I made some baby back ribs today and they came out VERY tough and
stringy. I took the membrane off the back and smoked them with pure
hickory, no coals, over a drip pan in my weber. I kept the temp
between 250-300 the whole time, and had them in the for 3 hours. They
were terrible. Im catching on that I did not smoke them long enough.
Is this the problem?

In Alton Brown's book "I'm just here for the food", there is this
quote:

"I have friends who smoke their ribs for hours and hours and then
wonder why they're tough. The reason is connective tissue, lots of it,
and no amount of dry heat is going to dissolve that."

This was in a braising recipe for ribs. Is it impossible to get
tender baby backs on the que?

Thanks!
Steve

> wrote in message
ups.com...
>I made some baby back ribs today and they came out VERY tough and
> stringy. I took the membrane off the back and smoked them with pure
> hickory, no coals, over a drip pan in my weber. I kept the temp
> between 250-300 the whole time, and had them in the for 3 hours.
>
> This was in a braising recipe for ribs. Is it impossible to get
> tender baby backs on the que?
>
> Thanks!
> Steve
>

I usually do them 4 hors. Could be they were a tough pig, but I'd say more
likely another hour needed.

In article . com>,
wrote:

> I made some baby back ribs today and they came out VERY tough and
> stringy. I took the membrane off the back and smoked them with pure
> hickory, no coals, over a drip pan in my weber. I kept the temp
> between 250-300 the whole time, and had them in the for 3 hours. They
> were terrible. Im catching on that I did not smoke them long enough.
> Is this the problem?

It sounds like they didn't cook long enough. Mine usually take about 4
hours. They're done when I pick them up in the middle and they bend
easily.

"Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote:
> > wrote in message
>
> >I made some baby back ribs today and they came out VERY tough and
> > stringy. I took the membrane off the back and smoked them with pure
> > hickory, no coals, over a drip pan in my weber. I kept the temp
> > between 250-300 the whole time, and had them in the for 3 hours.
> >
> > This was in a braising recipe for ribs. Is it impossible to get
> > tender baby backs on the que?
> >
> > Thanks!
> I usually do them 4 hors. Could be they were a tough pig, but I'd say
> more likely another hour needed.

Agreed. The clock is not your friend. I've smoked baby backs on several
occasions. Ya watch the meat pull back from the bone, see how easy it is
to bend the rack, stick in a fork and give it the twist test. When they're
done, they're done!

--
Nick. Support severely wounded and disabled Veterans and their families!

Thank a Veteran and Support Our Troops. You are not forgotten. Thanks ! ! !
~Semper Fi~

On Sun, 2 Sep 2007 18:21:15 -0400, "Edwin Pawlowski" >
wrote:

>
> wrote in message
oups.com...
>>I made some baby back ribs today and they came out VERY tough and
>> stringy. I took the membrane off the back and smoked them with pure
>> hickory, no coals, over a drip pan in my weber. I kept the temp
>> between 250-300 the whole time, and had them in the for 3 hours.
>>
>> This was in a braising recipe for ribs. Is it impossible to get
>> tender baby backs on the que?
>>
>> Thanks!
>> Steve
>>
>
>I usually do them 4 hors. Could be they were a tough pig, but I'd say more
>likely another hour needed.
>
I have stopped on babybacks - too much trouble for too little meat.
However when I was still using them I tended to treat them almost like
steak or burger - 450-500, flipped once, done in 40-45 minutes.

Harry

On Sep 2, 4:02 pm, wrote:
> I made some baby back ribs today and they came out VERY tough and
> stringy. I took the membrane off the back and smoked them with pure
> hickory, no coals, over a drip pan in my weber. I kept the temp
> between 250-300 the whole time, and had them in the for 3 hours. They
> were terrible. Im catching on that I did not smoke them long enough.
> Is this the problem?
>
> In Alton Brown's book "I'm just here for the food", there is this
> quote:
>
> "I have friends who smoke their ribs for hours and hours and then
> wonder why they're tough. The reason is connective tissue, lots of it,
> and no amount of dry heat is going to dissolve that."
>
> This was in a braising recipe for ribs. Is it impossible to get
> tender baby backs on the que?
>
> Thanks!
> Steve

Thanks everyone for the replies. I love google groups. I forgot to
mention, on top of the toughness, I had a lot of "creosote" on them.
I just learned this term today. My tongue got numb while eating these
horrible things, and I was wondering what it was. now I know. I
guess its cuz I smoked with all hickory on a weber kettle?

