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General Cooking (rec.food.cooking) For general food and cooking discussion. Foods of all kinds, food procurement, cooking methods and techniques, eating, etc.

Soup thickening



 
 
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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 18-10-2008, 11:52 PM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Posts: 4,282
Default Soup thickening

"SteveB" wrote

I went to a restaurant yesterday, and they had great clam chowder. Then my
wife made some corn chowder today, and it was altogether different.


(hehe oh man, are you in trouble if she reads it worded that way!)

The thick almost gravy broth had a flour taste. The restaurant chowder
had the same consistency, but a much more flavorful broth.

What is a good combination for thickening soup broths? Cornstarch?
Wondra?


Cornstarch is one, another is to use arrowroot and for the 'broth' use bone
stock (consomme really).. Rice flour also helps.


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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 19-10-2008, 12:16 AM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Posts: 4,445
Default Soup thickening


"cshenk" wrote in message
...
"SteveB" wrote

I went to a restaurant yesterday, and they had great clam chowder. Then
my wife made some corn chowder today, and it was altogether different.


(hehe oh man, are you in trouble if she reads it worded that way!)

The thick almost gravy broth had a flour taste. The restaurant chowder
had the same consistency, but a much more flavorful broth.

What is a good combination for thickening soup broths? Cornstarch?
Wondra?


Cornstarch is one, another is to use arrowroot and for the 'broth' use
bone stock (consomme really).. Rice flour also helps.



TIME and Simmering

According to Alton Brown (no I don't believe all he says) is takes quite a
bit of time (cooking) to eliminate the flour taste.

It all depends on how the flour was added

Slurry, Roux or sprinkled over sautéing food, or cold mixture of flour and
butter.

Dimitri

  #3 (permalink)  
Old 19-10-2008, 12:19 AM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Posts: 5,847
Default Soup thickening


SteveB wrote:

I went to a restaurant yesterday, and they had great clam chowder. Then my
wife made some corn chowder today, and it was altogether different. The
thick almost gravy broth had a flour taste. The restaurant chowder had the
same consistency, but a much more flavorful broth.

What is a good combination for thickening soup broths? Cornstarch? Wondra?


Flour taste indicates the flour was not cooked enough, and probably
added late as just a flour / water mix. Make a roux seperatly and add
that to thicken the chowder. You still have to simmer it for a few
minutes to get the thickening, but since the roux is already cooked
separately there is less chance of having a flour taste.
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 19-10-2008, 12:44 AM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Posts: 881
Default Soup thickening


"SteveB" toquerville@zionvistas wrote in message
news
I went to a restaurant yesterday, and they had great clam chowder. Then my
wife made some corn chowder today, and it was altogether different. The
thick almost gravy broth had a flour taste. The restaurant chowder had the
same consistency, but a much more flavorful broth.

What is a good combination for thickening soup broths? Cornstarch?
Wondra?

Steve


For corn chowder, two things: 1) cut the potatoes so that the edge
disintegrates into the chowder, and 2) partially puree the soup so that the
corn itself thickens it.


  #5 (permalink)  
Old 19-10-2008, 12:55 AM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Posts: 1,886
Default Soup thickening

On Sat, 18 Oct 2008 16:13:24 -0800, "SteveB" toquerville@zionvistas
wrote:

I went to a restaurant yesterday, and they had great clam chowder. Then my
wife made some corn chowder today, and it was altogether different. The
thick almost gravy broth had a flour taste. The restaurant chowder had the
same consistency, but a much more flavorful broth.

What is a good combination for thickening soup broths? Cornstarch? Wondra?


If your soup or gravy tastes floury, then you need to cook the roux
longer next time. You might also try mashed potato flakes to thicken
a creamy soup.

Tara
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 19-10-2008, 01:13 AM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Posts: 190
Default Soup thickening

I went to a restaurant yesterday, and they had great clam chowder. Then my
wife made some corn chowder today, and it was altogether different. The
thick almost gravy broth had a flour taste. The restaurant chowder had the
same consistency, but a much more flavorful broth.

What is a good combination for thickening soup broths? Cornstarch? Wondra?

