Diabetic (alt.food.diabetic) This group is for the discussion of controlled-portion eating plans for the dietary management of diabetes.

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  #1 (permalink)   Report Post  
CapStick
 
Posts: n/a
Default Newby here

Hi all im a type 2 newby to this NG

My easy sweet snack is

put two slices brown bread in a sandwich toaster

sprinkle with some curants or raisins or bits of apple or whatever you
fancy.

slap two more slices on top and toast

its that simple experiment with it and you can if you wish freeze the
results.




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Siobhan Perricone
 
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Default Newby here

On Fri, 24 Oct 2003 21:07:46 +0100, "CapStick"
> wrote:

>Hi all im a type 2 newby to this NG
>
>My easy sweet snack is
>
>put two slices brown bread in a sandwich toaster
>
>sprinkle with some curants or raisins or bits of apple or whatever you
>fancy.
>
>slap two more slices on top and toast
>
>its that simple experiment with it and you can if you wish freeze the
>results.


Erm... not trying to be rude, but... you're able to eat this as a snack?

One slice of bread is typically between 15 and 20 carbs (though Pepperidge
farms 9 grain is only 13 carbs per slice). A quarter cup (not packed) of
seedless raisins is 27 carbs. So just half of this this snack recipe is on
the order of 57 to 67 carbs.

That's more carbs than I typically eat for an entire dinner, and way beyond
what works for me as a snack. I'm endlessly surprised at how many carbs
other people are able to consume. With the diversity of diabetes, no wonder
it's so hard to get solid answers on things.

--
Siobhan Perricone
"Who would have thought that a bad Austrian artist who's obsessed with the human physical ideal could assemble such a rabid political following?"
- www.theonion.com
  #3 (permalink)   Report Post  
Priscilla Ballou
 
Posts: n/a
Default Newby here

In article >,
"CapStick" > wrote:

> Hi all im a type 2 newby to this NG
>
> My easy sweet snack is
>
> put two slices brown bread in a sandwich toaster
>
> sprinkle with some curants or raisins or bits of apple or whatever you
> fancy.
>
> slap two more slices on top and toast
>
> its that simple experiment with it and you can if you wish freeze the
> results.


Excuse me? You're recommending this for diabetics? Bread with fruit?
How many grams of carb are in this?

Priscilla
  #4 (permalink)   Report Post  
Alan
 
Posts: n/a
Default Newby here

On Fri, 24 Oct 2003 21:07:46 +0100, "CapStick"
> wrote:

>Hi all im a type 2 newby to this NG


Hi Capstick

Welcome to the club.

You will by now have seen the response from a couple of the other
"members".
Have you been on other diabetic ngs? If not, I'd strongly recommend
you drop in on alt.support.diabetes. Also, go over to the web-site at
http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org and click on "newly diagnosed" and
you will see why you got the reaction you did from the others.

I'm sure your snack would taste great, but for most of us it would
send our BGs sky-high. Do you test yours after eating? If not, then
next time you try your snack, check your BG at one hour after eating
and again at the two-hour point. I think you'll get a shock.

Welcome again, I look forward to hearing from you on a.s.d.

Cheers Alan, T2, Oz
dx May 2002, diet and exercise.
--
Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter.
  #5 (permalink)   Report Post  
Jennifer
 
Posts: n/a
Default Newby here

Cap...

Welcome!

Your snack sounds tasty, but for most of us would be too carby to eat as
a snack.

What do your blood glucose numbers do after that snack?

As a newbie, tell us more about yourself. When were you dx'd? What was
your A1c? How are your post meal numbers?

You'll soon learn that self knowledge is power with this disease.

Here's the advice I give all newbies:

There is so much to absorb... you don't have to rush into anything. Begin
by using your best weapon in this war, your meter. You won't keel over
today, you have time to experiment, test, learn, test and figure out just
how your body and this disease are getting along. The most important
thing you can do to learn about yourself and diabetes is test test test.

The single biggest question a diabetic has to answer is:

What do I eat?

