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Differences between gas and electric ovens
I remember reading somewhere that gas ovens have more of a 'moist
heat' since there is certain amount of moisture in natural gas, where an electric oven is a 'dry heat.' This article also hinted that baking in a gas oven is better than baking in an electric oven due to the added humidity of the gas heat. Any thoughts on this topic? -- Zilbandy - Tucson, Arizona USA > Dead Suburban's Home Page: http://zilbandy.com/suburb/ PGP Public Key: http://zilbandy.com/pgpkey.htm ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~ |
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Differences between gas and electric ovens
Zilbandy wrote:
> > I remember reading somewhere that gas ovens have more of a 'moist > heat' since there is certain amount of moisture in natural gas, where > an electric oven is a 'dry heat.' This article also hinted that > baking in a gas oven is better than baking in an electric oven due to > the added humidity of the gas heat. Any thoughts on this topic? It's true that perfect burning results in carbon dioxide and water vapor. However in my gas oven, the lower burner is below the metal chamber in which the food is baked. The burner heats the box, and the exhaust from the flame goes up the flue, never touching the food. The upper burner is within the metal box, but it would only be used for broiling, not baking bread or a cake. |
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Differences between gas and electric ovens
Gas must be vented , so you can't control moisture . Electric is for cooks who understand what really happening in their food . An oven can bake or broil . If there is even air temp , then you can bake , if youre broil is not by a thick rod on top of oven then you can broil so perfect , making toast is easy ( toast is a test ) ... Thick rods dont heat fast as your toaster does . If air temp is not even in your oven , then you compromise and put a thick insulator under the food and it works . In an oven that has even air temp by a fan , you dont IR from the lower burner , and the fan evens out the temp for perfect baking . Notice you must put a cookie sheet over the lower heating element to accomplish this "even" heat . It blocks direct IR from element . Then the fan brings that heat up to the top . 1) insulate your lower heat element from IR by a tin cover . 2) top heat element must be thin ni-chrome wire to heat fast like your toaster does . Now its so good , you could use a computer to "repeat" cooking exactly , same each time ... --------------------------------------- Electric skillets need thin stainless steel sheet to insulate all the lower portion , twice . The top needs insulation , but less . Now you get even heat ! Not just where the heating element circles about . Zilbandy wrote: > I remember reading somewhere that gas ovens have more of a 'moist > heat' since there is certain amount of moisture in natural gas, where > an electric oven is a 'dry heat.' This article also hinted that > baking in a gas oven is better than baking in an electric oven due to > the added humidity of the gas heat. Any thoughts on this topic? > > -- > Zilbandy - Tucson, Arizona USA > > Dead Suburban's Home Page: http://zilbandy.com/suburb/ > PGP Public Key: http://zilbandy.com/pgpkey.htm > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~ |
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Differences between gas and electric ovens
Zilbandy wrote: > I remember reading somewhere that gas ovens have more of a 'moist > heat' since there is certain amount of moisture in natural gas, where > an electric oven is a 'dry heat.' This article also hinted that > baking in a gas oven is better than baking in an electric oven due to > the added humidity of the gas heat. Any thoughts on this topic? Humidity, at 375ºF?!?!? Old wives tale. At baking temperatures there is no more or less humidity present in either oven. Both gas and electric ovens will often display some condensation when first turned on. But this has to do with ambient climatic conditions. Both types of ovens are equally vented. As oven temperatures rise moisture rapidly dissipates. Far more moisture is generated by that which is baking than from any other source... and even that has no effect... obviously you've never tried to add moisture to a hot oven, either type of oven, not easy. Sheldon |
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Differences between gas and electric ovens
Steve Wertz wrote: <gotta keep clear, it may be catching> > Sheldon wrote: > > Zilbandy wrote: > >> I remember reading somewhere that gas ovens have more of a 'moist > >> heat' since there is certain amount of moisture in natural gas, where > >> an electric oven is a 'dry heat.' This article also hinted that > >> baking in a gas oven is better than baking in an electric oven due to > >> the added humidity of the gas heat. Any thoughts on this topic? > > > > Humidity, at 375ºF?!?!? > > It's called steam. It has a maximum temperature of about 212F at > normal pressure. It doesn't just disappear. There's no steam in an UNpressurized chamber, MORON! |
