Hi,

I am planning on purchasing my first ever set of grape vines to plant this
spring. I was wondering what recommendations any of you have for my
location. I am pretty sure we have a long growing season here, if that
helps. I plan to grow table grapes, grapes for white wine (Chardonnay), and
a full bodied red. I am not a wine connoisseur; my aim is to purchase vines
that produce reliably in my area. I would really appreciate any insight
that you could give me.

Also I have found a couple of nurseries that seem reputable on the net.
However, without growing experience I am hesitant to try them blindly. Can
someone recommend a site to order vines?

Thanks,

Michael DeGraff
Southern New Jersey, USA

Michael DeGraff wrote:

Hi,

I am planning on purchasing my first ever set of grape vines to plant this
spring. I was wondering what recommendations any of you have for my
location. I am pretty sure we have a long growing season here, if that
helps. I plan to grow table grapes, grapes for white wine (Chardonnay),
and
a full bodied red. I am not a wine connoisseur; my aim is to purchase
vines
that produce reliably in my area. I would really appreciate any insight
that you could give me.

Also I have found a couple of nurseries that seem reputable on the net.
However, without growing experience I am hesitant to try them blindly.
Can someone recommend a site to order vines?

Thanks,

Michael DeGraff
Southern New Jersey, USA

For your red variety you might consider Cabernet Franc. It grows very well
here in Maryland and Northern Virginia and is even grown in New York State.
It is fairly cold hardy.

I have had better experience with it than what is "Supposed" to do well
here, Chambourcin, which is a French Hybrid. Others, however, do quite well
with Chambourcin. Some love its taste, others like me, like just a tad of
it in a blend for color and fruit.

As for Nurseries, you might try:
http://www.concordnurseries.com/

I have bought from them and have been pleased.

Michael DeGraff wrote:

Hi,

I am planning on purchasing my first ever set of grape vines to plant this
spring. I was wondering what recommendations any of you have for my
location. I am pretty sure we have a long growing season here, if that
helps. I plan to grow table grapes, grapes for white wine (Chardonnay),
and
a full bodied red. I am not a wine connoisseur; my aim is to purchase
vines
that produce reliably in my area. I would really appreciate any insight
that you could give me.

Also I have found a couple of nurseries that seem reputable on the net.
However, without growing experience I am hesitant to try them blindly.
Can someone recommend a site to order vines?

Thanks,

Michael DeGraff
Southern New Jersey, USA

For your red variety you might consider Cabernet Franc. It grows very well
here in Maryland and Northern Virginia and is even grown in New York State.
It is fairly cold hardy.

I have had better experience with it than what is "Supposed" to do well
here, Chambourcin, which is a French Hybrid. Others, however, do quite well
with Chambourcin. Some love its taste, others like me, like just a tad of
it in a blend for color and fruit.

As for Nurseries, you might try:
http://www.concordnurseries.com/

I have bought from them and have been pleased.

Thanks for your feedback, I apprecite your advice. I think I am going to
experiment with several vines and play it by ear.

Thanks

Mike
Paul E. Lehmann wrote in message
...
Michael DeGraff wrote:

Hi,

I am planning on purchasing my first ever set of grape vines to plant
this
spring. I was wondering what recommendations any of you have for my
location. I am pretty sure we have a long growing season here, if that
helps. I plan to grow table grapes, grapes for white wine (Chardonnay),
and
a full bodied red. I am not a wine connoisseur; my aim is to purchase
vines
that produce reliably in my area. I would really appreciate any insight
that you could give me.

Also I have found a couple of nurseries that seem reputable on the net.
However, without growing experience I am hesitant to try them blindly.
Can someone recommend a site to order vines?

Thanks,

Michael DeGraff
Southern New Jersey, USA

For your red variety you might consider Cabernet Franc. It grows very
well
here in Maryland and Northern Virginia and is even grown in New York
State.
It is fairly cold hardy.

I have had better experience with it than what is "Supposed" to do well
here, Chambourcin, which is a French Hybrid. Others, however, do quite
well
with Chambourcin. Some love its taste, others like me, like just a tad of
it in a blend for color and fruit.

As for Nurseries, you might try:
http://www.concordnurseries.com/

I have bought from them and have been pleased.

Thanks for your feedback, I apprecite your advice. I think I am going to
experiment with several vines and play it by ear.