Unfortunately, the answer is pretty confusing.

What confounds us all is the fact that different diabetics can get great
results on wildly different food plans. Some of us here achieve
great blood glucose control eating a high complex carbohydrate diet.
Others find that anything over 75 - 100g of carbs a day is too
much. Still others are somewhere in between.

At the beginning all of us felt frustrated. We wanted to be handed
THE way to eat, to ensure our continued health. But we all
learned that there is no one way. Each of us had to find our own path,
using the experience of those that went before, but still having
to discover for ourselves how OUR bodies and this disease were coexisting.

Ask questions, but remember each of us discovered on our own what works best
for us. You can use our experiences as jumping off points, but eventually
you'll work up a successful plan that is yours alone.

What you are looking to discover is how different foods affect you. As I'm
sure you've read, carbohydrates (sugars, wheat, rice... the things our
Grandmas called "starches") raise blood sugars the most rapidly. Protein
and fat do raise them, but not as high and much more slowly... so if you're
a T2, generally the insulin your body still makes may take care of the rise.

You might want to try some experiments.

First: Eat whatever you've been
currently eating... but write it all down.
Test yourself at the following times:

Upon waking (fasting)
1 hour after each meal
2 hours after each meal
At bedtime

That means 8 x each day. What you will discover by this is how long
after a meal your highest reading comes... and how fast you return to
"normal". Also, you may see that a meal that included bread, fruit or
other carbs gives you a higher reading.

Then for the next few days, try to curb your carbs. Eliminate breads,
cereals, rices, beans, any wheat products, potato, corn, fruit... get all
your carbs from veggies. Test at the same schedule above.

If you try this for a few days, you may find some pretty damn good
readings. It's worth a few days to discover.

Eventually you can slowly add back carbs until you see them affecting your
meter.

The thing about this disease... though we share much in common and we
need to
follow certain guidelines... in the end, each of our bodies dictate our
treatment and our success.

The closer we get to non-diabetic numbers, the greater chance we have of
avoiding horrible complications. The key here is AIM... I know that
everyone is at a different point in their disease... and it is progressive.
But, if we aim for the best numbers and do our best, we give ourselves the
best shot at heath we've got.
That's all we can do.

Here's my opinion on what numbers to aim for, they are non-diabetic numbers.

FBG under 110
One hour after meals under 140
Two hours after meals under 120

or for those in the mmol parts of the world:

Fasting Under 6
One hour after meals Under 8
Two hours after meals Under 6.5

Recent studies have indicated that the most important numbers are your
"after meal" numbers. They may be the most indicative of future
complications, especially heart problems.

Listen to your doctor, but you are the leader of your diabetic
care team. While his /her advice is learned, it is not absolute. You
will end up knowing much more about your body and how it's handling
diabetes than your doctor will. Your meter is your best weapon.

Just remember, we're not in a race or a competition with anyone but
ourselves... Play around with your food plan... TEST TEST TEST. Learn what
foods cause spikes, what foods cause cravings... Use your body as a science
experiment.

You'll read about a lot of different ways people use to control their
diabetes... Many are diametrically opposed. After awhile you'll learn that
there is no one size fits all around here. Take some time to experiment
and you'll soon discover the plan that works for you.

Best of luck!

Jennifer




CapStick wrote:
> Hi all im a type 2 newby to this NG
>
> My easy sweet snack is
>
> put two slices brown bread in a sandwich toaster
>
> sprinkle with some curants or raisins or bits of apple or whatever you
> fancy.
>
> slap two more slices on top and toast
>
> its that simple experiment with it and you can if you wish freeze the
> results.
>
>
>
>
> ---
> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> Version: 6.0.524 / Virus Database: 321 - Release Date: 06/10/2003
>
>




  #6 (permalink)   Report Post  
CapStick
 
Posts: n/a
Default Newby here


Thanks all for most informative replies.

If any of the following is of any help to anyone ....

