren't very good at using them, either.

Practice. Lots of little kids have problems with spoons too.


(me) Is
> considered that eating with chopsticks tidier than eating with a knife
> and fork? It seems less tidy to me and some slurping and splattering
> occurs in the course of using chopsticks.

Where do you live?

>
> Why aren't chopsticks being phased out? Why do we use chopsticks for
> certain types of food?

Because they are the best tool for the job?
>
> Do they make food taste better?

Yes.
> Is the slender chopstick able to place
> the food on the tongue in a location that may enhance the flavor?

I think it is because Chinese food has not evolved to deal with metal.
If you think about it, sticking a piece of metal into your mouth with
every bite of food seems rather perverse.
John Kane, Kingston ON Canada
>
> Just wondering.
>
> Karen

On Apr 19, 4:24?pm, Karen > wrote:
> Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
> knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?


I don't. Never have. Never will.

On Apr 19, 6:01 pm, maxine in ri > wrote:
> On Apr 19, 5:22 pm, Karen > wrote:
>
> > Ancient tools are updated to modern tools all over the board. But
> > chopsticks remain on the table. I'm just wondering why. I suppose
> > tradition is the answer?
>
> Tradition is nice. Traditional Asian foods are cut in the kitchen
> or before serving so that they are bite sized when they arrive
I> at the table. I forget which famous Chinese said that knives
> were weapons and should not be brought to the table, so
> the food is bite-sized when it arrives so one can eat it with
> whichever utensil one wishes.
>
> > > Well, don't use them, then. Ask for silverware.
>
> > I could, but I don't. I really don't want to use silverware when
> > everyone else is using chopsticks. So I struggle. But, then I wonder
> > why many struggle?
>
> Because unlike Asian children, we are not taught from early age
> to use them properly. Unless you are dining in a traditional
> Asian restaurant, (the kind with the roasted birds hanging in the
> window, and food like you don't find in the majority of Asian
> restaurants) ask for that silverware. Noone will take offense,
> and you will enjoy your meal much more.

But the food does not taste as good. Two or three days practice with
chopsticks is all it takes to become 'acceptably' competent. A few
more weeks are required to get a decent share of the food.

My real gripe is that too many restaurants bring me knives and forks.
I always have to ask for a bowl and chopsticks.


>
> > Anyway, NOT trying to pick a fight. Just wondering why we cling to
> > chopsticks when eating certain types of food. And, if those reasons
> > are valid (like avoiding the taste of metal), why not use chopsticks
> > exclusively, like for spaghetti, for example?
>
> > Karen
>
> My daughter will use chopsticks for everything. pasta, chicken,
> asparagus, cookies and crackers. I picked up a few of the flat
> shallow
> spoons at the Asian market, and she uses those for all her soups.
> Her dream is to live in Japan drawing graphic novels, so this sort of
> makes sense. I picked up some nice chopsticks at the Japanese-Korean
> store near my house, and we use them over and over. No waste.
>
> It's a choice, they are traditional, and if you prefer cutlery to
> them,
> do not feel intimidated by your friends. Ask. Or else ask the wait-
> staff for lessons. I cannot hold mine correctly and pick up
> anything,
> but the way I've learned to hold them works for me.
>
> Whatever you do, enjoy the food and the company.
>
> maxine in ri

On Apr 19, 5:49 pm, maxine in ri > wrote:
> On Apr 19, 4:47 pm, Sheldon > wrote:
>
> > Karen > wrote:
> > > Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
> > > knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?
>
> > > Chopsticks are disposable, which impacts the environment and uses up
> > > trees.
>
> > The vast majority of chopsticks are made of bamboo. Bamboo grows
> > faster than 10 billion Asians eating at the speed of light can use up
> > chopsticks. If not for chopsticks and Asians this planet would be
> > hurtling through space looking like a giant bambo quilled porcupine.
>
> > Sheldon
>
> I like that image! Pity we can't figure out a way to use the
> Japanese
> knotweed aka Japanese bamboo that overtakes almost everything
> once it gets a roothold. Impossible to dig out, too!

Maxine's organic bamboo chopsticks. Available at all good
retailers. ?
>
> maxine in ri, ever vigilant against invasive alien species!

Karen wrote:
> On Apr 19, 2:26 pm, Serene-y the Meanie >
> wrote:
>> So are hands. I'm not doing away with mine any time soon.
>
> Another good example. Utensils were invented so that people could stop
> eating with their hands, especially in western society.
>
> But, something are definitely still eaten with hands... like
> sandwiches, or French fries.
>
>> Maybe you can't. I can, and so can all the Japanese people I had the
>> good fortune to eat with in Tokyo for three weeks this past summer.
>
> Well, Tokyo is certainly an area where the trend is to keep the
> chopsticks. But, I am wondering why hasn't the fork, spoon and knife
> caught on in Japan?
>
> Aren't those utensils more efficient?

Only for people who grew up using them. My first boyfriend used to
tell me about the way little kids played with chopsticks when he was
little in Saigon. They would compete to see who could pick up the
smallest grain of rice. He figured out later in life that that game
was probably invented by adults so that little kids would get their
chopstick practice in.

Have you ever seen a toddler use a spoon? They're *terrible* at it.
We have to learn to use the utensils we're now so comfortable with.

>
> It must be so that chopsticks are more efficient than other utensils
> for some people. If that is so, are chopsticks used exclusively, for
> example, eating a baked potato in Japan?

I never saw forks in a restaurant in Japan unless a non-Japanese
person requested them.

>
>> If you don't like them, no one's saying you should use them, but
>> personally, they seem really comfortable for me to use, and I like them.
>
> Keeping individual personalities aside, why do you like them and do
> you like them for only certain foods?

I would like using them for every meal, but to be honest, habit
usually prevails, and I tend only to think of them when I make
Chinese/Japanese/Thai/etc. foods. But usually when I do, I wonder
why I don't use them all the time.

Serene

On Apr 19, 5:11 pm, Steve Wertz > wrote:
> On 19 Apr 2007 13:24:16 -0700, Karen wrote:
>
> > Pondering the use of chopsticks in western society. Since forks,
> > knives, spoons were invented, why do we still use chopsticks?
>
> I have never used chopsticks. And I cook and eat of lot of Asian
> food. Simply, forks are much more efficient.

Not really It depends on what you're eating. And the food tastes
better with chopsticks.Your comments are based on no experiece if you
have not tried chopsticks ( to the extend of becoming reasonably
proficent not just a one time try )

>
> Don't even get me started on those damned Chinese spoons.
Love them

John Kane, Kingston ON Canada