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Differences between gas and electric ovens
Steve Wertz wrote: > On 1 Oct 2006 19:36:05 -0700, Sheldon wrote: > > >> It's called steam. It has a maximum temperature of about 212F at > >> normal pressure. It doesn't just disappear. > > > > There's no steam in an UNpressurized chamber, MORON! > > Huh? Then how does food dry out, MORON? It may get quickly get > vented, but for sure there *IS* steam in the oven anytime you > cook something wet. > > -sw It's gas (not steam) at that temperature. It'll only turn back to steam if it cools below it's boiling point (ie, if you open the door). As far as real-world experience goes, I've had to cook with an electric fan oven for the past three years or so. Things which are meant to come out crispy (anything with pastry, etc) seem to come out perfectly, but things like roasts/joints seem to come out very dry (especially chicken, which doesn't brown nicely but comes out pale and dry). It doesn't seem to matter how much I baste something beforehand, or even during cooking, it just seems to dry out very quickly. I don't know exactly whether this is to do with a "dry heat" or whether this is to do with the way the fan blows the air over the food. From personal experience, I would say there *does* feel like there is more moisture in the air when you open the door to a gas oven. DSt. |
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Differences between gas and electric ovens
Oh pshaw, on Mon 02 Oct 2006 05:09:22a, Michael "Dog3" Lonergan meant to
say... > Peter A > news:MPG.1f8a2575e80131989898a2@news- > server.nc.rr.com: > >> Natural gas does not contain moisture, but water vapor is a byproduct >> when the gas burns so a gas oven is likely to be more humid. But I fail >> to see why this would be an advantage except is a few specialized >> situations, and you can always put a pan of water in an electric oven >> if you need to. > > All I know is by my own experience. I have both a gas wall oven and an > electric stove/oven. The only difference I can really see is the > electric oven burns hotter. I have to adjust recipes times when using > the electric. It's pretty new though. The wall oven is ancient and I > use it more just because I'm used to it. > > Michael It may be a matter of adjustment, Michael. I've generally found that the opposite is true. -- Wayne Boatwright __________________________________________________ Cats don't correct your stories. |
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Differences between gas and electric ovens
In article >, ost
says... > It's called steam. It has a maximum temperature of about 212F at > normal pressure. It doesn't just disappear. > > Water, not steam, has a maximum temperature of about 212F at normal pressure. Steam can be a lot hotter although not in the home kitchen (pressure cookers excepted). -- Peter Aitken Visit my recipe and kitchen myths pages at www.pgacon.com/cooking.htm |
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Differences between gas and electric ovens
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Differences between gas and electric ovens
In article . com>,
says... > It's gas (not steam) at that temperature. It'll only turn back to steam > if it cools below it's boiling point (ie, if you open the door). > You misunderstand what steam is. You seem to think - and I am sure you are not alone - that steam is that cloudy looking stuff that comes out of a teakettle. That is steam with suspended water droplets which make it visible. Steam itself is invisible and refers technically to vaporized water, so when you are baking bread the "air" in your over is part water vapor, or steam. Of course the air in your kitchen is part steam too, but most people don't call it steam, reserving the term for heated water vapor. -- Peter Aitken Visit my recipe and kitchen myths pages at www.pgacon.com/cooking.htm |
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Differences between gas and electric ovens
In article 1>,
says... > All I know is by my own experience. I have both a gas wall oven and an > electric stove/oven. The only difference I can really see is the electric > oven burns hotter. I have to adjust recipes times when using the electric. > It's pretty new though. The wall oven is ancient and I use it more just > because I'm used to it. > > That's most likely a thermostat difference. -- Peter Aitken Visit my recipe and kitchen myths pages at www.pgacon.com/cooking.htm |
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Differences between gas and electric ovens