I use a mmol meter and am currently taking
2 Glyclacide and 2 metformin morning and evening

At last check up medication was increased
2 more metformin at lunchtime


However since going from diet only to medication, which was about 12 months
ago
i have put on weight.

Due to other probs i was until recently unable to exercise.

Now i am able to exercise i do so by walking some 3.75 miles
1 to 2 times a day.
It takes me 1 hour approx

This has had a massive affect on my levels.

after a walk i can find myself down as low as 4.5.
whereas previous i was always 10 and above morn till night

Needless to say i have not needed to take the increased medication. ( the 2
metformin at lunchtime).

So exercise is doing it for me.

Typical days grub is

Breakfast
Small bowl of
Porridge oats made with water and some sweetner sprinkled .

Lunch
2 eggs and 4 slices toast using brown bread and flora light spread.

Evening Meal
Casserole

always whole vegatables and if with meat always lean


Comments on my diet gratefully appreciated

Also there seems to be a question mark over the use of Aspartame in
sweetners.

Constructive comments would be great
Sorry if i have rambled on a bit.
It is my way.


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.524 / Virus Database: 321 - Release Date: 06/10/2003


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Alan
 
Posts: n/a
Default Newby here

On Sat, 25 Oct 2003 01:12:19 +0100, "CapStick"
> wrote:

>
>Thanks all for most informative replies.
>
>If any of the following is of any help to anyone ....
>
>I use a mmol meter and am currently taking
>2 Glyclacide and 2 metformin morning and evening
>
>At last check up medication was increased
>2 more metformin at lunchtime
>
>
>However since going from diet only to medication, which was about 12 months
>ago
>i have put on weight.
>
>Due to other probs i was until recently unable to exercise.
>
>Now i am able to exercise i do so by walking some 3.75 miles
>1 to 2 times a day.
>It takes me 1 hour approx
>
>This has had a massive affect on my levels.
>
>after a walk i can find myself down as low as 4.5.
>whereas previous i was always 10 and above morn till night
>
>Needless to say i have not needed to take the increased medication. ( the 2
>metformin at lunchtime).
>
>So exercise is doing it for me.
>
>Typical days grub is
>
>Breakfast
>Small bowl of
>Porridge oats made with water and some sweetner sprinkled .
>
>Lunch
>2 eggs and 4 slices toast using brown bread and flora light spread.
>
>Evening Meal
>Casserole
>
>always whole vegatables and if with meat always lean
>
>
>Comments on my diet gratefully appreciated
>
>Also there seems to be a question mark over the use of Aspartame in
>sweetners.
>
>Constructive comments would be great
>Sorry if i have rambled on a bit.
>It is my way.
>
>
>---
>Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
>Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
>Version: 6.0.524 / Virus Database: 321 - Release Date: 06/10/2003
>

A couple of questions and comments.
How much weight have you put on? Probably better, how overweight are
you for your height and gender? Getting back to your best weight can
dramatically improve your ability to control the beast.
When you say "over 10 all the time (that's over 180 US)" when were you
measuring: fasting, pre-meals, post-meals? That is very high for
consistent readings. I get very nervous now if I see a reading anytime
over 7 - it means I made a mistake somewhere in my diet.

In your circumstances the advice you just received from Jennifer is
hard to improve on. Read it again and try it out.
I think the first thing you will discover is that four slices of brown
bread at lunch are not doing you a lot of good. No problem with the
eggs IMO. Similarly, you will get another surprise after porridge for
breakfast. Little things can catch you out, like forgetting to take
into account a slice of toast, or the milk in your tea.

Some "whole" vegetables are dangerous - potatoes for example.
Casseroles can be good, but watch the thickeners and carb content,
particularly if you eat them with rice.

Its the total carbs that count, so serve size is also very important.

PS Mentioning doubts about aspartame is fine by me. I have no problems
with it, or any other sweetener (including sugar in very small
quantities). However, on this forum it attracts extreme views on both
sides of the debate. Wisest to leave it out unless you have lots of
scientific facts and enjoy a vitriolic argument.

