Just for curiosity's sake (i.e., I'm not asking this because I want to write
about it), how many of you hard-core types out there no longer think Sierra
Nevada Pale Ale is worth drinking? I'm not saying it's changed, because I
don't think it has. But I've run into a surprising number of people recently
who think it just doesn't have enough flavor to interest them, and wondered
what you thought.

Just to start the ball rolling, I still enjoy it quite a bit. I like Anchor
Liberty, too.
--
Lew Bryson

www.LewBryson.com
Author of "New York Breweries" and "Pennsylvania Breweries," 2nd ed., both
available at <www.amazon.com>
The Hotmail address on this post is for newsgroups only: I don't check it,
or respond to it. Spam away.

On Sun, 04 Jan 2004 19:12:44 GMT, "Lew Bryson"
> wrote:

>Just for curiosity's sake (i.e., I'm not asking this because I want to write
>about it), how many of you hard-core types out there no longer think Sierra
>Nevada Pale Ale is worth drinking? I'm not saying it's changed, because I
>don't think it has. But I've run into a surprising number of people recently
>who think it just doesn't have enough flavor to interest them, and wondered
>what you thought.
>
>Just to start the ball rolling, I still enjoy it quite a bit. I like Anchor
>Liberty, too.

It's been a very long time since I've had SNPA, but not so much
because it's not worth drinking. It's simply that the bar has been
raised by the competition in so many places. That's certainly true
in my neck of the woods; faced with a choice of SNPA and Maritime
Pacific's Jolly Roger last night, the latter was just too easy to
make. Unfair comparison, perhaps. Even in other places I've been,
there's usually something else, especially locally-produced, that
I'll order instead. This was as true of my recent trip to Philly
and D.C. as it is of my hometown.
--

Nobody You Know

> It's been a very long time since I've had SNPA, but not so much
> because it's not worth drinking. It's simply that the bar has been
> raised by the competition in so many places. That's certainly true
> in my neck of the woods; faced with a choice of SNPA and Maritime
> Pacific's Jolly Roger last night, the latter was just too easy to
> make. Unfair comparison, perhaps. Even in other places I've been,
> there's usually something else, especially locally-produced, that
> I'll order instead. This was as true of my recent trip to Philly
> and D.C. as it is of my hometown.
> --
>
*What he said. (^_^)

In reality, I'm surrounded by such wonderful variety and selection that it's
disgusting. Yes, SNPA would be an oasis tap in, say, rural South Carolina
or seaside Georgia or lakeside Utah. But I'm in a town where I got people
bitchin' on Pubcrawler because one pub is charging $7 for draught Chimay--a
beer I suspect is basically unavailable at all to more than 60% of the US
population and unavailable on draught to effectively 99%+ of the population.
In an embarrassment of riches like this (and a town with British, German,
and Belgian-style brewpubs), SNPA is definitely going to take a back seat
status. But at the same time, it *is* still a good and worthwhile beer, and
also useful for weaning macrobrew drinkers off of Amstel Light and Sam
Adams. I simply have to be in the right frame of mind and mood for it, and
likely find it to be the most distinctive option before me (including the
house-brewed iced tea or chai). I think the last time I had SNPA was in
late summer in a bar with some friends in Annapolis where I thought it would
go well with the all-American menu of bacon cheeseburger and pomme frites.
It did, much better than the Mardesous 8 would have.

SNPA is a nice enough beer, but not worth having when more interesting
choices are available. Worth drinking? Yes, if your other choices are things
like Sam Adams or Yuengling. Put a micro with a bolder flavor in the mix and
SNPA loses. I put it in the same class as Fat Tire. Nice enough beer when
there aren't any better choices.

Garry

SNPA is a nice enough beer, but not worth having when more interesting
choices are available. Worth drinking? Yes, if your other choices are things
like Sam Adams or Yuengling. Put a micro with a bolder flavor in the mix and
SNPA loses. I put it in the same class as Fat Tire. Nice enough beer when
there aren't any better choices.

Garry

The thing with SNPA is it's become comfortable, it's available and cheaper
than alot of the other micro's so that, to some people would automatically
bring it down a notch. I still drink it especially in a few different
occasions. The first being it's the best beer in the bar, the second I've
found it at Costco which makes it cheap to get which is a good thing in my
book, third it's a beer that can be shared with people that are beer
neophyte's as long as you warn them it's a bit bitter. I think if I were to
walk into the local bar with 30 good beers on tap I wouldn't neccessarily go
with SNPA only becuase there are better choices available.

