On Mar 5, 8:29*pm, dh@. wrote:
> On Fri, 2 Mar 2012 04:03:58 -0800 (PST), Rupert >
> wrote:
>
> >Most animal products require more collateral deaths than plant-based
> >products, because grain needs to be grown and fed to the animals and
> >it is a less efficient means of producing protein than directly
> >feeding the grain to humans. Grass-fed beef may possibly be an
> >exception,
>
> * * In some case it is, but you can't accept that much so you can't even get to
> the starting line. IF you're ever able to be honest enough to admit that
> sometimes it is, then what?
>

Then having a diet which includes some grass-fed beef may be a good
approach to reducing animal suffering too, as well as a vegan diet.

> >but you have demonstrated yourself unable to substantiate
> >the assertion, which you nevertheless keep making, that one serving of
> >soy products is likely to involve hundreds of times as many deaths as
> >one serving of grass-fed beef.
>
> * * So far it looks like about a hundred if we DON'T figure byproducts into the
> count.

Nonsense. We have absolutely no grounds for making an estimate of what
the factor is.

> If we do figure byproducts into the count then the number for servings of
> food goes way down

Wrong.

> and the estimate of hundreds becomes again overly generous on
> my part, since if we include items made with byproducts the soy would propably
> jump to thousands or millions of times more. Try it for not only however many
> servings of beef, but also now include however many items made from the 600
> pounds of leather, and whatever other byproduct made items you want to account
> for. How about just doing it for the entire thousand pounds of animal material
> and however manty items...food...leather...animal food...fertilizer...... If you
> want to go at it that way, but I still suggest we stick with human grade food
> items only and not even pet food. Remember it's you eliminationists who want to
> include the byproduct stuff too, not me. But since you do, then you need to go
> ahead and do it. Go:

I did.