Cheers Alan, T2, Oz
dx May 2002, diet and exercise.
--
Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter.
  #8 (permalink)   Report Post  
Julie Bove
 
Posts: n/a
Default Newby here





"CapStick" > wrote in message
...
> Hi all im a type 2 newby to this NG
>
> My easy sweet snack is
>
> put two slices brown bread in a sandwich toaster
>
> sprinkle with some curants or raisins or bits of apple or whatever you
> fancy.
>
> slap two more slices on top and toast
>
> its that simple experiment with it and you can if you wish freeze the
> results.


And how is your BG after that snack? Mine would be through the roof!

--
Type 2
http://users.bestweb.net/~jbove/


  #9 (permalink)   Report Post  
CapStick
 
Posts: n/a
Default Newby here


"Alan" > wrote in message
...
> On Sat, 25 Oct 2003 01:12:19 +0100, "CapStick"
> > wrote:
>
> >
> >Thanks all for most informative replies.
> >
> >If any of the following is of any help to anyone ....
> >
> >I use a mmol meter and am currently taking
> >2 Glyclacide and 2 metformin morning and evening
> >
> >At last check up medication was increased
> >2 more metformin at lunchtime
> >
> >
> >However since going from diet only to medication, which was about 12

months
> >ago
> >i have put on weight.
> >
> >Due to other probs i was until recently unable to exercise.
> >
> >Now i am able to exercise i do so by walking some 3.75 miles
> >1 to 2 times a day.
> >It takes me 1 hour approx
> >
> >This has had a massive affect on my levels.
> >
> >after a walk i can find myself down as low as 4.5.
> >whereas previous i was always 10 and above morn till night
> >
> >Needless to say i have not needed to take the increased medication. ( the

2
> >metformin at lunchtime).
> >
> >So exercise is doing it for me.
> >
> >Typical days grub is
> >
> >Breakfast
> >Small bowl of
> >Porridge oats made with water and some sweetner sprinkled .
> >
> >Lunch
> >2 eggs and 4 slices toast using brown bread and flora light spread.
> >
> >Evening Meal
> >Casserole
> >
> >always whole vegatables and if with meat always lean
> >
> >
> >Comments on my diet gratefully appreciated
> >
> >Also there seems to be a question mark over the use of Aspartame in
> >sweetners.
> >
> >Constructive comments would be great
> >Sorry if i have rambled on a bit.
> >It is my way.
> >
> >
> >---
> >Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> >Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> >Version: 6.0.524 / Virus Database: 321 - Release Date: 06/10/2003
> >

> A couple of questions and comments.
> How much weight have you put on? Probably better, how overweight are
> you for your height and gender? Getting back to your best weight can
> dramatically improve your ability to control the beast.
> When you say "over 10 all the time (that's over 180 US)" when were you
> measuring: fasting, pre-meals, post-meals? That is very high for
> consistent readings. I get very nervous now if I see a reading anytime
> over 7 - it means I made a mistake somewhere in my diet.
>
> In your circumstances the advice you just received from Jennifer is
> hard to improve on. Read it again and try it out.
> I think the first thing you will discover is that four slices of brown
> bread at lunch are not doing you a lot of good. No problem with the
> eggs IMO. Similarly, you will get another surprise after porridge for
> breakfast. Little things can catch you out, like forgetting to take
> into account a slice of toast, or the milk in your tea.
>
> Some "whole" vegetables are dangerous - potatoes for example.
> Casseroles can be good, but watch the thickeners and carb content,
> particularly if you eat them with rice.
>
> Its the total carbs that count, so serve size is also very important.
>
> PS Mentioning doubts about aspartame is fine by me. I have no problems
> with it, or any other sweetener (including sugar in very small
> quantities). However, on this forum it attracts extreme views on both
> sides of the debate. Wisest to leave it out unless you have lots of
> scientific facts and enjoy a vitriolic argument.
>
> Cheers Alan, T2, Oz
> dx May 2002, diet and exercise.
> --
> Everything in Moderation - Except Laughter.