Kevin Adkins
"Lew Bryson" > wrote in message
. com...
> Just for curiosity's sake (i.e., I'm not asking this because I want to
write
> about it), how many of you hard-core types out there no longer think
Sierra
> Nevada Pale Ale is worth drinking? I'm not saying it's changed, because I
> don't think it has. But I've run into a surprising number of people
recently
> who think it just doesn't have enough flavor to interest them, and
wondered
> what you thought.
>
> Just to start the ball rolling, I still enjoy it quite a bit. I like
Anchor
> Liberty, too.
> --
> Lew Bryson
>
> www.LewBryson.com
> Author of "New York Breweries" and "Pennsylvania Breweries," 2nd ed., both
> available at <www.amazon.com>
> The Hotmail address on this post is for newsgroups only: I don't check it,
> or respond to it. Spam away.
>
>

Lew Bryson ) wrote:
: Just for curiosity's sake (i.e., I'm not asking this because I want to write
: about it), how many of you hard-core types out there no longer think Sierra
: Nevada Pale Ale is worth drinking? I'm not saying it's changed, because I
: don't think it has. But I've run into a surprising number of people recently
: who think it just doesn't have enough flavor to interest them, and wondered
: what you thought.
:
: Just to start the ball rolling, I still enjoy it quite a bit. I like Anchor
: Liberty, too.

I live about 10 miles from Stone, within their local delivery area, so
most places around here (liquor stores, restaurants, supermarkets) have
Stone Pale which I prefer to SNPA when I'm in a PA mood. When we're away
from home and SNPA is available I'll still order it occasionally. It's
still quite good.

--
Bill

reply to sirwill1 AT same domain as above

Lew Bryson > blurted:
> Just for curiosity's sake (i.e., I'm not asking this because I want
> to write about it), how many of you hard-core types out there no
> longer think Sierra Nevada Pale Ale is worth drinking? I'm not saying
> it's changed, because I don't think it has. But I've run into a
> surprising number of people recently who think it just doesn't have
> enough flavor to interest them, and wondered what you thought.
>
> Just to start the ball rolling, I still enjoy it quite a bit. I like
> Anchor Liberty, too.

Sierra Nevada Pale Ale is my
impromptu-party-on-a-budget-better-get-some-discount-beer beer.

fr0glet
--
"You cannot be an objective scientist if you have an agenda."
~The Madman

Lew Bryson > wrote:
>Just for curiosity's sake (i.e., I'm not asking this because I want to write
>about it), how many of you hard-core types out there no longer think Sierra
>Nevada Pale Ale is worth drinking? I'm not saying it's changed, because I
>don't think it has. But I've run into a surprising number of people recently
>who think it just doesn't have enough flavor to interest them, and wondered
>what you thought.

My wife drinks a fair amount of it. I still consider it a valid
choice, but these days even my small town is blessed with so many
other choices that SNPA is only an occasional for me. Still worth
drinking, though.
--
Joel Plutchak "We had all slipped into a silence of exquisite
plutchak@[...] fatigue with no wit to woo us. It was a special
silence. No lambs, just owls." - Neil Innes

SNPA is like Elvis. I really admire what they did in breaking new ground,
but I don't really have a strong need to spend much time with either at
this point.

Good, but there's much better out there now, so why bother?
--
************************************************** ***************
Dan Iwerks thinks that the beer you're drinking probably sucks.
The fundamental problem with Solipsism is it makes me
responsible for the fact that you're a complete idiot.
************************************************** ***************

Lew:

> Just to start the ball rolling, I still enjoy it quite a bit. I like Anchor
> Liberty, too.

I drink a fair amount of SNPA because it's still a ****ING GOOD pale
ale, and as someone else pointed out, it's cheap at Costco.

I dispute all these claims of there being "so much better" beers out
there. I have a feeling this is coming from the "Barleywine, Imperial
Stout, or my blown-out palate can't taste it" crowd. What's so much
better? Another pale ale? I can think of a few others that I prefer
over SNPA, but not many, and they're not *that* much better.

I don't drink Liberty Ale much because I think it's over-priced and
short-lived, and there really are a lot of IPAs that surpass it in
quality. Still a very good beer, though, and ****ING GOOD at the
source. Anchor Steam is still a mainstay for me at local taps, but I
eschew bottles, and avoid it in any form outside the Bay Area.

What about other old-timers? I completely ignore Pyramid and Red Hook
now, perhaps unfairly. Full Sail, on the other hand, just seems to
get better and better all the time (except for their SHITE packaging).

"Jon Binkley" > wrote in message
om...
> Lew:
> > Just to start the ball rolling, I still enjoy it quite a bit. I like
Anchor
> > Liberty, too.
>
> I drink a fair amount of SNPA because it's still a ****ING GOOD pale
> ale, and as someone else pointed out, it's cheap at Costco.
>
> I dispute all these claims of there being "so much better" beers out
> there. I have a feeling this is coming from the "Barleywine, Imperial
> Stout, or my blown-out palate can't taste it" crowd. What's so much
> better? Another pale ale? I can think of a few others that I prefer
> over SNPA, but not many, and they're not *that* much better.
>
> I don't drink Liberty Ale much because I think it's over-priced and
> short-lived, and there really are a lot of IPAs that surpass it in
> quality. Still a very good beer, though, and ****ING GOOD at the
> source. Anchor Steam is still a mainstay for me at local taps, but I
> eschew bottles, and avoid it in any form outside the Bay Area.
>
> What about other old-timers? I completely ignore Pyramid and Red Hook
> now, perhaps unfairly. Full Sail, on the other hand, just seems to
> get better and better all the time (except for their SHITE packaging).

