Hi folks,
I just wanted to get your input into the topic of topping up you barrels -
specifically how frequently you are topping them up.

I have several small barrels (around 50Litres) and have been in the habit of
topping them up weekly. My reading suggest that some people do this more or
less frequently or possibly not at all.... any comments?

steve

"steve small" wrote in message
...
Hi folks,
I just wanted to get your input into the topic of topping up you barrels -
specifically how frequently you are topping them up.

I have several small barrels (around 50Litres) and have been in the habit
of
topping them up weekly. My reading suggest that some people do this more
or
less frequently or possibly not at all.... any comments?

For a barrel that small, weekly should be the minimum.

I top and taste my 228 liter barrels every two or three weeks. AFAIC, three
weeks is pushing it a bit. I've seen some barrels (_not_ mine!) around the
winery that have been so long between toppings that the heads are visibly
concave. I think that's pushing it _way_ too far.

Tom S

Tom,

For your 228L barrrel, what would you give as an estimate for the total
amount of "top-up wine" added over the course of barrel ageing? I'm curious
what a typical "concentration factor" is for wines, especially reds, aged in
barrels.

Thanks,
Aaron

"Tom S" wrote in message
m...

"steve small" wrote in message
...
Hi folks,
I just wanted to get your input into the topic of topping up you
barrels -
specifically how frequently you are topping them up.

I have several small barrels (around 50Litres) and have been in the
habit
of
topping them up weekly. My reading suggest that some people do this more
or
less frequently or possibly not at all.... any comments?

For a barrel that small, weekly should be the minimum.

I top and taste my 228 liter barrels every two or three weeks. AFAIC,
three
weeks is pushing it a bit. I've seen some barrels (_not_ mine!) around
the
winery that have been so long between toppings that the heads are visibly
concave. I think that's pushing it _way_ too far.

Tom S

steve small wrote:

Hi folks,
I just wanted to get your input into the topic of topping up you barrels -
specifically how frequently you are topping them up.

I've a 228 litre and ~50 litre barrel... I am usually down in the cellar
weekly to check things, and top up if need be, though my cellar is
pretty cold, losses aren't as quick as they might be for some place that
is in a warmer climate.

--
charles

"Once ... in the wilds of Afghanistan, I lost my corkscrew, and we were
forced to live on nothing but food and water for days."
- W.C. Fields

"steve small" wrote in message ...
Hi folks,
I just wanted to get your input into the topic of topping up you barrels -
specifically how frequently you are topping them up.

I have several small barrels (around 50Litres) and have been in the habit of
topping them up weekly. My reading suggest that some people do this more or
less frequently or possibly not at all.... any comments?

steve

I would be on top of this especially with small barrels. It is amazing
how much "disappears" with all these fillings. I have several 5 &
10gal barrels where I blend and let age wine in. I top up every week
and you can in some 10g barrels see as much as 150 - 200ml be used.
This varies from barrel to barrel and how old they are. I usually
select the wine with which to use for this at the outset so that I
have some control of the finished product and this way I have "written
off" these top-of wines at the outset and don't feel the pain when you
see them disappear down the hole.

I would like to hear from others how they would deal with any vinegar
flies. I have one small barrel that seems to constantly be damp just
around the edge of the bunghole. The airlock shows constant pressure
and the wine taste fine. I check it daily, kill any vinegar flies if I
see any, wipe any moister up and have been spraying the area with
sulphur

I put in a pestomat and am switching the frequency weekly, but they
seem to still to appear just at this bunghole. I also keep a flytrap
right over it and I can see evidence of the small fly.

So if anyone of you have any suggestions I would be glad to hear them.

SG Brix

"Aaron Puhala" wrote in message
...
Tom,

For your 228L barrrel, what would you give as an estimate for the total
amount of "top-up wine" added over the course of barrel aging? I'm
curious
what a typical "concentration factor" is for wines, especially reds, aged
in
barrels.