I am without doubt well overweight
16st .00
Last Monday

Target weight according to Doc
12.75 stone
I am 6ft

so, as you can see i am Overweight.
I have started to exercise,
and lost two pounds last week.
This week dont know yet weigh in tommorrow.

Since reading these Diabetic NG's,
i am having a problem getting my head around the confliction,
between, Dieticians telling me to eat Brown Bread and Potatoes
(for carbs) and these N'Gs advocating a low Carb Diet.

Following The Medication Of Glyclacide and Metformin
Coupled with Potatoes and Bread etc seems like a surefire weightgainer.

Diabetus seems easy to Diagnose.
Not easy to Control.
Barrowloads of Confusion,
dished out to people who's blood sugar levels can surely get em confused in
the first place ?????






---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.524 / Virus Database: 321 - Release Date: 06/10/2003


  #10 (permalink)   Report Post  
Siobhan Perricone
 
Posts: n/a
Default The confusion between what they tell you and what we experience

On Sun, 26 Oct 2003 11:23:31 -0000, "CapStick"
> wrote:

>Since reading these Diabetic NG's,
>i am having a problem getting my head around the confliction,
>between, Dieticians telling me to eat Brown Bread and Potatoes
>(for carbs) and these N'Gs advocating a low Carb Diet.
>
>Following The Medication Of Glyclacide and Metformin
>Coupled with Potatoes and Bread etc seems like a surefire weightgainer.
>
>Diabetus seems easy to Diagnose.
>Not easy to Control.
>Barrowloads of Confusion,


The primary problem here is that there are many different types of
diabetics. People are at different stages of the condition. And not
everyone's BG levels react the same way to the same foods. So the health
care professionals are faced with trying to come up with a standard that is
easy enough to live with so that the majority of their patients will
actually *do* the things they must do to keep their BG under control.
Standards are hard to come up with, though, because it's such an individual
disease.

There are a few things that everyone seems to agree on, though:

Exercise is vital for increasing muscle mass and consuming glucose. The
increase in muscle mass decreases insulin resistence.

Carbohydrates are what increase your blood sugar levels, no matter what the
source of those carbohydrates are, they will increase your blood sugar
levels (exclusing fiber, which is a carbohydrate but an indigestible one).

The risk of complications and systemic failures (nerve damage, blood vessel
damage, organ damage) is high and therefore it is vital to keep the BG
under control. The closer to normal you keep your BG, the better for your
overall health, and the lower your risks of long term complications. Also,
you'll feel better physically for a longer time.

So...

The primary disconnect here is *how* to go about controlling one's BG
levels. The health care providers can only go so far in helping you with
this, *because* it's so individual. This is where you have to do your
work. And yes, it's "have to". You can't just tell your body "Well the
doctor says I should be able to eat brown bread" and have it listen. You
have to listen to your body first.

Fortunately medical research has provided us with tools we can use at home
to accomplish this listening to our bodies. If you don't have a glucometer
for your own testing purposes, get one immediately. The glucometer is your
best friend and advocate in managing your own particular instance of this
disease.

Blood glucose is an ever changing thing. It can change dramatically in a
relatively short time, so it's important that you start on a serious quest
for information. You should be testing first thing in the morning when you
wake up. This is your "fasting" test. It is a good number that indicates
how well you're doing in the area of overall control (though not as
accurate as an A1c test). It's not unusual for diabetics to have perfectly
fine numbers when they're doing their before and after meals testing, but
to have high morning numbers. That's an indication that you still have work
to do to get more control.

You should at a minimum, start testing immediately before and two hours
after meals, and you should be noting down how many carbs are in your
meals, and keeping track of how foods impact your BG levels. This is a key
thing: Different foods with the same grams of carbs will cause different BG
levels.

