Barbecue (alt.food.barbecue) Discuss barbecue and grilling--southern style "low and slow" smoking of ribs, shoulders and briskets, as well as direct heat grilling of everything from burgers to salmon to vegetables.

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  #1 (permalink)   Report Post  
Bubba
 
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Default Experimetal larding, stage 2

Many thanks for the helpful hints and comments. And of course, the
controversy! I did some more internet research and did find a reference
to injecting with fat on "Ask Smoky's" web site, but he was using flavor
infused oil and I wanted something that would congeal when it hit the
cool meat so that I wouldn't have leakage. So...I decided to do my own
"test kitchen".

I don't own a larding needle and the "stick and stuff" with frozen fat
is laborious, plus larding always leaves bits of unrendered fat that
look a bit odd when the meat is sliced.

I suspected that barding would help keep the moisture in but would not
penetrate the meat very far. (Why "barding" poultry with aluminum foil
or mashed potatoes works as well as barding with bacon).

I decided on bottom round as my test meat, and clarified butter as my
injection fat. I chose chicken fat as my barding fat because it's the
strongest flavored fat I know of and would give me the best indication
of how far fat penetrates the barded beef.

I used three chunks of bottom round about 3 inches on each side. One I
left plain (my control, I suppose), one I barded with chicken fat, and
one I injected with clarified butter. The injected piece went into the
freezer until it was quite firm and cold and was then injected with the
butter using a "Cajun" type syringe....I got almost no leakage from the
injection sites.

All three pieces went onto a roasting rack and into a 350-degree oven
and were roasted until they hit 200 degrees. (Not only did this save
time over the "low and slow" method, I figured it would give me a
worst-case scenario.) They were removed and allowed to rest for 15
minutes...then sliced.

As you might expect, the "plain" roast would be good for shoe soles.

The piece barded with the chicken fat tasted...well...like
chicken....for about a quarter of an inch, and was fairly moist about
halfway through. The bottom half was just as dry as the plain roast.

The injected roast? Ew baby, ew baby!!! The top quarter was a bit dry,
but the rest of the meat very most, well flavored (butter will do that!)
and I think a bit more tender. I might be on to something here! The
injection technique was easy to do and worked well, but I'm thinking
barding the top as well as injecting might be the way to go.



Bubba

--
You wanna measure, or you wanna cook?


  #2 (permalink)   Report Post  
Kevin S. Wilson
 
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On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 09:35:36 -0500, Bubba >
wrote:

>All three pieces went onto a roasting rack and into a 350-degree oven
>and were roasted until they hit 200 degrees. (Not only did this save
>time over the "low and slow" method, I figured it would give me a
>worst-case scenario.) They were removed and allowed to rest for 15
>minutes...then sliced.


I donut geddit. At 200 internal, all three are dog food by my
estimation. That one sample turned out to be edible proves only that
one can use that method to barely save overcooked meat.

Why cook them to 200?

--
Kevin S. Wilson
Tech Writer at a university somewhere in Idaho
"When you can't do something completely impractical and intrinsically
useless *yourself*, you go get the Kibologists to do it for you." --J. Furr
  #3 (permalink)   Report Post  
Kevin S. Wilson
 
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Default

On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 09:35:36 -0500, Bubba >
wrote:

>All three pieces went onto a roasting rack and into a 350-degree oven
>and were roasted until they hit 200 degrees. (Not only did this save
>time over the "low and slow" method, I figured it would give me a
>worst-case scenario.) They were removed and allowed to rest for 15
>minutes...then sliced.


I donut geddit. At 200 internal, all three are dog food by my
estimation. That one sample turned out to be edible proves only that
one can use that method to barely save overcooked meat.

Why cook them to 200?

--
Kevin S. Wilson
Tech Writer at a university somewhere in Idaho
"When you can't do something completely impractical and intrinsically
useless *yourself*, you go get the Kibologists to do it for you." --J. Furr
  #4 (permalink)   Report Post  
Bubba
 
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Default

Kevin S. Wilson wrote:

>On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 09:35:36 -0500, Bubba >
>wrote:
>
>
>
>>All three pieces went onto a roasting rack and into a 350-degree oven
>>and were roasted until they hit 200 degrees. (Not only did this save
>>time over the "low and slow" method, I figured it would give me a
>>worst-case scenario.) They were removed and allowed to rest for 15
>>minutes...then sliced.
>>
>>

>
>I donut geddit. At 200 internal, all three are dog food by my
>estimation. That one sample turned out to be edible proves only that
>one can use that method to barely save overcooked meat.
>
>Why cook them to 200?
>
>
>

Because the technique will ultimately be used on venison shoulder which
I want: a) well done b) the collagen to turn to gelatin.



--
You wanna measure, or you wanna cook?


