Barry Harmon wrote:

>
> ************************************************** ******
> Dick,
>
> Could this dough have risen too long? The salt would have extended
> rise, but he doesn't have any salt. I frequently let my doughs go 45
> minutes with nornal salt and get good rise, oven spring, etc. I also
> don't go much over 2 hours for a normal bread in fermentation.
>
> It strikes me that the dough could be exhausted. A first rise of 2 1/2
> hours follored by a one hour final rise could be enough to kill the
> dough, espeically with no salt.
>
> Barry
>
> ************************************************** ******

Barry,

Of course it's exhausted. What I'm trying to get at is the reason. How
is he determining the length of the fermentation? That is, is he going
by touch or by sight? I've given some specific advice and asked some
specific questions, but so far I haven't seen answers to those
questions. These doughs normally come very quickly, but if he's not
kneading it enough in the first place and he's judging the fermentation
visually instead of by touch, we're a long way from solving his problem.

Feel free to jump in anytime, though, especially if you've got a page
with pictures that will help. (Nice job you're doing on the site, by the
way; it has really come a long way.)

Dick