Mr. Gorilla mentioned on 12/30:
>... I go back to
> the lacto-vegetarian diet, and I'm OK. I guess I must have "Mahatma Gandhi
> Syndrome" or something, since he ran into the same problem. Except he went
> much longer and nearly died, and could only return to health by taking
> (goat's) milk. Some people seem to do OK on the vegan diet somehow,
though,
> and I certainly respect them for that. I wish I could.
>

We omnivores contain the enzyme systems for utilizing just about anything
that doesn't utilize us first. But it isn't all culture-and-upbringing
after that. It's been my experience that a proportion of adult men lose
flesh and begin to fail unless they can regularly get complex proteins in
compact forms -- such as those deriving from other animals. No, I do
*not* mean all men, and I cannot say whether how these men were
(nutritionally) reared makes the difference (perhaps a large-framed man
reared vegan is less likely to have trouble.) But by 'fail', I mean have
difficulty increasing muscle, and show immune stress (colds, infections,
etc). This may be true for some women; I simply haven't seen that myself.

In aboriginal societies one often finds it's adult males that eat meat most
often, or even at all. To all the reasons advanced for this, we could add
that it might have been observed that it's harder on certain men NOT to eat
the high/complex protein meat, fish, insects. Many societies include fish
in their diets and hold that it is somehow less terrible to cause fish to
die rather than "higher" animals. Maybe a more interesting question would
be why so few modernizing societies continue eating insects. I mean,
intentionally. Insect meal is extremely high quality protein in high
concentration.

[Note that there is no cruelty inherent in drinking milk, even cow's milk.
Had we not intentionally bred cattle producing obscene quantities of milk
over an unnatural length of time, there would be more room for argument;
but the deed is done. The cattle are here, and are now symbiotic with
humans. What should we do with what we have created? Only try to imagine
a Jersey milker trying to outrun wolves. Or a pack of determined
squirrels.]

For those who find that after more than 3 months of a vegan diet they are
feeling damned poorly, I suggest they look closely at altering the balance
of highest-quality protein in their diets. That is: after trying to flow
into a vegan diet in a natural manner, start studying. Study the
composition of foods, particularly FISH, and try to intentionally eat in a
manner that comes close to providing the same amino acids in the same
concentration. I have genuine reverence for those who are trying to tred
lightly while living in this world. I think that sincere vegans whose
bodies will not cooperate aren't necessarily up the creek... And with
gene-splicing among yeast and bacteria available to us, we will soon be
able to remedy any conceivable nutritional difficulties. Like, watch this
space.