I put together my first sauerbraten of the season yesterday to hold me over
until Christmas dinner (a goose). It should be ready for me to cook about
mid week.

I use 4 cookbooks to make it... I always get out my Joy of Cooking (1970s),
Good Housekeeping (1970s), Fannie Farmer (1970s) and Settlement Cookbook
(1990s) for reference. Most of my cooking (as opposed to baking) is done
just using recipes as points of departure. It's good to have multiple
cookbooks with the same general cuisine in them, as one can then see how
variable a recipe is and how much flexibility one really has. For
sauerbraten, there is a huge variation between these 4 classic cookbooks.

Some of the differences a

Marination time - as little as 2 days, as much as 5 days
Cooking method - 3 use the oven, 1 uses the stovetop
Cooking time - as little as 1-1/2 hours, as much as 4 hours

Most heat the marinade before use, one does not. Of those that heat it, one
says boil 5 minutes, the others say heat to below boiling. One says pour the
hot marinade over the beef, another says cool it to room temperature before
doing that.

One says just wine vinegar and water, two say a mixture of wine and wine
vinegar in different proportions, one says just wine.

Ingredients that are only in some of the marinade recipes: whole cloves,
carrots, celery, caraway seeds, juniper berries.

Ingredients that are only in some of the gravy recipes: raisins, ginger
snaps, sour cream.

When I get the 4 cookbooks out, it's mainly to review my procedures and make
sure I don't leave anything out that I might want to put in. Otherwise I
kind of make it up as I go along. I don't always make it the same way. It
depends what I have available and what I feel like. It's a great way to
cook.

Anyone else like to cook this way, or do you feel more comfortable with a
set recipe?

--
( #wff_ng_7# at #verizon# period #net# )

On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 20:34:41 GMT, "wff_ng_7"
wrote:

Ingredients that are only in some of the gravy recipes: raisins, ginger
snaps, sour cream.

Can you share a gravy recipe that is more from scratch, not requiring
gingersnaps? That's been one of the reasons I haven't made
sauerbraten yet. It just seems unnatural to put cookies in with a
roast..

When I get the 4 cookbooks out, it's mainly to review my procedures and make
sure I don't leave anything out that I might want to put in. Otherwise I
kind of make it up as I go along. I don't always make it the same way. It
depends what I have available and what I feel like. It's a great way to
cook.

Anyone else like to cook this way, or do you feel more comfortable with a
set recipe?

Yup. I use recipes as guidelines until I find the perfect version,
then I use a specific recipe from that point on.

Thanks,
Carol
--

http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/head_trollop/my_photos

Damsel in dis Dress wrote:

On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 20:34:41 GMT, "wff_ng_7"
wrote:


Ingredients that are only in some of the gravy recipes: raisins, ginger
snaps, sour cream.


Can you share a gravy recipe that is more from scratch, not requiring
gingersnaps? That's been one of the reasons I haven't made
sauerbraten yet. It just seems unnatural to put cookies in with a
roast..

My cabbage rolls recipe uses a few gingersnaps (crushed) in the sauce
and is WONDERFUL. I think you'd be surprised how common they are in such
dishes?
Goomba

Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 20:34:41 GMT, "wff_ng_7"
wrote:


Ingredients that are only in some of the gravy recipes: raisins, ginger
snaps, sour cream.


Can you share a gravy recipe that is more from scratch, not requiring
gingersnaps? That's been one of the reasons I haven't made
sauerbraten yet. It just seems unnatural to put cookies in with a
roast..


Not really, consider they are mostly flour which is typically used to
thicken gravy.




When I get the 4 cookbooks out, it's mainly to review my procedures and make
sure I don't leave anything out that I might want to put in. Otherwise I
kind of make it up as I go along. I don't always make it the same way. It
depends what I have available and what I feel like. It's a great way to
cook.

Anyone else like to cook this way, or do you feel more comfortable with a
set recipe?


Yup. I use recipes as guidelines until I find the perfect version,
then I use a specific recipe from that point on.

Thanks,
Carol

"Damsel in dis Dress" wrote:
Can you share a gravy recipe that is more from scratch, not requiring
gingersnaps? That's been one of the reasons I haven't made
sauerbraten yet. It just seems unnatural to put cookies in with a
roast..

But I always use gingersnaps these days. There really is only one hazard to
using gingersnaps, and I know better now... don't open the bag until you
need them for the gravy. The bag is on top of the refrigerator staring at
me, but I will resist! ;-)

Here's the gravy section of the New Settlement Cookbook recipe. The recipe
for the marinade is one that uses a red wine and wine vinegar mix like I do,
with a decent amount of chopped vegetables, which I also do. The
wine/vinegar mix is about 2-1/2 or so, the chopped carrots, celery, and leek
probably total 2 cups. I actually use onions rather than a leek. The
resulting cooking liquid from the oven braising is basically the marinade
that was used.