Thanks

Mike
Paul E. Lehmann wrote in message
...
Michael DeGraff wrote:

Hi,

I am planning on purchasing my first ever set of grape vines to plant
this
spring. I was wondering what recommendations any of you have for my
location. I am pretty sure we have a long growing season here, if that
helps. I plan to grow table grapes, grapes for white wine (Chardonnay),
and
a full bodied red. I am not a wine connoisseur; my aim is to purchase
vines
that produce reliably in my area. I would really appreciate any insight
that you could give me.

Also I have found a couple of nurseries that seem reputable on the net.
However, without growing experience I am hesitant to try them blindly.
Can someone recommend a site to order vines?

Thanks,

Michael DeGraff
Southern New Jersey, USA

For your red variety you might consider Cabernet Franc. It grows very
well
here in Maryland and Northern Virginia and is even grown in New York
State.
It is fairly cold hardy.

I have had better experience with it than what is "Supposed" to do well
here, Chambourcin, which is a French Hybrid. Others, however, do quite
well
with Chambourcin. Some love its taste, others like me, like just a tad of
it in a blend for color and fruit.

As for Nurseries, you might try:
http://www.concordnurseries.com/

I have bought from them and have been pleased.

Paul,

What type of soil do you have??? Do the Chambourcin and Cab Franc get
the same amount of sunshine during the day , summer AND Winter???

Michael,

I've had just the opposite experience as Paul. My Chambourcin is ALOT
more hardy than the Cab Franc that I'm growing. What I have also
experienced is that Lemberger is more cold hardy than Cab Franc for me
and "supposedly" it makes great wine even if the ripeness isn't exactly
what it should be. I haven't gotten to harvest for either the Franc or
the Lemberger BUT the hardiness is different with the Lemberger being
better for ME. Southern New Jeresy has Valenzano Winery and they grow
ALOT of Chambourcin and the owner really likes it. Chardonnay should do
fine where you are. If you have sandy-ish soil, which I think you
might, that's even better. I have sandy soil which I think keeps the
vines from getting to out of control whih makes them succeptible to
winter injury.

Bob


Paul E. Lehmann wrote:
Michael DeGraff wrote:

Hi,

I am planning on purchasing my first ever set of grape vines to
plant this
spring. I was wondering what recommendations any of you have for
my
location. I am pretty sure we have a long growing season here, if
that
helps. I plan to grow table grapes, grapes for white wine
(Chardonnay),
and
a full bodied red. I am not a wine connoisseur; my aim is to
purchase
vines
that produce reliably in my area. I would really appreciate any
insight
that you could give me.

Also I have found a couple of nurseries that seem reputable on the
net.
However, without growing experience I am hesitant to try them
blindly.
Can someone recommend a site to order vines?

Thanks,

Michael DeGraff
Southern New Jersey, USA

For your red variety you might consider Cabernet Franc. It grows
very well
here in Maryland and Northern Virginia and is even grown in New York
State.
It is fairly cold hardy.

I have had better experience with it than what is "Supposed" to do
well
here, Chambourcin, which is a French Hybrid. Others, however, do
quite well
with Chambourcin. Some love its taste, others like me, like just a
tad of
it in a blend for color and fruit.

As for Nurseries, you might try:
http://www.concordnurseries.com/

I have bought from them and have been pleased.

Paul,

What type of soil do you have??? Do the Chambourcin and Cab Franc get
the same amount of sunshine during the day , summer AND Winter???

Michael,

I've had just the opposite experience as Paul. My Chambourcin is ALOT
more hardy than the Cab Franc that I'm growing. What I have also
experienced is that Lemberger is more cold hardy than Cab Franc for me
and "supposedly" it makes great wine even if the ripeness isn't exactly
what it should be. I haven't gotten to harvest for either the Franc or
the Lemberger BUT the hardiness is different with the Lemberger being
better for ME. Southern New Jeresy has Valenzano Winery and they grow
ALOT of Chambourcin and the owner really likes it. Chardonnay should do
fine where you are. If you have sandy-ish soil, which I think you
might, that's even better. I have sandy soil which I think keeps the
vines from getting to out of control whih makes them succeptible to
winter injury.

Bob


Paul E. Lehmann wrote:
Michael DeGraff wrote:

Hi,

I am planning on purchasing my first ever set of grape vines to
plant this
spring. I was wondering what recommendations any of you have for
my
location. I am pretty sure we have a long growing season here, if
that
helps. I plan to grow table grapes, grapes for white wine
(Chardonnay),
and
a full bodied red. I am not a wine connoisseur; my aim is to
purchase
vines
that produce reliably in my area. I would really appreciate any
insight
that you could give me.

Also I have found a couple of nurseries that seem reputable on the
net.
However, without growing experience I am hesitant to try them
blindly.
Can someone recommend a site to order vines?

