General Cooking (rec.food.cooking) For general food and cooking discussion. Foods of all kinds, food procurement, cooking methods and techniques, eating, etc.

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  #1 (permalink)   Report Post  
Serene
 
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Default Tonight's dinner

Or, rather, what I'm planning for tonight's (late) dinner:

A whole chicken, roasted with my mom's secret marinade (grab whatever
salad dressing you're running out of, and rub it all over the chicken
before roasting) and stuffed with bread stuffing (may add nuts and/or
dried fruit to the stuffing; may not).

Spinach and collard greens, sauteed with mustard seed.

Kind of wish I'd bought winter squash -- it's what I'm in the mood for.

serene
--
http://serenejournal.livejournal.com
http://www.jhuger.com
  #5 (permalink)   Report Post  
Wayne Boatwright
 
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On Sun 03 Apr 2005 09:00:23p, Rusty wrote in rec.food.cooking:

> On 4 Apr 2005 05:36:25 +0200, Wayne Boatwright
> > wrote:
>
>>On Sun 03 Apr 2005 08:19:08p, Rusty wrote in rec.food.cooking:
>>
>>> On Sun, 3 Apr 2005 20:11:06 -0700, (Serene)
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Or, rather, what I'm planning for tonight's (late) dinner:
>>>>
>>>>A whole chicken, roasted with my mom's secret marinade (grab whatever
>>>>salad dressing you're running out of, and rub it all over the chicken
>>>>before roasting) and stuffed with bread stuffing (may add nuts and/or
>>>>dried fruit to the stuffing; may not).
>>>>
>>>>Spinach and collard greens, sauteed with mustard seed.
>>>>
>>>>Kind of wish I'd bought winter squash -- it's what I'm in the mood for.
>>>>
>>>>serene
>>>
>>> Tonights dinner:
>>>
>>> Chinese Steamed Buns with BBQ Pork Filling
>>> and Hot and Sour Soup.
>>>
>>> Got to find something better than waxed paper to steam the
>>> buns on. I peel it off the buns as soon as they come out
>>> of the steamer to prevent it sticking to them.
>>>
>>>
>>> Rusty

>>
>>Sounds like a good dinner! Try baking parchment paper.

>
> Thanks, I'm going to get some baking parchment. A few months ago
> I finally perfected the Hot and Sour Soup. Tonight, for the first time
> I made Chinese Steamed Buns with BBQ Pork. They turned out really
> good. Next time I'll try some different fillings.
>
>
> Rusty


Make one of the filings "red date"

--
Wayne Boatwright
____________________________________________

Give me a smart idiot over a stupid genius any day.
Sam Goldwyn, 1882-1974


  #7 (permalink)   Report Post  
Melba's Jammin'
 
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In article >, Rusty
> wrote:

> Got to find something better than waxed paper to steam the
> buns on. I peel it off the buns as soon as they come out
> of the steamer to prevent it sticking to them.


> Rusty


Parchment paper. Lettuce leaves.
--
-Barb, <http://www.jamlady.eboard.com> The Nylons added 4-3-05.

"I read recipes the way I read science fiction: I get to the end and
say,'Well, that's not going to happen.'" - Comedian Rita Rudner,
performance at New York, New York, January 10, 2005.
  #8 (permalink)   Report Post  
Nancy Young
 
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Last night I had a nice chicken cacciatore, I haven't
had that in ages. I added a couple of tablespoons of
tapenade, it came out really great. I messed up the
side salad, it was too vinegarry. Oh, well.

nancy


  #9 (permalink)   Report Post  
Mash
 
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Baked Ham
Mashed Potatoes
Broccoli with Cheese Sauce
Homemade Dinner Rolls
Tapioca Pudding

Plan on using some of the ham to make lasagna roll-ups for dinner
tonight. It's a new recipe so I'll let you know how the new recipe
turns out.

Mary

Nancy Young wrote:
> Last night I had a nice chicken cacciatore, I haven't
> had that in ages. I added a couple of tablespoons of
> tapenade, it came out really great. I messed up the
> side salad, it was too vinegarry. Oh, well.
>
> nancy


  #10 (permalink)   Report Post  
Ariane Jenkins
 
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On Mon, 04 Apr 2005 10:34:03 GMT, kilikini >
wrote:
>> I finally perfected the Hot and Sour Soup. Tonight, for the first time
>> I made Chinese Steamed Buns with BBQ Pork. They turned out really
>> good. Next time I'll try some different fillings.
>>
>>
>> Rusty

>
> Try Char Sui or a curry filling; those are excellent!


In Chinese cuisine, char siu _is_ bbq pork, and yeah, it's
very good.

