In article ,
Frogleg wrote:
[... discussion of how someone first tried various foods. ...]
= How is it we treasure aged Stilton, and return packages of
= molded cheddar to the supermarket?

Interesting question. I've wondered about cheese mold. Is all
cheese mold safe to eat or are there some that are not (as you
commented about bread molds)?


--
Kind regards,

Charlie "Older than dirt" Sorsby Edgewood, NM "I'm the NRA!"
www.swcp.com/~crs USA Life Member since 1965

In article , Charlie Sorsby
wrote:
Is all
cheese mold safe to eat
or are there some that are not (as you
commented about bread molds)?

For all practical purposes both cheese mold and bread mold is safe.
(although theres an area of uncertainty if you're a pregnant woman).

But of course we like some molds, others we don't like. It requires
quite a lot of skill (and experience) to make things go moldy in a way
that we'll like. So, in the caves where Roquefort cheese is aged, they
leave loaves of bread scattered around. These become very moldy and
encourage the spread of the spores of the mold that is wanted to make
the cheese taste good.

Lazarus

--
Remover the rock from the email address

Charlie Sorsby wrote:

In article ,
Frogleg wrote:
[... discussion of how someone first tried various foods. ...]
= How is it we treasure aged Stilton, and return packages of
= molded cheddar to the supermarket?

Interesting question. I've wondered about cheese mold. Is all
cheese mold safe to eat or are there some that are not (as you
commented about bread molds)?

--
Kind regards,

Charlie "Older than dirt" Sorsby

If the cheese is a natural cheese, without other preservatives,
synthetic gums or oils etc, then the mould is harmless. Just cut it off.

Don't think I'd want to mess with any mould that grows on those plastic
cheese slices or Velveeta.

On Sun, 14 Mar 2004 12:02:14 -0700, (Charlie Sorsby)
wrote:

In article ,
Frogleg wrote:
[... discussion of how someone first tried various foods. ...]
= How is it we treasure aged Stilton, and return packages of
= molded cheddar to the supermarket?

Interesting question. I've wondered about cheese mold. Is all
cheese mold safe to eat or are there some that are not (as you
commented about bread molds)?

[I distinctly remember seeing some pictures of how surface bread mold
spread filaments throughout a loaf, and the USDA says to discard moldy
bread. The effects of (unknown) mold can range from mild allergic
reaction to mold spores, to (apparently relatively rare) illness
caused by the toxins molds produce in growing.]

This site:

http://www.fsis.usda.gov/OA/pubs/molds.htm

says to cut off the mold on hard cheese that doesn't have specific
mold as a part of the manufacturing process, and discard those cheeses
that *do* have mold if a stranger mold shows up.

"Lazarus Cooke" a écrit dans le message de
om...
In article , Charlie Sorsby
wrote:
Is all
cheese mold safe to eat
or are there some that are not (as you
commented about bread molds)?

For all practical purposes both cheese mold and bread mold is safe.
(although theres an area of uncertainty if you're a pregnant woman).

But of course we like some molds, others we don't like. It requires
quite a lot of skill (and experience) to make things go moldy in a way
that we'll like. So, in the caves where Roquefort cheese is aged, they
leave loaves of bread scattered around. These become very moldy and
encourage the spread of the spores of the mold that is wanted to make
the cheese taste good.

If I may expand a little, they do not 'leave loaves of bread scattered
around', they specially bake rye bread loaves and put them in the vents
that bring air to the caves after inoculating them so that they slowly mold
away and cast a regular stream of spores through the air.


Lazarus


--
Salutations, greetings,
Guiraud Belissen, Château du Ciel, Drachenwald
Chris CII, Rennes, France

In article , Christophe Bachmann
wrote:


But of course we like some molds, others we don't like. It requires
quite a lot of skill (and experience) to make things go moldy in a way
that we'll like. So, in the caves where Roquefort cheese is aged, they
leave loaves of bread scattered around. These become very moldy and
encourage the spread of the spores of the mold that is wanted to make
the cheese taste good.

If I may expand a little, they do not 'leave loaves of bread scattered
around', they specially bake rye bread loaves and put them in the vents
that bring air to the caves after inoculating them so that they slowly mold
away and cast a regular stream of spores through the air.

They must have tidied up since I was last there.



Lazarus

--
Remover the rock from the email address

All molds were thought to be safe, if not always pleasant, until the
discovery of the deadly carcinogenic afflotoxin molds on peanuts a few years
back.

Of course, some people are allergic to molds.


--
-Mark H. Zanger
author, The American History Cookbook, The American Ethnic Cookbook for
Students
www.ethnicook.com
www.historycook.com


"Charlie Sorsby" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Frogleg wrote:
[... discussion of how someone first tried various foods. ...]
= How is it we treasure aged Stilton, and return packages of
= molded cheddar to the supermarket?

Interesting question. I've wondered about cheese mold. Is all
cheese mold safe to eat or are there some that are not (as you
commented about bread molds)?


--
Kind regards,

Charlie "Older than dirt" Sorsby Edgewood, NM "I'm the NRA!"
www.swcp.com/~crs USA Life Member since 1965

In article tdJ8c.9281$JO3.15250@attbi_s04, Mark Zanger
wrote:

All molds were thought to be safe, if not always pleasant, until the
discovery of the deadly carcinogenic afflotoxin molds on peanuts a few years
back.

Of course, some people are allergic to molds.

Thanks mark. My understanding is still that all moulds with the
exception of peanut are consdered safe.

Lazarus

--
Remover the rock from the email address

All molds were thought to be safe, if not always pleasant, until the
discovery of the deadly carcinogenic afflotoxin molds on peanuts a
few years back.
Of course, some people are allergic to molds.
Thanks mark. My understanding is still that all moulds with the
exception of peanut are consdered safe.