Thanks,

Michael DeGraff
Southern New Jersey, USA

For your red variety you might consider Cabernet Franc. It grows
very well
here in Maryland and Northern Virginia and is even grown in New York
State.
It is fairly cold hardy.

I have had better experience with it than what is "Supposed" to do
well
here, Chambourcin, which is a French Hybrid. Others, however, do
quite well
with Chambourcin. Some love its taste, others like me, like just a
tad of
it in a blend for color and fruit.

As for Nurseries, you might try:
http://www.concordnurseries.com/

I have bought from them and have been pleased.

Sorry guys, Just so you know, I live in NY just to the west of Danbury
Ct. ( 40 miles north of the Big Apple.)

Bob

Sorry guys, Just so you know, I live in NY just to the west of Danbury
Ct. ( 40 miles north of the Big Apple.)

Bob

wrote:

Paul,

What type of soil do you have??? Do the Chambourcin and Cab Franc get
the same amount of sunshine during the day , summer AND Winter???

Michael,

I have a very well drained sandy loam soil. Both get the same amount of
sunshine during the day as they are planted side by side and even
intermingled and not in separate lots.

I think some growers like Chambourcin because it can produce an enormous
crop and the grapes are large and beautiful. Like Merlot, it shares a
somewhat romantic sounding name.

I suggest to anyone planting Chambourcin (or any grape) to taste the wine
from the grapes grown in the area and see if you want to plant it. Of
course, it also depends a lot on who makes the wine. From my experience,
Chambourcin wine needs oak aging and is not at its best for at least
several years if not more. Like I said, many around here have "relatively"
no problem growing Chambourcin. I do. I have ignored the experts and
sprayed with Sulphur last year and kept my leaves all year (a first) even
though Chambourcin is suppose to be sensitive to Sulphur. Dick Penna,
another grower nearby, also uses Sulphur on his Chambourcin with no
problem. By the way, he has very vigorous vines and has a problem of them
overcropping if he is not careful. The Chambourcin I have is NOT on
rootstock. This may be a difference. I believe at least some of the
others may have grafted plants.

One of the famous old time growers around here, Jim Russel from German Town,
Md, who died last year, said that he did not like Chambourcin because it
was not a long lived variety and did not put out a healthy and extensive
root system. I do not know if he grew self rooted or grafted vines.

At "Wine East" trade expo in Lancaster, PA several weeks ago, a grower was
promoting Frontenac. He has a vineyard in Minnesota and said he does not
bury his vines in winter and they do just fine. If you are concerned about
cold hardy, you may want to consider this variety also. The firm is
Winterhaven Vineyard and Nursery. I have no idea what kind of wine
Frontenac makes.

If I had the space, I would like to grown some Traminette. This is a white
grape and supposedly grows very well around here. It is a floral wine like
a Gewurtz. and from what I have sampled is a VERY good wine. You may wish
to check this variety out in addition to the Chardonnay.

See reply to Bob below.

Hope this helps.



I've had just the opposite experience as Paul. My Chambourcin is ALOT
more hardy than the Cab Franc that I'm growing. What I have also
experienced is that Lemberger is more cold hardy than Cab Franc for me
and "supposedly" it makes great wine even if the ripeness isn't exactly
what it should be. I haven't gotten to harvest for either the Franc or
the Lemberger BUT the hardiness is different with the Lemberger being
better for ME. Southern New Jeresy has Valenzano Winery and they grow
ALOT of Chambourcin and the owner really likes it. Chardonnay should do
fine where you are. If yoI think some growers like Chambourcin because it
can produce an enormous crop and the grapes are large and beautiful. Like
Merlot, it shares a somewhat romantic sounding name.u have sandy-ish soil,
which I think you
might, that's even better. I have sandy soil which I think keeps the
vines from getting to out of control whih makes them succeptible to
winter injury.

Bob

Bob, I suggest you taste Lemberger wine. You may love it and I am sure it
has a following but I do not care for it at all.


Marachel Foch is another grape that has a following and some love it and
call it "The next Merlot" Personally, I think the wine taste like soap.
That is the beauty of viticulture and wine making; everyone has their own
opinion(s)




Paul E. Lehmann wrote:
Michael DeGraff wrote:

Hi,

I am planning on purchasing my first ever set of grape vines to
plant this
spring. I was wondering what recommendations any of you have for
my
location. I am pretty sure we have a long growing season here, if
that
helps. I plan to grow table grapes, grapes for white wine
(Chardonnay),
and
a full bodied red. I am not a wine connoisseur; my aim is to
purchase
vines
that produce reliably in my area. I would really appreciate any
insight
that you could give me.