Erik does a big batch on the K which gets sliced and frozen for later
use. When I use it in char siu bao filling, I diced it and stir-fry it with
minced garlic and scallions, a bit of sherry, and soy sauce/oyster sauce to
taste. Very addictive! On some occasions, I'll make a bunch of these and
we'll have them for dinner. Char siu also works great in stir fries with
vegetables and/or noodles, fried rice, etc.

Ariane



  #11 (permalink)   Report Post  
Sheldon
 
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Ariane Jenkins wrote:
> kilikini wrote:
> >
> > Try Char Sui or a curry filling; those are excellent!

>
> In Chinese cuisine, char siu _is_ bbq pork.
>
> Erik does a big batch on the K.


How do you cook on a Kubota?

Sheldon

  #12 (permalink)   Report Post  
Charles Gifford
 
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"Serene" > wrote in message
g...
> Or, rather, what I'm planning for tonight's (late) dinner:
>
> A whole chicken, roasted with my mom's secret marinade (grab whatever
> salad dressing you're running out of, and rub it all over the chicken
> before roasting) and stuffed with bread stuffing (may add nuts and/or
> dried fruit to the stuffing; may not).


Have you ever brined a chicken? I've never done it, but it seems almost
everyone recommends it. I am not much of a chicken eater, but now 'n' then I
think about cooking it for guests.

> Spinach and collard greens, sauteed with mustard seed.


Please tell me how you acomplish to sauté such differently textured leaves.
Do you start the collards first, then add the spinach? I can't quite picture
the combination. The mustard seed is good though! I have often cooked greens
with mustard seed and some asafetida. Wonderful!

> Kind of wish I'd bought winter squash -- it's what I'm in the mood for.
>
> serene


Sorry about the winter squash (it is Spring!). I'd like some nice fluffy
white rice now.

Charlie


  #13 (permalink)   Report Post  
Bob
 
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Charlie wrote:

> I have often cooked greens with mustard seed and some asafetida.


I frequently cook collard greens with mustard oil and garlic. I find it's
easier to control garlic than asafetida, and they do taste very similar to
me. (I spilled some powdered asafetida in the kitchen once, and watched it
seek out the most inaccessible crevices in which to reside.)

Bob


  #14 (permalink)   Report Post  
Melba's Jammin'
 
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In article t>,
"Charles Gifford" > wrote:
> Have you ever brined a chicken? I've never done it, but it seems
> almost everyone recommends it. I am not much of a chicken eater, but
> now 'n' then I think about cooking it for guests.


Make sure it hasn't already been shot up with 10-12% "flavor solution;"
i.e., salt water.
--
-Barb, <http://www.jamlady.eboard.com> The Nylons added 4-3-05.

"I read recipes the way I read science fiction: I get to the end and
say,'Well, that's not going to happen.'" - Comedian Rita Rudner,
performance at New York, New York, January 10, 2005.
  #15 (permalink)   Report Post  
D.A.Martinich
 
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Gosh, Barb-
I didn't expect to run into the Pirohy Queen out here in the tofu and
cilantro saturated Bay Area....

D.



  #16 (permalink)   Report Post  
Melba's Jammin'
 
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In article . com>,
"D.A.Martinich" > wrote:

> Gosh, Barb-
> I didn't expect to run into the Pirohy Queen out here in the tofu and
> cilantro saturated Bay Area....
>
> D.


Huh? What'd I miss?
--
-Barb, <http://www.jamlady.eboard.com> The Nylons added 4-3-05.

"I read recipes the way I read science fiction: I get to the end and
say,'Well, that's not going to happen.'" - Comedian Rita Rudner,
performance at New York, New York, January 10, 2005.
  #17 (permalink)   Report Post  
Steve Pope
 
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Bob > wrote:

> I frequently cook collard greens with mustard oil and garlic. I
> find it's easier to control garlic than asafetida, and they do
> taste very similar to me.


Whoa, really?

Asafetida is rotten isn't it? It has that
distinct fetid smell to it, in my experience.

Steve
  #18 (permalink)   Report Post  
Serene
 
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Charles Gifford > wrote:

> "Serene" > wrote in message
> g...
> > Or, rather, what I'm planning for tonight's (late) dinner:
> >
> > A whole chicken, roasted with my mom's secret marinade (grab whatever
> > salad dressing you're running out of, and rub it all over the chicken
> > before roasting) and stuffed with bread stuffing (may add nuts and/or
> > dried fruit to the stuffing; may not).

>
> Have you ever brined a chicken? I've never done it, but it seems almost
> everyone recommends it. I am not much of a chicken eater, but now 'n' then I
> think about cooking it for guests.