--
2 tablespoons softened butter mixed with 2 tablespoons flour
3 tablespoons raisins

Strain the cooking liquid into a small saucepan, pressing down hard on the
vegetables to extract as much flavor as possible. (You should have about 2
cups of liquid. If not, add enough water or beef stock to measure this
amount. If you have more than 2 cups, boil over high heat to reduce to this
amount.) Skim off fat.

Bring the strained sauce to a boil. Whisk in the mixture of butter and
flour. Blend until thickened. Season with salt and pepper to taste. (If
lumps appear, strain again after thickening.) Return both the meat and the
sauce to the casserole and add the raisins. Return to the oven and cook for
15 to 20 more minutes, covered.
--

I always use sour cream and ginger snaps. The amounts of those are around
1/2 to 1 cup each, roughly speaking. You can add either to the above basic
recipe as needed. I tend not to pay that much attention to getting the
amount of cooking liquid to 2 cups. I usually just add enough of the sour
cream and particularly the gingersnaps to get the consistency I'm looking
for. Sometimes it depends how much sour cream I have on hand and what other
uses I have for it. With the gingersnaps, I find it easy to continue adding
cookies until it's right. I have an old mini food processor that I toss a
few cookies in at a time to grind up for the gravy.

For me, juniper berries are required for the marinade. They add more of a
"game" flavor to the dish. Kind of like the way gin is required for a
martini... can we start that argument again! ;-)

--
( #wff_ng_7# at #verizon# period #net# )

On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 22:18:13 GMT, "wff_ng_7"
wrote:

Here's the gravy section of the New Settlement Cookbook recipe.

Thank you! I'm going to save this as a reference. I would really
love to make sauerbraten. The one time I tasted it, it was SO good!

Carol
--

http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/head_trollop/my_photos

In article ,
says...
On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 22:18:13 GMT, "wff_ng_7"
wrote:

Here's the gravy section of the New Settlement Cookbook recipe.

Thank you! I'm going to save this as a reference. I would really
love to make sauerbraten. The one time I tasted it, it was SO good!

Carol

Hmmm - not something to get me out of my tree. I can eat it, but I basically
think it's despoiling perfectly good beef. Well, ymmv obviously.

-P.

--
=========================================
firstname dot lastname at gmail fullstop com

On Sat 17 Dec 2005 01:41:17p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Damsel in dis
Dress?

Can you share a gravy recipe that is more from scratch, not requiring
gingersnaps? That's been one of the reasons I haven't made
sauerbraten yet. It just seems unnatural to put cookies in with a
roast..

Carol, in almost every German recipe I've ever seen for Sauerbraten, there is
some type of spicy cookie or cake used for both flavoring and thickening the
gravy. It's traditional, not some new far-flung idea. The exact addition
may vary, but may include gingersnaps, gingerbread, lebkuchen, honey cake,
etc. It would unnatural to me for that type of ingredient to be missing. It
is, after all, a sweet/sour type of dish. I haven't read the entire thread,
but I would be surprised if the one you tasted didn't have a gravy made like
this.

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
_____________________________________________

A chicken in every pot is a *LOT* of chicken!

On Sat 17 Dec 2005 09:28:33p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Peter
Huebner?

In article ,
says...
On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 22:18:13 GMT, "wff_ng_7"
wrote:

Here's the gravy section of the New Settlement Cookbook recipe.

Thank you! I'm going to save this as a reference. I would really
love to make sauerbraten. The one time I tasted it, it was SO good!

Carol

Hmmm - not something to get me out of my tree. I can eat it, but I
basically think it's despoiling perfectly good beef. Well, ymmv
obviously.

OR, a great way of making perfectly good beef better! You can always have
plain beef. It's sometimes nice to have something different.

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
_____________________________________________

A chicken in every pot is a *LOT* of chicken!

On Sun, 18 Dec 2005 17:28:33 +1300, Peter Huebner
wrote:

In article ,
says...
On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 22:18:13 GMT, "wff_ng_7"
wrote:

Here's the gravy section of the New Settlement Cookbook recipe.

Thank you! I'm going to save this as a reference. I would really
love to make sauerbraten. The one time I tasted it, it was SO good!

Carol

Hmmm - not something to get me out of my tree. I can eat it, but I basically
think it's despoiling perfectly good beef. Well, ymmv obviously.