Also I have found a couple of nurseries that seem reputable on the
net.
However, without growing experience I am hesitant to try them
blindly.
Can someone recommend a site to order vines?

Thanks,

Michael DeGraff
Southern New Jersey, USA

For your red variety you might consider Cabernet Franc. It grows
very well
here in Maryland and Northern Virginia and is even grown in New York
State.
It is fairly cold hardy.

I have had better experience with it than what is "Supposed" to do
well
here, Chambourcin, which is a French Hybrid. Others, however, do
quite well
with Chambourcin. Some love its taste, others like me, like just a
tad of
it in a blend for color and fruit.

As for Nurseries, you might try:
http://www.concordnurseries.com/

I have bought from them and have been pleased.

wrote:

Paul,

What type of soil do you have??? Do the Chambourcin and Cab Franc get
the same amount of sunshine during the day , summer AND Winter???

Michael,

I have a very well drained sandy loam soil. Both get the same amount of
sunshine during the day as they are planted side by side and even
intermingled and not in separate lots.

I think some growers like Chambourcin because it can produce an enormous
crop and the grapes are large and beautiful. Like Merlot, it shares a
somewhat romantic sounding name.

I suggest to anyone planting Chambourcin (or any grape) to taste the wine
from the grapes grown in the area and see if you want to plant it. Of
course, it also depends a lot on who makes the wine. From my experience,
Chambourcin wine needs oak aging and is not at its best for at least
several years if not more. Like I said, many around here have "relatively"
no problem growing Chambourcin. I do. I have ignored the experts and
sprayed with Sulphur last year and kept my leaves all year (a first) even
though Chambourcin is suppose to be sensitive to Sulphur. Dick Penna,
another grower nearby, also uses Sulphur on his Chambourcin with no
problem. By the way, he has very vigorous vines and has a problem of them
overcropping if he is not careful. The Chambourcin I have is NOT on
rootstock. This may be a difference. I believe at least some of the
others may have grafted plants.

One of the famous old time growers around here, Jim Russel from German Town,
Md, who died last year, said that he did not like Chambourcin because it
was not a long lived variety and did not put out a healthy and extensive
root system. I do not know if he grew self rooted or grafted vines.

At "Wine East" trade expo in Lancaster, PA several weeks ago, a grower was
promoting Frontenac. He has a vineyard in Minnesota and said he does not
bury his vines in winter and they do just fine. If you are concerned about
cold hardy, you may want to consider this variety also. The firm is
Winterhaven Vineyard and Nursery. I have no idea what kind of wine
Frontenac makes.

If I had the space, I would like to grown some Traminette. This is a white
grape and supposedly grows very well around here. It is a floral wine like
a Gewurtz. and from what I have sampled is a VERY good wine. You may wish
to check this variety out in addition to the Chardonnay.

See reply to Bob below.

Hope this helps.



I've had just the opposite experience as Paul. My Chambourcin is ALOT
more hardy than the Cab Franc that I'm growing. What I have also
experienced is that Lemberger is more cold hardy than Cab Franc for me
and "supposedly" it makes great wine even if the ripeness isn't exactly
what it should be. I haven't gotten to harvest for either the Franc or
the Lemberger BUT the hardiness is different with the Lemberger being
better for ME. Southern New Jeresy has Valenzano Winery and they grow
ALOT of Chambourcin and the owner really likes it. Chardonnay should do
fine where you are. If yoI think some growers like Chambourcin because it
can produce an enormous crop and the grapes are large and beautiful. Like
Merlot, it shares a somewhat romantic sounding name.u have sandy-ish soil,
which I think you
might, that's even better. I have sandy soil which I think keeps the
vines from getting to out of control whih makes them succeptible to
winter injury.

Bob

Bob, I suggest you taste Lemberger wine. You may love it and I am sure it
has a following but I do not care for it at all.


Marachel Foch is another grape that has a following and some love it and
call it "The next Merlot" Personally, I think the wine taste like soap.
That is the beauty of viticulture and wine making; everyone has their own
opinion(s)




Paul E. Lehmann wrote:
Michael DeGraff wrote:

Hi,

I am planning on purchasing my first ever set of grape vines to
plant this
spring. I was wondering what recommendations any of you have for
my
location. I am pretty sure we have a long growing season here, if
that
helps. I plan to grow table grapes, grapes for white wine
(Chardonnay),
and
a full bodied red. I am not a wine connoisseur; my aim is to
purchase
vines
that produce reliably in my area. I would really appreciate any
insight
that you could give me.