Steve Wertz wrote: > On 1 Oct 2006 19:36:05 -0700, Sheldon wrote: > > >> It's called steam. It has a maximum temperature of about 212F at > >> normal pressure. It doesn't just disappear. > > > > There's no steam in an UNpressurized chamber, MORON! > > Huh? Then how does food dry out, MORON? It may get quickly get > vented, but for sure there *IS* steam in the oven anytime you > cook something wet. > > -sw You're both wrong. There is moisture even in air above the boiling point of water (which is not always 212 degrees, contrary to what a lot of people who post here understand. At one atmosphere of pressure water boils at 212 degrees F. When the atmospheric pressure varies, so does the BP. I live it Denver, a mile high, lower atmospheric pressure, and water boils at about 202 degrees F here). Regardless of BP, air can contain moisture at higher temps, so there is moisture in a 375 degree oven, but not very much. Steam, on the other hand, is supersaturated air. Air with more moisture in it than it can contain as vapor, so it comes out of the air as tiny water droplets. If there is more moisture in the oven that the air at that temp can contain as vapor, there will be steam. This is not usually the case, but it you put a big pan of water in the bottom of the oven and somehow restrict the amout of air that can escape, you'll have steam in your oven. So, there will always be a certain amount of moisture in either oven, but rarely will there be steam. Oh, the poster that said there's water in Natural Gas as delivered to your home was way off base. When NG is collected and transported and burned, moisture is the enemy of all those processes. Practically all the moisture is removed from the very beginning by various tecniques because it's expensive to transmit and degrades the combustion qualities of the NG. There is, however, water created when NG is burned, which would add the the amount of moisture in the oven as opposed to an electric oven. I don't really know how much this would be, I'd have to look up and do some calculations I haven't done in years, and am not really much interested in these days. |
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Differences between gas and electric ovens
In article .com>,
says... > Steam, on the other hand, is supersaturated air. Air with more moisture > in it than it can contain as vapor, so it comes out of the air as tiny > water droplets. If there is more moisture in the oven that the air at > that temp can contain as vapor, there will be steam. This is not > usually the case, but it you put a big pan of water in the bottom of > the oven and somehow restrict the amout of air that can escape, you'll > have steam in your oven. > > And you are "wronger" than both of them. The above paragraph is totally wrong. See my other post. -- Peter Aitken Visit my recipe and kitchen myths pages at www.pgacon.com/cooking.htm |
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Differences between gas and electric ovens
salgud wrote: > Steve Wertz wrote: > > > > > > >> It's called steam. It has a maximum temperature of about 212F at > > >> normal pressure. It doesn't just disappear. > > > > > > There's no steam in an UNpressurized chamber, MORON! > > > > Huh? Then how does food dry out, MORON? It may get quickly get > > vented, but for sure there *IS* steam in the oven anytime you > > cook something wet. > > > > -sw > > You're both wrong. There is moisture even in air above the boiling > point of water (which is not always 212 degrees, contrary to what a lot > of people who post here understand. At one atmosphere of pressure water > boils at 212 degrees F. When the atmospheric pressure varies, so does > the BP. I live it Denver, a mile high, lower atmospheric pressure, and > water boils at about 202 degrees F here). Regardless of BP, air can > contain moisture at higher temps, so there is moisture in a 375 degree > oven, but not very much. > > Steam, on the other hand, is supersaturated air. Air with more moisture > in it than it can contain as vapor, so it comes out of the air as tiny > water droplets. If there is more moisture in the oven that the air at > that temp can contain as vapor, there will be steam. This is not > usually the case, but it you put a big pan of water in the bottom of > the oven and somehow restrict the amout of air that can escape, you'll > have steam in your oven. > > So, there will always be a certain amount of moisture in either oven, > but rarely will there be steam. > > Oh, the poster that said there's water in Natural Gas as delivered to > your home was way off base. When NG is collected and transported and > burned, moisture is the enemy of all those processes. Practically all > the moisture is removed from the very beginning by various tecniques > because it's expensive to transmit and degrades the combustion > qualities of the NG. > > There is, however, water created when NG is burned, which would add the > the amount of moisture in the oven as opposed to an electric oven. I > don't really know how much this would be, I'd have to look up and do > some calculations I haven't done in years, and am not really much > interested in these days. You're incorrect, all of it. Steam and water vapor are not the same. Steam is a gas, water vapor is not a gas. Steam can only exist at certain conditions above atmospheric pressure. When water is heated to nucleation in an unpressurized vessel very low pressure steam is created inside the bubbles; as the bubbles burst a very small quantity of very low pressure steam will very momentarilly exist just up to about 1/16" above the water surface, of so insignificant a quantity, and pressure, and time, that dissipates so instantaneously that it's of no use for