Ah... Vintage Binkley. Well-spoke, well-thought. I have found ONE place on
the East Coast where draft Steam tastes good; a sports bar in New Paltz, NY.
Why, I don't know, I just go and drink there sometimes. SNCA was up to $31 a
case this year...is there an exchange rate problem?

--
Lew Bryson

www.LewBryson.com
Author of "New York Breweries" and "Pennsylvania Breweries," 2nd ed., both
available at <www.amazon.com>
The Hotmail address on this post is for newsgroups only: I don't check it,
or respond to it. Spam away.

"Lew Bryson" > wrote in message
. com...
> Just for curiosity's sake (i.e., I'm not asking this because I want to
write
> about it), how many of you hard-core types out there no longer think
Sierra
> Nevada Pale Ale is worth drinking?

Not me. I still think it's a great beer. I'm not going to go out and
deliberately search it out, in part because it's so easy to find (especially
here in California). But I still think it's one of the best beers out there.

-Steve

"Steve Jackson" > wrote in message news:<jdLKb.30379$i55.25298@fed1read06>...
> "Lew Bryson" > wrote in message
> . com...
> > Just for curiosity's sake (i.e., I'm not asking this because I want to
> write
> > about it), how many of you hard-core types out there no longer think
> Sierra
> > Nevada Pale Ale is worth drinking?
>
> Not me. I still think it's a great beer. I'm not going to go out and
> deliberately search it out, in part because it's so easy to find (especially
> here in California). But I still think it's one of the best beers out there.
>

What he said

I drink it regularly on draft, though thinking back it has been mostly
at lunch type places.

Fred Waltman
www.LABeer.com
www.FranconiaBeerGuide.com

>What about other old-timers? I completely ignore Pyramid and Red Hook
>now, perhaps unfairly. Full Sail, on the other hand, just seems to
>get better and better all the time (except for their SHITE packaging).
>
>

I can't recall the last time I bought a 6 (or 12 or case) of SNPA but only
because I've had so much of it has become, dare I say, a bit boring (Of course
I drink a hell of a lot of PU when its on sale and I still haven't gotten bored
with it) I'll still get it on Tap if there is nothing better (although most
bars around my way either pour Anchor Steam or Lagunitas IPA and I'd drink
either of those over SNPA most of the time) Really the only time I drink it
anymore is when I visit my father since its the one goodbeer that I have turned
him on to.
As for other old-timers... I have a pyramid brewpub close to me and I like to
try the rotating brewers handles but other than one six of snowcap its been a
while since I've bought any pyramid at a store, Same with redhook (although I
did pick up a discounted 12 of winterhook which was avarage at best) I still
buy Full Sail occasionally, as well Woodstock IPA which is relatively old-time.

mike

"Alexander D. Mitchell IV" > wrote
in message ...

>
> But I'm in a town where I got people
> bitchin' on Pubcrawler because one pub is charging $7 for
draught Chimay--a
> beer I suspect is basically unavailable at all to more
than 60% of the US
> population and unavailable on draught to effectively 99%+
of the population.

I've had Chimay on tap in Houston, Philly, and DC. I
suspect it's available in several other large markets. So
draught Chimay is probably available to at least 50% of the
US population.

> I've had Chimay on tap in Houston, Philly, and DC. I
> suspect it's available in several other large markets. So
> draught Chimay is probably available to at least 50% of the
> US population.
>
Okay, let me qualify that: "Available within a REASONABLY convenient
drive/transit ride." I know of someone who road-tested a car by driving it
from Washington D.C. to Vermont and back just as an excuse to visit two
breweries. That ain't normal. Nor is driving from Washington DC to Chicago
just to throw cases of New Glarus or New Belgium beer in the car.

Sure, if we want to be persnickety about it, New Glarus' fruit beers are
also "available" to me--IF I hop in my car and drive two days over to
central Wisconsin. And Selin's Grove Brewing's wonderful beers are
available to any Californians that want to drive to central Pennsylvania,
over an hour from the nearest airport or Amtrak station. Ditto Dragonmead
Brewing's stuff.

What percentage of the population, however, is ever likely to gain exposure
to a Chimay tap, even if they happen to live in a city where it's routinely
available? Let alone be persuaded to actually order it?

Is there anyone out there that can specifically quantify where Chimay would
be barred by law? I can come up with Utah, South Carolina, and maybe
Mississippi............. what other states have laws against "strong
beers"? (Having said that, maybe I'd better check the ABV's on the various
Chimays......)