As an example: When I eat sushi (which I love), I know I have to walk
energetically and for a longer time than I normally do after meals, because
it shoots my BG up enormously, even though I'm eating the same number of
total carbs as I'd have eaten when I eat some beans with my steak for
dinner. The beans just don't cause the same spike. The only way I learned
this was to spend several months testing and collating data. I didn't
really pay attention to what the dietician was saying at all. I listened to
*my body*. When I eat things that the dietician recommends, and I eat the
amount of carbs in a day she recommends, I can't maintain control at all.

Does this mean she's a bad dietician? I don't know. Maybe her food plans
work for someone, but they don't work for me and my husband (who is also
diabetic).

The other point I need to make is, while you're doing all this data
collection, try experimenting with exercise. My husband and I have found
(and neither of us are on meds now because of this) that if we walk after
ever meal, it reduces our BG levels significantly.

Try it yourself. Just start out walking for five minutes within one hour
of eating a meal. Compare that to your BG levels when you don't walk. I'd
be surprised if you don't notice a difference.

In any case, the most important point is to learn what your body needs. You
will probably find that if you reduced the amount of carbs you're eating,
and started moving around after meals, you'll be able to reduce some of
your meds (which can have long term negative impacts on your organs, and so
is a desirable thing).

>dished out to people who's blood sugar levels can surely get em confused in
>the first place ?????


If you're inclined to listen only to the doctors, rather than working
through your own experience, this sentence makes sense. However, it does
seem to imply that we are so befuddled by BG that our accounts can't be
trusted. I'm just going to assume that this isn't what you meant.

--
Siobhan Perricone
"Who would have thought that a bad Austrian artist who's obsessed with the human physical ideal could assemble such a rabid political following?"
- www.theonion.com


  #11 (permalink)   Report Post  
Jennifer
 
Posts: n/a
Default Newby here



It is confusing Cap...

But you can sort out what YOUR body is doing by using your meter.

You won't kick the bucket today... so use a few weeks to experiment and
find out whether the brown bread and potatoes work for you or not.

Here's the advice I give all newbies:

There is so much to absorb... you don't have to rush into anything. Begin
by using your best weapon in this war, your meter. You won't keel over
today, you have time to experiment, test, learn, test and figure out just
how your body and this disease are getting along. The most important
thing you can do to learn about yourself and diabetes is test test test.

The single biggest question a diabetic has to answer is:

What do I eat?

Unfortunately, the answer is pretty confusing.

What confounds us all is the fact that different diabetics can get great
results on wildly different food plans. Some of us here achieve
great blood glucose control eating a high complex carbohydrate diet.
Others find that anything over 75 - 100g of carbs a day is too
much. Still others are somewhere in between.

At the beginning all of us felt frustrated. We wanted to be handed
THE way to eat, to ensure our continued health. But we all
learned that there is no one way. Each of us had to find our own path,
using the experience of those that went before, but still having
to discover for ourselves how OUR bodies and this disease were coexisting.

Ask questions, but remember each of us discovered on our own what works best
for us. You can use our experiences as jumping off points, but eventually
you'll work up a successful plan that is yours alone.

What you are looking to discover is how different foods affect you. As I'm
sure you've read, carbohydrates (sugars, wheat, rice... the things our
Grandmas called "starches") raise blood sugars the most rapidly. Protein
and fat do raise them, but not as high and much more slowly... so if you're
a T2, generally the insulin your body still makes may take care of the rise.

You might want to try some experiments.

First: Eat whatever you've been
currently eating... but write it all down.
Test yourself at the following times:

Upon waking (fasting)
1 hour after each meal
2 hours after each meal
At bedtime

That means 8 x each day. What you will discover by this is how long
after a meal your highest reading comes... and how fast you return to
"normal". Also, you may see that a meal that included bread, fruit or
other carbs gives you a higher reading.

Then for the next few days, try to curb your carbs. Eliminate breads,
cereals, rices, beans, any wheat products, potato, corn, fruit... get all
your carbs from veggies. Test at the same schedule above.

If you try this for a few days, you may find some pretty damn good
readings. It's worth a few days to discover.

