engv9q2ghqa wrote:
> "Dick Margulis" > wrote in message
> ...
>> engv9q2ghqa wrote:
>>>
>>> I think the problem is that it rises too fast and I just need to use less
>>> yeast and get my oven pre-heated before the dough rises too far. Does
>>> anyone
>>> have experience with this?
>> Yes. In addition to the two adjustments you've listed (less yeast and
>> solid oven heat), start with cold water. If you use instant yeast (the
>> kind you mix with the flour rather than dissolving), you can start with
>> icewater in the summer and 60 to 70 F water in the winter. This will help
>> slow down the fermentation and give you a little more time for flavor to
>> develop. However, without salt you are still going to have to keep an
>> eagle eye on the dough so it doesn't get away from you.
>>
>> Work it on the young side. That is, if the fermentation gets to the point
>> that the dough collapses when you slap it, you've waited too long and
>> you're going to have awful bread. Instead, let it start to rise and get
>> soft, but don't let it go so far. Remember, the dough is ready when it's
>> ready, not when the clock says it's ready.
>>
>>
> Hi,
>
> Today, I tried less yeast, 1/2 tsp disolved in room temperature water,

Is it winter where you are?

> first
> rise took 2.5 hours. I let it rise in the pan 55 minutes. So, less yeast
> makes it more manageable. However even though I put it in the oven before it
> rose fully, it still collapsed.

What's the consistency of the dough? How are you kneading it (hand?
machine? how long? what technique?...) It may just be that your dough is
too underdeveloped to support itself.


> The 4.5x8.5 pan was about 2/3 full when I
> put the loaf in to rise, and I put it in the oven (400 degrees) when the top
> of the loaf just rose above the edge of the pan.

What's the weight of dough in that pan? Did you do the dimple test or
just go by height?


> Should I try more
> flour/less water for a stiffer dough? Would adding egg whites help? Less
> oil? Any other suggestions?

Let's concentrate on technique first, formula second.

>
> I'm measuring the whole wheat flour by stirring it in the bag and then
> sprinkling it into the measuring cup to get ~4 oz by weight per cup. This is
> how I have read one should measure flour for white bread, is it the same for
> whole wheat flour?

Yes, although it would be preferable to use a scale and weigh your
ingredients.

> Would the fact that I am not adding sweetener (sugar/honey) as the original
> recipe calls for be part of the problem?

Not significantly.