Bruce Reistle > wrote:
>"Alexander D. Mitchell IV" > wrote:
>> But I'm in a town where I got people bitchin' on Pubcrawler because
>> one pub is charging $7 for draught Chimay--a beer I suspect is
>> basically unavailable at all to more than 60% of the US
>> population and unavailable on draught to effectively 99%+
>>of the population.
>
>I've had Chimay on tap in Houston, Philly, and DC. I
>suspect it's available in several other large markets. So
>draught Chimay is probably available to at least 50% of the
>US population.

I'm not so sure about that. What percentage of people
live in those large markets? I know the vast majority
of the country landwise has SHITE tap selection in general.
I've never seen Chimay on tap in any small market, even
semi-sophistamacated places like where I live.
--
Joel Plutchak "Senza la birra tutto diventa orfano."
plutchak@[...] - Italian proverb (slightly revised)

On Mon, 26 Jan 2004 14:27:28 +0000 (UTC),
(Joel Plutchak) wrote:

>Bruce Reistle > wrote:
>>"Alexander D. Mitchell IV" > wrote:
>>> But I'm in a town where I got people bitchin' on Pubcrawler because
>>> one pub is charging $7 for draught Chimay--a beer I suspect is
>>> basically unavailable at all to more than 60% of the US
>>> population and unavailable on draught to effectively 99%+
>>>of the population.
>>
>>I've had Chimay on tap in Houston, Philly, and DC. I
>>suspect it's available in several other large markets. So
>>draught Chimay is probably available to at least 50% of the
>>US population.
>
> I'm not so sure about that. What percentage of people
>live in those large markets?

A big percentage. The combined population of the biggest 15
metropolitan areas in the USA is more than 106,000,000. That
includes all the metropolian areas mentioned by Bruce, as well
as the likes of NYC, Puget Sound, and a couple of biggies in
California, among others.

Note, though, that Atlanta is among those top 15, and Georgia's
hidebound alcohol regs rule out the likes of draught Chimay.
However, expand the top 15 metro areas to the top 25, and you have
more than made up for that population. Like Portland, Oregon,
for instance. Maybe even Eugene. Or Spokane, Washington.

> I know the vast majority
>of the country landwise has SHITE tap selection in general.

The vast majority of the country's population doesn't live
in the vast majority of the country landwise, though. But
you're painfully right about that tap selection thing.

>I've never seen Chimay on tap in any small market, even
>semi-sophistamacated places like where I live.

Considering how close your semi-sophistamacated small market is
to the third largest metropolitan area in the USA, that's mildly
surprising. One would think there would be one really good
multitap bar to take care of the snob factor. I betcha one
could find draught Chimay in Corvallis, Oregon, or Bellingham,
Washington.
--

Nobody You Know

"Oh, Guess" > wrote in message
...

> However, expand the top 15 metro areas to the top 25, and you have
> more than made up for that population. Like Portland, Oregon,
> for instance. Maybe even Eugene. Or Spokane, Washington.

Only one of which is within sniffing distance of the top 25 metro areas.

> Considering how close your semi-sophistamacated small market is
> to the third largest metropolitan area in the USA, that's mildly
> surprising.

100-plus miles isn't all that close. Considering how even in Chicago, you
probably can count the number of Chimay taps on your hands. Or how I can
probably count the number of Chimay taps in a city like Los Angeles on one
hand.

> One would think there would be one really good
> multitap bar to take care of the snob factor. I betcha one
> could find draught Chimay in Corvallis, Oregon, or Bellingham,
> Washington.

Major (beer) cultural difference between that corner of the country and
everywhere else in the country. Just because it may be easy to find Chimay
taps all over the place there, it's hardly a shock that they're rare
elsewhere.

-Steve

Oh, Guess > wrote:
>Considering how close your semi-sophistamacated small market is
>to the third largest metropolitan area in the USA, that's mildly
>surprising. One would think there would be one really good
>multitap bar to take care of the snob factor.

One would think that, but professor types are snooty
to begin with, so they buy into the theory that wine is
what snooty people drink. (We do have a couple so-called
"wine bars", as 1990's as those are.) A lot of the rest
of the people here are students, who either won't spend
a few extra pennies on good beer, or drink crap like
Corona or Goldschlager.
We do have a few multi-taps (where multi means 6-12
non-swill) in town, but so far I haven't seen Chimay in
any of 'em. Except in bottles.
--
Joel Plutchak "Senza la birra tutto diventa orfano."
plutchak@[...] - Italian proverb (slightly revised)

On Mon, 26 Jan 2004 23:03:34 -0800, "Steve Jackson"
> wrote:

>"Oh, Guess" > wrote in message
...
>
>> However, expand the top 15 metro areas to the top 25, and you have
>> more than made up for that population. Like Portland, Oregon,
>> for instance. Maybe even Eugene. Or Spokane, Washington.
>
>Only one of which is within sniffing distance of the top 25 metro areas.