Thank you for your input! : )
Carol
--

http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/head_trollop/my_photos

On 18 Dec 2005 06:39:30 +0100, Wayne Boatwright
wrote:

On Sat 17 Dec 2005 01:41:17p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Damsel in dis
Dress?

Can you share a gravy recipe that is more from scratch, not requiring
gingersnaps? That's been one of the reasons I haven't made
sauerbraten yet. It just seems unnatural to put cookies in with a
roast..

Carol, in almost every German recipe I've ever seen for Sauerbraten, there is
some type of spicy cookie or cake used for both flavoring and thickening the
gravy. It's traditional, not some new far-flung idea. The exact addition
may vary, but may include gingersnaps, gingerbread, lebkuchen, honey cake,
etc. It would unnatural to me for that type of ingredient to be missing. It
is, after all, a sweet/sour type of dish. I haven't read the entire thread,
but I would be surprised if the one you tasted didn't have a gravy made like
this.

Well, I'll give it a shot. Still seems odd to me, but what the hay?

Carol
--

http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/head_trollop/my_photos

On Sat 17 Dec 2005 02:03:12p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Goomba38?

Damsel in dis Dress wrote:

On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 20:34:41 GMT, "wff_ng_7"
wrote:


Ingredients that are only in some of the gravy recipes: raisins, ginger
snaps, sour cream.


Can you share a gravy recipe that is more from scratch, not requiring
gingersnaps? That's been one of the reasons I haven't made
sauerbraten yet. It just seems unnatural to put cookies in with a
roast..

My cabbage rolls recipe uses a few gingersnaps (crushed) in the sauce
and is WONDERFUL. I think you'd be surprised how common they are in such
dishes?

The sauce for my cabbage rolls is more like a paprikash gravy, but I'd like
to try yours, Goomba. Could you post it? TIA

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
_____________________________________________

A chicken in every pot is a *LOT* of chicken!

On Sat 17 Dec 2005 01:34:41p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it wff_ng_7?

I put together my first sauerbraten of the season yesterday to hold me
over until Christmas dinner (a goose). It should be ready for me to cook
about mid week.

I use 4 cookbooks to make it... I always get out my Joy of Cooking
(1970s), Good Housekeeping (1970s), Fannie Farmer (1970s) and Settlement
Cookbook (1990s) for reference. Most of my cooking (as opposed to
baking) is done just using recipes as points of departure.

I almost always do this when I'm researching a dish I'll be making for the
first time, or that I didn't document the first time around. Once I've
arrived at what I like, I've learned to document it to avoid future
disappointments. g

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
_____________________________________________

A chicken in every pot is a *LOT* of chicken!

On Sat 17 Dec 2005 10:44:47p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Damsel in
dis Dress?

On 18 Dec 2005 06:39:30 +0100, Wayne Boatwright
wrote:

On Sat 17 Dec 2005 01:41:17p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Damsel
in dis Dress?

Can you share a gravy recipe that is more from scratch, not requiring
gingersnaps? That's been one of the reasons I haven't made
sauerbraten yet. It just seems unnatural to put cookies in with a
roast..

Carol, in almost every German recipe I've ever seen for Sauerbraten,
there is some type of spicy cookie or cake used for both flavoring and
thickening the gravy. It's traditional, not some new far-flung idea.
The exact addition may vary, but may include gingersnaps, gingerbread,
lebkuchen, honey cake, etc. It would unnatural to me for that type of
ingredient to be missing. It is, after all, a sweet/sour type of dish.
I haven't read the entire thread, but I would be surprised if the one
you tasted didn't have a gravy made like this.

Well, I'll give it a shot. Still seems odd to me, but what the hay?

Good girl! You'll love it!

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
_____________________________________________

A chicken in every pot is a *LOT* of chicken!

In article ,
Damsel in dis Dress wrote:

On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 20:34:41 GMT, "wff_ng_7"
wrote:

Ingredients that are only in some of the gravy recipes: raisins, ginger
snaps, sour cream.

Can you share a gravy recipe that is more from scratch, not requiring
gingersnaps? That's been one of the reasons I haven't made
sauerbraten yet. It just seems unnatural to put cookies in with a
roast..


I can do without the gingersnaps also.

Do you cook pot roast? I think of this as pot roast. You marinate it
in the fridge for a few days, then cook it as a pot roast using the
marinade as the liquid. You can then make the gravy just like you do
for pot roast. Watch the seasonings of course, since it is already
heavily seasoned.

We've made this a few times, but not for a long time. It is quite
forgiving about the cooking.

--
Dan Abel

Petaluma, California, USA