Well did a cook this past weekend... started on Friday (took the day
off to prepare for Saturdays gathering).

A little preface to let you know where I am at, still not sure where
I'm going.

I was doing a little experimenting, due to the fact of reading the FAQ
and following several messages. In the past I had thought "Smoking"
was with alot of smoke.. needless to say, the smoker was covered in
that infamous gooo (creosote).
On that note though, I have always received compliments about my
brisket, even though I myself could taste the bitterness (only on the
crust,... deep inside was great sweetness).
I cleaned the smoker as others have suggested... Re seasoned with nice
light smoke, but continuous.

Char Grill Silver Smoker with side firebox:

ok, day of the cooking Saturday. I used lump coal (my first time),
and Hickory wood blocks / chunks. Lets just say.. they burn much
differently than standard charcoal.
2 Briskets, and a Pork Rump Picnic. Put my rub on em the night before.
Grand total I cooked them about 9 hrs with average dome temp of
320-350, pulled them off wrapped them in foil and put in cooler.
After about 4 hrs in cooler, I let them cool and put in fridge.
Now, understand the reason I cooked the brisket and pork the day
before is I planned to do one more rum and 2 chickens the next day.
(this was my first time to do the pork rump and chickens so was little
nervous).

Next day, got up started up rubbed pork and put on grill. A little
later I put the birds on their wire cage, rubbed chicken. I used the
lower grates on the side far away from firebox for chicken (dome too
low to put em on top grates, the lower grates are actually meant to
hold brickets).

at some point I pulled the briskets and first pork out, let them warm
a little in the room, and put in oven on warm to slowly heat them back
up.

When time came to cut and serve... the pork came out awesome... just
fell apart, and OMG the taste was over the top (had never had this
before, so my "taste" is from the uninformed). The chicken came out
moist, I just removed the skin, had a nice look but I'm not all about
the skin in the first place.
Now, the brisket is what bothered me. It came out delicious, with a
nice smoke ring, but I couldn't cut the bugger to save my life. It
fell apart like the pork... in nice long strings like a string cheese
if you will. (not the texture, but the way it pulls apart). I was
hoping for a more sliceable brisket (which I have gotten numerous
times in the past). So, in the end, everyone loved it, and everyone
got to take some home for later eating, and still left me with nuff
leftovers for the weekend.

So, where did the brisket go wrong? ahh.. no, where did I go wrong on
the brisket?

appreciate your insight and time.

Lew

Lewzephyr wrote in alt.food.barbecue

Now, the brisket is what bothered me. It came out delicious, with a
nice smoke ring, but I couldn't cut the bugger to save my life. It
fell apart like the pork... in nice long strings like a string cheese
if you will. (not the texture, but the way it pulls apart). I was
hoping for a more sliceable brisket (which I have gotten numerous
times in the past). Lew

Sounds to me like you made pulled brisket.
What's the problem?


--
BigDog
To E-mail me, you know what to do.

On 1-Jun-2004, Lewzephyr wrote:

Well did a cook this past weekend... started on Friday (took the day
off to prepare for Saturdays gathering).

A little preface to let you know where I am at, still not sure where
I'm going.

I was doing a little experimenting, due to the fact of reading the FAQ
and following several messages. In the past I had thought "Smoking"
was with alot of smoke.. needless to say, the smoker was covered in
that infamous gooo (creosote).

Been there and did that once.

On that note though, I have always received compliments about my
brisket, even though I myself could taste the bitterness (only on the
crust,... deep inside was great sweetness).
I cleaned the smoker as others have suggested... Re seasoned with nice
light smoke, but continuous.

I burned mine out with a nice hot fire in the cook chamber.


Char Grill Silver Smoker with side firebox:

NB Silver, same box different name.

ok, day of the cooking Saturday. I used lump coal (my first time),
and Hickory wood blocks / chunks. Lets just say.. they burn much
differently than standard charcoal.

Amen

2 Briskets, and a Pork Rump Picnic. Put my rub on em the night before.

You did that right.

Grand total I cooked them about 9 hrs with average dome temp of
320-350, pulled them off wrapped them in foil and put in cooler.
After about 4 hrs in cooler, I let them cool and put in fridge.
Now, understand the reason I cooked the brisket and pork the day
before is I planned to do one more rum and 2 chickens the next day.
(this was my first time to do the pork rump and chickens so was little
nervous).

It's difficult for a novice to cook briskets and butts at the same time.
They are such different animals. Big Jim would laugh and tell you how
easy it is. But he don't need a thermometer to tell him when a particular
chunk is done.


Next day, got up started up rubbed pork and put on grill. A little
later I put the birds on their wire cage, rubbed chicken. I used the
lower grates on the side far away from firebox for chicken (dome too
low to put em on top grates, the lower grates are actually meant to
hold brickets).

