I believe I'm up against a brick wall here- I have been unable to
produce dry wine, red or white, regardless of what I do. No matter
what when I go to taste said wine there is a hint of sweetness upon the
tongue.

I've a 'restarter' set here and the yeast won't work on it, so even
blending that in to try and consume the last partial percent won't
work. The clinitests say just around 1% RS, give or take.

Any suggestions for this next year?

What SG are you starting at?

Keep the gravity down to 1.085 - 1.090 tops. Use a champagne yeast.
Make sure you have adequate nutrient and stir the must twice daily over
the couse of the most active fermentation (the first 5-7 days).


wrote:
I believe I'm up against a brick wall here- I have been unable to
produce dry wine, red or white, regardless of what I do. No matter
what when I go to taste said wine there is a hint of sweetness upon the
tongue.

I've a 'restarter' set here and the yeast won't work on it, so even
blending that in to try and consume the last partial percent won't
work. The clinitests say just around 1% RS, give or take.

Any suggestions for this next year?

What is your process for making wine? I think that's where we need to
begin.



wrote:
I believe I'm up against a brick wall here- I have been unable to
produce dry wine, red or white, regardless of what I do. No matter
what when I go to taste said wine there is a hint of sweetness upon the
tongue.

I've a 'restarter' set here and the yeast won't work on it, so even
blending that in to try and consume the last partial percent won't
work. The clinitests say just around 1% RS, give or take.

Any suggestions for this next year?

wrote in message
oups.com...
I believe I'm up against a brick wall here- I have been unable to
produce dry wine, red or white, regardless of what I do. No matter
what when I go to taste said wine there is a hint of sweetness upon the
tongue.

I've a 'restarter' set here and the yeast won't work on it, so even
blending that in to try and consume the last partial percent won't
work. The clinitests say just around 1% RS, give or take.

Any suggestions for this next year?

Fermentation can stop for a variety of reasons including accidental
contamination. However, most stuck fermentations are caused by the
following conditions: (1) excessively low or high fermentation temperatures,
(2) a lack of available nitrogen, (3) a lack of an essential yeast micro
nutrients and (4) excessive quantities of acetic acid.

Fermentation Temperature
Undoubtedly, the most common fermentation problem occurs when red
fermentations overheat. In warm weather fermentations can become fast and
very hot. Then problems often occur because wine yeasts die when
fermentation temperatures exceed 90 degrees for just a few hours. This is
why contentious winemakers check fermentation temperatures at least once a
day. Another kind of temperature problem sometimes occurs when Epernay
yeast is used at low fermentation temperatures. Epernay does not tolerate
low temperatures very well, and this yeast often stops fermenting when juice
is suddenly cooled to below 45 degrees.

Nitrogen Deficiency
Diammonium phosphate (DAP) is added to juice and must to provide extra
nitrogen, and the nitrogen encourages rapid yeast growth. DAP is usually
added to juice or must before fermentation is started, and DAP is a major
ingredient in most proprietary yeast foods. California Chardonnay grapes
are often deficient in nitrogen, and many winemakers add DAP to all
Chardonnay juices to help the yeast ferment completely. Practically all
wine yeasts produce excessive amounts of hydrogen sulfide when juice lacks
sufficient available nitrogen. Here, winemakers use DAP to provide extra
nitrogen to help reduce the quantity of hydrogen sulfide produced.

Micro Nutrients
Besides nitrogen, yeasts require several vitamins and amino acids to
reproduce the great many yeast cells needed to complete fermentation.
Grapes deficient in these materials can be difficult to ferment to dryness
unless extra micro nutrients are added to help the yeast. "Super Food,"
"Startup," "Yeast Extract" and "Yeast Hulls" are commercial preparations
used by winemakers to supply micro nutrients.

Excessive Acetic Acid
Acetic acid is very toxic to all strains of Saccharomyces (wine) yeast.
Yeast activity is curtailed when the acetic acid content of fermenting juice
exceeds about 0.1 percent, and fermentation begins to slow. When the acetic
acid content exceeds 0.2 to 0.3 percent, few viable yeast cells can be
found. Then fermentation stops.

A subtle fermentation problem can develop in the following way. Controlling
the native bacteria with sulfur dioxide is difficult when juice pH is high
(above 3.8). Under these conditions, a large population of Lactobacillus
bacteria sometimes develops early in the primary sugar fermentation. The
bacteria convert the grape sugars into acetic acid, and the acetic acid
content of the fermentation begins to rise. Little or no ethyl acetate is
produced by the Lactobacillus. Acetic acid does not have a strong odor, and
without ethyl acetate, the winemaker may not be aware of the problem.
Undetected, the lactic bacteria can quickly raise the acetic acid content of
the juice into the 0.1 to 0.4 percent range. The wine yeasts are unable to
tolerate such high concentrations of acetic acid. The yeast cells begin to
die, and the fermentation stops. Then the unhappy winemaker is left with a
fermentation both high in volatile acid and high in residual sugar. The
high acid content and the high sugar level produce a characteristic
sweet-sour taste in the wine.

If you are having trouble with residual sugar year after year, I would
switch to Primer Cuvee yeast and provide extra nitrogen and nutrients.

Lum
Del Mar, California, USA
www.geocities.com/lumeisenman

You already have good advice from Lum.

I use Lalvin yeasts here and can tell you EC 1118 and K1V1116 like to
make dry wines, they are almost idiot proof. I use nutrient too,
either DAP, Yeastex or Fermaid, whatever I have on hand or is
available.