> wrote in message
>
> Thanks everyone for the replies. I love google groups. I forgot to
> mention, on top of the toughness, I had a lot of "creosote" on them.
> I just learned this term today. My tongue got numb while eating these
> horrible things, and I was wondering what it was. now I know. I
> guess its cuz I smoked with all hickory on a weber kettle?
>

Creosote is from burning the fire too cold. You can get the same heat from
a large smoldering fire or a smaller hot burning fire. The smoldering makes
the creosote. You should also be letting the meat come up to room
temperature to avoid condensation on the meat.

FWIW, I don't do baby backs. Too expensive for what you get. I like the so
called country ribs. Did a batch today.

wrote:

> Thanks everyone for the replies. I love google groups.

You mean that you love usenet. Google Groups is just an access that allows a
glimpse at usenet posts. And a very clumsy access at that. As to your rib
problem:

1. Too much smoke from: using straight wood rather than lump charcoal and
ribs probably put on the grill cold from the fridge.
2. Worrying about the clock instead of what the ribs are telling you with
regard to doneness.
3. Not measuring the temperature at the proper location (at the grill
surface).
4. Doing babybacks instead of spares :-)
--
Dave
www.davebbq.com

wrote:

> I made some baby back ribs today and they came out VERY tough and
> stringy. I took the membrane off the back and smoked them with pure
> hickory, no coals, over a drip pan in my weber. I kept the temp
> between 250-300 the whole time, and had them in the for 3 hours. They
> were terrible. Im catching on that I did not smoke them long enough.
> Is this the problem?

Monitor them. They will become more and more tender as they
cook. At some point they become tender enough to eat. If you
keep cooking them too long beyond that point they'll become
dry.

Observe. Pick them up with your tongs. How far do they bend?
Does the meat begin to crack? These are indications that the
meat is becoming tender.

Cut off a a piece and eat it. If it's not tender, keep
cooking. If it's tender and you like it, you're done.

You have to admit that's pretty simple.


> In Alton Brown's book "I'm just here for the food", there is this
> quote:
>
> "I have friends who smoke their ribs for hours and hours and then
> wonder why they're tough. The reason is connective tissue, lots of it,
> and no amount of dry heat is going to dissolve that."
>

Doesn't mean much to me, I've never served tough ribs. But...

Alton is a great guy and I admire his work. He's not
the indisputable authority that some see him as, however.
People who view him that way aren't worth shit as cooks,
in my experience.

So please, don't come around here saying "cause Alton said
so".

> This was in a braising recipe for ribs.

Braising is wonderful. It's a completely different approach to
cooking meat, and it makes for true beauty when done properly.
It's not the same thing as Q, though. The idea that a liquid
cooking medium will enhance moisture in some unique way is a
myth.

> Is it impossible to get tender baby backs on the que?

<choke>

Keep reading, Grasshopper.

--
Reg

wrote in news:1188766969.826343.225220@
50g2000hsm.googlegroups.com:

> Is it impossible to get
> tender baby backs on the que?

Noy impossible at all. People do it every day.



--
Ask Me Why I support Stem Cell Research
http://stemcells.nih.gov/info/faqs.asp

On 3-Sep-2007, Reg > wrote:

> wrote:
>
> > I made some baby back ribs today and they came out VERY tough and
> > stringy.

<snippity, snip>

> > In Alton Brown's book "I'm just here for the food", there is this
> > quote:
> >
> > "I have friends who smoke their ribs for hours and hours and then
> > wonder why they're tough. The reason is connective tissue, lots of it,
> > and no amount of dry heat is going to dissolve that."
> >

<snip some more>

>
> > Is it impossible to get tender baby backs on the que?
>
> <choke>
>
> Keep reading, Grasshopper.
>
> --
> Reg

I have a lot of respect for Alton Brown, but that statement about
connective tissue not dissolving in dry heat just doesn't make
any sense to me. I Use an offset cooker. It doen't get much dryer
then that. If Alton is correct then it must be impossible for me to
make tender juicy smoked chuck roast in my cooker. Likewise,
there's no way I can get tender briskett or tender pork butt/shoulder.
Like most folks here, I don't do baby backs much, but I've NEVER
made any tough baby backs.