Sloppy writing on my part. Should have added "or even smaller metro
areas outside the top 25" before mentioning the likes of Eugene and
Spokane.

>> Considering how close your semi-sophistamacated small market is
>> to the third largest metropolitan area in the USA, that's mildly
>> surprising.
>
>100-plus miles isn't all that close. Considering how even in Chicago, you
>probably can count the number of Chimay taps on your hands. Or how I can
>probably count the number of Chimay taps in a city like Los Angeles on one
>hand.

Point. I was thinking in terms of being close to a good supplier, but
distribution in most states is highly regional anyway.

>> One would think there would be one really good
>> multitap bar to take care of the snob factor. I betcha one
>> could find draught Chimay in Corvallis, Oregon, or Bellingham,
>> Washington.
>
>Major (beer) cultural difference between that corner of the country and
>everywhere else in the country. Just because it may be easy to find Chimay
>taps all over the place there, it's hardly a shock that they're rare
>elsewhere.

Damn savages.
--

Nobody You Know

"Alexander D. Mitchell IV" > wrote
in message ...
> > I've had Chimay on tap in Houston, Philly, and DC. I
> > suspect it's available in several other large markets.
So
> > draught Chimay is probably available to at least 50% of
the
> > US population.
> >
> Okay, let me qualify that: "Available within a REASONABLY
convenient
> drive/transit ride." I know of someone who road-tested a
car by driving it
> from Washington D.C. to Vermont and back just as an excuse
to visit two
> breweries. That ain't normal. Nor is driving from
Washington DC to Chicago
> just to throw cases of New Glarus or New Belgium beer in
the car.
>
> Sure, if we want to be persnickety about it, New Glarus'
fruit beers are
> also "available" to me--IF I hop in my car and drive two
days over to
> central Wisconsin. And Selin's Grove Brewing's wonderful
beers are
> available to any Californians that want to drive to
central Pennsylvania,
> over an hour from the nearest airport or Amtrak station.
Ditto Dragonmead
> Brewing's stuff.
>
> What percentage of the population, however, is ever likely
to gain exposure
> to a Chimay tap, even if they happen to live in a city
where it's routinely
> available? Let alone be persuaded to actually order it?
>
If Chimay is available on tap in NY, SFO, Chicago, DC,
Houston, LA, and Philly, then it is available to a
significant proportion of the US population. I'm sure it's
available in many smaller markets as well.

In Houston, Chimay was commonplace. I've had it in at least
four different places there. And Houston is not a beer
destination, although the pub scene was probably better
there than the DC area.

"Bruce Reistle" > wrote in message
...
> If Chimay is available on tap in NY, SFO, Chicago, DC,
> Houston, LA, and Philly, then it is available to a
> significant proportion of the US population. I'm sure it's
> available in many smaller markets as well.

Yeah, but how many SEATS do these places have? HA!

> In Houston, Chimay was commonplace. I've had it in at least
> four different places there. And Houston is not a beer
> destination, although the pub scene was probably better
> there than the DC area.

Isn't the importer in Austin? Might have an effect on things.

--
Lew Bryson

www.LewBryson.com
Author of "New York Breweries" and "Pennsylvania Breweries," 2nd ed., both
available at <www.amazon.com>
The Hotmail address on this post is for newsgroups only: I don't check it,
or respond to it. Spam away.

Bruce Reistle > wrote:
>"Alexander D. Mitchell IV" > wrote
>in message ...
>> > draught Chimay is probably available to at least 50% of
>> > the US population.
>> >
>> Okay, let me qualify that: "Available within a REASONABLY
>>convenient drive/transit ride."

>If Chimay is available on tap in NY, SFO, Chicago, DC,
>Houston, LA, and Philly, then it is available to a
>significant proportion of the US population.

Those cities encompass roughly 7% of the population
of the United States, according to World Atlas.

>[I suspect it's] available in many smaller markets as well.

I drank it on tap in Austin immediately after it
debuted in kegs.
--
Joel Plutchak "Senza la birra tutto diventa orfano."
plutchak@[...] - Italian proverb (slightly revised)

Joel Plutchak wrote:

> Bruce Reistle > wrote:
>
>>If Chimay is available on tap in NY, SFO, Chicago, DC,
>>Houston, LA, and Philly, then it is available to a
>>significant proportion of the US population.
>
> Those cities encompass roughly 7% of the population
> of the United States, according to World Atlas.

I wrote this before, and I'll write it again:

The combined population of the biggest 15 metropolitan areas in the
USA is more than 106,000,000. That includes all the metropolian areas
mentioned by Bruce, as well as the likes of Puget Sound, and some
more big metro areas in California, as well as Phoenix and Boston,
among others.