Eventually you can slowly add back carbs until you see them affecting your
meter.

The thing about this disease... though we share much in common and we
need to
follow certain guidelines... in the end, each of our bodies dictate our
treatment and our success.

The closer we get to non-diabetic numbers, the greater chance we have of
avoiding horrible complications. The key here is AIM... I know that
everyone is at a different point in their disease... and it is progressive.
But, if we aim for the best numbers and do our best, we give ourselves the
best shot at heath we've got.
That's all we can do.

Here's my opinion on what numbers to aim for, they are non-diabetic numbers.

FBG under 110
One hour after meals under 140
Two hours after meals under 120

or for those in the mmol parts of the world:

Fasting Under 6
One hour after meals Under 8
Two hours after meals Under 6.5

Recent studies have indicated that the most important numbers are your
"after meal" numbers. They may be the most indicative of future
complications, especially heart problems.

Listen to your doctor, but you are the leader of your diabetic
care team. While his /her advice is learned, it is not absolute. You
will end up knowing much more about your body and how it's handling
diabetes than your doctor will. Your meter is your best weapon.

Just remember, we're not in a race or a competition with anyone but
ourselves... Play around with your food plan... TEST TEST TEST. Learn what
foods cause spikes, what foods cause cravings... Use your body as a science
experiment.

You'll read about a lot of different ways people use to control their
diabetes... Many are diametrically opposed. After awhile you'll learn that
there is no one size fits all around here. Take some time to experiment
and you'll soon discover the plan that works for you.

Best of luck!

Jennifer


> I am without doubt well overweight
> 16st .00
> Last Monday
>
> Target weight according to Doc
> 12.75 stone
> I am 6ft
>
> so, as you can see i am Overweight.
> I have started to exercise,
> and lost two pounds last week.
> This week dont know yet weigh in tommorrow.
>
> Since reading these Diabetic NG's,
> i am having a problem getting my head around the confliction,
> between, Dieticians telling me to eat Brown Bread and Potatoes
> (for carbs) and these N'Gs advocating a low Carb Diet.
>
> Following The Medication Of Glyclacide and Metformin
> Coupled with Potatoes and Bread etc seems like a surefire weightgainer.
>
> Diabetus seems easy to Diagnose.
> Not easy to Control.
> Barrowloads of Confusion,
> dished out to people who's blood sugar levels can surely get em confused in
> the first place ?????
>


  #12 (permalink)   Report Post  
CapStick
 
Posts: n/a
Default The confusion between what they tell you and what we experience


"Siobhan Perricone" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 26 Oct 2003 11:23:31 -0000, "CapStick"
> > wrote:
>
> >Since reading these Diabetic NG's,
> >i am having a problem getting my head around the confliction,
> >between, Dieticians telling me to eat Brown Bread and Potatoes
> >(for carbs) and these N'Gs advocating a low Carb Diet.
> >
> >Following The Medication Of Glyclacide and Metformin
> >Coupled with Potatoes and Bread etc seems like a surefire weightgainer.
> >
> >Diabetus seems easy to Diagnose.
> >Not easy to Control.
> >Barrowloads of Confusion,

>
> The primary problem here is that there are many different types of
> diabetics. People are at different stages of the condition. And not
> everyone's BG levels react the same way to the same foods. So the health
> care professionals are faced with trying to come up with a standard that

is
> easy enough to live with so that the majority of their patients will
> actually *do* the things they must do to keep their BG under control.
> Standards are hard to come up with, though, because it's such an

individual
> disease.
>
> There are a few things that everyone seems to agree on, though:
>
> Exercise is vital for increasing muscle mass and consuming glucose. The
> increase in muscle mass decreases insulin resistence.
>
> Carbohydrates are what increase your blood sugar levels, no matter what

the
> source of those carbohydrates are, they will increase your blood sugar
> levels (exclusing fiber, which is a carbohydrate but an indigestible one).
>
> The risk of complications and systemic failures (nerve damage, blood