Works for me. Why waste all that space if you have the fire grates to
do the job with? (Only fire grates fit in the bottom of the Char Broil
Silver)


at some point I pulled the briskets and first pork out, let them warm
a little in the room, and put in oven on warm to slowly heat them back
up.

When time came to cut and serve... the pork came out awesome... just
fell apart, and OMG the taste was over the top (had never had this
before, so my "taste" is from the uninformed). The chicken came out
moist, I just removed the skin, had a nice look but I'm not all about
the skin in the first place.
Now, the brisket is what bothered me. It came out delicious, with a
nice smoke ring, but I couldn't cut the bugger to save my life. It
fell apart like the pork... in nice long strings like a string cheese
if you will. (not the texture, but the way it pulls apart). I was
hoping for a more sliceable brisket (which I have gotten numerous
times in the past). So, in the end, everyone loved it, and everyone
got to take some home for later eating, and still left me with nuff
leftovers for the weekend.

So, where did the brisket go wrong? ahh.. no, where did I go wrong on
the brisket?

Sorry about the texture of your brisket Lew. You over cooked it. When you
want to slice it you have to take it off below 170°F. Nine hours at 320° to

350°, you cooked it well into or beyond the pulling point. I like it that
way.
It's difficult to get brisket tender and still be able to slice it nicely.
The few
here that have done a lot of briskets and have gained control of the process
may try to tell you how to accomplish your particular goal, but truth is
they
all learned the hard way as well.


appreciate your insight and time.

Lew

Sounds like you're fairly new to cooking in an offset. You've surely done
better then most disregarding the sidetrack into creosote. (I did that too).
I won't do that again, and I'll bet you won't either. I've been meaning to
cook something on the lower grill, but just haven't gotten around to it
yet. I guess, I better get too it, regardless of the fact that I don't need
the space. If you consider both upper and lower racks, that cooker has
a hell of a lot of space.

--
M&M ("When You're Over The Hill You Pick Up Speed")

On Tue, 01 Jun 2004 15:46:48 GMT, Lewzephyr
wrote:

Well did a cook this past weekend... started on Friday (took the day
off to prepare for Saturdays gathering).

A little preface to let you know where I am at, still not sure where
I'm going.

I was doing a little experimenting, due to the fact of reading the FAQ
and following several messages. In the past I had thought "Smoking"
was with alot of smoke.. needless to say, the smoker was covered in
that infamous gooo (creosote).
On that note though, I have always received compliments about my
brisket, even though I myself could taste the bitterness (only on the
crust,... deep inside was great sweetness).
I cleaned the smoker as others have suggested... Re seasoned with nice
light smoke, but continuous.

Char Grill Silver Smoker with side firebox:

ok, day of the cooking Saturday. I used lump coal (my first time),
and Hickory wood blocks / chunks. Lets just say.. they burn much
differently than standard charcoal.
2 Briskets, and a Pork Rump Picnic. Put my rub on em the night before.
Grand total I cooked them about 9 hrs with average dome temp of
320-350, pulled them off wrapped them in foil and put in cooler.
After about 4 hrs in cooler, I let them cool and put in fridge.
Now, understand the reason I cooked the brisket and pork the day
before is I planned to do one more rum and 2 chickens the next day.
(this was my first time to do the pork rump and chickens so was little
nervous).

Next day, got up started up rubbed pork and put on grill. A little
later I put the birds on their wire cage, rubbed chicken. I used the
lower grates on the side far away from firebox for chicken (dome too
low to put em on top grates, the lower grates are actually meant to
hold brickets).

at some point I pulled the briskets and first pork out, let them warm
a little in the room, and put in oven on warm to slowly heat them back
up.

When time came to cut and serve... the pork came out awesome... just
fell apart, and OMG the taste was over the top (had never had this
before, so my "taste" is from the uninformed). The chicken came out
moist, I just removed the skin, had a nice look but I'm not all about
the skin in the first place.
Now, the brisket is what bothered me. It came out delicious, with a
nice smoke ring, but I couldn't cut the bugger to save my life. It
fell apart like the pork... in nice long strings like a string cheese
if you will. (not the texture, but the way it pulls apart). I was
hoping for a more sliceable brisket (which I have gotten numerous
times in the past). So, in the end, everyone loved it, and everyone
got to take some home for later eating, and still left me with nuff
leftovers for the weekend.

So, where did the brisket go wrong? ahh.. no, where did I go wrong on
the brisket?

appreciate your insight and time.

Lew


My 2¢...

I also have a Silver Smoker (the older NB "branded"), and it does have
a "slight" learning curve...