Never have. I don't eat chicken/turkey very often (don't much like
poultry) and people seem to like it fine when I cook it, so I'm unlikely
to make the effort.

>
> > Spinach and collard greens, sauteed with mustard seed.

>
> Please tell me how you acomplish to sauté such differently textured leaves.
> Do you start the collards first, then add the spinach? I can't quite picture
> the combination. The mustard seed is good though! I have often cooked greens
> with mustard seed and some asafetida. Wonderful!


I usually do spinach and flat mustard greens together, and the texture
is never an issue -- it cooks so quickly. However, last night I decided
to just do spinach in a little olive oil, salt, and garlic powder. It
was wonderful.

> > Kind of wish I'd bought winter squash -- it's what I'm in the mood for.

>
> Sorry about the winter squash (it is Spring!). I'd like some nice fluffy
> white rice now.


Mmmm, rice.

Got my new (first ever) pressure-cooker today. James mistyped it
"pleasure cooker" and I think I'm gonna call it that. Cooked black-bean
chili in it, and though I'm gonna have to spend some time getting used
to how long things take, I can already tell I'm going to love this new
toy.

serene
--
http://serenejournal.livejournal.com
http://www.jhuger.com
  #19 (permalink)   Report Post  
Serene
 
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Steve Pope > wrote:

> Bob > wrote:
>
> > I frequently cook collard greens with mustard oil and garlic. I
> > find it's easier to control garlic than asafetida, and they do
> > taste very similar to me.

>
> Whoa, really?
>
> Asafetida is rotten isn't it? It has that
> distinct fetid smell to it, in my experience.


You may be using too much. A teeny-tiny pinch is all that is needed. It
gives the redolence of onion/garlic, but more is not better.

serene
--
http://serenejournal.livejournal.com
http://www.jhuger.com
  #20 (permalink)   Report Post  
Serene
 
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Black bean chili in the new pleasure-cooker:

1 cup black beans
3 cups water
1 can diced tomatoes
1 chopped onion
2 ribs chopped celery
1 T chili powder
1 T cumin
dash red pepper flakes

Cooked it at high pressure for 10 minutes and it wasn't enough. Kept
trying until I got it right, but next time I'll try 30 to start with.
(Didn't soak the beans.) It was way yummy. Served it with warmed corn
tortillas and some guacamole-flavored chips (Mission brand) that
reminded me of salsa verde Doritos.

serene


  #21 (permalink)   Report Post  
Steve Pope
 
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Serene > wrote:

>Steve Pope > wrote:


>> Asafetida is rotten isn't it? It has that
>> distinct fetid smell to it, in my experience.


> You may be using too much. A teeny-tiny pinch is all that
> is needed. It gives the redolence of onion/garlic, but more is
> not better.


Perhaps, though I was talking I about how I think it smells, not what
the result is in a recipe. You definitely don't want to use
a whole bunch of the stuff (like you would with garlic...)

Steve

  #22 (permalink)   Report Post  
Jim Lane
 
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Steve Pope wrote:
> Serene > wrote:
>
>
>>Steve Pope > wrote:

>
>
>>>Asafetida is rotten isn't it? It has that
>>>distinct fetid smell to it, in my experience.

>
>
>>You may be using too much. A teeny-tiny pinch is all that
>>is needed. It gives the redolence of onion/garlic, but more is
>>not better.

>
>
> Perhaps, though I was talking I about how I think it smells, not what
> the result is in a recipe. You definitely don't want to use
> a whole bunch of the stuff (like you would with garlic...)
>
> Steve
>



Hehehehe, as thosgh it wasn't telling you up front:

asaFETIDa


jim
;->
  #23 (permalink)   Report Post  
Steve Pope
 
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Jim Lane > wrote:

>> Perhaps, though I was talking I about how I think it smells


>Hehehehe, as thosgh it wasn't telling you up front:


>asaFETIDa


Yes, for sure.

I'm wondering though if it was some sort of garlic or onion,
before it went fetid.

S.
  #24 (permalink)   Report Post  
Leila
 
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Serene wrote:
> Got my new (first ever) pressure-cooker today. James mistyped it
> "pleasure cooker" and I think I'm gonna call it that. Cooked

black-bean
> chili in it, and though I'm gonna have to spend some time getting

used
> to how long things take, I can already tell I'm going to love this

new
> toy.
>


I used the PC to make something out of a Lorna Sass PC cookbook:
Chicken with olives and escarole. You saute onions in the PC, add 1/2
c. white wine and cook it down, add 1/2 cup chix broth, 6 mashed
anchovies, 1 cup green or mixed Italian olives, 1.5 lbs. escarole,
chopped, 3 cups of marinara sauce, and 2-3 pounds chicken parts,
skinned. I used 4 chicken legs. Also some shakes of red pepper flakes.
Lock it down, cook 9 minutes for chix parts - I gave it another 5 for
the legs but it was too much, should have given it only 12 minutes
total. Never mind. THe stew came out pungent, flavorful, tomatoey and
delicious. She says serve it over pasta or polenta but I just served
ciabatta bread to sop it up.

