Craig Winchell wrote:
Gee, I know Jeff, though he's not a personal friend, just an acquaintance
because he used to buy my wine. I'll ask him. I had no idea he was doing
BBQ brisket, since it's not on his menu. Hot links aren't either. Veal
brats are, though. So he's into BBQ too? I see the makings of a long
friendship developing here, as well as discounted sausages (grin).

Craig Winchell


snip

Craig, as others have alluded to wanting to know, could you tell us a
little more about the smoker used, timing, temperatures for cooking and
"doneness", wood, and seasoning? Foil?
Above all, your wine selection, Kosher me assumes.

That would be a great place to start.
Thanks.
Pierre

"Pierre" wrote in message
ups.com...

Craig Winchell wrote:
Gee, I know Jeff, though he's not a personal friend, just an acquaintance
because he used to buy my wine. I'll ask him. I had no idea he was
doing
BBQ brisket, since it's not on his menu. Hot links aren't either. Veal
brats are, though. So he's into BBQ too? I see the makings of a long
friendship developing here, as well as discounted sausages (grin).

Craig Winchell


snip

Craig, as others have alluded to wanting to know, could you tell us a
little more about the smoker used, timing, temperatures for cooking and
"doneness", wood, and seasoning? Foil?
Above all, your wine selection, Kosher me assumes.

OK, I bought myself a Char-Griller brand grill and optional side firebox
from Lowes, a cover and an Oregon Scientific wireless BBQ thermometer- cost
around $240 total including sales tax, has around 580 sq. inches of cooking
surface, and another approx 200 inches on a warming rack, cast iron grates
(which I seasoned). I used a mixture of charcoal and soaked mesquite hunks.
I knew the meat would be overcooked rather than rare, but I decided to err
on the overcooked side, because I didn't trust the thermometer (discovered,
however, that it was correct) and didn't want to cut into it and then
discover it to be too rare. The meat? Shoulder roast, notorious for its
lack of fat, but it didn't need 12 hours of smoking the way brisket does
(didn't have the time). The rub was mixed "kosher" salt, cayenne pepper,
paprika, dry mustard, cumin, chili powder, 5-spice powder, a bit of ginger
and a touch of brown sugar. I followed a suggestion and slathered a thin
layer of yellow mustard over the surface before the rub, left in fridge
overnight, then brought to ambient temp. No mop, since I don't know what to
do as far as mops are concerned. Result? Beautiful red exterior, smelled
terrific, not-red interior (shoulder roast should be rare inside, but that
was my fault). Smoky taste on exterior, a bit tough (due to being
medium-well to well rather than rare to medium rare). We made a BBQ sauce
to go with it, but we substituted ingredients for those we could not find
locally, and it ended up being too sweet. Served in slices with BBQ sauce.
Oh, smoke ring extended about 3/8 inch into the meat, so it was a pink ring
around gray meat.

Wine- well, I only drink my own. I have about 1500 cases left of 2 types-
GAN EDEN 1997 Limited Reserve Cabernet Sauvignon, and GAN EDEN 2000 Syrah.
Both very good wines. I have a knack with dry reds, it's unfortunate I'm
out of the business now. Once upon a time, I had the top rated Cab in the
country. It was good, but not my best, in my opinion. Yes, GAN EDEN wines
were always kosher, but that wasn't the market I was trying to access, that
was just a fact of life for any wine I wanted to be able to drink myself, so
I made them kosher. Quality-wise, they competed well against nonkosher
wines in their same price-classes. I also had some good late-harvest wines,
and an occasional really good dry white, though most of the dry whites I put
out in my later years were just average, since I lost interest in drinking
whites in the early '90s. All in all, it was a good 20 year run for the
winery, and I'm pleased to have done it. Obviously, I'm selling the wines I
have left, but I won't bore the folks here with particulars- they can
contact me directly.

In the meantime, I need to smoke a couple of chickens and a turkey breast
for my Sabbath dinner tonight. I'll go out and buy the birds pretty early.
No time to sit them with rub overnight. Any decent recipes? I know it's
late notice, but what the hell!

Craig Winchell



That would be a great place to start.
Thanks.
Pierre

Salt & pepper, maybe some garlic slivers under the skin, and most
importantly imo, *apple wood* for smoking.

