I made up a starter with whole rye flour a few days ago with 1/2 cup
rye flour and 1/2 cup bottled water. After one day, no activity,
removed 1/2 and added another 1/2 cup and 1/2 cup. After two days,
the thing went crazy and was oozing out of the mason jar with a loose
fitting lid. It smelled and tasted kinda nasty though and not acidic.
Discarded 1/2 and added 1/2 cup whole wheat flour and enough water to
make a paste. Third day, all activity seemed to stop, but it had a
very pleasent acidic taste and smell. It also has seemed to liquify
itself. It appears runnier and wetter after setting a day. But where
are the bubbles like the 2nd day? I'm now feeding it white flour every
day. It's day 4 and still not much activity. Is this normal?

Todd K.

Todd K. wrote:

I made up a starter with whole rye flour a few days ago with 1/2 cup
rye flour and 1/2 cup bottled water. After one day, no activity,
removed 1/2 and added another 1/2 cup and 1/2 cup. After two days,
the thing went crazy and was oozing out of the mason jar with a loose
fitting lid. It smelled and tasted kinda nasty though and not acidic.
Discarded 1/2 and added 1/2 cup whole wheat flour and enough water to
make a paste. Third day, all activity seemed to stop, but it had a
very pleasent acidic taste and smell. It also has seemed to liquify
itself. It appears runnier and wetter after setting a day. But where
are the bubbles like the 2nd day? I'm now feeding it white flour every
day. It's day 4 and still not much activity. Is this normal?

My own starter didn't look like much for the first week and a half. So, you
shouldn't worry yet. Is it sitting out at room temperature? And what is
that temperature? Cooler temperatures will slow down your progress. But if
your getting the acidic smell consistently, I would say the right things
are happening. The starter I began back in early November now rages with
activity. Rising is strong and the time required to double is rarely more
than five hours.

Todd K. wrote:
I made up a starter with whole rye flour a few days ago with 1/2 cup
rye flour and 1/2 cup bottled water. After one day, no activity,
removed 1/2 and added another 1/2 cup and 1/2 cup. After two days,
the thing went crazy and was oozing out of the mason jar with a loose
fitting lid. It smelled and tasted kinda nasty though and not acidic.

Thhat's the "shakeout" process, where everything grows.

Discarded 1/2 and added 1/2 cup whole wheat flour and enough water to
make a paste. Third day, all activity seemed to stop, but it had a
very pleasent acidic taste and smell.

So you got the LB's to establish themselves.

It also has seemed to liquify
itself.

They break down material and it gets more liquid.

It appears runnier and wetter after setting a day. But where
are the bubbles like the 2nd day? I'm now feeding it white flour every
day. It's day 4 and still not much activity. Is this normal?

Probably, but not what you want to happen.

It seems you may not be refreshing i. e. feeding an adequate ratio of
old flour(existing starter flour) to new flour (addition).

The critters need a certain environment to grow and if that does not
happen, nothing much grows.

That's the case when it gets too acidic and this could be your situation.

In a working starter, with every feeding, you lower the acidity and if
it's already on a level, where the organisms have problems living, you
get the environment back to where they can live better.

If you don't feed enough, the acidity stays too high and not much happens.

If you are doing the replacing thing - 1/2 cup out, 1/2 cup back,
essentially feeding a constant amount, you create a problem.

The bacterial growth is geometric - 1, 2, 4, 8 - doubling in every
growth period and in optimal conditions with sourdough LB's, that period
is something like 1 or 2 hours.

With constant feeding, you are running them in the ditch. That's
desirable when growing a new starter because that creates an acidic
environment, where the other, not so desirable organisms die out.

So - long story short, and if this is your issue, change the feeding
ratio from replacing to normally doubling or tripling, in your case,
where you are maybe very sour and with white flour, maybe increase to 5
or 10 times (make two experiments) and see if that gives you better action.