Joe

One other thing, dry, low acid wines at 11 or 12% or higher tend to
taste sweet from the alcohol. If your acids are under 6g/l it may be
that.

Joe

Excellent advice! The only thing I can add is to keep the environment
stable -- ferment the wine in a location with a constant temperature.
A sudden drop in temperature can also stick the fermentation.

For instance, depending upon where you live, your garage may be the
worst place possible.

Bryan



On Sun, 07 May 2006 04:23:01 GMT, "Lum Eisenman"
wrote:

wrote in message
roups.com...
I believe I'm up against a brick wall here- I have been unable to
produce dry wine, red or white, regardless of what I do. No matter
what when I go to taste said wine there is a hint of sweetness upon the
tongue.

I've a 'restarter' set here and the yeast won't work on it, so even
blending that in to try and consume the last partial percent won't
work. The clinitests say just around 1% RS, give or take.

Any suggestions for this next year?

Fermentation can stop for a variety of reasons including accidental
contamination. However, most stuck fermentations are caused by the
following conditions: (1) excessively low or high fermentation temperatures,
(2) a lack of available nitrogen, (3) a lack of an essential yeast micro
nutrients and (4) excessive quantities of acetic acid.

Fermentation Temperature
Undoubtedly, the most common fermentation problem occurs when red
fermentations overheat. In warm weather fermentations can become fast and
very hot. Then problems often occur because wine yeasts die when
fermentation temperatures exceed 90 degrees for just a few hours. This is
why contentious winemakers check fermentation temperatures at least once a
day. Another kind of temperature problem sometimes occurs when Epernay
yeast is used at low fermentation temperatures. Epernay does not tolerate
low temperatures very well, and this yeast often stops fermenting when juice
is suddenly cooled to below 45 degrees.

Nitrogen Deficiency
Diammonium phosphate (DAP) is added to juice and must to provide extra
nitrogen, and the nitrogen encourages rapid yeast growth. DAP is usually
added to juice or must before fermentation is started, and DAP is a major
ingredient in most proprietary yeast foods. California Chardonnay grapes
are often deficient in nitrogen, and many winemakers add DAP to all
Chardonnay juices to help the yeast ferment completely. Practically all
wine yeasts produce excessive amounts of hydrogen sulfide when juice lacks
sufficient available nitrogen. Here, winemakers use DAP to provide extra
nitrogen to help reduce the quantity of hydrogen sulfide produced.

Micro Nutrients
Besides nitrogen, yeasts require several vitamins and amino acids to
reproduce the great many yeast cells needed to complete fermentation.
Grapes deficient in these materials can be difficult to ferment to dryness
unless extra micro nutrients are added to help the yeast. "Super Food,"
"Startup," "Yeast Extract" and "Yeast Hulls" are commercial preparations
used by winemakers to supply micro nutrients.

Excessive Acetic Acid
Acetic acid is very toxic to all strains of Saccharomyces (wine) yeast.
Yeast activity is curtailed when the acetic acid content of fermenting juice
exceeds about 0.1 percent, and fermentation begins to slow. When the acetic
acid content exceeds 0.2 to 0.3 percent, few viable yeast cells can be
found. Then fermentation stops.

A subtle fermentation problem can develop in the following way. Controlling
the native bacteria with sulfur dioxide is difficult when juice pH is high
(above 3.8). Under these conditions, a large population of Lactobacillus
bacteria sometimes develops early in the primary sugar fermentation. The
bacteria convert the grape sugars into acetic acid, and the acetic acid
content of the fermentation begins to rise. Little or no ethyl acetate is
produced by the Lactobacillus. Acetic acid does not have a strong odor, and
without ethyl acetate, the winemaker may not be aware of the problem.
Undetected, the lactic bacteria can quickly raise the acetic acid content of
the juice into the 0.1 to 0.4 percent range. The wine yeasts are unable to
tolerate such high concentrations of acetic acid. The yeast cells begin to
die, and the fermentation stops. Then the unhappy winemaker is left with a
fermentation both high in volatile acid and high in residual sugar. The
high acid content and the high sugar level produce a characteristic
sweet-sour taste in the wine.

If you are having trouble with residual sugar year after year, I would
switch to Primer Cuvee yeast and provide extra nitrogen and nutrients.

Lum
Del Mar, California, USA
www.geocities.com/lumeisenman

Good point. I restarted a stuck Gewurz at about 1% RS with EC1118, I
had to warm the wine up for it to get going. I used a heating pad and
a few towels. I built up the starter from about a quart to a gallon
and then to 6 gallons. It worked well.

When I do sparkling wines I go for 90 PSIG using EC1118 and don't do
anything special other than hydrating it first and dumping it in.
Granted the wine is lower in alcohol, usually 10 to 11%, but it usually
starts up in a day. As soon as I'm sure it's fermenting I stir it up
and bottle it. The only time I had an issue was with a mead and it was
just an experiment gone terribly wrong....

Joe

Wine spent most of it's life in a heated booth to 69-71F, fairly
constant as far as I can tell. Will have to integrate the temperature
measurement/logging on the new computer- the old one died due to a
lightning strike. I should just put the computer in the booth- why
heat both spaces at once?

On a more serious note, I reviewed the logs for when I started the
reds. They were all pressed at 1.08 +/- - which means very little
body/mouth feel.

Could I add, at this incredibly late date, grape tannin to said wines
in order to rescue them from the red-juice wine taste I have now? Am I
hoping too much to make a Banrock Station style Cab at 4$/bottle?