Bob (this one) wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:

Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:

Bob (this one) wrote:

Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:

Pulpitfire wrote:

Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:

Amen and amen :-)

May the LORD help us all to face the great tribulation when the Lamb
opens the 6th seal possibly in less than a few months (03/29/06), in
Jesus' most precious and holy name...

Alright, now this is the same thing you posted in reply to an article
on forgiveness. What are you doing?

Doing that which the LORD would have me do.

Translation

No translation needed when things have been written plainly.

Oh, I thoroughly agree.

Then let us end this discussion on that positive note.

May the LORD help us all to face the great tribulation when the Lamb
opens the 6th seal possibly in less than a few months (03/29/06), in
Jesus' most precious and holy name.

Amen !!!

Now this is about the works of the four horsemen from the 6th chapter
of the Book of Revelation (we are now in the 6th year into the third
millenium after the birth of the Son of Man):

(1) Crowned rider wielding a bow and riding a white horse:

"See you on the other side. It's not bad. We are just going to
sleep." - missive (missile) from one of 12 born-again Christian miners
who gave up their lives to save the youngest among them after being
trapped by an explosion in a W.Va mine.

(2) Rider wielding a sword and riding a fiery red horse:

Ariel Sharon, the world's hope for lasting peace in the middle east,
suffers a massive bleeding stroke. Violence and bloodshed in Iraq
escalates. U.S. now less likely to pull out of Iraq anytime soon.

(3) Rider wielding a set of food scales and riding a black horse:

The rate of increase of the number of people worldwide using the
2PD-OMER Approach (which advocates the use of food scales) accelerates
with growing worldwide concerns about the obesity epidemic:

http://www.HeartMDPhD.com/wtloss.asp

Meanwhile, folks like Bob Pastorio who refuse to use this Approach are
heard muttering that an omer is not a weight measure but a volume
measure somewhere between one and three quarts depending on what the
food is and that liquid foods like milk (emulsified oil) and wine
should not be counted toward daily intake.

(4) Rider on a pale horse given the authority to kill a fourth of the
world's population "by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts
of the earth":

The H5N1 Avian Flu Pandemic seems to be starting in Turkey:

http://tinyurl.com/amj4a

Yes, the migratory birds spreading H5N1 virus are wild beasts of the
earth.

When will the sun "turn black like sackcloth made of goat hair"
(Revelation 6:12b) ?

It will turn black during the total solar eclipse that will happen
**also** in Turkey on Wednesday 03/29/2006 at around 14:00 hrs LT.

http://tinyurl.com/dcj7w

The order of darkening of the following ancient cities in Turkey:

(1) Ephesus
(2) Smyrna
(3) Pergamum
(4) Thyatira
(5) Sardis
(6) Philadelphia
(7) Laodicea

Will be the same order that Christ Jesus used to address the seven
churches:

"Write on a scroll what you see and send it to the seven churches: to
Ephesus, Smyrna, Pergamum, Thyratira, Sardis, Philadelphia and
Laodicea." (Revelation 1:11)

Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things
like cardiology, diabetes, cooking and nutrition that interest those
following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/26/06) from
6 to 7 pm EST:

http://tinyurl.com/cpayh

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/b6xwk

Bob (this one) wrote:
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
Bob (this one) wrote:

Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:


Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:


Bob (this one) wrote:


Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:


Pulpitfire wrote:


Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:


Amen and amen :-)

May the LORD help us all to face the great tribulation when the Lamb
opens the 6th seal possibly in less than a few months (03/29/06), in
Jesus' most precious and holy name...

Alright, now this is the same thing you posted in reply to an article
on forgiveness. What are you doing?

Doing that which the LORD would have me do.

Translation

No translation needed when things have been written plainly.

Oh, I thoroughly agree.

Then let us end this discussion on that positive note.

LOL

....or not.

For this, you will remain in my prayers, dear Bob whom I love, in
Jesus' most precious and holy name :-)

Amen :-))


Would be more than happy to "glow" and chat about this and other things
like cardiology, diabetes, cooking and nutrition that interest those
following this thread here during the next on-line chat (01/26/06) from
6 to 7 pm EST:

http://tinyurl.com/cpayh

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/bgfqt

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/be9va

Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:

May the LORD help us all to face the great tribulation when the Lamb
opens the 6th seal possibly in less than a few months (03/29/06), in
Jesus' most precious and holy name...

Dr. Chung, I appreciate your desire to help people avoid heart and
health problems. But regarding the ability to save men from spiritual
harm, 1 Corinthians 1-2 says that the wisdom of the world does not
bring people to a saving knowledge of God, and is therefore "foolish".
You think God wants you to warn people so they won't experience a
global health crisis and earthquake, but I believe God wants us to lead
people to a saving knowledge of Christ, and comfort one another with
the hope that God has not appointed us unto Tribulation wrath (1 Thess.
4-5).

The only way to be saved from the Tribulation is by trusting Christ.
If you are really concerned about saving people, become an evangelist,
proclaim the gospel, and turn people to Christ, instead of trying to be
a medical savior. Have you ever taken time to see how the following
verses and reasons we won't enter the Tribulation fit into your
theology?

I believe we will not enter the Tribulation:

1) Because the Tribulation is the time of "Jacob's trouble" (Jeremiah
30:7).

The twofold purpose of the Tribulation, is to prepare Israel,
spiritually, for the Messiah she rejected the first time (Jeremiah
30-33), and to rain judgment on the "inhabitants of the earth" (Rev.
3"10; 8:13). The only places in the gospel that refer to how God's
people should prepare for Tribulation life, are where He is addressing
Jews--primarily in Matthew, and a little in Luke. The gospel of
John--mainly adressing church age saints-- warns only of general
persecution. Read Revelation 12, to see who the players are during the
Tribulation. The woman who gave birth to the male child, is clearly
the nation Israel, not the church.