vessel
> damage, organ damage) is high and therefore it is vital to keep the BG
> under control. The closer to normal you keep your BG, the better for your
> overall health, and the lower your risks of long term complications. Also,
> you'll feel better physically for a longer time.
>
> So...
>
> The primary disconnect here is *how* to go about controlling one's BG
> levels. The health care providers can only go so far in helping you with
> this, *because* it's so individual. This is where you have to do your
> work. And yes, it's "have to". You can't just tell your body "Well the
> doctor says I should be able to eat brown bread" and have it listen. You
> have to listen to your body first.
>
> Fortunately medical research has provided us with tools we can use at home
> to accomplish this listening to our bodies. If you don't have a

glucometer
> for your own testing purposes, get one immediately. The glucometer is

your
> best friend and advocate in managing your own particular instance of this
> disease.
>
> Blood glucose is an ever changing thing. It can change dramatically in a
> relatively short time, so it's important that you start on a serious quest
> for information. You should be testing first thing in the morning when

you
> wake up. This is your "fasting" test. It is a good number that indicates
> how well you're doing in the area of overall control (though not as
> accurate as an A1c test). It's not unusual for diabetics to have

perfectly
> fine numbers when they're doing their before and after meals testing, but
> to have high morning numbers. That's an indication that you still have

work
> to do to get more control.
>
> You should at a minimum, start testing immediately before and two hours
> after meals, and you should be noting down how many carbs are in your
> meals, and keeping track of how foods impact your BG levels. This is a

key
> thing: Different foods with the same grams of carbs will cause different

BG
> levels.
>
> As an example: When I eat sushi (which I love), I know I have to walk
> energetically and for a longer time than I normally do after meals,

because
> it shoots my BG up enormously, even though I'm eating the same number of
> total carbs as I'd have eaten when I eat some beans with my steak for
> dinner. The beans just don't cause the same spike. The only way I learned
> this was to spend several months testing and collating data. I didn't
> really pay attention to what the dietician was saying at all. I listened

to
> *my body*. When I eat things that the dietician recommends, and I eat the
> amount of carbs in a day she recommends, I can't maintain control at all.
>
> Does this mean she's a bad dietician? I don't know. Maybe her food plans
> work for someone, but they don't work for me and my husband (who is also
> diabetic).
>
> The other point I need to make is, while you're doing all this data
> collection, try experimenting with exercise. My husband and I have found
> (and neither of us are on meds now because of this) that if we walk after
> ever meal, it reduces our BG levels significantly.
>
> Try it yourself. Just start out walking for five minutes within one hour
> of eating a meal. Compare that to your BG levels when you don't walk. I'd
> be surprised if you don't notice a difference.
>
> In any case, the most important point is to learn what your body needs.

You
> will probably find that if you reduced the amount of carbs you're eating,
> and started moving around after meals, you'll be able to reduce some of
> your meds (which can have long term negative impacts on your organs, and

so
> is a desirable thing).
>
> >dished out to people who's blood sugar levels can surely get em confused

in
> >the first place ?????

>
> If you're inclined to listen only to the doctors, rather than working
> through your own experience, this sentence makes sense. However, it does
> seem to imply that we are so befuddled by BG that our accounts can't be
> trusted. I'm just going to assume that this isn't what you meant.
>
> --
> Siobhan Perricone
> "Who would have thought that a bad Austrian artist who's obsessed with the

human physical ideal could assemble such a rabid political following?"
> - www.theonion.com



I have the greatest respect for the sort of advice you have given here.

I did not mean in any way to imply that the posters here were in any
Befuddled.

Its just that i get confliction between Doctor,Nurse and Dieticians.

But these NG's and replies of your quality have made me see where i have
been going wrong.
e.g
Mainly using the high carb clinical advice

So i will now put in more exercise more often.
Go for lower carb diet and see if i cant get down low enough so that my
medication is not increased.

All above whilst testing regularly and at the times shown to me on this NG.

Big thanks.

Capstick Type 2


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