I'm not familiar with your cooker, but you might want to try *not*
soaking the wood chunks. If the airflow is somewhat restricted in the
firebox, the wood chunks probably won't burn. Alternatively, you could
wrap the dry chunks in foil to encourage them to smolder rather than
flame up. I've found that soaked wood can result in a harsher smoke
flavor on the meat than when it just smolders dry.

Bob
=====================
In article . net,
says...
In the meantime, I need to smoke a couple of chickens and a turkey breast
for my Sabbath dinner tonight. I'll go out and buy the birds pretty early.
No time to sit them with rub overnight. Any decent recipes? I know it's
late notice, but what the hell!

On Fri, 08 Dec 2006 15:37:59 GMT, "Craig Winchell"
wrote:

In the meantime, I need to smoke a couple of chickens and a turkey breast
for my Sabbath dinner tonight. I'll go out and buy the birds pretty early.
No time to sit them with rub overnight. Any decent recipes?

It's nice to be able to let the rubbed meat sit overnight, but not
essential. When I'm in a hurry to cook poultry, I use McCormick's
Chicken Seasoning. There's two or three varieties, all of them good.
Should be available at your local supermarket.

On Thu, 07 Dec 2006 21:15:46 -0800, Denny Wheeler
wrote:

On Thu, 07 Dec 2006 23:08:23 -0500, Steve Calvin
wrote:

I do beef ribs the same way.

Question: do beef ribs have that membrane?

Yes, but it doesn't come off as easily as it does with spares. There's
often quite a bit of fat below it, too, so if you want to trim the
ribs it's probably worth fighting with.

More questions re beef ribs--I've never cooked 'em, nor ever eaten
'em. Have I missed a treat?

Yes. They're eggspecially good with Asian sauces/mops, something
sweet/tart.

On Fri, 08 Dec 2006 15:37:59 GMT, "Craig Winchell"
wrote:

(which I seasoned). I used a mixture of charcoal and soaked mesquite hunks.
I knew the meat would be overcooked rather than rare, but I decided to err

Why did you say "rare"?

daniel mcgrath
--
Daniel Gerard McGrath, a/k/a "Govende":
for e-mail replace "invalid" with "com"

Developmentally disabled;
has Autism (Pervasive Developmental Disorder),
Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder,
& periodic bouts of depression.
[This signature is under construction.]

OK, I bought myself a Char-Griller brand grill and optional side firebox
from Lowes, a cover and an Oregon Scientific wireless BBQ thermometer- cost
around $240 total including sales tax, has around 580 sq. inches of cooking
surface, and another approx 200 inches on a warming rack, cast iron grates
(which I seasoned). I used a mixture of charcoal and soaked mesquite hunks.
I knew the meat would be overcooked rather than rare, but I decided to err
on the overcooked side, because I didn't trust the thermometer (discovered,
however, that it was correct) and didn't want to cut into it and then
discover it to be too rare. The meat? Shoulder roast, notorious for its
lack of fat, but it didn't need 12 hours of smoking the way brisket does
(didn't have the time).

snip
Craig, looks like you're off and running with a full plume of smoke.
If you're looking for the cooking method (low and slow) to be the
tenderizing agent, you should probably forget about the terms rare/
medium rare etc. The slow methods referred to in this group as bbq
generally refer to bringing the meat up to a temperature at which the
collagens or stringy fibers which hold the meat together begin to break
down. yes, essentially cook the shit out of it, but not so much as to
have it dissintegrate completely or turn into a hockey puck. Hence the
art of this hobby. Your first runs should also be made with a fattier
cut, for better results, as was previously posted.
Try a small chuck roll, available from your butcher. Take it to 195°.

Thats my 2 sheckels. Good luck with the chickens.
Pierre

Pierre wrote:
Craig, looks like you're off and running with a full plume of smoke.
If you're looking for the cooking method (low and slow) to be the
tenderizing agent, you should probably forget about the terms rare/
medium rare etc. The slow methods referred to in this group as bbq
generally refer to bringing the meat up to a temperature at which the
collagens or stringy fibers which hold the meat together begin to break
down. yes, essentially cook the shit out of it, but not so much as to
have it dissintegrate completely or turn into a hockey puck. Hence the
art of this hobby. Your first runs should also be made with a fattier
cut, for better results, as was previously posted.
Try a small chuck roll, available from your butcher. Take it to 195°.