2) Because the rapture (catching up) is not part of the Day of the
Lord.

In 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 Paul has to educate them about the rapture
of the church, and our being caught up together with Him in the air.
By sharp contrast ("But") to the events of this rapture, he tells them
they already knew full well about the events of the "day of the
Lord"--the time when Tribulation judgment would fall on the inhabitants
of the earth.

Now how could they know full well about the Tribulation, but nothing
about the catching up (rapture) of the church? It seems the only way
is if the rapture of the church is not part of the events of the
Tribulation, in Scripture. If that's the case, then the rapture must
occur before the events of the Day of the Lord.


3) Because we're supposed to comfort one another with the hope of the
rapture (1 Thess. 4:18).

It would be hard to imagine "these words" as being a "comfort", if the
Thessalonians thought they'd have to endure the Tribulation before they
would get raptured.


4) Because we are not children of darkness (1 Thess. 5:5).

Regarding those events of the day of the Lord's judgment, Paul said
church age believers are not children of darkness, that the day of the
Lord should overtake them like a thief. It is the children of
darkness, and not children of light, who are overtaken, like a thief,
by the day of the Lord's judgment (5:4-5). It is when "they" (not
"you") say "peace and safety", that destruction shall come upon "them".
You might say then, that they will simply not be overtaken by the day
the way a thief is, but read on, where the passage shows God has not
appointed us to this Tribulation wrath at all.


5) Because God has not appointed us to wrath (1 Thess. 5:8-10).

In contrast to the drunken sleepers who will be overtaken like a thief
by the day of the Lord's judgment (which includes the Tribulation, and
not just eternal damnation), we, who are sober, are supposed to put on
for a helmet, the "hope of salvation". Why? Because God has "NOT
[emphasis mine] appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our
Lord Jesus Christ, Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we
should live together with him." This knowledge is supposed to be a
comfort, regarding not only those who sleep in Christ, but also the day
of the Lord's judgment. Whether we are alive or dead, we will be with
the Lord, and not experiencing the wrath of God that falls on the
drunken sleepers who are children of darkness (cf. Ephesians
5:8,13,14).


6) Because the rapture assures us we have not entered the Tribulation
(2 Thess. 2)

The Thessalonians were troubled by the thought that maybe they had
already entered the day of Tribulation. Paul besought them by the hope
of the "coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and our gathering together
unto Him", that they had not already entered the day of Christ's
judgment (2 Thess 2:1-2). This prospect of the coming of the Lord, and
gathering of the saints to be with Him, would not be a proof for them,
that they had not entered the Tribulation, if they had to endure the
entire, or even part of the Tribulation, before they were gathered to
the Lord. They could no thave entered the time of judgment (and
neither could we), becuase the gathering of church age saints (whether
they sleep or are alive) to the Lord will occur first, and this is the
hope by which Paul besought them.


7) Because God promised to deliver the church from the hour of
Tribulation (Revelation 3:10)

In Revelation 3:10, God promises to deliver the church from the very
hour in which the testing occurs for "them" "that dwell upon the
earth". How can they be delivered from testing that falls on earth
dwellers, and from the very hour in which the testing occurs, if they
still dwell on earth, or in a realm where earth time applies?
Apparently, the church will not dwell on earth during the hour the
testing occurs. This truth applies to whomever "has an ear" in the
"churches" (v13).


8) Because John was raptured before the "things which shall be
hereafter" (Rev 4:1)

In Revelation 1:19, John was told to write the "things which thou hast
seen " (vision of the resurrected Christ), the "things which are"
(letters to the "churches"), and the "things which shall be hereafter"
(Tribulation wrath upon the inhabitants of the earth). The letters to
the churches conclude the "the things which are". But before God shows
him the "things which shall be hereafter", He catches him up into
heaven (rapture), from earth (4:1). It is not until he is in heaven
that he sees the judgments which shall be "hereafter", falling on "them
who dwell on the earth". This is in keeping with the promise God just
made in Revelation 3:10, that the church will not go through the hour
of testing that falls on "them that dwell upon the earth", and that the
church (addressed in the "things which are"), is not part of the
"things which shall be hereafter".

9) Because Tribulation saints are not the "church".

Revelation 1-3 addresses believers as the "church" something like 19
times before Revelation 4 refers to the judgments which shall be
"hereafter" falling on "the inhabitants of the earth". Then, during
the time of the Tribulation, instantly believers are referred to only
by terms like "saints", and there is not one reference to the "church".
Israel, and the 144,000 chosen from the twelve tribes are the subjects
of God's sealing during that time, and not the church (cf. Revelation
12).

Now, is it just a coincidence Revelation refers to church age
believers, during the "things which are", as the "church" 19 times, and
then instantly stops calling believers the "church" once John is
raptured to heaven and the "things which shall be hereafter" begin? It
seems highly unlikely to me.

I don't believe God has appointed the church to the wrath which Paul
said would overtake the children of darkeness during the "day of the
Lord" (1 Thess. 5), but to salvation, through our Lord Jesus Christ.
Paul beseeches us, by the hope of our gathering to the Lord, not to
think we have entered into the day of the Lord, and exhorts us to
comfort one another with the hope of being raptured. If you want to
save people from the Tribulation, become an evangelist and tell them to
trust Christ as their Savior.