Also, as Jim mentioned, temperature is an issue, but since you mention
acidic smell, I think that's more your case.


Samartha

On 14 Jan 2006 01:10:15 -0800, "Todd K."
wrote:

I'm now feeding it white flour every
day. It's day 4 and still not much activity. Is this normal?

Hi Todd,

If you are asking if it is normal to generate a starter by
switching flour sources every day, I would say no...g

You might want to start again with the rye, and continue the
process with rye for a week or so.

All the best,
--
Kenneth

If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."

Thanks for all your advice. I did a pH check today according to the
FAQ. It was 4.3. The FAQ said it should be 3.9-4.1 so I feel I'm not
too far off and certainly not to acidic. I am gonna switch back to rye
again for awhile and see what happens.

Todd K.

todd,
i had the same experience following the recipe in peter reinharts book.
a lot of activity on day two and day 3 three and then it pooped out. i
sent him email and he graciously responded and said it may have to do
with natural occuring bacteria that flourishes when the seed is not
acidic enough. it can help to using pinapple juice instead of water for
the first couple feedings. can find more at the baking circle on king
arthurs web site.
good luck!
kathi

kathi wrote:

todd,
i had the same experience following the recipe in peter reinharts book.
a lot of activity on day two and day 3 three and then it pooped out. i
sent him email and he graciously responded and said it may have to do
with natural occuring bacteria that flourishes when the seed is not
acidic enough. it can help to using pinapple juice instead of water for
the first couple feedings.

I didn't always agree with Peter Reinhart's methods, but at least I
respected him. Until now.

B/

wow brian,
that is... hostile. the recommendation came from work done by a group
of home bakers/scientists at the king arthur baking circle. would you
care to explain your derision?
k

kathi wrote:
wow brian,
that is... hostile.

No, it isn't, actually. It's not warm and fuzzy and full of group hugs,
this is true, but not "hostile."

the recommendation came from work done by a group
of home bakers/scientists at the king arthur baking circle.

If everyone pushed their mothers off a cliff, would that be a good idea?

would you care to explain your derision?

If it were "derision" I might. Then again, if it were truly "derision"
it would be self-explanatory.

B/

kathi wrote:
wow brian,
that is... hostile.

What?

That's your opinion - can't he just write what he thinks?

Freedom of expression seems to be a lost value these days.

More appropriate would be to say: "I think this is hostile."

What you're gonna do if somebody really blasts - commit suicide?


My 0,02 Eur

Samartha


the recommendation came from work done by a group
of home bakers/scientists at the king arthur baking circle. would you
care to explain your derision?
k

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Rec.food.sourdough mailing list

http://www.mountainbitwarrior.com/ma...food.sourdough

Another update. It been 6 or 7 days. I switched back to whole wheat
flour and its acting like I think it should. In fact, tonite I feed it
and within an hour or two, it doubled! Smells good (bready) and tastes
a little acidic.

I also began mixing it to more of a biscuit dough consistency rather
than pancake batter. I think that has helped it. It seemed when I
was making "pancake batter" with the AP white flour, it just could
never get going. Also, when I feed it, I pour out nearly the entire
jar. Only what's clinging to sides gets more fresh flour on top of it.

Thanks all!

Todd K.

Huh?

That's Kathi's opinion

Doesn't fredom of express.......oops, sorry




In article
ountainbitwarrior.com,
Samartha Deva wrote:

kathi wrote:
wow brian,
that is... hostile.

What?

That's your opinion - can't he just write what he thinks?

Freedom of expression seems to be a lost value these days.

More appropriate would be to say: "I think this is hostile."

What you're gonna do if somebody really blasts - commit suicide?


My 0,02 Eur

Samartha


the recommendation came from work done by a group
of home bakers/scientists at the king arthur baking circle. would you
care to explain your derision?
k

_______________________________________________
Rec.food.sourdough mailing list

http://www.mountainbitwarrior.com/ma...food.sourdough

td,
thanks for expressing ......