Looks like you did OK, for your 1st time w/lump...takes practice,
you'll get better, and the "practice" results taste GREAT!!!

I've done lots of briskets, using everything from a kettle grill to an
ECB, to the NBSS (now). By no means do I think I'm a "pro", I think I
still have a lot to learn, but I have a process down that gets me
fairly consistent results. You don't know how much I hate hearing "
it was better last time", or "it tastes a little different this time"
I know I could tell them to take a flying leap, but it IS family...LOL

Anyway, I digress...

Lew here's somethings that I do, that you may want to look at:

Bitterness: Been there, done that...I've had the same problem in the
past, it's a little disconcerting when YOU taste it with the first
bite and you're watching 20 or so of your fav friends & family loading
up their plates... The probable cause(s): Too much smoke, Bad smoke,
Exhaust stack not fully open, and **my opinion** the rub (I make my
own, so easy to adjust). To avoid this, there's the standard answers
of keeping the smokestack fully open at all times; using only good,
seasoned (not green) wood. If you did this, then I would look at
cutting back on the amount of smoking wood you use. Instead of 4
chunks at a time, try 2. Also, I felt my rub was a culprit, so I
backed off on some of the ingredients that I thought could go bitter:
black pepper, cumin, chile powder (not a lot, but instead of 2 TBL, I
tried 1 or 1½ TBL) Things like that could make a difference. Now, I
have a rub that works for me, and the big change was that I WROTE the
measurments down, instead of mixing a bunch of crap together till it
"looked" OK. Anyway, enough on that...

The next thing I do is smoke at a lower temp, like 225° - 250°. Of
course it takes longer, but I'm happy with the results. Please do not
think that I'm trying to say your temp is wrong! I also do not pull
my brisket off the pit until 190° plus (temp varies because I'll do a
"tenderness" check).

The last thing on your post about the sliceability...I like my brisket
tender, almost falling apart. And I like relatively thin slices. I
have never been able slice a warm brisket and get it the way I like
it. The only way I have been successful is to smoke, chill 24 or more
hours, then slice and reheat. I do this for all meats that are served
sliced (Brisket, pork loin, ham) This will be blasphemy to some, but
it works for me. This also solves my biggest past problem, when
you're smoking a brisket and you tell folks dinner at 2, they show up
at noon saying"is it done yet?" And to make matters worse, it was a
windy day, or the planets aligned wrong, and the beef won't be ready
till 4 or 5...never again. The only thing I cook the day of the party
is poultry and pork butt (not to mention grilling stuff which takes no
time) It's a lot less stressful when your guests arrive early and
your meat is already cooked and sliced (and slowly reheating) .

Couple of more points to ponder: Do not use mesquite until you are at
the "expert" stage. If the meat tastes good, and your guests were
happy...don't let anyone tell you that you did something wrong.

Happy Q'n,
Tex

On Tue, 01 Jun 2004 20:51:29 GMT, I needed a babel fish to understand
BigDog :

Lewzephyr wrote in alt.food.barbecue

Now, the brisket is what bothered me. It came out delicious, with a
nice smoke ring, but I couldn't cut the bugger to save my life. It
fell apart like the pork... in nice long strings like a string cheese
if you will. (not the texture, but the way it pulls apart). I was
hoping for a more sliceable brisket (which I have gotten numerous
times in the past). Lew

Sounds to me like you made pulled brisket.
What's the problem?

No real "problem" in the end, but was curious on how to make it
sliceable... defiantly still good to munch on none the less..

On Tue, 1 Jun 2004 23:18:59 GMT, I needed a babel fish to understand
"M&M" :


On 1-Jun-2004, Lewzephyr wrote:

Grand total I cooked them about 9 hrs with average dome temp of
320-350, pulled them off wrapped them in foil and put in cooler.
After about 4 hrs in cooler, I let them cool and put in fridge.
Now, understand the reason I cooked the brisket and pork the day
before is I planned to do one more rum and 2 chickens the next day.
(this was my first time to do the pork rump and chickens so was little
nervous).

It's difficult for a novice to cook briskets and butts at the same time.
They are such different animals. Big Jim would laugh and tell you how
easy it is. But he don't need a thermometer to tell him when a particular
chunk is done.

Looking into a thermometer for the grill level now... haven't found
one of those polders (not sure if that's correct name) yet, probably
due to the fact I shop at walmart, and haven't really put the effort
into looking at all.... LoL.


Next day, got up started up rubbed pork and put on grill. A little
later I put the birds on their wire cage, rubbed chicken. I used the
lower grates on the side far away from firebox for chicken (dome too
low to put em on top grates, the lower grates are actually meant to
hold brickets).