Note, though, that Atlanta is among those top 15, and Georgia's
hidebound alcohol regs rule out the likes of draught Chimay. This
is true for any state that limits or restricts beer based on
alcohol content.

>>[I suspect it's] available in many smaller markets as well.

Beyond the top 15 metro areas in population, you have smaller areas,
like Portland (Oregon), or Eugene, or even Spokane, that still have
a bit of a decent beer market, including at least one or two places
where you'll find the likes of Chimay on draught. Wasn't there a
thread on a good beer bar near Louisville, KY, recently?

> I drank it on tap in Austin immediately after it
> debuted in kegs.

Home to MBI, which imports Chimay, and former home of Celis
Brewery. Maybe Belgobeers are just popular there, for some
unfathomable reason.
--
dgs

dgs > wrote:
>Joel Plutchak wrote:
>> Bruce Reistle > wrote:
>>>If Chimay is available on tap in NY, SFO, Chicago, DC,
>>>Houston, LA, and Philly, then it is available to a
>>>significant proportion of the US population.
>>
>> Those cities encompass roughly 7% of the population
>> of the United States, according to World Atlas.
>
>I wrote this before, and I'll write it again:
>
>The combined population of the biggest 15 metropolitan areas in the
>USA is more than 106,000,000. That includes all the metropolian areas
>mentioned by Bruce, as well as the likes of Puget Sound, and some
>more big metro areas in California, as well as Phoenix and Boston,
>among others.
>Note, though, that Atlanta is among those top 15, and Georgia's
>hidebound alcohol regs rule out the likes of draught Chimay. This
>is true for any state that limits or restricts beer based on
>alcohol content.

So assuming Chimay is available there, and within a decent
commute (like "The Valley" to Santa Monica?), that's roughly 36%
of the population of the US. (We'll wave our hands and say
places like Atlanta makes up for several smaller markets.)
--
Joel Plutchak "Senza la birra tutto diventa orfano."
plutchak@[...] - Italian proverb (slightly revised)

"Joel Plutchak" > wrote in message
...

> >If Chimay is available on tap in NY, SFO, Chicago, DC,
> >Houston, LA, and Philly, then it is available to a
> >significant proportion of the US population.
>
> Those cities encompass roughly 7% of the population
> of the United States, according to World Atlas.

Depends on how you count. If you count the more colloquial and common usage
of referring to the center city and its suburbs, those places now represent
approximately 24 percent of the US population.

Which is still less than a quarter. And is hardly a good barometer for the
widespread availability of draught Chimay.

-Steve

On Thu, 05 Feb 2004 10:43:27 -0800, dgs > wrote:


>The combined population of the biggest 15 metropolitan areas in the
>USA is more than 106,000,000.

>Note, though, that Atlanta is among those top 15, and Georgia's
>hidebound alcohol regs rule out the likes of draught Chimay.

Hi Don!

This is true for now, but maybe not much longer. House Bill 645 just
passed the Georgia Senate today, after passing in the House last year,
and is on its way to the Governor for signature. The Governor is a
non-drinker, which might explain the "promote tourism" angle mentioned
in the link below.

Keep your fingers crossed for us down here!

Sean

http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/met...4a/05beer.html

"dgs" > wrote in message
...
> Joel Plutchak wrote:
>
> > Bruce Reistle > wrote:
> >
> >>If Chimay is available on tap in NY, SFO, Chicago, DC,
> >>Houston, LA, and Philly, then it is available to a
> >>significant proportion of the US population.
> >
> > Those cities encompass roughly 7% of the population
> > of the United States, according to World Atlas.
>
> I wrote this before, and I'll write it again:
>
> The combined population of the biggest 15 metropolitan
areas in the
> USA is more than 106,000,000. That includes all the
metropolian areas
> mentioned by Bruce, as well as the likes of Puget Sound,
and some
> more big metro areas in California, as well as Phoenix and
Boston,
> among others.
>
> Note, though, that Atlanta is among those top 15, and
Georgia's
> hidebound alcohol regs rule out the likes of draught
Chimay. This
> is true for any state that limits or restricts beer based
on
> alcohol content.
>
This is partly true. Apparently, strong beers can be
categorized as wine in Georgia, and hence it is possible
that Chimay is available on tap.

