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Old 21-11-2005, 11:48 PM posted to,talk.politics.animals,alt.animals.ethics.vegetarian
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Default wife swap vegan episode

S. Maizlich wrote:


because many people who are not vegans are still
concerned about *unnecessary* death and suffering of animals.

Irrelevant. They aren't concerned about death and suffering _per se_.

Yes, many non-vegans *are* concerned about animal death and
suffering _per se_. The popularity of programs like "Animal
Precinct" and "Animal Cops" on Animal Planet, the many editorials
and articles about factory farmed animals in the mainstream press,
and so on, demonstrate that some particular methods are seen as
unethical even by people who eat meat, milk, or eggs. Several
European countries have banned the worst forms of factory farming,
even though their populations still include a majority of
non-vegans. SPCAs nation-wide and outside the U.S. show most
people are concerned about animal suffering and death in general.
It is an almost universal concern of normal people, in fact.

CDs in vegetable production are a result of *methods* used,
failures which can be reduced with greater or less effort,
if not eliminated entirely.

Yes, which COULD be reduced or eliminated, but which "vegans" make ZERO
effort to reduce or eliminate.

Anti-vegans claim this frequently, but it does not match my experience
as a vegan, or with other vegans I have known.