Thats my 2 sheckels. Good luck with the chickens.
Pierre


Exactly. Low and slow for tough cuts. If I'm doing a roast
that I want rare to medium rare, I quick sear it in a cast
iron pan and then over the coals at around 350dF until the
desired internal temperature.


--
Steve

On Fri, 08 Dec 2006 11:48:47 -0500, Daniel al-Autistiqui
wrote:

On Fri, 08 Dec 2006 15:37:59 GMT, "Craig Winchell"
wrote:

(which I seasoned). I used a mixture of charcoal and soaked mesquite hunks.
I knew the meat would be overcooked rather than rare, but I decided to err

Why did you say "rare"?

Daniel,

Craig said "rare" because that is the relevant standard term in
cookery.

--
Peter Duncanson, UK
(in alt.usage.english)

Thanks, Pierre. I'll try that. Although, chuck will take damned near as
long as brisket, I would imagine. In any case, I'll tell you how the
chickens turn out.

Craig

snip
Craig, looks like you're off and running with a full plume of smoke.
If you're looking for the cooking method (low and slow) to be the
tenderizing agent, you should probably forget about the terms rare/
medium rare etc. The slow methods referred to in this group as bbq
generally refer to bringing the meat up to a temperature at which the
collagens or stringy fibers which hold the meat together begin to break
down. yes, essentially cook the shit out of it, but not so much as to
have it dissintegrate completely or turn into a hockey puck. Hence the
art of this hobby. Your first runs should also be made with a fattier
cut, for better results, as was previously posted.
Try a small chuck roll, available from your butcher. Take it to 195°.

Thats my 2 sheckels. Good luck with the chickens.
Pierre

On 8-Dec-2006, "Pierre" wrote:

OK, I bought myself a Char-Griller brand grill and optional side firebox
from Lowes, a cover and an Oregon Scientific wireless BBQ thermometer-
cost
around $240 total including sales tax, has around 580 sq. inches of
cooking
surface, and another approx 200 inches on a warming rack, cast iron
grates
(which I seasoned). I used a mixture of charcoal and soaked mesquite
hunks.
I knew the meat would be overcooked rather than rare, but I decided to
err
on the overcooked side, because I didn't trust the thermometer
(discovered,
however, that it was correct) and didn't want to cut into it and then
discover it to be too rare. The meat? Shoulder roast, notorious for
its
lack of fat, but it didn't need 12 hours of smoking the way brisket does
(didn't have the time).

snip
Craig, looks like you're off and running with a full plume of smoke.
If you're looking for the cooking method (low and slow) to be the
tenderizing agent, you should probably forget about the terms rare/
medium rare etc. The slow methods referred to in this group as bbq
generally refer to bringing the meat up to a temperature at which the
collagens or stringy fibers which hold the meat together begin to break
down. yes, essentially cook the shit out of it, but not so much as to
have it dissintegrate completely or turn into a hockey puck. Hence the
art of this hobby. Your first runs should also be made with a fattier
cut, for better results, as was previously posted.
Try a small chuck roll, available from your butcher. Take it to 195°.

Thats my 2 sheckels. Good luck with the chickens.
Pierre

Pierre, I think Craig was trying to produce a lean medium rare roast.
His only complaint was that he overshot his mark by little. Just because
he used a smoker, doesn't demand that he make BBQ.

--
Brick(Youth is wasted on young people)

Daniel al-Autistiqui wrote:

On Fri, 08 Dec 2006 15:37:59 GMT, "Craig Winchell"
wrote:

(which I seasoned). I used a mixture of charcoal and soaked
mesquite hunks. I knew the meat would be overcooked rather than
rare, but I decided to err

Why did you say "rare"?

What would you have said? Oh wait, you'll never answer the question.




Brian

--
If televison's a babysitter, the Internet is a drunk librarian who
won't shut up.
-- Dorothy Gambrell (http://catandgirl.com)

"Daniel al-Autistiqui" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 08 Dec 2006 15:37:59 GMT, "Craig Winchell"
wrote:

(which I seasoned). I used a mixture of charcoal and soaked mesquite
hunks.
I knew the meat would be overcooked rather than rare, but I decided to err

Why did you say "rare"?