BTW, when you can't find brisket, chuck roast is a poorly kept
secret that'll send your guests home happy. But is it 'Q'? Who
cares?
--
Brick(Meanwhile, back at the Oasis, where the Arabs were
busily eating their dates.)

Brick wrote:
> On 3-Sep-2007, Reg > wrote:
>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I made some baby back ribs today and they came out VERY tough and
>>> stringy.
>
> <snippity, snip>
>
>>> In Alton Brown's book "I'm just here for the food", there is this
>>> quote:
>>>
>>> "I have friends who smoke their ribs for hours and hours and then
>>> wonder why they're tough. The reason is connective tissue, lots of it,
>>> and no amount of dry heat is going to dissolve that."

Since the connective tissue is immersed in the ribs, I also question
this statement. IMHO, dry heat or steam heat make little difference in
the meat's tenderness. That's a function of time at temperature and the
fat content of the meat.

Nonny


>>>
>
> <snip some more>
>
>>> Is it impossible to get tender baby backs on the que?
>> <choke>
>>
>> Keep reading, Grasshopper.
>>
>> --
>> Reg
>
> I have a lot of respect for Alton Brown, but that statement about
> connective tissue not dissolving in dry heat just doesn't make
> any sense to me. I Use an offset cooker. It doen't get much dryer
> then that. If Alton is correct then it must be impossible for me to
> make tender juicy smoked chuck roast in my cooker. Likewise,
> there's no way I can get tender briskett or tender pork butt/shoulder.
> Like most folks here, I don't do baby backs much, but I've NEVER
> made any tough baby backs.
>
> BTW, when you can't find brisket, chuck roast is a poorly kept
> secret that'll send your guests home happy. But is it 'Q'? Who
> cares?


--
---Nonnymus---
You don’t stand any taller by
trying to make others appear shorter.

Brick wrote:
> On 3-Sep-2007, Reg > wrote:
>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I made some baby back ribs today and they came out VERY tough and
>>> stringy.
>
> <snippity, snip>
>
>>> In Alton Brown's book "I'm just here for the food", there is this
>>> quote:
>>>
>>> "I have friends who smoke their ribs for hours and hours and then
>>> wonder why they're tough. The reason is connective tissue, lots of it,
>>> and no amount of dry heat is going to dissolve that."
>>>
>
> <snip some more>
>
>>> Is it impossible to get tender baby backs on the que?
>> <choke>
>>
>> Keep reading, Grasshopper.
>>
>> --
>> Reg
>
> I have a lot of respect for Alton Brown, but that statement about
> connective tissue not dissolving in dry heat just doesn't make
> any sense to me. I Use an offset cooker. It doen't get much dryer
> then that. If Alton is correct then it must be impossible for me to
> make tender juicy smoked chuck roast in my cooker. Likewise,
> there's no way I can get tender briskett or tender pork butt/shoulder.
> Like most folks here, I don't do baby backs much, but I've NEVER
> made any tough baby backs.
>
> BTW, when you can't find brisket, chuck roast is a poorly kept
> secret that'll send your guests home happy. But is it 'Q'? Who
> cares?

I do Sam's Club Chucks pretty regular. Can't beat em. Marinate in
Teryaki overnight to tenderize, a little salt and pepper, and Q em with
Hickory at about 250 degrees to about 180 internal. Melts in the mouth.

Dave Bugg wrote:
> 4. Doing babybacks instead of spares :-)

I think this all depends on where you get your meat. If you get
babybacks from any old grocer, they're normally pre-packaged (like
hormel.. soaking in brine) and very very small amount of meat.
Something I'd more liken to "riblets" from Applebees (ugh).

Now, I get all my meat at Sams club (no costco, but I hear it's similar).

They sell spares and babybacks. I prefer the babybacks and they seem to
be spares with all the extra fat/tissue taken off.. they "look like
ribs" instead of just a big hunk o meat with fat/bone, and there is a
LOT of meat on them. 1/3 a rack will fill me up, and I can eat! So now
when I make ribs for friends, I buy babybacks and figure on a rack
feeding at least 3-4. And there is normally 2 racks in the package.
About 30 bucks.