cooking... when people speak of steaming vegetables they are not steaming, they are cooking with hot water vapor. There is no steam inside an ordinary oven... even commercial injection bread baking ovens contain no actual steam, steam is injected because it is inside the tubing under pressure but instantly upon release into the unpressurized oven it forms hot water vapor. When bread baking recipes say to add water to an oven to create steam, no stesm exists insde that oven other than that very insignificant amount above the water's surface from nucleation... what the recipe should actually say is "create water vapor".... those steam ovens are not steam ovens, they are water vapor ovens... you want a steam oven, get an autoclave. There is no steam inside an ordinary gas cooking oven, only a very miniscule quantity of water vapor is possible from the burning gas, most of which never enters the oven, as most of it condenses before it can enter... far, far, far less water vapor from burning gas than is created from that which is being cooked... food is composed of significant water which is evaporated relatively rapidly when heated during cooking, but that moisture forms water vapor, not steam.... and the water vapor created from that which is being cooked inside a hot oven has no effect on the cooking whatsoever, in fact it's the other way around, the cooking food creates the water vapor... that water vapor goes right out the vent with the heated air. All things being relative, think of steam as compared to water vapor in exhaled air... you (and those others) exhale an awful lot of hot air but none of it contains steam, all yours is just a lot of hot air with a small quantity of tepid water vapor, no actual steam whatsoever... not unless somebody puts a cork in your ass. <G> Ahahahahahahahahahaha. . . . Sheldon |
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Differences between gas and electric ovens
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Differences between gas and electric ovens
wrote on 02 Oct 2006 in rec.food.cooking
> On 2 Oct 2006 02:45:03 -0700, wrote: > > > (especially > >chicken, which doesn't brown nicely but comes out pale and dry). It > >doesn't seem to matter how much I baste something beforehand, or even > >during cooking, it just seems to dry out very quickly. I don't know > >exactly whether this is to do with a "dry heat" or whether this is to > >do with the way the fan blows the air over the food. From personal > >experience, I would say there *does* feel like there is more moisture > >in the air when you open the door to a gas oven. > > Oh, my goodness... you have to be over cooking your chicken on too low > heat. Dry chicken is never an issue for me. I just throw my chicken > into a hot oven (400+) on a vertical roaster. I don't even bother to > baste it with anything. I cook it until the skin is brown and crispy. > The meat (including white meat) is *always* juicy. > I find my electric stove's convection oven cooks meats, especially chicken, very juicy and makes for a golden crisper skin. More juicy than my regular electric oven ever used too. I mostly cook spatchcocked or butterflied chickens, as they cook quicker that way. I cook mine on convection roundabout 400F. I too believe your oven is cooking too slow, so check out the oven's temperature settings or crank up the dial. I've never owned a gas stove, but I am quite famillar with other gas applliances and my father used to work at the gas works. If there was enough moisture to effect the humidity coming out of your oven; your food wouldn't be palatible due to the odorant that makes gas smell. That odorant would make the foodstuffs smell and taste very bad indeed. This odorant, as you know if you've ever smelled gas, is quite strong in smell and very dissolvible in water. In fact your whole house would smell badly due to this chemical escaping thru the ovens heat vent and permiating the air. My father's coats had to be kept in the garage, as just walking past the building where ordorant was added, gave his coats quite a pong. This bad smell has to be added to gas by law, as under normal conditions natural gas has no ordour. |
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Differences between gas and electric ovens
Peter A wrote: > In article .com>, > says... > > Steam, on the other hand, is supersaturated air. Air with more moisture > > in it than it can contain as vapor, so it comes out of the air as tiny > > water droplets. If there is more moisture in the oven that the air at > > that temp can contain as vapor, there will be steam. This is not > > usually the case, but it you put a big pan of water in the bottom of > > the oven and somehow restrict the amout of air that can escape, you'll > > have steam in your oven. > > > > > > And you are "wronger" than both of them. The above paragraph is totally > wrong. See my other post. > I was wrong about the steam. I am still right about the boiling point of water, the water in NG and as a product of combustion. > -- > Peter Aitken > Visit my recipe and kitchen myths pages at www.pgacon.com/cooking.htm |
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