Nobody who's looked at the literature in the last 20 years would consider
that way. Aflatoxin grows pretty well in maize, in which form it carries
through into the milk of corn-fed cattle, as the only slightly less toxic
substance aflatoxin-M. This is the one responsible for most aflatoxin
outbreaks in the US; aflatoxin on peanuts is mainly a problem when the
nuts are stored in tropical conditions, no growing area in the US gets
hot enough.

There is also zearalenone (immensely powerful oestrogen analogue; in
pigs it causes bizarre genital deformities in utero and is probably
not much less dangerous for humans), the ergot alkaloids on rye, and
the mycotoxins responsible for Balkan epidemic nephropathy (I forget
the exact death toll for that but in some years it's scarily high).

======== Email to "j-c" at this site; email to "bogus" will bounce ========
Jack Campin: 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU; 0131 6604760
http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/purrhome.html food intolerance data & recipes,
Mac logic fonts, Scots traditional music files and CD-ROMs of Scottish music.

Lazarus Cooke wrote:

In article tdJ8c.9281$JO3.15250@attbi_s04, Mark Zanger
wrote:

All molds were thought to be safe, if not always pleasant, until the
discovery of the deadly carcinogenic afflotoxin molds on peanuts a few years
back.

Of course, some people are allergic to molds.

Thanks mark. My understanding is still that all moulds with the
exception of peanut are consdered safe.

Ergot on rye?

Pastorio

On Fri, 26 Mar 2004 23:15:47 -0500, "Bob (this one)"
wrote:

Lazarus Cooke wrote:

In article tdJ8c.9281$JO3.15250@attbi_s04, Mark Zanger
wrote:

All molds were thought to be safe, if not always pleasant, until the
discovery of the deadly carcinogenic afflotoxin molds on peanuts a few years
back.

Of course, some people are allergic to molds.

Thanks mark. My understanding is still that all moulds with the
exception of peanut are consdered safe.

Ergot on rye?

Yes.

"Ergot, caused by the fungus Claviceps purpurea, is a disease of
cereal crops and grasses....Human poisoning was common in Europe in
the Middle Ages when ergoty rye bread was often consumed."

http://www.ext.nodak.edu/extpubs/pla...ops/pp551w.htm

Ergotamine is an abortifacient and a vaso-constrictor. Ergotamine
tartrate is the primary ingredient of LSD. Ergot poisoning from a
large dose includes convulsions, halucinations and bizarre behaviour.
Smaller repeated doses may result in gangrene.

"Ergot, caused by the fungus Claviceps purpurea, is a disease of
cereal crops and grasses....Human poisoning was common in Europe in
the Middle Ages when ergoty rye bread was often consumed."

http://www.ext.nodak.edu/extpubs/pla...ops/pp551w.htm

Ergotamine is an abortifacient and a vaso-constrictor. Ergotamine
tartrate is the primary ingredient of LSD.

It isn't. It's a chemical from whch LSD can be made. It's commonly
prescribed as an anti-migraine drug; the standard dose is 2mg, which
is 8 times larger than a 1960s-level LSD dose and about 50 times the
LSD dose people usually take these days. That is, if there were any
significant LSD-like effects from ergotamine tartrate there'd be a
lot of migraine sufferers noticing it.

It takes complicated chemical processing to make anything hallucinogenic
from ergotamine, and your own metabolism can't do it. The idea that the
effects of ergot on rye have anything to do with LSD is a 1960s urban
legend. Mouldy rye might well make your fingers and toes drop off with
gangrene, but that's no hallucination. Goodman and Gilman's "The
Pharmacological Basis of Therapeutics" describes the toxic effects of
crude ergot in some detail.

You or your source are also mixed up about the abortifacient properties
of ergot. There are several oxytocic chemicals in it; the one used in
obstetrics is ergometrine, which is chemically related to ergotamine but
isn't the same thing.

======== Email to "j-c" at this site; email to "bogus" will bounce ========
Jack Campin: 11 Third Street, Newtongrange, Midlothian EH22 4PU; 0131 6604760
http://www.purr.demon.co.uk/purrhome.html food intolerance data & recipes,
Mac logic fonts, Scots traditional music files and CD-ROMs of Scottish music.

On 29 Mar 2004 01:11:13 GMT, (bogus address)
wrote:



"Ergot, caused by the fungus Claviceps purpurea, is a disease of
cereal crops and grasses....Human poisoning was common in Europe in
the Middle Ages when ergoty rye bread was often consumed."

http://www.ext.nodak.edu/extpubs/pla...ops/pp551w.htm

Ergotamine is an abortifacient and a vaso-constrictor. Ergotamine
tartrate is the primary ingredient of LSD.

It isn't. It's a chemical from whch LSD can be made. It's commonly
prescribed as an anti-migraine drug; the standard dose is 2mg, which
is 8 times larger than a 1960s-level LSD dose and about 50 times the
LSD dose people usually take these days. That is, if there were any
significant LSD-like effects from ergotamine tartrate there'd be a
lot of migraine sufferers noticing it.

I didn't say ergotamine tartrate *was* LSD; I said it was a primary
ingredient. I *was* wrong about it being an abortifacient -- I seem to
remember that warning from my migraine days. It *is* contraindicated
for pregnant women or those who may become pregnant. Symptoms of
ergotism (ergot poisoning) may include writhing, tremors, convulsions,
hallucinations, and temporary or permanant psychosis. One presumes
medications prescribed for vascular headaches are not *quite* the same
formulation as either LSD or rye bread made from ergoty grain, just
the same as curare and digitalis are both poisons and medications.