Hello;
Only recently have I started to take a real interest in German wines - a
youth and childhood spent exposed to Liebfraumilch and Moselblümchen has
left me a bit on the cold side, I´d say ... a tasting this autumn which
ncluded the Dr Loosen Wehlener Sonnenurh Riesling Auslese 1995 made me see
the light ... anyway, here´s the question.
Many German wines of good quality has a considerable amount of residual
sugar (the one I mentioned, e g) but has a rather low alcohol content.
How do they stop the feremntation? I have come across dry German wines of
the auslese class, and they are quite high on alcohol, as would be expected
if all the sugar was allowed to ferment (we are talking QmP, so no
chaptalisation).

TIA

Nils Gustaf

--
Respond to nils dot lindgren at drchips dot se

In article , "Nils Gustaf Lindgren"
writes:

Many German wines of good quality has a considerable amount of residual
sugar (the one I mentioned, e g) but has a rather low alcohol content.
How do they stop the feremntation?

I'm no expert, especially at tech stuff, but always assumed it was probably
addition of sulphur (dioxide, I think) - lots of Prum wines have a very
sulphury nose when young. But I think its also legal to add juice (süssreserve,
I hope I got accent right).
Dale

Dale Williams
Drop "damnspam" to reply

"Dale Williams" skrev i meddelandet
...
In article , "Nils Gustaf
Lindgren"
writes:

...
I'm no expert, especially at tech stuff, but always assumed it was
probably
addition of sulphur (dioxide, I think) - lots of Prum wines have a very
sulphury nose when young. But I think its also legal to add juice
(süssreserve,
I hope I got accent right).

It´s not an accent, it´s a diacritical or, really, the two dots over the
u is a marker for a trailing e (an umlaut). We have that in Swedish (ä and
ö). Sorry about that. At one time, my nick was Umlaut Lymebranch.

As far as I know, it is not legal to add süssreserve to anything above the
level of QbA.
I think you are right about the sulphur.
--
Respond to nils dot lindgren at drchips dot se

"Nils Gustaf Lindgren" wrote in message
...


As far as I know, it is not legal to add süssreserve to anything above the
level of QbA.
I think you are right about the sulphur.
--
Sulphur is right. The "süssreserve" was a common method of adjusting the
final sweetness of a wine (adding "sweet reserve", sterilized grape juice)
and, afaik, was and still is legal for QmP's too. That usage was pretty
widespread as it made it quite easy to make a nice wine (without having to
follow fermentation in order to stop at the right moment, I believe) but was
frowned upon by top wine makers and discerning drinkers. It seems to me that
you see less of this practice nowadays.
Anders

Hello, im a german sommelier and my english is not so good, but i will try:
the german winemaker can use the süssreserve for all Quality wines he
made( Kabinett, Spätlese, Auslese), but good producer dont do that. The
problem is: the most german wines are sell in the world were made by
winemaker with low quality ambition. Ernie Loosen ist one of the best
winemaker. Dry wines with high alcohol will be made only with natural
sugar( QmP). The fermentation stops naturally or with sulfides. There are
limits by german law. And you cant taste it, because the wines will be
tasted bei law.
Best wishes
"Nils Gustaf Lindgren" schrieb im
Newsbeitrag ...
Hello;
Only recently have I started to take a real interest in German wines - a
youth and childhood spent exposed to Liebfraumilch and Moselblümchen has
left me a bit on the cold side, I´d say ... a tasting this autumn which
ncluded the Dr Loosen Wehlener Sonnenurh Riesling Auslese 1995 made me see
the light ... anyway, here´s the question.
Many German wines of good quality has a considerable amount of residual
sugar (the one I mentioned, e g) but has a rather low alcohol content.
How do they stop the feremntation? I have come across dry German wines of
the auslese class, and they are quite high on alcohol, as would be
expected
if all the sugar was allowed to ferment (we are talking QmP, so no
chaptalisation).

TIA

Nils Gustaf

--
Respond to nils dot lindgren at drchips dot se

"Nils Gustaf Lindgren" wrote in message ...
"Dale Williams" skrev i meddelandet
...
In article , "Nils Gustaf
Lindgren"
writes:

...
I'm no expert, especially at tech stuff, but always assumed it was
probably
addition of sulphur (dioxide, I think) - lots of Prum wines have a very
sulphury nose when young. But I think its also legal to add juice
(süssreserve,
I hope I got accent right).

It´s not an accent, it´s a diacritical or, really, the two dots over the
u is a marker for a trailing e (an umlaut). We have that in Swedish (ä and
ö). Sorry about that. At one time, my nick was Umlaut Lymebranch.

As far as I know, it is not legal to add süssreserve to anything above the
level of QbA.
I think you are right about the sulphur.

Bassically; the normal procedure is to measure the specific
gravity/taste and depending on what you want (dry, off-dry, etc.) you
then stabilise the wine, as in halting fermentation. Adding Sulphur
IIRC is more for the preservative properties to prevent the wine
spoiling. Without looking it up, I think the potassium metabisulphite
(which I guess is a kind of sulphite?) and you throw in your bentonite
or what not to help clear the wine.

"Nils Gustaf Lindgren" wrote in message
...
Hello;
Only recently have I started to take a real interest in German wines - a
youth and childhood spent exposed to Liebfraumilch and Moselblümchen has
left me a bit on the cold side, I´d say ... a tasting this autumn which
ncluded the Dr Loosen Wehlener Sonnenurh Riesling Auslese 1995 made me see
the light ... anyway, here´s the question.
Many German wines of good quality has a considerable amount of residual
sugar (the one I mentioned, e g) but has a rather low alcohol content.
How do they stop the feremntation?