Steve

--
"...the man who really counts in the world is the doer, not the mere
critic-the man who actually does the work, even if roughly and imperfectly,
not the man who only talks or writes about how it ought to be done."
Theodore Roosevelt 1891


  #7 (permalink)  
Old 19-10-2008, 01:34 AM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Posts: 11,457
Default Soup thickening


"Tara" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 18 Oct 2008 16:13:24 -0800, "SteveB" toquerville@zionvistas
wrote:

I went to a restaurant yesterday, and they had great clam chowder. Then
my
wife made some corn chowder today, and it was altogether different. The
thick almost gravy broth had a flour taste. The restaurant chowder had
the
same consistency, but a much more flavorful broth.

What is a good combination for thickening soup broths? Cornstarch?
Wondra?


If your soup or gravy tastes floury, then you need to cook the roux
longer next time.


That's what I was thinking. It's certainly true of gravy.


  #8 (permalink)  
Old 19-10-2008, 02:20 AM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Posts: 4,244
Default Soup thickening

SteveB wrote:
I went to a restaurant yesterday, and they had great clam chowder. Then my
wife made some corn chowder today, and it was altogether different. The
thick almost gravy broth had a flour taste. The restaurant chowder had the
same consistency, but a much more flavorful broth.

What is a good combination for thickening soup broths? Cornstarch? Wondra?

Steve

A common method is to use a stick blender for a short time or just
remove a ladle or two and puree in the blender and reintroduce. If you
can taste flour it wasn't cooked. Make a roux separately (heat fat of
your choice, add flour, stir till cooked) and add it to the chowder.
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 19-10-2008, 02:29 AM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Posts: 6,955
Default Soup thickening

SteveB wrote:

What is a good combination for thickening soup broths? Cornstarch? Wondra?


Barley is a great thickener.
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 19-10-2008, 02:36 AM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Posts: 9,315
Default Soup thickening

On Oct 18, 8:13�pm, "SteveB" toquerville@zionvistas wrote:
I went to a restaurant yesterday, and they had great clam chowder. �Then my
wife made some corn chowder today, and it was altogether different. �The
thick almost gravy broth had a flour taste. �The restaurant chowder had the
same consistency, but a much more flavorful broth.

What is a good combination for thickening soup broths? �Cornstarch? �Wondra?


Commercially made soups/stews are usually artificially thickened,
almost always with some type of starch, matters not which. Better
quality soups/stews are thickened naturally by using more ingredients
other than additional starch. For instance, why thicken bean soup
with a starch slurry when the same thickening result can be obtained
and the soup produced would be so much better by simply using more
beans. With most soups and stews adding an artificial thickener is
cheating.
  #11 (permalink)  
Old 19-10-2008, 03:00 AM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Posts: 6,040
Default Soup thickening


"SteveB" toquerville@zionvistas wrote in message
news
I went to a restaurant yesterday, and they had great clam chowder. Then my
wife made some corn chowder today, and it was altogether different. The
thick almost gravy broth had a flour taste. The restaurant chowder had the
same consistency, but a much more flavorful broth.

What is a good combination for thickening soup broths? Cornstarch?
Wondra?

Steve


None of the above.

You can thicken a bit with the starch in the potatoes, or you can make a
roux first and add the liquid to that. Or, you can eat it on the thin side.
Some of the best chowders I've ever had are not thick at all, just loaded
with flavor. There seems to be a fascination that thicker is better no
matter how bland the taste.





Turner's Boston Clam Chowder







INGREDIENTS:

8 pounds of clams, steamed.

Or substitute three 10 oz.
whole canned clams

2 cloves garlic, peeled and
crushed



1 stick butter



1 medium yellow onion,
minced

1 rib celery, minced



1/2 tsp white pepper

1 bay leaf

1/4 tsp whole thyme leaves



1/2 cup flour



5 1/2 cups clam nectar and
milk. (use the nectar from steaming and
make up the quantity needed by adding milk



3 small or 2 med potato,
peeled and cut into 1/4 inch dice



1 pint whipping cream



Wash clams and steam in a 12 qt stockpot. Reserve the broth.



Remove the clams from their shells and chop coarsely. Cover both items and
set aside



In the same pot sauté the garlic in the butter for about 3 minutes. Add the
onion, celery, pepper, bay leaf, and thyme. Sauté until the onions are
clear.