I said rare because if you have shoulder roast, a very lean cut of meat from
the chuck, but able to be dry-roasted successfully, you can either generally
pot-roast it until tender or roast it rare. I wanted something that didn't
require long smoking, because I didn't have the time. So I thought that if
I "roast" the meat at low heat in the smoker, I'll end up rare and smoked.
But then I began getting squeemish, didn't trust the thermometer when it
said the meat was ready, decided to cook it longer (because if you cut it in
half to check, you lose all of those good juices from a rare piece of meat).
In essence, I wasn't really barbecuing, but I was smoking (it stayed in for
4 hours), and it was good. I really wanted to do a brisket, but I didn't
have time. And all the briskets I can get are trimmed of fat ahead of time.
I have a frozen whole one (1st and 2nd cuts and all the layers of fat) but
that should take 12-20 hours to smoke.

Craig Winchell


daniel mcgrath
--
Daniel Gerard McGrath, a/k/a "Govende":
for e-mail replace "invalid" with "com"

Developmentally disabled;
has Autism (Pervasive Developmental Disorder),
Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder,
& periodic bouts of depression.
[This signature is under construction.]

wrote in message
.. .

On 8-Dec-2006, "Pierre" wrote:

OK, I bought myself a Char-Griller brand grill and optional side
firebox
from Lowes, a cover and an Oregon Scientific wireless BBQ thermometer-
cost
around $240 total including sales tax, has around 580 sq. inches of
cooking
surface, and another approx 200 inches on a warming rack, cast iron
grates
(which I seasoned). I used a mixture of charcoal and soaked mesquite
hunks.
I knew the meat would be overcooked rather than rare, but I decided to
err
on the overcooked side, because I didn't trust the thermometer
(discovered,
however, that it was correct) and didn't want to cut into it and then
discover it to be too rare. The meat? Shoulder roast, notorious for
its
lack of fat, but it didn't need 12 hours of smoking the way brisket
does
(didn't have the time).

snip
Craig, looks like you're off and running with a full plume of smoke.
If you're looking for the cooking method (low and slow) to be the
tenderizing agent, you should probably forget about the terms rare/
medium rare etc. The slow methods referred to in this group as bbq
generally refer to bringing the meat up to a temperature at which the
collagens or stringy fibers which hold the meat together begin to break
down. yes, essentially cook the shit out of it, but not so much as to
have it dissintegrate completely or turn into a hockey puck. Hence the
art of this hobby. Your first runs should also be made with a fattier
cut, for better results, as was previously posted.
Try a small chuck roll, available from your butcher. Take it to 195°.

Thats my 2 sheckels. Good luck with the chickens.
Pierre

Pierre, I think Craig was trying to produce a lean medium rare roast.
His only complaint was that he overshot his mark by little. Just because
he used a smoker, doesn't demand that he make BBQ.

Yes, but also smoked for 4 hours. Thought it would be interesting as a
first attempt to use the smoker. Perhaps I should have done chicken.
That's what I'm doing now- I have 3 in there.

Craig

--
Brick(Youth is wasted on young people)

"Craig Winchell" wrote:
Thanks, Pierre. I'll try that. Although, chuck will take damned near as
long as brisket, I would imagine. In any case, I'll tell you how the
chickens turn out.

Craig

snip
Craig, looks like you're off and running with a full plume of smoke.
If you're looking for the cooking method (low and slow) to be the
tenderizing agent, you should probably forget about the terms rare/
medium rare etc. The slow methods referred to in this group as bbq
generally refer to bringing the meat up to a temperature at which the
collagens or stringy fibers which hold the meat together begin to break
down. yes, essentially cook the shit out of it, but not so much as to
have it dissintegrate completely or turn into a hockey puck. Hence the
art of this hobby. Your first runs should also be made with a fattier
cut, for better results, as was previously posted.
Try a small chuck roll, available from your butcher. Take it to 195°.

Thats my 2 sheckels. Good luck with the chickens.

Post some pics of dinner and wine on alt.binaries.food. Can you bottom
post?

--
Nick. Support severely wounded and disabled Veterans and their families!

Thank a Veteran and Support Our Troops. You are not forgotten. Thanks ! ! !
~Semper Fi~