I've done spares twice from Sams. Didn't like them as much as the
babybacks.. but then again, I don't think they're really "babybacks" as
most people know them (from restaurants).

Bradley V. Stone wrote:
> Dave Bugg wrote:
>> 4. Doing babybacks instead of spares :-)
>
> I think this all depends on where you get your meat.

Nope; not at all.

--
Dave
www.davebbq.com

Dave Bugg wrote:
> Bradley V. Stone wrote:
>> Dave Bugg wrote:
>>> 4. Doing babybacks instead of spares :-)
>> I think this all depends on where you get your meat.
>
> Nope; not at all.
>

I couldn't tell if that was sarcasm or not. But I can tell you the bb
ribs from the local grocer are 1/3 the size as the ones from sams. And
the ones from sams aren't packaged in brine.

Brick wrote:

> I have a lot of respect for Alton Brown, but that statement about
> connective tissue not dissolving in dry heat just doesn't make
> any sense to me. I Use an offset cooker. It doen't get much dryer
> then that. If Alton is correct then it must be impossible for me to
> make tender juicy smoked chuck roast in my cooker. Likewise,
> there's no way I can get tender briskett or tender pork butt/shoulder.

I like Alton, but he does make mistakes now and then, as all
humans do.

I also think he overdoes it with the whacky equipment thing.
I've been able to make ravioli for years now without an
ironing board.

> Like most folks here, I don't do baby backs much, but I've NEVER
> made any tough baby backs.

I do baby backs rarely, and it's mostly for effect (cocktail
rib, Mr Important Guest?). Spares are a much better value.

> BTW, when you can't find brisket, chuck roast is a poorly kept
> secret that'll send your guests home happy. But is it 'Q'? Who
> cares?

So true. I like chuck roll the best, but just about
any cut will do.

--
Reg

Denny Wheeler wrote:
> On Tue, 04 Sep 2007 10:46:28 -0500, "Bradley V. Stone"
> > wrote:
>
>> Dave Bugg wrote:
>>> Bradley V. Stone wrote:
>>>> Dave Bugg wrote:
>>>>> 4. Doing babybacks instead of spares :-)
>>>> I think this all depends on where you get your meat.
>>> Nope; not at all.
>>>
>> I couldn't tell if that was sarcasm or not. But I can tell you the bb
>> ribs from the local grocer are 1/3 the size as the ones from sams. And
>> the ones from sams aren't packaged in brine.
>
> I think Dave was suggesting that spares just plain have it all over
> baby backs. How much did you say you pay for two racks? Around $30?
> I've never paid more than $2/lb for spares--good meaty ones at that.
> Costco's run $1.99/lb, iirc, and so you'd be under $20 for two
> goodsize racks.
>
> -denny-

Oh.. I was talking about where you get your ribs makes a difference.

I've had spares and BBs from Sams.. I prefer the BBs.. they are huge
and meaty. It's the same price for spares, but there is a couple more
lbs of meat, but I find it's not a high quality meat. Like they don't
get close enough to the ribs when cutting them and there's a lot more
fat and connective tissue.

I've seen BBs at grocers, and they don't compare to BBs from sams..
they're closer to spares from the local grocers or meat markets. While
the spares from sams are almost like a big pork brisket with rib bones
in them...

Yep, $30 for BBs, but thats for 15lbs. So $2/lb. Spares cost a
little less..

On 3-Sep-2007, Dave Turner > wrote:

> Brick wrote:
> > On 3-Sep-2007, Reg > wrote:
> >
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> I made some baby back ribs today and they came out VERY tough and
> >>> stringy.
> >
> > <snippity, snip>
> >
> >
> > BTW, when you can't find brisket, chuck roast is a poorly kept
> > secret that'll send your guests home happy. But is it 'Q'? Who
> > cares?
>
> I do Sam's Club Chucks pretty regular. Can't beat em. Marinate in
> Teryaki overnight to tenderize, a little salt and pepper, and Q em with
> Hickory at about 250 degrees to about 180 internal. Melts in the mouth.