  #5 (permalink)   Report Post  
Bubba
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Kevin S. Wilson wrote:

>On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 09:35:36 -0500, Bubba >
>wrote:
>
>
>
>>All three pieces went onto a roasting rack and into a 350-degree oven
>>and were roasted until they hit 200 degrees. (Not only did this save
>>time over the "low and slow" method, I figured it would give me a
>>worst-case scenario.) They were removed and allowed to rest for 15
>>minutes...then sliced.
>>
>>

>
>I donut geddit. At 200 internal, all three are dog food by my
>estimation. That one sample turned out to be edible proves only that
>one can use that method to barely save overcooked meat.
>
>Why cook them to 200?
>
>
>

Because the technique will ultimately be used on venison shoulder which
I want: a) well done b) the collagen to turn to gelatin.



--
You wanna measure, or you wanna cook?




  #6 (permalink)   Report Post  
Bubba
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Kevin S. Wilson wrote:

>On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 09:35:36 -0500, Bubba >
>wrote:
>
>
>
>>All three pieces went onto a roasting rack and into a 350-degree oven
>>and were roasted until they hit 200 degrees. (Not only did this save
>>time over the "low and slow" method, I figured it would give me a
>>worst-case scenario.) They were removed and allowed to rest for 15
>>minutes...then sliced.
>>
>>

>
>I donut geddit. At 200 internal, all three are dog food by my
>estimation. That one sample turned out to be edible proves only that
>one can use that method to barely save overcooked meat.
>
>Why cook them to 200?
>
>
>

Because the technique will ultimately be used on venison shoulder which
I want: a) well done b) the collagen to turn to gelatin.
Basically, the same reason a brisket would be cooked to 200.


--
You wanna measure, or you wanna cook?


  #7 (permalink)   Report Post  
Bubba
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Kevin S. Wilson wrote:

>On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 09:35:36 -0500, Bubba >
>wrote:
>
>
>
>>All three pieces went onto a roasting rack and into a 350-degree oven
>>and were roasted until they hit 200 degrees. (Not only did this save
>>time over the "low and slow" method, I figured it would give me a
>>worst-case scenario.) They were removed and allowed to rest for 15
>>minutes...then sliced.
>>
>>

>
>I donut geddit. At 200 internal, all three are dog food by my
>estimation. That one sample turned out to be edible proves only that
>one can use that method to barely save overcooked meat.
>
>Why cook them to 200?
>
>
>

Because the technique will ultimately be used on venison shoulder which
I want: a) well done b) the collagen to turn to gelatin.
Basically, the same reason a brisket would be cooked to 200.


--
You wanna measure, or you wanna cook?


  #8 (permalink)   Report Post  
Buzz1
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Bubba" > wrote in message
...
> Kevin S. Wilson wrote:
>
>>Why cook them to 200?
>>
>>
>>

> Because the technique will ultimately be used on venison shoulder which
> I want: a) well done b) the collagen to turn to gelatin.
>

Darn I usually take venison to about 140°--darn tasty too!
Guess I've been doing it wrong for years<LOL>

Buzz


  #9 (permalink)   Report Post  
Buzz1
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Bubba" > wrote in message
...
> Kevin S. Wilson wrote:
>
>>Why cook them to 200?
>>
>>
>>

> Because the technique will ultimately be used on venison shoulder which
> I want: a) well done b) the collagen to turn to gelatin.
>

Darn I usually take venison to about 140°--darn tasty too!
Guess I've been doing it wrong for years<LOL>

Buzz


  #10 (permalink)   Report Post  
Bubba
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Buzz1 wrote:

>"Bubba" > wrote in message
t...
>
>
>>Kevin S. Wilson wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>Why cook them to 200?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>

>>Because the technique will ultimately be used on venison shoulder which
>>I want: a) well done b) the collagen to turn to gelatin.
>>
>>
>>

>Darn I usually take venison to about 140°--darn tasty too!
>Guess I've been doing it wrong for years<LOL>
>
>Buzz
>
>
>
>

I'm sure it was. If this were the backstrap I'd be eating it rare, but
while a shoulder would taste just fine at 140, I would find it a bit dry
and chewy. I'm after the same sort or texture one finds in a brisket or
pork shoulder that's been brought to 200. Hell, I'm retired and love to
cook....why not play and learn at the same time?

Bubba


--
You wanna measure, or you wanna cook?




  #11 (permalink)   Report Post  
Bubba
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Buzz1 wrote:

>"Bubba" > wrote in message
t...
>
>
>>Kevin S. Wilson wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>Why cook them to 200?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>

>>Because the technique will ultimately be used on venison shoulder which
>>I want: a) well done b) the collagen to turn to gelatin.
>>
>>
>>

>Darn I usually take venison to about 140°--darn tasty too!
>Guess I've been doing it wrong for years<LOL>
>
>Buzz
>
>
>
>

I'm sure it was. If this were the backstrap I'd be eating it rare, but
while a shoulder would taste just fine at 140, I would find it a bit dry
and chewy. I'm after the same sort or texture one finds in a brisket or
pork shoulder that's been brought to 200. Hell, I'm retired and love to
cook....why not play and learn at the same time?

Bubba


--
You wanna measure, or you wanna cook?


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