I recently heard bandied about the number 7%. That was over the course of
about a year and a half, and it sounds reasonable to me. It's sort of hard
to estimate this accurately, since I always taste - sometimes with one or
more others "help", and occasionally pull a sample out for "evaluation"
purposes. :^)

Tom S

"sgbrix" wrote in message
m...
I would like to hear from others how they would deal with any vinegar
flies. I have one small barrel that seems to constantly be damp just
around the edge of the bunghole. The airlock shows constant pressure
and the wine taste fine. I check it daily, kill any vinegar flies if I
see any, wipe any moisture up and have been spraying the area with
sulphur

I put in a pestomat and am switching the frequency weekly, but they
seem to still to appear just at this bunghole. I also keep a flytrap
right over it and I can see evidence of the small fly.

So if anyone of you have any suggestions I would be glad to hear them.

Why not wet a washcloth with sulfite solution, wring out most of the sulfite
and wrap it around the bung and the bottom of the airlock? I doubt that
they'd care to hang around that.

Tom S

"Tom S" wrote in message . com...
"sgbrix" wrote in message
m...

Why not wet a washcloth with sulfite solution, wring out most of the sulfite

Thanks Tom, but I have been wetting down a papertowel each time and
leaving it. Maybe I just should make a stronger solution. I just get
crazy whenever I see one of these critters.

SG Brix

"sgbrix" wrote in message
om...
"Tom S" wrote in message
. com...
"sgbrix" wrote in message
m...

Why not wet a washcloth with sulfite solution, wring out most of the
sulfite

Thanks Tom, but I have been wetting down a papertowel each time and
leaving it. Maybe I just should make a stronger solution. I just get
crazy whenever I see one of these critters.

I just sprinkle a little sulfite powder around the bung. The powder seems
to keep the flies away for a week or two. I wipe and blow the powder off
before pulling the bung.

"steve small" wrote in message ...
Hi folks,
I just wanted to get your input into the topic of topping up you barrels -
specifically how frequently you are topping them up.

I have several small barrels (around 50Litres) and have been in the habit of
topping them up weekly. My reading suggest that some people do this more or
less frequently or possibly not at all.... any comments?

steve

And another question. If you have to top up every week or so with 100
to 200 ml of wine, where does that top up wine come from? How do you
store variable volumes of wine for topping up? You can't take 100 ml
from a carbouy. Do you bottle wine prematurely? I suppose you could
top up with commercial wine and drink the remainder. What do you do?

Getting a barrel next year.

Dan

I have 50 L barrels as well (probably from the same place as Steve) and top
them up weekly (or every second week on occasion). Right now I have three
vintages in various stages in the "winery"; 2001 were bottled 3-4 months ago
and are not labeled, 2002 are in carboy for blending and 2003 are in barrel.
For topping up I use a similar wine from the 2001 bottles.

My barrel room is relatively warm (low to mid 60's) so weekly topping off is
important. As a reply to an earlier post, I have estimated that over the
course of a year I add back about 10L or 20% of the volume of a barrel.
Usually I have two wines go through a barrel, so this represents about a 10%
concentration for each wine.
Tim


"Dan Emerson" wrote in message
om...
: "steve small" wrote in message
...
: Hi folks,
: I just wanted to get your input into the topic of topping up you
barrels -
: specifically how frequently you are topping them up.
:
: I have several small barrels (around 50Litres) and have been in the
habit of
: topping them up weekly. My reading suggest that some people do this more
or
: less frequently or possibly not at all.... any comments?
:
: steve
:
: And another question. If you have to top up every week or so with 100
: to 200 ml of wine, where does that top up wine come from? How do you
: store variable volumes of wine for topping up? You can't take 100 ml
: from a carbouy. Do you bottle wine prematurely? I suppose you could
: top up with commercial wine and drink the remainder. What do you do?
:
: Getting a barrel next year.
:
: Dan

"Dan Emerson" wrote in message
om...
"steve small" wrote in message
...
Hi folks,
I just wanted to get your input into the topic of topping up you
barrels -
specifically how frequently you are topping them up.