Add the flour to make a roux, stirring constantly. Cook over low heat for 5
minutes (don't brown).



Slowly add the clam nectar, stirring constantly to avoid lumps. Simmer for
0 minutes. The soup will be thick at this point so be careful that it
doesnot burn.



Add the potato and cook until tender.



Add the cream and clams and bring back to a boil.



Correct the seasoning.








  #12 (permalink)  
Old 19-10-2008, 03:18 AM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Posts: 11,896
Default Soup thickening

In article ,
"SteveB" toquerville@zionvistas wrote:

I went to a restaurant yesterday, and they had great clam chowder. Then my
wife made some corn chowder today, and it was altogether different. The
thick almost gravy broth had a flour taste. The restaurant chowder had the
same consistency, but a much more flavorful broth.

What is a good combination for thickening soup broths? Cornstarch? Wondra?

Steve


Floury taste means the roux wasn't cooked long enough. I don't thicken
my soup broths ‹ I like them liquid. Cooking barley in soup will
thicken the soup ‹ more than I like, so I cook the barley separately and
add it to the soup.

--
-Barb, Mother Superior, HOSSSPoJ
http://web.mac.com/barbschaller, Thelma and Louise
On the Road Again - It is Finished
  #13 (permalink)  
Old 19-10-2008, 04:00 AM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Posts: 1,367
Default Soup thickening

SteveB wrote:
I went to a restaurant yesterday, and they had great clam chowder. Then my
wife made some corn chowder today, and it was altogether different. The
thick almost gravy broth had a flour taste. The restaurant chowder had the
same consistency, but a much more flavorful broth.

What is a good combination for thickening soup broths? Cornstarch? Wondra?

Steve


Pardon me if my failure to read every other post in this thread before i
reply causes me to reiterate this basic advice.

Cook the white flour in a pan by itself or with butter to make a roux to
thicken with. Roughly one tbs. of flour to one tbs. of butter for 1 cup
of milk or other liquid to thicken it.

Brining to a boil and then simmering a small dice of 1 small onion in
the cup of milk for about 15 minutes and then straining the milk before
you use it to thicken the soup is very good.

Combining flour with water to act as a thickener can result in a
'floury' taste. Cooking the flour is usually the answer to that
problem. Letting the flour darken a bit to produce what is called a
blond roux, as opposed to a white or brown roux which is just cooked a
correspondingly shorter and longer period of time, is a way to make sure
you have cooked off the 'raw' flour taste.

Cornstarch does not have the same flavor issue and a lot of people
prefer it to flour, but it gives me indigestion when used as a
thickener. But it is the easiest as it can be mixed with a bit of water
and added to thicken a soup or sauce.
--
Joseph Littleshoes
  #14 (permalink)  
Old 19-10-2008, 04:41 AM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Posts: 4,220
Default Soup thickening

SteveB wrote:
I went to a restaurant yesterday, and they had great clam chowder. Then my
wife made some corn chowder today, and it was altogether different. The
thick almost gravy broth had a flour taste. The restaurant chowder had the
same consistency, but a much more flavorful broth.

What is a good combination for thickening soup broths? Cornstarch? Wondra?

Steve

Cream? Cream fraiche?
  #15 (permalink)  
Old 19-10-2008, 05:30 AM posted to rec.food.cooking
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Posts: 24,846
Default Soup thickening

In article ,
George wrote:

SteveB wrote:
I went to a restaurant yesterday, and they had great clam chowder. Then my
wife made some corn chowder today, and it was altogether different. The
thick almost gravy broth had a flour taste. The restaurant chowder had the
same consistency, but a much more flavorful broth.

What is a good combination for thickening soup broths? Cornstarch? Wondra?

Steve

A common method is to use a stick blender for a short time or just
remove a ladle or two and puree in the blender and reintroduce. If you
can taste flour it wasn't cooked. Make a roux separately (heat fat of
your choice, add flour, stir till cooked) and add it to the chowder.


I personally prefer Arrowroot, or Cornstarch if I've none on hand.
Arrowroot gives a lovely finish.
--
Peace! Om

"He who has the gold makes the rules"
--Om

"He who has the guns can get the gold."
-- Steve Rothstein
 




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