On Thu, 05 Feb 2004 16:32:24 -0500, Sean Maxwell >
wrote:

>On Thu, 05 Feb 2004 10:43:27 -0800, dgs > wrote:
>
>
>>The combined population of the biggest 15 metropolitan areas in the
>>USA is more than 106,000,000.
>
>>Note, though, that Atlanta is among those top 15, and Georgia's
>>hidebound alcohol regs rule out the likes of draught Chimay.
>
>Hi Don!
>
>This is true for now, but maybe not much longer. House Bill 645 just
>passed the Georgia Senate today, after passing in the House last year,
>and is on its way to the Governor for signature. The Governor is a
>non-drinker, which might explain the "promote tourism" angle mentioned
>in the link below.
>
>Keep your fingers crossed for us down here!
>
>Sean
>
>http://www.ajc.com/metro/content/met...4a/05beer.html

Well, I'll be. The possibility that y'all will be drinkin' the good
stuff must be a mighty pleasing prospect. You're gonna be seeing
a few "tourists" from the beer-starved Carolinas, I can tell you that.
Congratulations, and I hope the Governor signs that puppy soon.
--
Nobody You Know

Steve Jackson > wrote:
>"Joel Plutchak" > wrote:
>> >If Chimay is available on tap in NY, SFO, Chicago, DC,
>> >Houston, LA, and Philly, then it is available to a
>> >significant proportion of the US population.
>>
>> Those cities encompass roughly 7% of the population
>> of the United States, according to World Atlas.
>
>Depends on how you count. If you count the more colloquial and common usage
>of referring to the center city and its suburbs, those places now represent
>approximately 24 percent of the US population.

Yeah, you're right, I checked my figures and it was strictly
for city boundaries-- no suburbs.
Then again, I know people who live in the far suburbs of Chicago
who don't go into the city much due to the hassle. The concept
of availability gets fairly soft in such cases.

>Which is still less than a quarter. And is hardly a good barometer for the
>widespread availability of draught Chimay.

>
>-Steve
>
>


--
Joel Plutchak "Senza la birra tutto diventa orfano."
plutchak@[...] - Italian proverb (slightly revised)

"Joel Plutchak" > wrote in message
...
> Then again, I know people who live in the far suburbs of Chicago
> who don't go into the city much due to the hassle. The concept
> of availability gets fairly soft in such cases.

Yeah, what the hell's "available" mean, anyway? By mass transit? By car
driven flat-out on the interstate? Within 20 minutes' travel time? Within 2
hours? A day trip? I would submit that if it's more than half an hour's
travel time away, it's not "available." Maybe it's attainable, but not
available.

--
Lew Bryson

www.LewBryson.com
Author of "New York Breweries" and "Pennsylvania Breweries," 2nd ed., both
available at <www.amazon.com>
The Hotmail address on this post is for newsgroups only: I don't check it,
or respond to it. Spam away.

> Yeah, what the hell's "available" mean, anyway? By mass transit? By car
> driven flat-out on the interstate? Within 20 minutes' travel time? Within
2
> hours? A day trip? I would submit that if it's more than half an hour's
> travel time away, it's not "available." Maybe it's attainable, but not
> available.
>
This is exactly, precisely my original point (thanks, Lew).

I live 3.5 miles across town (can be driven with only two right turns and
then park the car) from one bar that tries to have Chimay on draught
regularly. At the wrong time of day in an automobile, the "half-hour" rule
disqualifies THAT place! <:-o

Refine this further--if I went out here right now in Baltimore, I guarantee
you I could find a dozen or more locations that would have Chimay available
by bottle or glass, bar or retail sale. And I could find it here just by
hitting a good enough liquor/beer store, and we have plenty in the area. If
someone had never heard of Chimay until right now, just a few intelligent
thoughts will let the person locate it here in town in minutes--they won't
have to launch a search party or call the importer/distributor.

There are entire states where the stuff is technically illegal. There are
other states (Pennsylvania strikes me as an example) where I will only find
Chimay in one or two urban areas and specific retailers I would have to know
about by word of mouth (Shangy's, anyone?).

I've done articles on beers with various themes. I found, in my experience
talking to the brewers and/or distributors, that a great many craft beers
are routinely distributed in only five markets (at most) in the United
States: California, Colorado, Maryland/DC/Va. metro region, central North
Carolina, and Minnesota/Wisconsin (the latter with some leakage to Chicago,
I hear). Go figure.

"Alexander D. Mitchell IV" wrote:

>
>
> I've done articles on beers with various themes. I found, in my experience
> talking to the brewers and/or distributors, that a great many craft beers
> are routinely distributed in only five markets (at most) in the United
> States: California, Colorado, Maryland/DC/Va. metro region, central North
> Carolina,

as North Carolina has a 6% abv cap on beer, I can assure you that you will not
see Chimay White on tap in Central North Carolina, or a whole host of other
great beers. Whoever told you this was a great beer market is wrong, period.
Chuck C.

"Alexander D. Mitchell IV" > wrote in message
...
> There are entire states where the stuff is technically illegal. There are
> other states (Pennsylvania strikes me as an example) where I will only
find
> Chimay in one or two urban areas and specific retailers I would have to
know
> about by word of mouth (Shangy's, anyone?).

OI! Philly, Lehigh Valley, Wilkes-Barre/Scranton, Pittsburgh, and I'd be
really surprised if one of the KClinger's bars didn't have it. PA has a lot
of rural territory, true, but even out in the sticks, you can find great
stuff: Russell's, in Bloomsburg, for instance. Wouldn't be very surprised to
find draft Chimay in Reading or Lancaster; come to think of it, I did have
draft Chimay White in Lancaster last fall at Strawberry Hill, not noted as a
bar with a huge draft selection.
Gotta stick up for my state, dammit!