I have several small barrels (around 50Litres) and have been in the
habit of
topping them up weekly. My reading suggest that some people do this more
or
less frequently or possibly not at all.... any comments?

steve

And another question. If you have to top up every week or so with 100
to 200 ml of wine, where does that top up wine come from? How do you
store variable volumes of wine for topping up? You can't take 100 ml
from a carbouy. Do you bottle wine prematurely? I suppose you could
top up with commercial wine and drink the remainder. What do you do?

Getting a barrel next year.

Dan

Steve, Dan and All,

Barrels exchange roughly 2 ml of oxygen (O2) per liter of wine per year.
So, a 50 liter barrel exchanges 2 X 50 = 100 ml of O2 per year.
Or, 100 / 52 ~ 2 ml O2 per week.
Air contains about 20 ml of O2 per 100 ml.
So leaving 100 ml of head space in a small barrel just about doubles the
oxygen input.

100 ml is a pretty small head space, so I'm not sure that topping small
barrels once a week is necessarily a good thing. But, maybe may arithmetic
is wrong????

lum

Lum,

I haven't actually measured, but the top up of my headspace in my 60
liter barrels is more like a half bottle or even more every 2 weeks.
There is no leaking and the bung is on tightly.

Glen Duff
---------------


Lum wrote:

"Dan Emerson" wrote in message
om...

"steve small" wrote in message

...

Hi folks,
I just wanted to get your input into the topic of topping up you

barrels -

specifically how frequently you are topping them up.

I have several small barrels (around 50Litres) and have been in the

habit of

topping them up weekly. My reading suggest that some people do this more

or

less frequently or possibly not at all.... any comments?

steve

And another question. If you have to top up every week or so with 100
to 200 ml of wine, where does that top up wine come from? How do you
store variable volumes of wine for topping up? You can't take 100 ml
from a carbouy. Do you bottle wine prematurely? I suppose you could
top up with commercial wine and drink the remainder. What do you do?

Getting a barrel next year.

Dan


Steve, Dan and All,

Barrels exchange roughly 2 ml of oxygen (O2) per liter of wine per year.
So, a 50 liter barrel exchanges 2 X 50 = 100 ml of O2 per year.
Or, 100 / 52 ~ 2 ml O2 per week.
Air contains about 20 ml of O2 per 100 ml.
So leaving 100 ml of head space in a small barrel just about doubles the
oxygen input.

100 ml is a pretty small head space, so I'm not sure that topping small
barrels once a week is necessarily a good thing. But, maybe may arithmetic
is wrong????

lum

"Glen Duff" wrote in message
...
Lum,

I haven't actually measured, but the top up of my headspace in my 60
liter barrels is more like a half bottle or even more every 2 weeks.
There is no leaking and the bung is on tightly.

Wow! That sounds like a _lot_ of evaporative loss to me. I probably lose
about the same volume over the same length of time from a barrel almost 4
times the size.

I'd guess that your losses are that high because the staves are thinner in
your barrel than they are in my 228 liter export barrels, which are an inch
thick. Either that, or you recently filled a new barrel and it's still
soaking up wine.

Tom S

"Dan Emerson" wrote in message
om...
And another question. If you have to top up every week or so with 100
to 200 ml of wine, where does that top up wine come from? How do you
store variable volumes of wine for topping up? You can't take 100 ml
from a carbouy.

No, but you _can_ break down a carboy to gallon jugs, liter bottles and
smaller sizes. Also, when tasting and topping, pull out a sample such that
your topping wine volume is a bit smaller than the headspace, pour in the
topping wine, top off from the sample you just pulled and use the remainder
for tasting. No leftovers that way!

Tom S