![]() |
|
Welcome to FoodBanter.com forums which provide access to the finest food and drink related newsgroups. You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most newsgroup discussions and access our other FREE features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics to the food related newsgroups, communicate privately with other FoodBanter.com members (PM), respond to polls, upload your own photos and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today! If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact support. |
|
|||||||
| Wine (alt.food.wine) Devoted to the discussion of wine and wine-related topics. A place to read and comment about wines, wine and food matching, storage systems, wine paraphernalia, etc. In general, any topic related to wine is valid fodder for the group. |
|
|
LinkBack | Thread Tools | Search this Thread | Display Modes |
|
|||
|
I have been cellaring fine California wines since the 70's and long ago drank up my mistakes. Now at 25 - 30 years, some have proved to be very age worthy and are outstanding. Keep in mind that many wines from the 70's were very ripe "monsters". Some have matured very well, and others had too much tannin and long ago dried out. You can find minute technical details about how such wines were made in the book "Great Winemakers of California" by Robert Benson, Capra Press, Santa Barbara 1977. The book likely is out of print, so you may have to go to a library to find it. Benson interviews many of the top wine makers, and gives their replies to his questions. A few of the wine makers were Martin Ray, Paul Draper, Andre Tchelistcheff, Warren Winiarski, Mike Grgich, Donn Chappellet, Jerry Luper, Joseph Heitz, Robert Mondavi, Richard Arrowood , etc. Many of these give details about if they add acid or not and what kind, if they use malo-lactic fermentation or not, what kind of yeast they use, what kind of wood they use, when and how they use SO2 or sulfites, and on and own. You will find a great variety of procedures. Some never add acid, some do only in hot years, etc. Some areas such as Napa seem more likely to need acid than some other areas. I have pulled 3 remarkable California wines from the cellar to read the labels. The Freemark Abbey Edelwein Gold 1976 Johannisberg Riesling perhaps is the greatest Riesling ever made in California with no end in sight. It is about the richness of a fine German TBA. Residual Sugar is 16.4% and alcohol 10.5%. The sugar to acid balance is about the same as in a great Rheingau TBA. The Joseph Phelps Napa Valley Selected Late Harvest Johannisberger Riesling 1978 has 30% by weight of residual sugar, is 10% alcohol by volume, and had 48% by weight of sugar at harvest. Yet the acid to sweet balance is perfect. The Callaway 1977 Temecula "Sweet Nancy" Late Harvest Chenin Blanc has 10.7% by volume of alcohol, 9% residual sugar, and 0.9% total acidity by volume. It does not compare with the best late harvest Chenin Blancs from the Loire, but there is no doubt that it is a fine example of a late harvest Chenin Blanc that ages very well. I will not bother to detail the fine Monte Bello Cabernet Sauvignon from Ridge during this era. Most have lasted well, and several are outstanding and still will keep. I mention but a few examples. There are many others. The famous California microclimates in areas near the coast produce radically different growing conditions. It is nearly as if you had Bordeaux in one area, Burgundy a short distance away, and Morocco just a few miles further on. Those cold Pacific waters, valley orientations, and wind directions are responsible for this wild climate variation. Thus it is no surprise that very different techniques can be best for different regions. |
|
|||
|
The 3 very rich wines mentioned all owe their richness to Botrytis