Leila

  #25 (permalink)   Report Post  
Tim May
 
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In article .com>,
Leila > wrote:

> Serene wrote:
> > Got my new (first ever) pressure-cooker today. James mistyped it
> > "pleasure cooker" and I think I'm gonna call it that. Cooked

> black-bean
> > chili in it, and though I'm gonna have to spend some time getting

> used
> > to how long things take, I can already tell I'm going to love this

> new
> > toy.
> >

>
> I used the PC to make something out of a Lorna Sass PC cookbook:
> Chicken with olives and escarole. You saute onions in the PC, add 1/2
> c. white wine and cook it down, add 1/2 cup chix broth, 6 mashed
> anchovies, 1 cup green or mixed Italian olives, 1.5 lbs. escarole,
> chopped, 3 cups of marinara sauce, and 2-3 pounds chicken parts,
> skinned. I used 4 chicken legs. Also some shakes of red pepper flakes.
> Lock it down, cook 9 minutes for chix parts - I gave it another 5 for
> the legs but it was too much, should have given it only 12 minutes
> total. Never mind. THe stew came out pungent, flavorful, tomatoey and
> delicious. She says serve it over pasta or polenta but I just served
> ciabatta bread to sop it up.


SShhhh! You two chicks sittin' around talking about chix and chickpeas
in a PC need to let off some steam and pipe down! PCs are widely used
outside the U.S.A....we need to keep it that way.

(I cook simply, but often using a PC. Some potatoes and a few pieces of
Aaron's chicken, from TJ's, cook in under 20 minutes, from a cold
start, in my Kuhn-Rikon PC. I use an induction cooktop, an inexpensive
Sunpentown (? don't blame me for the weird name) "Mr. Induction" that I
got for $125. Almost as fast as gas, but much more convenient. The
ferromagnetic bottom of a Kuhn-Rikon is perfect. American PCs tend to
be aluminum (Presto, Rival, etc.), so they won't work on an induction
cooktop.)

As for which type to get, several years ago I got the Kuhn-Rikon "Duo"
set, consisting of a 2.5 liter pan and a 5 liter larger pot, with one
pressure lid that fits both and one glass lid that can be used either
for conventional cooking or for keeping something warm. I think the
price then was $160.

I recently added a "special deal" pot that happens to use the same size
of lid, for $80. Look around on the Web to find it. There's also an
"Anniversary Model," about 3.5 liters, for about $100. A good way to
get started with PCs.

(There are two other European PC makers of note, and Lorna Sass,
mentioned above, is careful to not annoint Kuhn-Rikon as the only
decent modern PC. But it's what many recommend.)


--Tim May


  #26 (permalink)   Report Post  
Leila
 
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Luckily I have a gas cooktop so I don't *have* to own a $160 pressure
cooker. But stainless steel rather than aluminum is an enticing
thought. However I already shelled out $60 for the Presto (bought at
the local hardware store) and I want to get my money's worth from it. I
do wonder about cooking very acid foods (tomato sauce, lemony recipes)
in the aluminum PC. So far no weird reactions.

Leila

  #27 (permalink)   Report Post  
Tim May
 
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In article .com>,
Leila > wrote:

> Luckily I have a gas cooktop so I don't *have* to own a $160 pressure
> cooker. But stainless steel rather than aluminum is an enticing
> thought. However I already shelled out $60 for the Presto (bought at
> the local hardware store) and I want to get my money's worth from it. I
> do wonder about cooking very acid foods (tomato sauce, lemony recipes)
> in the aluminum PC. So far no weird reactions.



The 3.5 liter Kuhn-Rikon can be found for about $80, with the latest
Lorna Sass cookbook, "Pressure Perfect," included. Shop around and this
can be with free shipping, no state sales tax, etc.

But as you already have a PC, buying another is not a high priority. So
this message is mainly for others who might be thinking about getting
one.

3.5 liters is not large, but is OK for 2-3 people. Large pots of
lentils or beans probably require about 6-8 liters (especially because
of foaming, so more internal volume is needed), as some of the older
American PCs routinely are found in. (The weight of aluminum versus
stainless is an issue here.)

I think the alleged Alzheimer's connection with aluminum and acid foods
has been refuted, so the main effect of acidy foods would be to etch
the aluminum slightly.