Works for me. Why waste all that space if you have the fire grates to
do the job with? (Only fire grates fit in the bottom of the Char Broil
Silver)

I got some really good feedback on the chicken... saw a few of the
people yesterday and they were like, I have never had chicken so good
and juicy...
Needless to say made me feel good that they were talking about it a
week later.


So, where did the brisket go wrong? ahh.. no, where did I go wrong on
the brisket?

Sorry about the texture of your brisket Lew. You over cooked it. When you
want to slice it you have to take it off below 170°F. Nine hours at 320° to
350°, you cooked it well into or beyond the pulling point. I like it that
way.
It's difficult to get brisket tender and still be able to slice it nicely.
The few here that have done a lot of briskets and have gained control of the process
may try to tell you how to accomplish your particular goal, but truth is
they all learned the hard way as well.

Well, once I actually go looking for that thermometer, Ill be a little
more accurate on temp. As I have read that dome temp can be off a
bit.


appreciate your insight and time.

Lew

Sounds like you're fairly new to cooking in an offset. You've surely done
better then most disregarding the sidetrack into creosote. (I did that too).
I won't do that again, and I'll bet you won't either. I've been meaning to
cook something on the lower grill, but just haven't gotten around to it
yet. I guess, I better get too it, regardless of the fact that I don't need
the space. If you consider both upper and lower racks, that cooker has
a hell of a lot of space.

Thank you for your input.. much appreciate the feedback.

On Wed, 02 Jun 2004 14:39:07 GMT, I needed a babel fish to understand
Tech-Sun :


appreciate your insight and time.

Lew


My 2¢...

I also have a Silver Smoker (the older NB "branded"), and it does have
a "slight" learning curve...

Looks like you did OK, for your 1st time w/lump...takes practice,
you'll get better, and the "practice" results taste GREAT!!!

Yes, I was impressed with the taste difference between my last smoke
and this one... but of course my previous one was where I had the
thought of more smoke the better.

I've done lots of briskets, using everything from a kettle grill to an
ECB, to the NBSS (now). By no means do I think I'm a "pro", I think I
still have a lot to learn, but I have a process down that gets me
fairly consistent results. You don't know how much I hate hearing "
it was better last time", or "it tastes a little different this time"
I know I could tell them to take a flying leap, but it IS family...LOL

Anyway, I digress...

No, no, I like to eat my BBQ, but honestly I like to cook for
others... and get feedback.. So I know what you mean when they say
"It was better last time". Good thing is... everyone said I out did
my self this last time... (made me giddy like a little school girl).

Lew here's somethings that I do, that you may want to look at:

snip some good info

Also, I felt my rub was a culprit, so I
backed off on some of the ingredients that I thought could go bitter:
black pepper, cumin, chile powder (not a lot, but instead of 2 TBL, I
tried 1 or 1½ TBL) Things like that could make a difference. Now, I
have a rub that works for me, and the big change was that I WROTE the
measurments down, instead of mixing a bunch of crap together till it
"looked" OK. Anyway, enough on that...

Great ideas.... I am really in the need of starting a BBQ log. I am
really bad about, "Just throwing a rub together".
I intend to be more specific on my next rub, and make extra to store
for the next time.


The next thing I do is smoke at a lower temp, like 225° - 250°. Of
course it takes longer, but I'm happy with the results. Please do not
think that I'm trying to say your temp is wrong! I also do not pull
my brisket off the pit until 190° plus (temp varies because I'll do a
"tenderness" check).

I'm all good with slow times... I belive I was running hotter than my
previous smokes, because I was burning a different coal (lump instead
of briquets), and I was burning cleaner (less smoke) so the fire
stayed hotter. I was trying to not watch the temp too much so I dint
get into the temp fight that several have mentioned.

The last thing on your post about the sliceability...I like my brisket
tender, almost falling apart. And I like relatively thin slices. I
have never been able slice a warm brisket and get it the way I like
it. The only way I have been successful is to smoke, chill 24 or more
hours, then slice and reheat.

I think I will be doing this on my next attempt... 4th July weekend.

I do this for all meats that are served
sliced (Brisket, pork loin, ham) This will be blasphemy to some, but
it works for me. This also solves my biggest past problem, when
you're smoking a brisket and you tell folks dinner at 2, they show up
at noon saying"is it done yet?"

Have had this happen in the past, that's why I did the brisket the day
before this time. I hate to disappoint my guests, and make em wait.
1 hr is ok, but if it goes much longer, people just shovel the food in
and don't really taste it..

Couple of more points to ponder: Do not use mesquite until you are at
the "expert" stage. If the meat tastes good, and your guests were
happy...don't let anyone tell you that you did something wrong.

I only like mesquite with my grilling really... fajitas, steak,
etc... Don't really care for the flavor from long smoking.


Happy Q'n,
Tex

Thanks for all the feedback..