There are several techniques employed to achieve this:
(1) Use of a slow, alcohol intolerant strain of yeast such as Epernay II
(aka Côtes de Blanc). Not only does the slow fermentation tend to preserve
the fruitiness of the wine, but these types of strains are also sensitive to
cold shock.
(2) Chilling the fermentation (~0°C) when the target Brix is nearly
reached. This stops the fermentation dead in its tracks. The yeast is then
allowed to settle and the wine is separated from it by racking and sent to
step #3.
(3) Sterile filtration. This step effectively prevents the wine from
resuming fermentation by removing _all_ yeast cells from it.

The wine is normally sulfited prior to filtration, but that alone is
insufficient to prevent refermentation. Addition of sorbate in conjunction
with sulfite would obviate the need for sterile filtration by preventing the
reproduction of yeast cells, but that is regarded as an inferior method
because many people object to the flavor of sorbate.

Tom S

"Tom S" skrev i meddelandet
om...

"Nils Gustaf Lindgren" wrote in message
...
...

There are several techniques employed to achieve this:
(1) Use of a slow, alcohol intolerant strain of yeast such as Epernay II
(aka Côtes de Blanc). Not only does the slow fermentation tend to
preserve
the fruitiness of the wine, but these types of strains are also sensitive
to
cold shock.
(2) Chilling the fermentation (~0°C) when the target Brix is nearly
reached. This stops the fermentation dead in its tracks. The yeast is
then
allowed to settle and the wine is separated from it by racking and sent to
step #3.
(3) Sterile filtration. This step effectively prevents the wine from
resuming fermentation by removing _all_ yeast cells from it.

Hello Tom;
Of these, version 1 would mean that you could not use wild strains of yeast
then.
All three have this in common that they eschew the addition of chemicals
etc, which I feel distinctly queasy about ...

Thnaks you, and thank you all for taking an interest

Nils Gustaf


--
Respond to nils dot lindgren at drchips dot se

"Anders Tørneskog" skrev i meddelandet
...

"Nils Gustaf Lindgren" wrote in message
...


As far as I know, it is not legal to add süssreserve to anything above
the
level of QbA.
...
Sulphur is right. The "süssreserve" was a common method of adjusting the
final sweetness of a wine (adding "sweet reserve", sterilized grape juice)
and, afaik, was and still is legal for QmP's too.

Apparently, I am mixing up chaptalisation, i e, adding saccharose, and
süssreserve, which is sterilized grape juice from the same grape and the
same region. The latter is allowed even in QmP, the former only up to QbA.
Sorry about that.

Nils Gustaf

--
Respond to nils dot lindgren at drchips dot se

"Nils Gustaf Lindgren" wrote in message
...



"Tom S" skrev i meddelandet
om...

"Nils Gustaf Lindgren" wrote in
message
...
...

There are several techniques employed to achieve this:
(1) Use of a slow, alcohol intolerant strain of yeast such as Epernay
II
(aka Côtes de Blanc). Not only does the slow fermentation tend to
preserve
the fruitiness of the wine, but these types of strains are also
sensitive
to
cold shock.
(2) Chilling the fermentation (~0°C) when the target Brix is nearly
reached. This stops the fermentation dead in its tracks. The yeast is
then
allowed to settle and the wine is separated from it by racking and sent
to
step #3.
(3) Sterile filtration. This step effectively prevents the wine from
resuming fermentation by removing _all_ yeast cells from it.

Hello Tom;
Of these, version 1 would mean that you could not use wild strains of
yeast
then.
All three have this in common that they eschew the addition of chemicals
etc, which I feel distinctly queasy about ...

Thnaks you, and thank you all for taking an interest

Nils Gustaf

Hi, Nils Gustaf -

I was afraid I'd misstated the above. Actually, steps (2) and (3) are
_both_ essential to the process of producing quality sweet wines that are
shelf-stable. Step (1) (using a slow fermenting cultured yeast strain) is
optional, but is more predictable in its outcome and easier to control than
the use of "wild" yeasts.

I intentionally omitted the practice of fermenting to dryness and sweetening
with sussreserve because that is not the method used for the production of
the highest quality wines. A wine made using sussreserve would also require
sterile filtration or the addition of sorbate and sulfite prior to bottling
to assure shelf-stability, so there's little to gain by employing the
technique.

Tom S

"Nils Gustaf Lindgren" wrote in message ...
"Tom S" skrev i meddelandet
om...

"Nils Gustaf Lindgren" wrote in message
...
...

There are several techniques employed to achieve this:
(1) Use of a slow, alcohol intolerant strain of yeast such as Epernay II
(aka Côtes de Blanc). Not only does the slow fermentation tend to
preserve
the fruitiness of the wine, but these types of strains are also sensitive
to
cold shock.
(2) Chilling the fermentation (~0°C) when the target Brix is nearly
reached. This stops the fermentation dead in its tracks. The yeast is
then
allowed to settle and the wine is separated from it by racking and sent to
step #3.
(3) Sterile filtration. This step effectively prevents the wine from
resuming fermentation by removing _all_ yeast cells from it.

Hello Tom;
Of these, version 1 would mean that you could not use wild strains of yeast
then.

Not really. Their house strain (wild yeast, whatever you want to call
it) may already have these characteristics.

All three have this in common that they eschew the addition of chemicals
etc, which I feel distinctly queasy about ...

Chances are they still use "chemicals" (sulfite, fining agents) some
where in the process, just not to stop the fermentation, primarily
because they aren't very effective for this use.


Thnaks you, and thank you all for taking an interest

Nils Gustaf

Andy