cinerea. This is a fungus that attacks grapes. It also is known as pourriture noble in France and Edelf=E4ule in German speaking countries. It should strile when the grapes are ripe but still have plenty of acid. If it strikes too early you just get rotten grapes. Besides the rich California wines mentioned, it is responsible for many Auslese, Beerenauslese(BA), and Trockenbeerenauslese(TBA) wines in German speaking countries; Sauternes, Monbazillac, and some rich Loire wines in France; Tokaji Aszu, Tokaji Aszu Essencia, and Tokaji Essencia in Hungary, to name a few. Here is part of how Alexis Lichine describes it in one of his encyclopedias. ______________________________________ "The fungus penetrates the skin of the fruit without breaking it , and thus without exposing the pulp to air. If all is in order, the grape begins to wither and become desiccated, and there is a corresponding concentration of the juice. " "The climatic conditions must be such that as the grapes mature moisture must be present in the air to allow the fungus to grow, alternating with periods of dry weather to cause the water in the grapes to evaporate and so keep the mold from growing too fast. Yet if the temperature rises too high, the fungus will be killed." ______________________________________ This type of wine can be made fairly often in some areas and rarely or never in others. The 3 examples I give from California may appear very rich, but the legendary Tokaji Essencia can be even richer and contain well over 50% residual sugar by weight and only a very few percent alcohol. As the sugar content of the must becomes extremely high, it will hardlly ferment at all, may require special yeast strains, and may reach only a very few percent alcohol after up to a few years of fermentation. The types of grapes used, the climate, and taste preferences determine how this type of wine is made. A Sauternes usually has much less residual sugar than a German Riesling TBA, but much more alcohol. An attempt is made to strike the best balance between acidity, sweetness, and alcohol for the fruit at hand. |
|
|||
|
Cwdjrx _ wrote:
I have been cellaring fine California wines since the 70's and long ago drank up my mistakes. Now at 25 - 30 years, some have proved to be very age worthy and are outstanding. Keep in mind that many wines from the 70's were very ripe "monsters". Some have matured very well, and others had too much tannin and long ago dried out. You can find minute technical details about how such wines were made in the book "Great Winemakers of California" by Robert Benson, Capra Press, Santa Barbara 1977. The book likely is out of print, so you may have to go to a library to find it. You can always try Alibris: http://www.alibris.com/search/search...hes=49&qsort=r Dana |
|
|||
|
|
|
|||
|
Dale Williams wrote:
Nice post, thanks. Is there more than one '76 Freemark Abbey Edelwein? I have a 375 ordered at Premier Cru (last one they had) , but it didn't say Gold on site. If it is indeed the finest Riesling made in CA, it might have to be served to an Englishman living in France when he visits US. Peter Mayle?? :P Mark Lipton |
|
|||
|
Salut/Hi Dale Williams,
le/on 09 Apr 2004 12:51:11 GMT, tu disais/you said:- sight. It is about the richness of a fine German TBA. Residual Sugar is 16.4% and alcohol 10.5%. The sugar to acid balance is about the same as in a great Rheingau TBA. Nice post, thanks. Is there more than one '76 Freemark Abbey Edelwein? I have a 375 ordered at Premier Cru (last one they had) , but it didn't say Gold on site. If it is indeed the finest Riesling made in CA, it might have to be served to an Englishman living in France when he visits US. I didn't see this! -- All the Best Ian Hoare http://www.souvigne.com mailbox full to avoid spam. try me at website |
|
|||
|
Sorry about the html sig post. I use this on most NG posts and email
that allow html so that I can be contacted through the domain without having the address appear. The button takes you to a form page that allows posting as pop mail on the domain. Concerning Edelwein, the 73 is what put this style of wine on the map, although it is not nearly as rich as the mentioned 76 gold. It is now rather old tasting, but still quite drinkable in an old Riesling sort of way. I have a little of the 78 Edelwein and do not know if any 78 Edelwein gold was made or not. I do have half bottles of the 1991 Edelwein Gold. It has 21.2% residual sugar. I will have to try a bottle before long. |
|
|||
|
|
| Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
| Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads
|
||||
| Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
| Where is your BBQ made? | mg | Cooking Equipment | 7 | 26-04-2004 07:23 PM |
| List of Malaysian Restaurants ($Revision: 0.25 $). | Willie Lim | Restaurants | 1 | 29-12-2003 07:05 AM |
| Pork Rib help | Steve Calvin | General Cooking | 13 | 11-12-2003 09:57 PM |