I'll bet the recent trends in European PCs will cause American makers
like Presto to start selling stainless steel models with third
generation pressure lids.

Or, perhaps more likely, whoever owns Presto (I haven't Googled on
this) will come out with a new brand. Perhaps the "George Foreman
Pressure Pleaser" or somesuch?

--Tim May
  #28 (permalink)   Report Post  
Leila
 
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Okay, Tim, you who despiseth wasting money in expensive restaurants -
why buy a Kuhn-Rikon rather than a Presto? I see that Presto makes an 8
quart stainless steel PC for $86.39
(http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...tchen&n=289825)

Since I cook for a family of big eaters, and I like to make enough to
have leftovers, I will never use a 3.5 liter PC. 8 liters/quarts is
more like it.

I'm using the PC so much that I'm considering an upgrade, to a bigger,
stainless steel version.

I'll be googling a thread on RFC recently comparing the brands, but
your thoughts would be appreciated. I'm particularly interested in your
defense of spending more $ on a Kuhn-Rikon. Why isn't this profligacy
in your book?

Leila

  #29 (permalink)   Report Post  
Steve Pope
 
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Leila > wrote:

>I'm using the PC so much that I'm considering an upgrade, to a bigger,
>stainless steel version.


Slow-food people, from the Medditeranean (isn't that where
you and I are from) would disdain a PC. My mother and my
grandmother cooked up ceci beans under normal atmospheric
pressure.

Tastes good to me.

S.
  #30 (permalink)   Report Post  
AlleyGator
 
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Tim May > wrote:


>(I cook simply, but often using a PC. Some potatoes and a few pieces of
>Aaron's chicken, from TJ's, cook in under 20 minutes, from a cold
>start, in my Kuhn-Rikon PC. I use an induction cooktop, an inexpensive
>Sunpentown (? don't blame me for the weird name) "Mr. Induction" that I
>got for $125. Almost as fast as gas, but much more convenient. The
>ferromagnetic bottom of a Kuhn-Rikon is perfect. American PCs tend to
>be aluminum (Presto, Rival, etc.), so they won't work on an induction
>cooktop.)


Tim, just curious about the current draw for that induction unit.
Just did a quick search and didn't find a lot of detail. I assume
it's no worse than an electric skillet or whatever? (BTW, yes we do
know each other <G>) I've been wanting one for the wok, since it's
either electric or an outside propane burner here. Sheldon
recommended a good one but it's several hundred bucks. Ever try yours
with a wok?


  #31 (permalink)   Report Post  
Sheldon
 
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Steve Pope wrote:
> Leila > wrote:
>
> >I'm using the PC so much that I'm considering an upgrade, to a

bigger,
> >stainless steel version.

>
> Slow-food people, from the Medditeranean (isn't that where
> you and I are from) would disdain a PC. My mother and my
> grandmother cooked up ceci beans under normal atmospheric
> pressure.


Hmmm. . . Slow-food people...

Pressure Pot process = Slow-People food


Ahahahahahahahahahaha. . . .

Sheldon Sloth

  #32 (permalink)   Report Post  
Bob (this one)
 
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Steve Pope wrote:

> Leila > wrote:
>
>>I'm using the PC so much that I'm considering an upgrade, to a bigger,
>>stainless steel version.

>
> Slow-food people, from the Medditeranean (isn't that where
> you and I are from) would disdain a PC.


Hmmm. My Mediterranean family uses pressure cookers for all sorts of
things. Started using them in the 40's when they saw how much faster
things went and how much more fully integrated the flavorings were. No
need to wait for that second-day flavor improvement in stews and
braises. It all happened more quickly, more thoroughly. Less work for
mama. Always a good thing.

> My mother and my
> grandmother cooked up ceci beans under normal atmospheric
> pressure.
>
> Tastes good to me.


<LOL> "Good 'nough for my grandpaw; good 'nough fer me..." So there's
only one way...?

Pastorio
  #33 (permalink)   Report Post  
Leila
 
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Steve Pope wrote:
> Leila > wrote:
>
> >I'm using the PC so much that I'm considering an upgrade, to a

bigger,
> >stainless steel version.

>
> Slow-food people, from the Medditeranean (isn't that where
> you and I are from) would disdain a PC. My mother and my
> grandmother cooked up ceci beans under normal atmospheric
> pressure.
>
> Tastes good to me.
>
> S.


Well, just because one has Mediterranean ancestry doesn't mean that one
*has* to cook via the slow-food method. My Lebanese grandmother cooked
on an outdoor grill she made herself with clay, and she used (Tim May
alert! Tim May alert!) dried cow dung for fuel. I ain't going there.

