Mark Preston wrote:

"The Ruzicka Family" wrote snip

but I was quite sure if it was decided that it could be preserved
well with a BWB.

Paul,

I start with the caveat that nobody at this ng is qualified either as
a food scientist or completely by experience with foodstuffs to make
your recipes and products safe.

Oh, jaysus, it's Mark Preston again offering still more dubious
"information." First, he always says nobody is qualified to give info,
and then he does exactly that.

Let's deal with the question raised, shall we? BWB is a bad idea for
any pasty food product. You don't get convection currents to insure
that the entire jar has reached optimum temperature. Without that
movement, you have to rely on a very long cook time to get the
conduction to raise the temp in the middle of the mass. The only way
to measure is to open the jars and that defeats the purpose. If you're
making a thousand jars, taking a few out to check makes sense.
Otherwise, you can't be sure.

Beyond that bit of science, here's more. A BWB is a bad idea because
heating the mustard, either as seeds or flour, will pretty much
destroy the flavor. That's one of the reasons why a mustard-crusted
roast doesn't taste strongly of mustard after roasting.

Look he http://www.apinchof.com/makingmustard1078.html

Commercial mustards rely on the combination of low pH and low water
activity to preserve them. Some add preservatives. Many add sugars to
sequester water and add sweetness. The point is that commercial
producers have access to labs with good measuring equipment to test
what they're doing.

Mustard, somewhat by it's nature has erucic oil in it.

Mustard contains erucic *acid* not erucic oil. This first citation,
below, talks about the oil extracted from mustard seeds that contains
low levels of erucic acid. "Somewhat by its nature" translates into
"I'm not really sure about it."

Towards that I cite to:

http://vm.cfsan.fda.gov/~rdb/opa-g033.html

This is about the oil extracted from rapeseed and mustard seeds to be
marketed as "canola oil." Nothing about process safety of anything.
It's a reference to "GRAS" or "Generally Regarded As Safe" designation
for food ingredients, not mustard.

and

http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/art...i?artid=154497

This is about bacteriostatic properties of mustard with and without
added vinegar. There are no references to processing.

That answers a part of your question.

It answers nothing raised.

As for the rest:

Mustards made with vinegar that reach a pH of lower than 4.2 are
generally regarded as safe.

It doesn't say that anywhere in what you cited. This is an
extrapolation about *all* foods as a safe pH level.

How is one to know what the pH of the mustard they make is? Can't
calculate it. It has to be measured with a pH meter.

Mustards made without vinegar, but with
other liquids, e.g., beer or wine, are IMHO safe, too, for the alcohol
acts as a deterrent along with the erucic acid.

Given the low percentage of alcohol in the finished product, this is a
guess with no substance. The mustard with *no* added liquid has better
bacteriostatic properties. There are several acids to factor in, not
just erucic.

On the Indian sub-continent, Indians eat chutneys, relishes and
pickles everyday that have high concentrations of this acid. In India,
it is considered safe.

Right. They use mustard oil as a cooking oil. Street vendors routinely
fry foods in mustard oil. It's usually about 98% pure mustard oil with
other oils added for flavor or piquancy.

Here in the U.S. (are you posting to r.f.p.
from the U.S.?), mustard oil, or erucic acid is not permitted in high
concentrations.

Nonsense. You can buy pure mustard oil for cooking. Order some
"gourmet" mustard oil from California:
http://www.napastyle.com/store/product.jsp?sku=625

Here's the chemistry of mustard oil. Note that erucic acid is an
ingredient in it.
http://www.sarepta.ru/MOIL.htm

There, I've tried to concentrate on the facts about safety.

Puhleeze, Mark. You did the Mark Preston Shuffle again. A very small
idea crammed into lots of words.

When you do get around to making mustards, buy mustard FLOUR, no
mustard powder. The powder is ground seed with the hulls, and the
FLOUR has no hulls and makes a wonderfuly smooth (like storebought)
product.

You seem to think that the yellow stuff they serve at Little League
Baseball games is all there is. Check out the ever-expanding variety
of mustards made with seeds for additional texture and secondary
flavors. Any supermarket.

For information, recipes, books and accessories, see:
http://www.mustardmuseum.com/

Right. And go look at: http://tinyurl.com/sqsl on their site that
offers various flours whole, crushed and cracked mustard seeds to make
your own blends at home.

Or look at: http://www.leeners.com/mustard.html
or maybe: http://thebeeressentials.com/books_m...ard_books.html

Pastorio