Also I have found a couple of nurseries that seem reputable on the
net.
However, without growing experience I am hesitant to try them
blindly.
Can someone recommend a site to order vines?

Thanks,

Michael DeGraff
Southern New Jersey, USA

For your red variety you might consider Cabernet Franc. It grows
very well
here in Maryland and Northern Virginia and is even grown in New York
State.
It is fairly cold hardy.

I have had better experience with it than what is "Supposed" to do
well
here, Chambourcin, which is a French Hybrid. Others, however, do
quite well
with Chambourcin. Some love its taste, others like me, like just a
tad of
it in a blend for color and fruit.

As for Nurseries, you might try:
http://www.concordnurseries.com/

I have bought from them and have been pleased.

Paul,

That's funny. I was at Lancaster also and spoke to Winterhaven about
vines. I think those vines would ripen too soon in southern NJ. Just my
hunch. I'm really interested in Lacresent though I've never tasted it.
I have tasted Lemberger and it was REALLY good. I highly recommend
Goose Watch Vineyard in the Finger Lakes if you want to taste really
good Lemberger and Chambourcin. I grow my chambourcin on it's own roots
also. I will never grow anything graftyed anymore. Never dug my
chambourcin up so I can't say anything about the root system. THey
seem to do fairly well here considering we get some cold temps in the
winter. This may be the coldest part of Westchester County and I live
in a valley. Traminette has survived for me and that would be a GREAT
choice for southern NJ. I don't think my growing season here is long
enough to ripen it so I have my doubts BUT the winter hardiness is
plenty good enough for S NJ.. It make GREAT wine in my opinion and I
like it better than Chardonnay BUT ya gotta grow what you like. What
problems do you have with chambourcin as far as growing it????? Sulphur
on Chambourcin???? Never tried it, but if it works, great!

Bob

Paul,

That's funny. I was at Lancaster also and spoke to Winterhaven about
vines. I think those vines would ripen too soon in southern NJ. Just my
hunch. I'm really interested in Lacresent though I've never tasted it.
I have tasted Lemberger and it was REALLY good. I highly recommend
Goose Watch Vineyard in the Finger Lakes if you want to taste really
good Lemberger and Chambourcin. I grow my chambourcin on it's own roots
also. I will never grow anything graftyed anymore. Never dug my
chambourcin up so I can't say anything about the root system. THey
seem to do fairly well here considering we get some cold temps in the
winter. This may be the coldest part of Westchester County and I live
in a valley. Traminette has survived for me and that would be a GREAT
choice for southern NJ. I don't think my growing season here is long
enough to ripen it so I have my doubts BUT the winter hardiness is
plenty good enough for S NJ.. It make GREAT wine in my opinion and I
like it better than Chardonnay BUT ya gotta grow what you like. What
problems do you have with chambourcin as far as growing it????? Sulphur
on Chambourcin???? Never tried it, but if it works, great!

Bob

Michael,

Where exactly are you? Southern NJ has great potential for grape growing.

I'm in northern NJ, but a friend in southern NJ (Galloway Twp) has been
growing Vinifera very successfully for over 25 years. At Sylvin Farms he
grows Cab sauv & franc, Merlot, Sangiovese, Dolcetto, Nebbiolo, Barbera,
Corvino, Pinot Noir, Chardonnay, Riesling, Pinot Gris, Rkatziteli and others
I can't think of at the moment. Over the years he's eliminated some
varieties due to lack of hardiness, but what he has now does pretty well,
possibly excepting the Pinot Noir.

I've had excellent service & results with vines from Double A Vineyards in
NY state. www.doubleavineyards.com

Mike McGeough, Cokesbury, Hunterdon Cty, NJ

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Michael,

Where exactly are you? Southern NJ has great potential for grape growing.

I'm in northern NJ, but a friend in southern NJ (Galloway Twp) has been
growing Vinifera very successfully for over 25 years. At Sylvin Farms he
grows Cab sauv & franc, Merlot, Sangiovese, Dolcetto, Nebbiolo, Barbera,
Corvino, Pinot Noir, Chardonnay, Riesling, Pinot Gris, Rkatziteli and others
I can't think of at the moment. Over the years he's eliminated some
varieties due to lack of hardiness, but what he has now does pretty well,
possibly excepting the Pinot Noir.

I've had excellent service & results with vines from Double A Vineyards in
NY state. www.doubleavineyards.com

Mike McGeough, Cokesbury, Hunterdon Cty, NJ

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----------------------------------------------------------
** SPEED ** RETENTION ** COMPLETION ** ANONYMITY **
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