In the 70s my Lebanese relatives all acquired food processors long
before we did. Now they eat takeout thyme bread (manaqeesh) and I
understand that many Beirutis don't even cook at home anymore. THey all
eat takeout. There was an article about how they like to drive to
Syria, a few hours, pick up good take out home style food there, and
drive back to eat it in Beirut. ??? (PS my relatives are from South
Lebanon, a small village, not Beirut)

So much for slow food.

Not that I'm against the concept, I think it's fine, but I don't really
live that way.

Leila

  #34 (permalink)   Report Post  
Tim May
 
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In article .com>,
Leila > wrote:

> Okay, Tim, you who despiseth wasting money in expensive restaurants -
> why buy a Kuhn-Rikon rather than a Presto? I see that Presto makes an 8
> quart stainless steel PC for $86.39


I buy lots of nice _stuff_. What I dislike is spending lots of money on
temporary, fleeting, ephemeral experiences of certain kinds.

So for the difference in price between an inexpensive bottle of wine
and one of the bottles of wines served at restaurants, I have the
stainless steel Kuhn-Rikon instead of the aluminum Presto. And I'll be
using the Kuhn-Rikon for, hopefully, many years to come.

This is my choice. Others make different choices. (The thing about
their choices that continues to bother me is when I see people
obviously squandering, assuming Social Security or illusory pension
funds or "society" will someday pay for their old age: they won't.)

By the way, 20 years ago I likely would've bought the Presto. But, of
course, 20 years ago I was happy to heat things in a microwave or, if
absolutely necessary, use an old beat-up T-Fal pan acquired at Long's
Drugs. (Not that 20 years ago I instead indulged frequently in
expensive restaurants. Mostly I worked, invested, worked, saved,
worked, etc.)

>
> Since I cook for a family of big eaters, and I like to make enough to
> have leftovers, I will never use a 3.5 liter PC. 8 liters/quarts is
> more like it.
>
> I'm using the PC so much that I'm considering an upgrade, to a bigger,
> stainless steel version.
>
> I'll be googling a thread on RFC recently comparing the brands, but
> your thoughts would be appreciated. I'm particularly interested in your
> defense of spending more $ on a Kuhn-Rikon. Why isn't this profligacy
> in your book?


Mostly covered above, for at least the smaller of the KRs. I,
personally, would not spend $250 on a "hotel-grade" PC (thicker walls,
very tall, intended to sit close to other such pots on burners). If the
5-6 liter models are not large enough, perhaps sticking with a less
expensive aluminum model is the way to go.


By the way, in a recent PBS show, "Hidden India: The Kerala
Spicelands," I caught a clear glimpse of a Kuhn-Rikon PC being used to
cook a family meal. The flanges around the rim are a giveaway. (I used
my DVR to replay the sequence.) It looked to be about an 8 liter model.

If a presumably poor Indian family gets a high quality stainless steel
PC....

(Of course, there are other possibilities. Maybe they are well-off for
India. Maybe Kuhn-Rikon has different prices for the Third World. Maybe
it's a knock-off. Etc.)

As the difference in price between the aluminum Presto and the
stainless steel KR is the cost of a "drinkable" (!) wine at a
moderately upscale restaurant, I know the choice I would make.

--Tim May
  #35 (permalink)   Report Post  
Tim May
 
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In article >, Steve Pope
> wrote:

> Leila > wrote:
>
> >I'm using the PC so much that I'm considering an upgrade, to a bigger,
> >stainless steel version.

>
> Slow-food people, from the Medditeranean (isn't that where
> you and I are from) would disdain a PC. My mother and my
> grandmother cooked up ceci beans under normal atmospheric
> pressure.
>
> Tastes good to me.


Indians (the real ones) also favor slow food. However, modern Indians
have embraced the PC with wild enthusiasm, as we all should know by
now.

There are lots of reasons for this: leaving a pot of beans on all day,
while away from home, is not safe. A lot of the "slow cooking" recipes
are designed to have someone in the kitchen basically all day.

Not exactly compatible with today's economy.

The "crock pot" was intended to solve this problem by safely allowing a
slow cooker to run unattended for many hours, even overnight.

Personally, my mother and my sister both received crock pots as gifts
during the 1970s heyday, but I have never eaten a meal cooked in a
crock pot, not from either of them, not from anyone else.

I use my PC frequently, by contrast. For a variety of foods, not just
for beans and lentils.

Your mileage may vary.


--Tim May
--Tim May


  #36 (permalink)   Report Post  
Paul Broadway
 
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"Tim May" > wrote in message
...
>
> Personally, my mother and my sister both received crock pots as gifts
> during the 1970s heyday, but I have never eaten a meal cooked in a
> crock pot, not from either of them, not from anyone else.