I'm pretty ignorant about marinades Dave. I like the flavor I get from
various
brines for fowl, but I haven't done much marinating of beef or pork. I don't
think chuck needs any help in the tenderize department when I slow roast
it. It comes out "gummy tender as is". But, the flavor possibilities
intrigue
me. Can you elaborate on how strong a marinade should be. I couldn't
abide straight Shoyu or straight vinegar. I can't think of the words to ask
the question properly. Consider Kikkoman's Teriyaki marinade. How much
should it be diluted for an overnight soak? (Not that I favor that marinade,
but I have to use something as a reference to ask)

--
Brick(Save a tree, eat a Beaver)

Brick wrote:
> On 3-Sep-2007, Dave Turner > wrote:
>
>> Brick wrote:
>>> On 3-Sep-2007, Reg > wrote:
>>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I made some baby back ribs today and they came out VERY tough and
>>>>> stringy.
>>> <snippity, snip>
>>>
>>>
>>> BTW, when you can't find brisket, chuck roast is a poorly kept
>>> secret that'll send your guests home happy. But is it 'Q'? Who
>>> cares?
>> I do Sam's Club Chucks pretty regular. Can't beat em. Marinate in
>> Teryaki overnight to tenderize, a little salt and pepper, and Q em with
>> Hickory at about 250 degrees to about 180 internal. Melts in the mouth.
>
> I'm pretty ignorant about marinades Dave. I like the flavor I get from
> various
> brines for fowl, but I haven't done much marinating of beef or pork. I don't
> think chuck needs any help in the tenderize department when I slow roast
> it. It comes out "gummy tender as is". But, the flavor possibilities
> intrigue
> me. Can you elaborate on how strong a marinade should be. I couldn't
> abide straight Shoyu or straight vinegar. I can't think of the words to ask
> the question properly. Consider Kikkoman's Teriyaki marinade. How much
> should it be diluted for an overnight soak? (Not that I favor that marinade,
> but I have to use something as a reference to ask)
>
Brick,

I started using marinade on Chuck when my BW assured me that Chuck was
too tough to cook any other way but as a pot roast. Since it was
extremely important to prove her wrong (I'm taking my life in my own
hands now)I used about 1 cup of straight Yoshidas traditional teryaki
and some other spices and marinaded overnight. This tenderized it enough
that the following day I cooked it like a steak for about 25 minutes on
a side over direct medium heat, until the internal temp was about 140.
Excellent. I fell in love with the flavor and began using it with low &
slow. With smoke, the teryaki ends up quite mild and very flavorful,
even used undiluted.

Reg wrote:

> Brick wrote:
>
>> I have a lot of respect for Alton Brown, but that statement about
>> connective tissue not dissolving in dry heat just doesn't make
>> any sense to me. I Use an offset cooker. It doen't get much dryer
>> then that. If Alton is correct then it must be impossible for me to
>> make tender juicy smoked chuck roast in my cooker. Likewise,
>> there's no way I can get tender briskett or tender pork butt/shoulder.
>
>
> I like Alton, but he does make mistakes now and then, as all
> humans do.
>
> I also think he overdoes it with the whacky equipment thing.
> I've been able to make ravioli for years now without an
> ironing board.
>
>> Like most folks here, I don't do baby backs much, but I've NEVER
>> made any tough baby backs.
>
>
> I do baby backs rarely, and it's mostly for effect (cocktail
> rib, Mr Important Guest?). Spares are a much better value.
>
>> BTW, when you can't find brisket, chuck roast is a poorly kept
>> secret that'll send your guests home happy. But is it 'Q'? Who
>> cares?
>
>
> So true. I like chuck roll the best, but just about
> any cut will do.
>


I have bbq'd a chuck roast for philly cheese beef sandwiches and was
very pleased with the result. I almost always have a chuck roast in the
freezer. They are good for grinding up for burgers or cut up for stew
or chili.

For the baby back vs spares discussion, I will get either, if the price
is right!!! I have q'ued baby backs indirectly on a weber kettle and
gotten terrific results. Took all of 90 minutes. Spares, I have always
used a smoker (WSM now). Usually they take about 4 hours, but sometimes
less. There done when there done.

BBQ