--
Lew Bryson

www.LewBryson.com
Author of "New York Breweries" and "Pennsylvania Breweries," 2nd ed., both
available at <www.amazon.com>
The Hotmail address on this post is for newsgroups only: I don't check it,
or respond to it. Spam away.

"Alexander D. Mitchell IV" > wrote
in message ...
> > Yeah, what the hell's "available" mean, anyway? By mass
transit? By car
> > driven flat-out on the interstate? Within 20 minutes'
travel time? Within
> 2
> > hours? A day trip? I would submit that if it's more than
half an hour's
> > travel time away, it's not "available." Maybe it's
attainable, but not
> > available.
> >
> This is exactly, precisely my original point (thanks,
Lew).

Someone had stated that draft Chimay was available to less
than 1% of the US population. My point was that it was in
fact available to a significantly higher percentage.

I'd put a 45 minute travel time as reasonable, say 45
minutes on a Saturday evening.

I contend that a significant percentage of the population
can get draft Chimay.

>
> Refine this further--if I went out here right now in
Baltimore, I guarantee
> you I could find a dozen or more locations that would have
Chimay available
> by bottle or glass, bar or retail sale. And I could find
it here just by
> hitting a good enough liquor/beer store, and we have
plenty in the area. If
> someone had never heard of Chimay until right now, just a
few intelligent
> thoughts will let the person locate it here in town in
minutes--they won't
> have to launch a search party or call the
importer/distributor.
>
> There are entire states where the stuff is technically
illegal. There are
> other states (Pennsylvania strikes me as an example) where
I will only find
> Chimay in one or two urban areas and specific retailers I
would have to know
> about by word of mouth (Shangy's, anyone?).
>
> I've done articles on beers with various themes. I found,
in my experience
> talking to the brewers and/or distributors, that a great
many craft beers
> are routinely distributed in only five markets (at most)
in the United
> States: California, Colorado, Maryland/DC/Va. metro
region, central North
> Carolina, and Minnesota/Wisconsin (the latter with some
leakage to Chicago,
> I hear). Go figure.
>
This is absurd. Like I said, Houston is not a beer
destination, but draft Chimay is readily available. It's
probably available in Dallas and Austin as well.

And what about Portland? Seattle? Philly? New ****ing
York City?

Bruce Reistle wrote:

> This is absurd. Like I said, Houston is not a beer
> destination, but draft Chimay is readily available. It's
> probably available in Dallas and Austin as well.

Regardless of the "articles" the poster has written,
I'm getting the sense there's a knowledge gap. Unless
I was hallucinating in Austin this past December, both
bottled (Rouge) and draft (Blanche) were available at
The Gingerman.

> And what about Portland? Seattle? Philly? New ****ing
> York City?

How's the Prima Pils these days?

"JustARandomMook" > wrote in message
news:CqXVb.25645$CJ1.21396@lakeread01...
> Bruce Reistle wrote:
> > This is absurd. Like I said, Houston is not a beer
> > destination, but draft Chimay is readily available. It's
> > probably available in Dallas and Austin as well.
>
> Regardless of the "articles" the poster has written,
> I'm getting the sense there's a knowledge gap. Unless
> I was hallucinating in Austin this past December, both
> bottled (Rouge) and draft (Blanche) were available at
> The Gingerman.

Well, that's hardly a shocker, given that (as Don said) the Chimay importer
is in Texas. There are a relatively few markets in the U.S. where draft
White is going to be a good proposition for the wholesaler and retailer. You
can cherry-pick your accounts and carefully send out kegs to those places. I
can think of seven towns in New York (outside NYC Metro) where you could
reasonably expect to sell draft White on a regular basis, nine in PA, three
in Maryland, three in Connecticut...but in most of those towns the number of
accounts that could reasonably expect to sell White are limited to three at
most. It really becomes a question of how "available" such a draft would
really be.

An interesting question, but it comes down to definition of terms...as it
always seems to do on here.

--
Lew Bryson

www.LewBryson.com
Author of "New York Breweries" and "Pennsylvania Breweries," 2nd ed., both
available at <www.amazon.com>
The Hotmail address on this post is for newsgroups only: I don't check it,
or respond to it. Spam away.

JustARandomMook > wrote:
>Regardless of the "articles" the poster has written,
>I'm getting the sense there's a knowledge gap. Unless
>I was hallucinating in Austin this past December, both
>bottled (Rouge) and draft (Blanche) were available at
>The Gingerman.

The importer is based in Austin, so it's not a stretch
that it's available in Texas.
--
Joel Plutchak "Senza la birra tutto diventa orfano."
plutchak@[...] - Italian proverb (slightly revised)