I use a crock pot every week. I find that the crock pot is a wonderful
labor saving device. You can make any sort of stew or braised recipe in
them and you don't have to stand over them all day long. Chili, beef stew,
and any cream soup is wonderful in a crock pot. You really should try one.


--
Paul Broadway
1521 30th St.
San Diego, Ca.
92102-1503
www.broadwaypub.com
(619) 696-9831


  #37 (permalink)   Report Post  
Michael Sierchio
 
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Paul Broadway wrote:

> I use a crock pot every week. I find that the crock pot is a wonderful
> labor saving device. You can make any sort of stew or braised recipe in
> them and you don't have to stand over them all day long. Chili, beef stew,
> and any cream soup is wonderful in a crock pot. You really should try one.


Got an oven? I start a pot on the stovetop to get things to a safe temp,
put it in an oven at 250-275 def F, and leave it for hours (covered).

What I don't need is another gadget taking up space in my kitchen
when I already have something that does an excellent job.
  #38 (permalink)   Report Post  
Tim May
 
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This post is mostly about my measurements (Christopher Kimball-style)
of wattages and heating times with my new Sunpentown induction cooktop,
as compared to an electric hotplate and a butane burner. And my
experiences with a cast iron wok (!), the Lodge 14-inch monster.
(Modern thin woks are sometimes called "carbon steel," sometimes
"iron," when what they are is mostly cold rolled steel, or hammered
steel sheet. Mostly iron, to be sure, but really non-stainless steel. A
cast iron wok is the stuff that Griswold, Wagner, and Lodge cookware is
made of. Altogether different. And unusual for a wok. More on this
later.)

In article >, AlleyGator
> wrote:

> Tim May > wrote:
>
>
> >(I cook simply, but often using a PC. Some potatoes and a few pieces of
> >Aaron's chicken, from TJ's, cook in under 20 minutes, from a cold
> >start, in my Kuhn-Rikon PC. I use an induction cooktop, an inexpensive
> >Sunpentown (? don't blame me for the weird name) "Mr. Induction" that I
> >got for $125. Almost as fast as gas, but much more convenient. The
> >ferromagnetic bottom of a Kuhn-Rikon is perfect. American PCs tend to
> >be aluminum (Presto, Rival, etc.), so they won't work on an induction
> >cooktop.)

>
> Tim, just curious about the current draw for that induction unit.
> Just did a quick search and didn't find a lot of detail. I assume
> it's no worse than an electric skillet or whatever? (BTW, yes we do
> know each other <G>) I've been wanting one for the wok, since it's
> either electric or an outside propane burner here. Sheldon
> recommended a good one but it's several hundred bucks. Ever try yours
> with a wok?


Wow, a question I am very well-prepared to answer. I did a bunch of
tests of current draw (actually, watts, but watts = amps times volts)
on this induction unit when it arrived. I also measured the time to
raise a liter of water from tap water temperature (about 50 F in my
area, this time of year) to the first (7-8 psig) and second (14-16
psig) rings on my 5 liter Kuhn-Rikon.

Here are my recordings, taken with a Brand Electronics watt-meter
(where one plugs the Brand into the wall, then plugs the appliance into
the Brand, zeroes it, and begins):

Sunpentown "Mr. Induction," set on highest setting:
1st ring: 8.75 minutes
2nd ring: 9.5 minutes
measured watts: 1170
measured KWH to 2nd ring: 0.19

Aroma electric coil (standalone hotplate, comparable to medium-sized
coil on electric range), set on highest setting:
1st ring: 16-17 minutes
2nd ring: 17.5-18 minutes
measured watts: 760
measured KWH to 2nd ring: 0.23

Butane burner, Max Burton, set on highest flame:
1st ring: 6.5 minutes
2nd ring: 7 minutes
measured watts: not available (though I could have weighed the butane
cannister before and after and imputed a BTU value, I didn't)
KWH to 2nd ring: not available (ditto)

I have an outdoor wok burner (like a turkey fryer burner, except even
larger) which heats my woks to cherry red in a couple of minutes. (See
the Alton Brown "Good Eats" episode called "Squid Pro Quo" to see a
turkey fryer heat a wok to cherry red in minutes.) But I haven't done
the above tests with it...partly I don't want to melt or damage the
resin handles on my Kuhn-Rikons with such an intense heat source.

With the butane burner above--which I use indoors, as it is fairly safe
to do so, and units like this are used by professional chefs
indoors--there was a fair amount of heat "wasted" by going up the sides
of the pot. This was apparent just by waving my hands around the pot.

As for your question about using a wok, a couple of points:

1. For very fast, modern-style wok cooking, I use a large (17-inch)
rolled-steel wok on the aforementioned outdoor burner.

2. But sometimes I don't feel like stepping outside onto my deck, so I
use woks inside. Not the full "wok he" ("spirit of the wok"), but often
good enough, especially for improvised stir fries.

For this, the induction cooktop is not so great. A round-bottom wok
will still make "inductive contact" (that is, the "no contact" beeper
does NOT go off), but I surmise that the contact is not so great. I
haven't done enough experiments. Instead, I have either used an older
flat-bottom wok, also rolled-steel, or my newer Lodge cast iron wok.

3. The idea of using a cast iron wok is seemingly counter to everything
said about woks for "fast" cooking. However, Googling around, and
thinking about the issue, I realized that thin, steel woks on weak heat
sources (indoor gas burners or electric coils) had the "gloppy" problem
so often seen: the thermal mass of stuff thrown into the wok overwhelms
the thermal mass of the part of the wok doing the cooking, and the heat
source can't keep up. And so the same reason that a cast iron or heavy
pan is so good for searing steaks and whatnot is the same reason it
works better as an indoor wok: once very hot, as hot as the indoor
burner or coil or induction unit can make it, it _STAYS HOT LONGER_
when things are put in the pan.

Which is why people have managed to do stir fires in conventional
skillets (recall stories of immigrants from China making do with
western appliances).

Anyway, Googling around, I discovered that Lodge made a couple of cast
iron woks, sort of like their big cast iron skillets, but wok-shaped
inside and with a flat bottom (accomplished in the obvious way by
molding the wok with a large chunk of iron extending out on the bottom,
flat on the bottom). They seem to have discontinued one of the models,
the one with a long, insulated handle, in favor of a simpler model with
just two small handles on the sides. This makes sense, as I doubt
anyone would try the "wok flip" with such a heavy wok.

I found mine for $43 from Amazon. Listed as a "14-inch cast iron wok."
Free shipping, no sales tax, etc. No lid, by the way, though one could
make do with a lid from a Lodge fry pan (or even an aluminum lid of
some sort), for steaming.

It works quite well, for more than just stir fries. Basically, it's a
large, heavy skillet with a wok shape. The "sweet spot" of highest heat
is in the center, of course, because of heat losses up the sides. This
is how the searing can be done at the bottom, then ingredients pushed
up out of the center, in the usual wok style.

Cleaning is the same as with the rolled steel woks: hot water, a stiff
brush or nylon scrubbing thing, just to get the worst of the gunk out,
then drying either on the cooktop or whatever. (I usually put it back
on the induction cooktop, hit the "HI" button until it's hot again, and
wipe it down with a small amount of vegetable oil, to aid in
preservation and seasoning.)

Lastly, you mentioned the more expensive induction cooktops. Indeed, I
have seen them listed in restaurant supply prices at $500 and up.
Presumably more wattage.

The unit I got is really just like a single induction surface from one
of those GE or similar induction ranges that were sold up until
recently. (I don't know why they were discontinued....I heard something
on the Net recently about Viking planning to introduce a new induction
range.)

The "Sunpentown" model I got only weighs a few pounds. Apparently these
are quite popular in Asia. As for durability, it looks well-made. No
stainless steel, no big fans, just a small, counter-top unit. Sort of
the analog to consumer-grade microwave ovens. (Except of course, unlike
microwave ovens, well-suited for a variety of conventional frying,
wokking, and pressure cooker uses.)

I hope this helps. I would buy another Sunpentown in a second, if I
needed a second cooktop. (I intended to run propane into my kitchen, to
replace my aging and dangerous electric range. Then I discovered how
expensive the "permits" might be, so I have procrastinated on this.
Hence my purchase of a small electric hotplate and then the induction
cooktop. And now I am thinking I may never bother to get the propane
line run at all.)

--Tim May

--
Uo
  #40 (permalink)   Report Post  
AlleyGator
 
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Tim May > wrote:

>>Sheldon recommended a good one but it's several hundred bucks. Ever try yours
>> with a wok?

>
>Wow, a question I am very well-prepared to answer. I did a bunch of
>tests of current draw (actually, watts, but watts = amps times volts)
>on this induction unit when it arrived. I also measured the time to
>raise a liter of water from tap water temperature (about 50 F in my
>area, this time of year) to the first (7-8 psig) and second (14-16
>psig) rings on my 5 liter Kuhn-Rikon.


Wow. Thanks for all the information. I did forget to mention that
the expensive unit Sheldon found was specifically for wok use. Now I
have more to think about.
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